PGA Tour: Runners and Ryders: Notes from the Ballwasher

First topic message reminder :

1).From the ridiculous to the sublime this week, or from the contrived to the (fiercely) competitive if you prefer.
Thumbs down here for the FedEx Cup but thumbs up for the individual tournaments, most of which, as usual, provided for compelling viewing, though perhaps less so as the Play-offs went on - certainly at least half of last weekend's "competitors" seemed to be going through the motions once their chances at the wheelbarrow-full of $10M were gone.

2).The best player of the Play-Offs was clearly identified, Rory McIlroy, while the bloke with the best timing, Brandt Snedeker and his red hot putter, received all the plaudits, not to mention much of the loot.
Rory will be Player Of The Year, no question about that, while Brandt's marathon of nine tournaments in ten weeks was richly rewarded - can only hope that Medinah will be one week too far (as it almost certainly will be for Furyk).

3).And before we look at this week's events in Chicago, a word about the first inductee to the World Golf Hall Of Fame for 2013, Freddie Couples.
Given that no-one received the 65% of the vote in the PGA Tour ballot for automatic induction, Fred was the lucky loser with 51%. No doubt the most popular man on the ballot (the equally well-qualified but terminally curmudgeonly, Weiskopf doesn't even merit a vote any more), Couples led Love and Venturi (38%), O'Meara (36%), Tony Lema (28%), Macdonald Smith (24%) and double-Major winners Zoeller and Stockton. My vote would have been for Venturi but his retirement away from the public eye seems to diminish his legacy rather than enhance it.
"International" votes expected soon. Perhaps a phone call that Padraig Harrington will be happy to receive?

4).While most of America looks the other way, all golfing eyes will be fixed on Chicago this week and Medinah's cauldron. The golfing stereotypes seem to have been in play in setting up Medinah's 7,600 yards:
~Team USA have the best/longest drivers, so widen the fairways for the grip-it-and-rippers and minimize the rough.
~Europe make all the crucial putts, so speed the greens up to Augusta National standards.
~USA prefer flop-shots around the green, Europe the chip-and-run,
etc, etc.
In addition it seems to be fashionable to feel that FedEx action has sharpened Team USA's competitive form.
So let's have a look.

5).Form first, and most of the combatants played Bridgestone, the PGA and at least some Play-Off or ET golf. The players with most owgr points these past eight weeks then are:
McIlroy: 271
Snedeker: 127
Bradley: 115 (but only 10 in the past five weeks)
Rose: 89
Garcia and Woods: 80
Those with fewer than 25 points include: Kuchar, Simpson, Zach, Colsaerts, McDowell, Kaymer and Molinari (with only 9.66 in four events).
Edge to Team USA, though additional tournaments for most of them introduce the fatigue factor.

6).Driving:
With apologies to non-PGA Tour members, the driving distance stats on this year's PGA Tour show:
1st: Bubba Watson
4th: Dustin
5th: McIlroy
14th: Bradley
28th: Westwood
Given Colsaerts' length and Garcia's extra gear this is closer than DLIII probably realises, though clearly Mickelson and Woods can swing for the fences when they can do so with impunity.
Edge to Team USA.

7).Putting:
The "Strokes gained Putting" Tour stats show the following:
1st: Snedeker
2nd: Donald
7th: Mickelson (difficult to believe)
10th: Zach
23rd: Kuchar
24th: Furyk (difficulter to believe)
26th: Garcia (difficultest to believe)
Definite Edge to Team USA.

8).So why fear the Europeans?
Ryder Cup records of golfers with winning RC records:
Westwood: 16-11-6: (2-5 in singles)
Garcia: 14-6-4: (even with a 1 win, 4 losses singles record)
Donald: 8-2-1: (6-0 in foursomes)
Poulter: 8-3-0: (winning record in each format, 3-0 in singles)
McDowell: 4-2-2
Rose: 3-1-0
Lawrie: 3-1-1
Kaymer: 2-1-1

Team USA:
-

Big Edge to Europe, but history may not be worth a damn.

9).I can't see Europe winning unless Garcia and Westwood come up trumps and banish the memory of the forlorn figures they cut at Valhalla.
Head: USA
Heart: Europe
Result: Chicken: 14-14 so Europe keep Cup.

10).And one more compelling reason to hope Europe win:
1991 Ryder Cup protagonist David Feherty has publicly stated he hopes Team USA win.
What a pr1ck.

Yeah, s_r has softened up. Has he had quality time with DL3 and Bubba lately? I bet they would both cry like poofs watching "Titanic" if they'd witnessed his transition, let alone had read this thread...

Feherty being a renegade doesn't surprise me. Think about who pays his rock-star salary? And being in a fake kiss-up environment all day must take its toll. I bet he even puts on that silly accent to stand out. Bit like Schwarzenegger - who probably speaks fluent dixie lingo or something after all the years in the States, but clings to the old accent to stay interesting. Or maybe even like Bobcat Goldthwaite, or whatever his name is from Police Academy.

Westwood/Lawrie could be a good pairing. Just plan it so Lawrie gets all the chips around the green. Kaymer must be played in the fourballs, to get him going. Though, am a bit anxious what could happen if we play all our big guns in the foursomes, and we happen to lose most of the matches. Then it could easily turn into another Valhalla. And speaking about Valhalla - the place where vikings go to die - it seems that's where Robert Karlsson has been left...

Westwood/Lawrie reminds me of the apocryphal story about Einstein and Marilyn Munroe. She's supposed to have suggested they have kids 'cos with my looks and your brains' they'd have everything. To which Einstein replied 'But what if they had my looks and your brains?'

I haven't checked how the course is playing (order of par 5's, 4's, 3's), but how do you play Westwood in 4-somes? Great long game (driving, irons) but questionable short game. So I guess you would want Westwood to hit most of the approach shots into the green, rather than the drives - and leave the birdie putts (or scrambling) to others (Lawrie)?

SmithersJones wrote:Westwood/Lawrie reminds me of the apocryphal story about Einstein and Marilyn Munroe. She's supposed to have suggested they have kids 'cos with my looks and your brains' they'd have everything. To which Einstein replied 'But what if they had my looks and your brains?'

Which of them 2 is the looker???

SJ,
How true, how apropos, how funny!


OK, So how else can Europe be said to hold an edge?

Well, aren't you just sick and tired of all this "ping pong" crap? Fact is, Freddie Jac beats all of them and we didn't even need to pick him.
Edge: Europe

And Teams USA continue to chatter about how much the Europeans drink.
Presumably Team USA will quaff as much iced tea (awful, don't do it) as Team Europe drink
Edge: Europe
(Not to mention the contributions from the Vice Captains

Some of each team have played Medinah in Majors.

Woods has the best record with two (PGA) wins but we know there are "a million reasons" why he prefers WGC's etc to Ryder Cup in remember he can only earn so many points - hopefully none.

So, matching the Medinah records of each team. let's see how we do:

Woods: 1st, 1st beats Garcia: 2nd, 3rd.

Donald: 3rd beats Stricker: 7th and cut

Furyk: 8th and 29th beats Poulter: 9th. Just!

Westwood: 16th and 29th and Mickelson: 16th, 29th and 57th tie

Lawrie: 34th beats Zach Johnson: cut

And McDowell: 37th and Rose: 41st beat any next two DLIII puts up.

So: Edge to Europe: 4 1/2 to 2 1/2.

OK for those UK golfers, explain this to me ...

After I golf, I almost always have a beer or two. It's what I do.

I'm fortunate enough to play many a course in and around London. I normally play with an American living in London (who belongs to a fine club in Surrey). Our group (or groups) is generally rounded out by Londeners ... and to a person they almost all have tea afterwards, some looking at me oddly as I quaff my beer (really like Fuller's Pride).

Is this UK drinking thing a big farce? Are you mostly a nation of tea-totallers?


PS - US wins this thing.

Probably a drink driving thing shotrock. a pint is more than a unit so effectively you have had too much to drive (unless you are shane Lowry)

Super - I wasn't driving ... in fact, I never drive in or around London. Fortunately, my host does.

That's what I mean, you weren't driving so you could drink, the others presumably were driving so couldn't drink and were looking on in envy rather than judgementally.

Are there any decent usa beers out there we only get the dog pi$$, like bud, miller etc over here although a few others are starting to make their way over recently like blue moon which raise the standard a little.

Shotrock wrote:OK for those UK golfers, explain this to me ...

After I golf, I almost always have a beer or two. It's what I do.

I'm fortunate enough to play many a course in and around London. I normally play with an American living in London (who belongs to a fine club in Surrey). Our group (or groups) is generally rounded out by Londeners ... and to a person they almost all have tea afterwards, some looking at me oddly as I quaff my beer (really like Fuller's Pride).

Is this UK drinking thing a big farce? Are you mostly a nation of tea-totallers?


PS - US wins this thing.

err i am not sure what part of surrey you have been to. But to answer your question from someone that has played 95% off clubs in surrey- No.

From what I've seen most people have a couple of pints and drive home , never seen too much tea drink in a clubhouse.
Mind you I was amazed when I was on LA how much drink driving went on. Thought it was health kick city but everyone was smoking and drink driving.

the layabouts drink tea- but only then only a small percentage. The reality is that almost all the 19th crowd at many local surrey clibs to me- all drink and drive. I persoanlly will have 1 or 2 as most do.

super_realist wrote:That's what I mean, you weren't driving so you could drink, the others presumably were driving so couldn't drink and were looking on in envy rather than judgementally.

Are there any decent usa beers out there we only get the dog pi$$, like bud, miller etc over here although a few others are starting to make their way over recently like blue moon which raise the standard a little.

Do you get Sam Adams in the UK ? That's pretty much the only US beer that I'll drink, other than the occasional microbrew. At our local bar you can get a decent pint of bass, smithwicks, or boddingtons so I usually stick to that.

Wonderful microbrews in and around here. Some much less traditional than others, and I really enjoy the offerings from Dog Fish Head.

And, of course, Saranac (with a nod to Kwini)!

LA ... ever notice there's a fast food joint around every corner, but people still think it's the "healthy lifestyle" city. Another stereotype shattered.

anyone know when tomorrows match ups are announced?

incidentally - still quite a few folks yet to get their entries in for the fantasy game - time's running out...(you know you want to )

Only ever had one cup of tea in my life - at an interview when I was 18. Tasted awful and never 'ad another.

Best rule of thumb I'd offer regarding American beer is to never drink a national brand - they're all godawful. Drink the local draught or, as Plunky and Shotrock suggest: Sam Adams or Saranac (preferably their Adirondack Lager - not really lager).
There are some top class microbreweries almost everywhere in the east - drink local (Switchback, Long Trail IPA or Magic Hat around here) and Stay Thirsty!

I think Friday morning's match-ups will be announced during the opening ceremonies, about 10.00 p.m. BST.


I wonder if any of Team USA are drinkers?

Can imagine Phil having a swift half and Stricker and Furyk. And Jason Dufner, who's been playing a bit more like Jason Dufner since his Colonial wobble, looks like he's never far away from a bevy. Snedeker's Dad had a liver transplant and looks it too.

But as for the rest imagine their god would look askance at adult beverages.

Remember the very first "Miracle"?

From personal observation and discussions I've had with others, VERY little beer consumer by golfers in a PGA event. (Although my club specifically has a "Justin Rose" drink, we cajoled him into telling us what he prefers - or he just made it up!)

No good reason NOT to knock back a few after the Ryder Cup (win or lose) IMO.

Kwini

I thought tiger was meant to drink quite a bit when he was younger?



I don't tend to find the quality of food and drink to be very high in golf clubs so maybe the tea is a good choice. I certainly cant be worse than golf club coffee.


As for the pairings, they may as well draw names out of a hat.

Nice write up, kwini

What (about) the FEC? Only one word about last week's Tour Champ.... boooring! But that's probably just me...

Carefully cleared all my duties for the next three days, so can't wait to watch the big battle...!
Europe all the way!!!

Good to see the Europeans continuing in their tradition and come up with some more imaginative ways to keep themselves entertained and 'bond' together as a team. Apparently they had a bit of a Strictly competition in their team room last night. No surprise to hear that the supercool Mechanic came up trumps at that particular skill...

http://www.irishgolfdesk.com/news-files/2012/9/27/miguel-el-rey-del-mambo.html?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=twitter&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+IrishGolfDesk+%28Irish+Golf+Desk%29

In the mean time, what were the Americans doing to gel their team together?
Some more...ping-pong, of course...

I've heard that drinking some of the national beers is like having sex in a canoe. It's the closest thing to fooking water that you can get.

Dancing?

This Euro team unity this pretty revealing.

Not that there's anything wrong with that.

JMO's smile creeps me out- The latest bungling captain that doesnt know where to put himself. I vote that poults should be player captain for the next 10000 years

Update from Charlotte:
Robbie Karlsson and Russell Knox both four under par for Round 1.

Anyone heard definitively the Europeans going to PGA Tour Q-School? Deadline was yesterday and we've heard Lowry, Gonzo and Ramsay would enter - any others?
Must say that Mrs.Gonzo would certainly cut a striking figure patrolling the fairways, and everywhere else.

Woof,
BBC has Ben Dirs doing the Live Text - they should provide a link to 606v2 if they really want to know what's happening.

mystiroakey wrote:JMO's smile creeps me out- The latest bungling captain that doesnt know where to put himself. I vote that poults should be player captain for the next 10000 years

That might not work out as well as you think. I'm not too sure Poulter is too bothered which team wins so long as he plays well himself.

kwinigolfer wrote:Woof,
BBC has Ben Dirs doing the Live Text - they should provide a link to 606v2 if they really want to know what's happening.

I especially liked the comment

"On paper, the Americans should do a number on the Europeans - they have only one player outside the top 10 (Jim Furyk in 13th) while Europe have six."

So, not only did he get Furyk's OWGR position wrong but Maths isn't a strength either. By my rubbish Maths I count 17 players in the top 10 according to Dirs.

oh dear lol

People talk drivel about the strength in depth of the US but they only have eight players on the course at any one time (until Sunday) and we have four of the top five, plus Garcia, McDowell, Poulter any one of whom would fly in to Team USA.

At this stage in the game, you can pretty much throw the world rankings out. Perennial #1 Tiger never intimidated a Euro player -- and none of the Euro rankings, I assure you, have a US player shaking even a little bit.

Bring it on -- should be great viewing (although I'll be golfing myself all day tomorrow).

we can golf all day then watch the golf!! love your time zone!!

Ben Dirs....

I think both teams are very strong, current rankings, form, majors, even past records fairly irrelevant. Think and hope it's going to be very close, Team USA slight favourites due to the home support IMO.

Bring it on!

Dufner looks like he'll have fun.

Can we have Ryder Cups without opening ceremonies, please!
As boring and gray as those matching jackets the two teams are wearing....

One observation from the oc; the Europeans all have a reasonable amount of hair (with the possible exception of Rory) whereas the Americans either have too much or too little.

Too much of that hair is coloured.
Kudos to Paul Lawrie for exhibiting a touch of maturity!

Did Justin really just say 'the youngest winner in American Idol history'? It's a tv program, ffs, and not even an old one.

Surprised about the final match - often reserved for those who might sit out the afternoon. Well, Stricker will but not so sure about TW, Rose or Poultie.

Europe 4
Usa 0

kwinigolfer wrote:Europe 4
Usa 0

Hear, hear!

I think 2½-1½. Win the first 2, lose the third ('cause they can't putt) and halve the last.

3 - 1 I think...

Bit of a surprise Westwood & Molinari... But Molinari has improved his putting recently.

1/10 odds Team USA afternoon lead-off pair will be Simpson and Bubba.

Bubba likes to go first because of his ADD - who does Jose Maria want to combat them? I'd send out Kaymer - he's already beaten Bubba in one play-off! With Hanson?

Excited for this, majors still the biggest event imo this is the fifth biggest!!!

Surprised Ollie put perhaps the two worst putters the Euros have together....Lawrie would have been better equipped imo....I also wouldn't have played Phil/Keegan and left them to the fourball....

Euros win match 1&2 USA win match 3 Half in match 4

USA win by a couple of points.

Westy and molinari are gonna be possibly the best tee to green match up. And molinari is the really steady player that i think will work will in 4 balls. Westy can clutch putt in match play. I have no probs with that match

Don't get the Westy/Molinari pairing. Yes, if they play at their best it doesn't matter. But I think there are a few question marks around Westys short game at the moment, and Franny is not the one I would pair him with. Why not Lawrie?

Why lawre, when he would probally be more inclined to miss a green than molinari?

Another nice piece from the European Tour Productions..

https://www.youtube.com/user/Everyshotimaginable?feature=watch

Let's hope our guys will bring on the magic this week!

yeah but Westy would take most of the approach shots, so you'd need one with a good short game to complement him. Lawrie could be one. I just can't understand a foursome pairing without a good scrambler / putter.

Nothing wrong with westys putting in match play dude.

Lawie isnt a great scrambler anyway. secondly lee is an awesome driver of the ball as well. So i dont buy that he will be taking the majority of par 3's and approaches/ However i dont even know how the course is set up. so i am not sure if it evens it self out or not

Anyway whos EXCITED..

Working from home today to watch it.. Loveing it. Cant wait!