The official "Brighton and Hove Albion to mid table mediocrity" thread

[Good Golly I'm Olly]

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A place to discuss all things Brighton and Hove Albion

[Crimey]

Crimey its not ridiculas its fact.. It may not be something you can see as being the moral choice( You are clearly looking at this about why should the gay footballers have to come out!)

Well to be honest they do in the society we live in!

As soon as someone comes out. It will cause a massive riplle and homophobic abuse will not be tolerated any more.

And as i said Its not even about the fans.. The gay footballers are IMO more scared about coming out to there team mates and managers etc than the fans. I garantee this!

No, I'm not saying that at all. What I'm saying is that no footballer should have to sacrifice himself by being subject to homophobic abuse for the FA to act. The FA should be acting to tackle it now, not waiting for a homosexual player to come out of the closet.

The FA should be proactive rather than reactive. It has failed repeatedly to deal with a growing problem, shelving an anti-homophobia video message, no action being taken against it and no campaign like the Kick it Out campaign.

I disagree totally, apparently there are many Premier League footballers who are out to their teammates and managers but refuse to come out because of fear of the fans.

[mystiroakey]

And the point is GSC is that the brighton fans also play along. As Duty pointed out.

paraphasing here -but they chant things like -" your getting stuffed by the pansies"


This problem isnt going to be a problem untill it is seen in being targeted abuse . At the moment its no different from other fans calling ipswitch fans inbreds or palace scum etc!

[Crimey]

I think for me, if they were abusing just a large group of homosexuals, then yeah, thats unacceptable. In this case they're just bantering a section for representing the 'gay capital of England', much like other clubs fans get bantered for stigmas belonging to their area.

Then answer my question, if the fans were chanting "banter" based on Blackburn/Burnley having high Asian populations at Blackburn or Burnley games, would that be acceptable?

The fact that Brighton is the "gay capital of England" means that they're likely to have many homosexual fans who will feel offended by the chants, who will feel alienated by football because of it.

[mystiroakey]

Crimey its not ridiculas its fact.. It may not be something you can see as being the moral choice( You are clearly looking at this about why should the gay footballers have to come out!)

Well to be honest they do in the society we live in!

As soon as someone comes out. It will cause a massive riplle and homophobic abuse will not be tolerated any more.

And as i said Its not even about the fans.. The gay footballers are IMO more scared about coming out to there team mates and managers etc than the fans. I garantee this!

No, I'm not saying that at all. What I'm saying is that no footballer should have to sacrifice himself by being subject to homophobic abuse for the FA to act. The FA should be acting to tackle it now, not waiting for a homosexual player to come out of the closet.

The FA should be proactive rather than reactive. It has failed repeatedly to deal with a growing problem, shelving an anti-homophobia video message, no action being taken against it and no campaign like the Kick it Out campaign.

I disagree totally, apparently there are many Premier League footballers who are out to their teammates and managers but refuse to come out because of fear of the fans.

apparantly!!.. thats the problem your basing it all on heresay and you have drawn a line between types of discimination!

And yes I couldnt disagree with you more tbh.. Its all about being proactive .. Not scared.. We cant rely on authorities. If footballers wont this fixed - they need to do something about it!

And it is there responsibility as it is us fans.. We cant rely on the FA or police to do anything., Because they wont untill they the abuse is targetted

[mystiroakey]

I think for me, if they were abusing just a large group of homosexuals, then yeah, thats unacceptable. In this case they're just bantering a section for representing the 'gay capital of England', much like other clubs fans get bantered for stigmas belonging to their area.

Then answer my question, if the fans were chanting "banter" based on Blackburn/Burnley having high Asian populations at Blackburn or Burnley games, would that be acceptable?

The fact that Brighton is the "gay capital of England" means that they're likely to have many homosexual fans who will feel offended by the chants, who will feel alienated by football because of it.

Why is that worse than targetting Ipswitch fans as being imbred?

I cant see any difference.. But you can.

By the way you have answered my point- Its all about targetted abuse.. Abuse is dealt with when its real; Ie racist chants against fans that are asian or black. Same goes for players.. THEN IT IS DEALT WITH.

Untill players come out it wont be dealt with.

I am not saying its right or wrong. But its the starting point to solve the problem

[Duty281]

Well the majority of Brighton fans, if one forum is anything to go by, don't really care.

http://www.northstandchat.com/showthread.php?275392-Poll-Time-quot-Homophobic-Chanting-quot

[Duty281]

I think for me, if they were abusing just a large group of homosexuals, then yeah, thats unacceptable. In this case they're just bantering a section for representing the 'gay capital of England', much like other clubs fans get bantered for stigmas belonging to their area.

Then answer my question, if the fans were chanting "banter" based on Blackburn/Burnley having high Asian populations at Blackburn or Burnley games, would that be acceptable?

The fact that Brighton is the "gay capital of England" means that they're likely to have many homosexual fans who will feel offended by the chants, who will feel alienated by football because of it.

Why is that worse than targetting Ipswitch fans as being imbred?

I cant see any difference.. But you can.

I can't see any difference either. It's not specific, it's a generalisation.

[GSC]

And most Spurs fans aren't jewish but adopt the y- army chant. Footballs very tribal.

If they were abusing asians specifically, then yeah Crimey. Targetted abuse is not acceptable. Bantering the majority over a stigma is fine.

[Guest]

The fact that Brighton is the "gay capital of England" means that they're likely to have many homosexual fans who will feel offended by the chants, who will feel alienated by football because of it.

You can't just assume that mate, just because Brighton has a 'reputation' for being a hotbed of gay people doesn't mean Brighton will have any more gay fans than other teams. I know tons of gay people and they all to a man/woman hate football. I've never met a gay person that does.

[GSC]

If somebody was being abused being of their skin colour, or sexual preference, then yeah that is worse than for inbreeding.

But this isn't the same circumstances, its not abuse targetted at a minority, its banter aimed at the majority.

[GSC]

The fact that Brighton is the "gay capital of England" means that they're likely to have many homosexual fans who will feel offended by the chants, who will feel alienated by football because of it.

You can't just assume that mate, just because Brighton has a 'reputation' for being a hotbed of gay people doesn't mean Brighton will have any more gay fans than other teams. I know tons of gay people and they all to a man/woman hate football. I've never met a gay person that does.

I have a gay friend whose a massive Liverpool fan. That was the deal breaker in our friendship for me

[Crimey]

Well the majority of Brighton fans, if one forum is anything to go by, don't really care.

http://www.northstandchat.com/showthread.php?275392-Poll-Time-quot-Homophobic-Chanting-quot

30% is still a very high percentage of people who don't like it.

[mystiroakey]

Isnt saying that brighton is the gay capital on a message board just as bad as chanting it on the stands

[GSC]

Isnt saying that brighton is the gay capital on a message board just as bad as chanting it on the stands

I put it in quote marks didn't I? Please dont sue .

[Duty281]

Well the majority of Brighton fans, if one forum is anything to go by, don't really care.

http://www.northstandchat.com/showthread.php?275392-Poll-Time-quot-Homophobic-Chanting-quot

30% is still a very high percentage of people who don't like it.

I'm sure there's an equally high percentage of Welsh fans who don't like being referred to as 'sheep sha**ers' or Norwich fans being referred to as 'inbred' but that's different apparently.

[Crimey]

No because the phrase "gay capital" doesn't have negative connotations, it's just a quicker than saying that they have the high population of homosexuals.

I think as long as people dismiss homophobic chants as banter the longer the problem of homophobia will last in football.

mysti, the FA take a lot of proactive action against racism, they have a huge campaign called "Kick it Out", they make a big effort to make sure it doesn't happen in the first place AND then take action when it actually happens.

They do neither for homophobic abuse, and it shouldn't take a player coming out and suffering abuse for this to change.

[Crimey]

Well the majority of Brighton fans, if one forum is anything to go by, don't really care.

http://www.northstandchat.com/showthread.php?275392-Poll-Time-quot-Homophobic-Chanting-quot

30% is still a very high percentage of people who don't like it.

I'm sure there's an equally high percentage of Welsh fans who don't like being referred to as 'sheep sha**ers' or Norwich fans being referred to as 'inbred' but that's different apparently.

Of course it's different! Those claims aren't damaging. There isn't evidence that there are people who have sex with sheep, or inbred footballers who can't come forward because they fear abuse. There is considerable evidence from current and past footballers as well as others involved with the game that there are homosexual footballers who don't want to come out. These chants are part of that problem.

[mystiroakey]

"mysti, the FA take a lot of proactive action against racism, they have a huge campaign called "Kick it Out", they make a big effort to make sure it doesn't happen in the first place AND then take action when it actually happens.

They do neither for homophobic abuse, and it shouldn't take a player coming out and suffering abuse for this to change."

Crimey maybe your right and maybe it shouldnt. But the way i am looking at it. The sooner footballers do come out the sooner it will be a massive deal and be dealt with!

[Duty281]

Well the majority of Brighton fans, if one forum is anything to go by, don't really care.

http://www.northstandchat.com/showthread.php?275392-Poll-Time-quot-Homophobic-Chanting-quot

30% is still a very high percentage of people who don't like it.

I'm sure there's an equally high percentage of Welsh fans who don't like being referred to as 'sheep sha**ers' or Norwich fans being referred to as 'inbred' but that's different apparently.

Of course it's different! Those claims aren't damaging. There isn't evidence that there are people who have sex with sheep, or inbred footballers who can't come forward because they fear abuse. There is considerable evidence from current and past footballers as well as others involved with the game that there are homosexual footballers who don't want to come out. These chants are part of that problem.

So footballers can put up with horrible chants about their families, or hoping they die of cancer, but they can't put up with some chants about how they take it up the a**e. What a strange world.

[Crimey]

Well the majority of Brighton fans, if one forum is anything to go by, don't really care.

http://www.northstandchat.com/showthread.php?275392-Poll-Time-quot-Homophobic-Chanting-quot

30% is still a very high percentage of people who don't like it.

I'm sure there's an equally high percentage of Welsh fans who don't like being referred to as 'sheep sha**ers' or Norwich fans being referred to as 'inbred' but that's different apparently.

Of course it's different! Those claims aren't damaging. There isn't evidence that there are people who have sex with sheep, or inbred footballers who can't come forward because they fear abuse. There is considerable evidence from current and past footballers as well as others involved with the game that there are homosexual footballers who don't want to come out. These chants are part of that problem.

So footballers can put up with horrible chants about their families, or hoping they die of cancer, but they can't put up with some chants about how they take it up the a**e. What a strange world.

Where did I say that they can put up with that? I'm just as for stopping those chants as I am homophobic chants.

[Duty281]

Well the majority of Brighton fans, if one forum is anything to go by, don't really care.

http://www.northstandchat.com/showthread.php?275392-Poll-Time-quot-Homophobic-Chanting-quot

30% is still a very high percentage of people who don't like it.

I'm sure there's an equally high percentage of Welsh fans who don't like being referred to as 'sheep sha**ers' or Norwich fans being referred to as 'inbred' but that's different apparently.

Of course it's different! Those claims aren't damaging. There isn't evidence that there are people who have sex with sheep, or inbred footballers who can't come forward because they fear abuse. There is considerable evidence from current and past footballers as well as others involved with the game that there are homosexual footballers who don't want to come out. These chants are part of that problem.

So footballers can put up with horrible chants about their families, or hoping they die of cancer, but they can't put up with some chants about how they take it up the a**e. What a strange world.

Where did I say that they can put up with that? I'm just as for stopping those chants as I am homophobic chants.

Of course, but what I'm trying to say is surely homophobic chants are not as offensive as some of the other chants footballers have to put with.

[Crimey]

No, but they are illegal and yet it seems a lot of people are turning a blind eye to them.

It would also be good for the rest of society if homosexuality was accepted in football, for younger homosexuals, in the same way that having black footballers is better for young black people. It's hard for fans to be racist if one of their favourite footballers is black for example.

[mystiroakey]

You keep mentioning what is illegal and what isnt. Tbh mate I havent got a clue if being abusive in one way is worse than another in the yes of the law(well bar racism off course- we know that is)

But in most of our eyes its about what we see as being morally worse..

(I do agree with your sentiment though Crimey. Its just I can accept the frailties of the FA, govenment and the public. Its all about being proactive if you want to solve something in my eyes!

[Crimey]

You keep mentioning what is illegal and what isnt. Tbh mate I havent got a clue if being abusive in one way is worse than another in the yes of the law(well bar racism off course- we know that is)

But in most of our eyes its about what we see as being morally worse..

(I do agree with your sentiment though Crimey. Its just I can accept the frailties of the FA, govenment and the public. Its all about being proactive if you want to solve something in my eyes!

It is illegal. These are protected characteristics covered by the Equality Act 2010:

age, disability, gender reassignment, marriage or civil partnership, pregnancy and maternity, race, religion or belief, sex, and sexual orientation

They're supposed to be treated as badly as each other.

[mystiroakey]

Well there you go.. Maternity is there(covers imbred chants doesnt it)

[Marky]

Crimey, get off your high horse mate. Homophobic abuse to Brighton fans can't stop until Brighton fans stop being equally homophobic.

I present, Exhibit A.

Also since this is Palace (scum) 2nd Sunday defeat in a row lets have a little sing along

WE SCORED 3 THEY SCORED NONE, BRIGHTON ******* YOU UP THE BUM, WITH A NICK NACK PADDY WACK GIVE A DOG A BONE, CRYSTAL PALACE **** OFF HOME!!!

[Crimey]

Crimey, get off your high horse mate. Homophobic abuse to Brighton fans can't stop until Brighton fans stop being equally homophobic.

I present, Exhibit A.

Also since this is Palace (scum) 2nd Sunday defeat in a row lets have a little sing along

WE SCORED 3 THEY SCORED NONE, BRIGHTON ******* YOU UP THE BUM, WITH A NICK NACK PADDY WACK GIVE A DOG A BONE, CRYSTAL PALACE **** OFF HOME!!!

I'm pretty sure I said earlier in the thread that I thought them doing it back is just as bad.

[mystiroakey]

Marky, Allthough I am a Palace fan. Thats just classic Nick isnt it

[Marky]

I know you said that earlier Crimey, but that's the point. Until Brighton fans stop, you can't expect everyone else to stop. Bottom line is, make Brighton fans stop first.

And as for classic Nick, he wasn't the one who made that chant up.

[Crimey]

I know you said that earlier Crimey, but that's the point. Until Brighton fans stop, you can't expect everyone else to stop. Bottom line is, make Brighton fans stop first.

And as for classic Nick, he wasn't the one who made that chant up.

For me, it's less to do with Brighton, and more to do with the overall attitude to homophobia in British football, where it seems to be seen as a lot less serious than racism.

If the FA act strongly now, it'll send a message that they are going to treat it seriously.

[Marky]

Bearing in mind the same person who posted that homophobic chant also posted;

I personally feel Homophobic abuse and Racist abuse should be dealt with in the same matter.

While I'm voxpopping a little, this gives the impression homophobia is something Brighton fans can get away with but opposition fans can't. Until Brighton fans are forced to stop, no-one else will.

[Duty281]

I know you said that earlier Crimey, but that's the point. Until Brighton fans stop, you can't expect everyone else to stop. Bottom line is, make Brighton fans stop first.

And as for classic Nick, he wasn't the one who made that chant up.

For me, it's less to do with Brighton, and more to do with the overall attitude to homophobia in British football, where it seems to be seen as a lot less serious than racism.

If the FA act strongly now, it'll send a message that they are going to treat it seriously.

I still don't see how chants of "we can see you holding hands" can be classed as homophobic abuse.

[Guest]

Apologies to Brighton and Hove Albion Football Club and its fans for this debate taking place on their pages.

[NickisBHAFC]

I think everyone should give it a rest now personally. Fact of the matter is, homophobic abuse at football games, shouldn't be tolerated as shouldn't racist abuse. I have a mate who is gay and goes with his mates (straight) to some Crawley games. He has cut down due to homophobic abuse in a friendly back in the summer, where a couple of idiots were shouting unpleasant abuse at a few of the Brighton players.


This Debate Ends Now.

[Marky]

No it doesn't, queerbo

[NickisBHAFC]

No need for that what so ever, im reporting that message 100%

That was just

A. Offensive
B. Needless
C. Stupidity

[Marky]

#AreYouSeriousBro

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