Scarlets v Dragons, Friday 5th October

First topic message reminder :

Scarlets: Liam Williams; George North, Gareth Maule, Scott Williams, Andy Fenby; Aled Thomas, Tavis Knoyle; Phil John, Matthew Rees, Samson Lee, Sione Timani, Johan Snyman, Aaron Shingler, Rob McCusker (capt), Josh Turnbull.

Replacements: Ken Owens, Shaun Hopkins, Deacon Manu, Richard Kelly, Kieran Murphy, Gareth Davies, Rhys Priestland, Morgan Stoddart.

Dragons: Dan Evans; Adam Hughes, Pat Leach, Andy Tuilagi, Tom Prydie; Steffan Jones, Jonathan Evans; Toby Faletau, Nic Cudd, Lewis Evans (capt), Adam Jones, Ian Nimmo, Dan Way, Steve Jones, Phil Price.

Replacements : Hugh Gustafson, Aaron Coundley, Nathan Buck, Jevon Groves, Tom Brown, Liam Davies (Bedwas), Ashley Smith, Will Harries.

Referee: Nigel Owens (WRU)

Assistant Referees: Ian Davies, Gwyn Morris (both WRU)

Citing Commissioner: Aurwell Morgan (WRU)

TMO: Derek Bevan (WRU) -




So what do we think? Where's your money?

Treviso Winning 27 -15 up in Scotland

MOTM is a tough call today, Williams has been good, as has Maule but too bad a conditions to give it to the backs.

Lee has been good, but John gave much more in the loose. Rees went off too early, and Timani and Snyman were very solid. I'd say Falatau's work rate has been higher than anyones except for Lewis evans but not all effective.

Lee wasn't stand out but was there or there abouts

Game over well done considering the conditions there were some saving good moments in a game that was hard for both sides.

WEll reffed by Nigel too I thought

Now that Scarlets have a bit of grit I'd say they were a loosehead, goal kicker and back rower from being HC contenders!!

I suppose I'm happy we lose by 7, but in the grand scheme of things we've lost an LBP tonight. What was Jon Evans carded for?

What is it with Video Refs at PYS, Bevan made a huge blunder two weeks ago and now this one, that ball was through the posts, the replays cleraly showed it, what is going on?

Dragons hung in well, second best for most of the game but Faletau and Lewis Evans were imense. For the Scarlets Laim Williams, and pretty much the whole pack went well. Samson Lee at just 19 years of age looks a great prospect. But with heavily bandaged knees and a cauliflour ear already looks a seasoned prop. Great to see Stoddard look so sharp on his comeback!

Thought Morgan Stoddard looked really good for a comeback. Great pace and power.

Odd try but it could have give either way. I didn't think it did look over but I jabber Scarlet eyes

Disappointed in the Dragons though. We were apparently not in the game in the first half and of course we've had the usual "we are going to do this" off a Dragons player (target the scrum). Annoying. I wish they would stop doing that.

I really can't begrudge Stoddart scoring though. Awful injury to come back from and though he said he doesn't think he will warrant a Welsh call up, I think he could.

Risca Rev wrote:What was Jon Evans carded for?

For the tiniest of tugs on Josh Turnbull's shirt, who himself could have been penalised for detaching early from the scrum. We'd just scored our try so the timing couldn't have been much worse.

We really didn't offer much all game and we shouldn't be surprised we lost. There wasn't much shape to us at all. But if it's true that Steffan Jones has been ill all week it makes Darren Edwards's decision not to have a recognised 10 on the bench all the more stupid.

Knoyle has been the worst scrum-half in Wales for years, yet some people still rate him. He'll probably be in the Wales squad though for being the 2nd most experienced to Phillips. It's about time the best in Wales (Davies) had a shot. If Wales stick to their tradition of rewarding early good and consistent form to young guys then Jon Evans should also get picked.

The Scarlets back row plays as if they have three Jon Thomas's playing all lightweight, the Dragons back row is better balanced and more powerful even with a weaker front 5. I can see Lewis Evans getting nto the Wales squad ahead of all three Scarlets 6's (Even Holey stated the Scarlets have three 6's playing) at 6 or 7.

There was a bit too much kicking in the game but the conditions were not great for good handling.

A win is a win for the Scarlets and good to see Stoddart back and playing well.

glamorganalun wrote:The Scarlets back row plays as if they have three Jon Thomas's playing all lightweight, the Dragons back row is better balanced and more powerful even with a weaker front 5. I can see Lewis Evans getting nto the Wales squad ahead of all three Scarlets 6's (Even Holey stated the Scarlets have three 6's playing) at 6 or 7.

There was a bit too much kicking in the game but the conditions were not great for good handling.

A win is a win for the Scarlets and good to see Stoddart back and playing well.

All three before Shingler ? I think, you need, a rethink.

I'd agree that Davies was the best 9 in Wales, but IMHO there are 3 better options not playing in Wales!!

The Scarlets have three good 6's but no go forward 8 and not ball winner 7 for the on the ground work, Shingler was not in the game against the Ospreys except in the line out. I still think Lewis Evans should be in the Wales squad ahead of McCuster, Turnbull and Shingler but Shingler will make the squad.

LordDowlais wrote:

glamorganalun wrote:The Scarlets back row plays as if they have three Jon Thomas's playing all lightweight, the Dragons back row is better balanced and more powerful even with a weaker front 5. I can see Lewis Evans getting nto the Wales squad ahead of all three Scarlets 6's (Even Holey stated the Scarlets have three 6's playing) at 6 or 7.

There was a bit too much kicking in the game but the conditions were not great for good handling.

A win is a win for the Scarlets and good to see Stoddart back and playing well.

All three before Shingler ? I think, you need, a rethink.

You have a point here about the Scarlets back-row. Turnbull and Edwards are the most super-average flankers I've seen. Sometimes that's enough but sometimes it is not. McCusker is actually good if he can regain the form from previous season, form that seen him pick up some Wales caps. Shingler is good too, but could probably do with throwing his weight around a bit. If you're a good ball carrier then there isn't much difference between 6 and 8. Perhaps McGog and Shingles could swap positions and perhaps the Scarlets could call up their best fetcher into the squad (the one playing for Llanelli).

thebluesmancometh wrote:I'd agree that Davies was the best 9 in Wales, but IMHO there are 3 better options not playing in Wales!!

Phillips, Peel and Roberts?

And let's not forget the Llandovery scrum-half who is in outstanding form...

Evans has been in and around the Welsh squad before and had a ggod game tonight so he's not to far away from squad I dont think.

Both Evans's looked good and could get a welsh spot IMO.


People have said "we can see it, why can't the coaches" regarding the scrum but who on earth could we bring in? Were a million shy of the wage cap n Newport/Gwent is dying.

It is sad that we have top players struggling behind that pack.

Morgannwg wrote:

thebluesmancometh wrote:I'd agree that Davies was the best 9 in Wales, but IMHO there are 3 better options not playing in Wales!!

Phillips, Peel and Roberts?

And let's not forget the Llandovery scrum-half who is in outstanding form...

Rhodri Williams.

He played for Scarlets last year.

I don't post very often but do enjoy reading these threads, but in my honest opinion i don't think Nigel owens, or any welsh officials should be involved in big welsh derbies. He is far to chatty with players, more often than not from the scarlets or Ospreys and i jusr find he is very inconsistent in these games.

It was far from a clasic last night, with the weather being a big factor, but i really did think the Dragons would be playing better rugby than they are. Darren Edwards has not recruited in the areas that we need i.e a seasoned front row that can get parity at scrum time, and an additional second row. The dragons pack is poor at the breakdown, turned over far to many times, and bar Falatau now one breaks the gain line. Why not use Tom Brown??, he had a really good season last year and offers some go forward??

I know decent front rowers (especially T/H) are in high demand and can demand top dollar but surely there must be a few seasoned pros out there that could do a job for us.

With Kingsley Jones involved with Russia I was hoping we might have had one or two from there.

The annoying thing is that our scrums have been getting better. We got a penalty from one early on but couldnt take advantage cos Jone's kicking was so poor

It was poor but we have a severe lack of go forward ball, very few seem to cross the gain line and put us on the front foot.

bedfordwelsh wrote:I know decent front rowers (especially T/H) are in high demand and can demand top dollar but surely there must be a few seasoned pros out there that could do a job for us.

With Kingsley Jones involved with Russia I was hoping we might have had one or two from there.

Isn't Kingsley with London Welsh too...?

Dragons fgront row were duffed up last night by Phil John and a 19 year old boy.......that must be a big worry!

I have allways been impressed by Phil Price, but another strong prop and scrumaging hooker is needed. Also some grunt in the second row, which makes a big difference.

It would be interesting to know how much drive was generated by Scarlets new second row, Snyman last night. Their scrum certainly appreared stronger.

They should keep the same front 5 for Clermont. Starting with Manu would be a massive step backwards.

Morgannwg wrote:Knoyle has been the worst scrum-half in Wales for years, yet some people still rate him.

Morgannwg,

What is it with you and Knoyle? Has he had his wicked way with a girl friend of yours? It just seems as if you love to pounce on his every action???? Could it be that the people who rate him know a little bit more about rugby that you?

Puzzled

IAOB

maestegmafia wrote:

bedfordwelsh wrote:I know decent front rowers (especially T/H) are in high demand and can demand top dollar but surely there must be a few seasoned pros out there that could do a job for us.

With Kingsley Jones involved with Russia I was hoping we might have had one or two from there.

Isn't Kingsley with London Welsh too...?

Is he,thats new one on me if he is Maes

Kingsley is with London Welsh.

rugbydreamer wrote:Kingsley is with London Welsh.

In what capacity dreamer?

I didn't know that at all.

He's working with the forwards I believe. He was certainly with them when LW came down to play the Scarlets in the pre-season friendly.