Welsh Regions

First topic message reminder :

Welsh rugby does not have the money that French and English rugby has so it needs to be very careful with what it has and not waste a penny. Welsh rugby is spending many pounds on foreign players' salaries and the Welsh people are complaining that Welsh qualified players are leaving Wales, for money reasons. Given that a large amount of the Welsh rugby budget is generated by the Welsh national rugby team, it seems foolish to re-invest this money in Argentinian, Tongan, South African, Samoan, Fijian rugby players whilst watching our own rugby players leave.

It's going to take a long time for the regions to be in a position to be competitive in Europe as I see it. The current crop of youngsters need to be kept in Wales. The likes of Faletau, J.Davies, North, Warburton and Biggar have to be kept and help bring through the next crop of youngsters. The money has to be stumped up by the union and then the regions need to be given more cash to bring in quality. Just as the Irish provinces have done. I know it works differently in Ireland with players contracted to the union, but the WRU need to act now.
As a Dragons fan I've seen my fair share of foreign dross at Rodney Parade, as have fans of all regions and some of these average players have been given a fortune, when they've not been worth blowing your budget on.
I think twice in the last 10 years, the clubs/regions have been told by the WRU to reduce their overseas players. I don't think these rules have ever been taken seriously.
Having top overseas players is crucial. Just look at how much Xavier Rush, Percy Montgomery, Regan King and Jerry Collins have brought. They bring a buzz to the regions and amongst the fans. Dragons fans still talk about Monty to this day.
I'm not sure how much trust id put in Darren Edwards to spend money however.

manofgwent

But weren't we told that within the decade a welsh region would have won or at least competed on the final day for the HC?

And in reality what say do the coaches have in player signings? I get the feeling that when the top dog wants someone they get them, and the coaches just do their best with what is available!

ScarletSpiderman wrote:NWQ (now)

1) Campese Ma'Afu, 2) Andy Kyriacou, 3) Jacobia Adriaanse
4) George Earle, 5) Johan Snyman
6) Robin Copeland, 8) George Stowers, 7) Tomas Vallejos
9) Joe Bedford, 10) Kahn Fotuali'i
11) Hanno Dirksen, 12) Andy Tuilagi, 13) ???, 14) Tonderai Chavanga
15) Jamie Smith

https://www.606v2.com/t36783-niq-v-nwq (it was made a while back, but is near enough right, a few changes needed)

Yeah it definately seems weaker, but that is because the majority of NWQs seem to be in the front five at the moment, which is generally a problem area for wales.

Have to disagree with this team a bit. The whole point of doing a NWQ team is to point out the players that are keeping welsh players out of the team, and thus having a negative impact on the national team. Joe Bedford has gone, Jamie Smith I have never seen play (maybe once!), Hanno Dirksen is a project player (if you want to call home that) - he's not keeping a welsh player out as he is due to be a welsh player himself (probably)! The others I can agree with to an extent, but none are dead cert first teamers. I'd still say that in the grand scheme of things times have changed from having immovable NWQs in the team (Rush, Blair, Marhsall, Collins, Tia Tia, etc.) to a situation where many of these are not first choice as the welsh lads are better and are getting just as much if not more game time. NWQs back up players like this is much better than first choices.

Just looked at the Dragons squad on wiki - only 6 in the whole squad. One is Jamie Smith (surely to be gone when his contract ends), one is Nimmo (technically a project player as he hasn't played international rugby) and another is Dan Way another project player and young enough too. Not bad out of 44.

Griff

Doesn't this highlight though the poor quality NWQ players the regions are signing??

Fortuali, Tuilagi and Snyman aside none are nailed on first choice, so why not give their opportunity to a welch prospect? Get rid of a few and sign the type of NWQ player who inspires, teches and a welsh boy has to fight for his place??

They are largely average players, but that comes down to money. Look at the Dragons signing of Tuilagi. We were crying out for a ball-carrier in the centre for a couple of seasons. Tuilagi replaced Tom Riley. That's just bringing in a player who can do a specific job. I'm sure Darren Edwards would have loved to sign a Welsh big ball-carrying centre, but we can't afford Jamie Roberts and only pick up the cast-offs from the other regions, not anyone who is a key player.
I think we needed to sign Tuilagi. We were so lightweight in midfield. It's meant that Tom Riley can now play at his real level in the Prem and we have the young Jack Dixon to come through under Tuilagi. If Dixon was eg 23 years old, then I'm sure we wouldn't have gone for an overseas player, but sometimes coaches need quick fixes in certain areas and in the Dragons case, we have a small pool of players in which to make signings. We don't pay the real big money, we struggle in the league and can't offer HC rugby.

On signings such as Joe Bedford. You could see after a few games he was nowhere this level and that was a really poor signing. No surprises he's now left. In fairness to the Dragons, in the last few seasons we've really cut down on our foreign players and regularly field as many as 13 and sometimes 15 welsh players in the starting line-up.

manofgwent wrote:They are largely average players, but that comes down to money. Look at the Dragons signing of Tuilagi. We were crying out for a ball-carrier in the centre for a couple of seasons. Tuilagi replaced Tom Riley. That's just bringing in a player who can do a specific job. I'm sure Darren Edwards would have loved to sign a Welsh big ball-carrying centre, but we can't afford Jamie Roberts and only pick up the cast-offs from the other regions, not anyone who is a key player.
I think we needed to sign Tuilagi. We were so lightweight in midfield. It's meant that Tom Riley can now play at his real level in the Prem and we have the young Jack Dixon to come through under Tuilagi. If Dixon was eg 23 years old, then I'm sure we wouldn't have gone for an overseas player, but sometimes coaches need quick fixes in certain areas and in the Dragons case, we have a small pool of players in which to make signings. We don't pay the real big money, we struggle in the league and can't offer HC rugby.

On signings such as Joe Bedford. You could see after a few games he was nowhere this level and that was a really poor signing. No surprises he's now left. In fairness to the Dragons, in the last few seasons we've really cut down on our foreign players and regularly field as many as 13 and sometimes 15 welsh players in the starting line-up.

What player in his right mind "wants" to play for The Dragons?

Cardiff Dave wrote:

manofgwent wrote:They are largely average players, but that comes down to money. Look at the Dragons signing of Tuilagi. We were crying out for a ball-carrier in the centre for a couple of seasons. Tuilagi replaced Tom Riley. That's just bringing in a player who can do a specific job. I'm sure Darren Edwards would have loved to sign a Welsh big ball-carrying centre, but we can't afford Jamie Roberts and only pick up the cast-offs from the other regions, not anyone who is a key player.
I think we needed to sign Tuilagi. We were so lightweight in midfield. It's meant that Tom Riley can now play at his real level in the Prem and we have the young Jack Dixon to come through under Tuilagi. If Dixon was eg 23 years old, then I'm sure we wouldn't have gone for an overseas player, but sometimes coaches need quick fixes in certain areas and in the Dragons case, we have a small pool of players in which to make signings. We don't pay the real big money, we struggle in the league and can't offer HC rugby.

On signings such as Joe Bedford. You could see after a few games he was nowhere this level and that was a really poor signing. No surprises he's now left. In fairness to the Dragons, in the last few seasons we've really cut down on our foreign players and regularly field as many as 13 and sometimes 15 welsh players in the starting line-up.

What player in his right mind "wants" to play for The Dragons?

Would love to see you say this to Lewis Evans or Andrew Coombs, tough guy.

The nwq debate is a non-starter unless someone out there can name me 120 Welsh players out there capable of consistently reaching at a minimum the Rab C Nesbitt play offs.

Griff that NWQ team wasn't to show players blocking welsh players paths, it was the best 15 NWQ players in wales.

Scarlets remind me of where Ulste were a number of years ago, able to push to top of table and compete with big teams in first half of season but then drop off second half as lack squad depth to rotate and players get injuried or not able to perform to same level, Ulster had a good acamady of players coming through but had lost a lot of senor players to guide these one, so got a number of Quality NIQ players, and its paid, have quality experened players, some amazing young players, and a number of Iriah internationals, imagine if Scarlets added ulters NIQ players, instead of there NWQ players?

PAYNE;
George North, Jonathan Davies, Adam Warren, Kristian Phillips;
Aled Thomas, PIENAAR;
Phil John, Ken Owens, AFOA,
George Earle, Johan MULLER,
Rob McCusker (capt), WILLIAMS, Josh Turnbull.

5 NWQ players, and I doubt this team would have been Scoreless against Clermont,

having quality NWQ players and making the latter stages of touraments, prob teaches the acamady players more, than getting more gametime in a team that gets niled, a winning team breeds confidence and this is surly a better enviroment to learn in?

I have always said there is a need for non qualified players in each team/region/province etc but they have to be top notch of which there have been plenty.

However I doubt there are many teams/region/province etc who can honestly that they haven't signed a dud or two in their period.