If pacquiao vs marquez 1 had been for WBC strap

I don't know if this will fill out a thread. But I thought it would be interesting to hear other posters views on what would have happen to both boxers had their 2004 fight been subject to the 3 knock downs rule.
This of course would have ment that their first fight finishes with Pacquiao win by KO in the first round and really no reason ever to have a rematch.

So i'd be interested to hear how you think both careers would have continued.

Perhaps not that different? On the one hand an easy win for manny might've meant less call for a rematch and JMM having to fight his way back into contention - but seeing as the rematch didn't happen for 4 years it probably wouldve made no difference.

On the other hand if Team Pac thought JMM was a soft touch they may have rematched him sooner and possibly lost? Who knows. History shows us that JMM would have to lay manny out cold to get a draw in these fights.

Had it been for the WBC belt nothing would have changed, they very rarely enforced the 3 knockdown rule in fights back then, all of Mayweathers fights for the WBC belt were fought under the unified rules.

I thought that didn't apply in title fights ?

If the first fight had been for a WBC strap the Mexican would've won. No-brainer.

Think what the state commission needs to do this time is check to see If the cards have been filled in before the fight has started...............

i think the first fight was the only one manny won legitimatly anyways

I rewatched the first fight, its in very high quality on bad left hook. Here is how I scored it

1. 10-6 Pacquiao (Could be 10-7 since Manny got his butt kicked in the first half minute)
2. 10-9 Pacquiao
3. 10-9 Marquez
4. 10-9 Marquez
5. 10-9 Marquez
6. 10-9 Marquez
7. 10-9 Marquez
8. 10-9 Marquez
9. 10-9 Marquez (Closer round, could be even, I don't give even rounds)
10. 10 -9 Pacquiao
11. 10-9 Marquez
12 10-9 Marquez

114-111

Although the judge said he made a mistake scoring the first round 10-7 instead of 10-6, I can see a case for giving it a 10-7 round.

It's been a couple of years since I watched that fight, having seen it two or three times before that. I had it 114-112 to Marquez (8-3-1 in rounds, the knockdowns narrowing the scoe considerably, of course). 10-6 for the first round was quite justified, in my eyes, and the second was unequivocally Pacquiao's as well. After those first two stanzas, it was certainly Marquez's best showing against Manny, but we can't just ignore those opening two rounds. As such, a draw was no disgrace in that fight, even if Marquez was a touch unlucky.

Revisionist history tells us that Marquez has been robbed three times, and badly, against Pacquiao. A more reasonable take on it, I reckon, would that he was a touch unlucky first time out, can have no complaints in the second at all, but was shafted in the third bout. He should, at the very least, be 1-1-1 with Pacquiao, although something like 2-1 or 1-0-2 might be more justifiable.

i think 1-0-2 is right. the difference in the first fight was the knockdowns, i had manny 2 rounds down but obviously 3 points up. the draw was closer, but i think marquez was unlucky not to get the decision, but the last round was a shambles, i cant remember which but i had marquez winning by either 4 or 5 rounds

The thing is, everything should point towards Marquez outscoring Pacquiao next month, as he's clearly got the wood on him from a styles perspective and there will be immense pressure to make sure that he's rewarded with a points win if he turns in a performance worthy of one. On top of that, Pacquiao's looking a considerably lesser fighter than he was a few years back.

And yet, I keep toying with the thought that Pacquiao is going to win, and win beyond any reasonable doubt. Marquez's showing last time out against Fedchenko went under the radar, but I actually wasn't all that impressed with him. He looked a wee bit sluggish at times against Katsidis and Diaz before turning in a great showing against Pacquiao last year, of course, but I can't quite shake the niggling worry that it may have been the last great hurrah of his career, that he'll have aged badly overnight, and that the injustice of last November's decision may have taken something out of him.

Gun to my head, I'd probably say that Marquez wins a tight decision, but I wouldn't be at all surprised if Pacquiao does what I (and many others) thought he'd do the last time they boxed, and win it big.

The last Marquez/Pacquaio fight was considered heavily weighted in Pacquaios favour. Marquez was old, hadnt looked particularly great and was stepping up in weight slightly. I think there might have a lack of focus from Pacquiao while Marquez boxed to his best.

Its interesting that from what I can see Pacquaio is still favourite for the next fight despite coming off what was considered a poor decision against Marquez and not looking fantastic against Bradley when he was hot favourite.

If the Bradley fight acted as a wake up call then I think we could see a revitilaised Pacquiao but I also wonder if the stigma of JMM unluckyness against Pacquaio over the years will work to his advantage with the judges.

88Chris05 wrote:It's been a couple of years since I watched that fight, having seen it two or three times before that. I had it 114-112 to Marquez (8-3-1 in rounds, the knockdowns narrowing the scoe considerably, of course). 10-6 for the first round was quite justified, in my eyes, and the second was unequivocally Pacquiao's as well. After those first two stanzas, it was certainly Marquez's best showing against Manny, but we can't just ignore those opening two rounds. As such, a draw was no disgrace in that fight, even if Marquez was a touch unlucky.

Revisionist history tells us that Marquez has been robbed three times, and badly, against Pacquiao. A more reasonable take on it, I reckon, would that he was a touch unlucky first time out, can have no complaints in the second at all, but was shafted in the third bout. He should, at the very least, be 1-1-1 with Pacquiao, although something like 2-1 or 1-0-2 might be more justifiable.

Can definitely agree with your scoring, the 9th could be a draw in which case I have the same score as you (8-3-1). The third bout however, wasn't even close.

manos de piedra wrote:The last Marquez/Pacquaio fight was considered heavily weighted in Pacquaios favour. Marquez was old, hadnt looked particularly great and was stepping up in weight slightly. I think there might have a lack of focus from Pacquiao while Marquez boxed to his best.

Its interesting that from what I can see Pacquaio is still favourite for the next fight despite coming off what was considered a poor decision against Marquez and not looking fantastic against Bradley when he was hot favourite.

If the Bradley fight acted as a wake up call then I think we could see a revitilaised Pacquiao but I also wonder if the stigma of JMM unluckyness against Pacquaio over the years will work to his advantage with the judges.

I picked Marquez in the third fight, however this time I am no where near as confident, if Pacquiao is aggressive he is going to play into Marquez hands, however if he does catch Marquez clean then it could be all over. I don't even think Pacquiao landed many decent punches the entire of the third fight, so we don't know if Marquez does get caught, he can handle the power.