We all need to become Lions fans or there could be a lot of unhappiness when the first test team is announced

First topic message reminder :

This board shows a lot of people looking at the Lions through blue, red, green or white tainted glasses. Thats normal I am the same when the Welsh squad/team is announced, I always count the number of Scarlets, Ospreys, Blues, Dragons ... and French players and mutter if the entire Blues team isn't selected(no honestly I am not that stupid!). But when the Welsh team goes out on the park I'm Welsh and when the Britsish Lions team goes out on the park I will be British and 100% behind all of them.

There have been Lions tours in the past when few Welshmen made the starting line up and I didn't find that any reason not to enjoy watching them..... This time I think English and Scottish fans will need to take a deep breath and try and do the same as in my opinion there may not be any players from either country in the starting 15 although there will be lots on the bench.

If we picked on form today, and a lot might change during the tour then -

Front row would be 3 Welsh or 2 Welsh and Healey
Second row POC and a Welshman
Back row will be any 3 from Heaslip, Toby, SOB, Warburton and Tuperic
Phillips, Sexton, Roberts, BOD,
Back 3 will be any 3 from Bowe, North, Cuthbert, Halfpenny and Kearney

Croft, Gray, Parling and Vunipola have the best chance of breaking this Welsh/Irish monopoly

flyhalffactory wrote:

rainbow-warrior wrote:

flyhalffactory wrote:

t1000advancedprototype wrote:The argument about recent form is irrelevant.

International form is what matters. Players play differently when playing for rubbish regional sides playing along and against substandard opposition.

How their recent international form is what matters and how they play with other international players and combinations.

We all know how good these lions are individually and we know how much they will raise their game.

MIKE PHILLIPS: Match winner, game changer, passion, aggression and intensity.
POC: Born winner, Lions expert, inspirational
HALFPENNY: Never plays bad, puts body on the line
BOD: He is the lions
ROBERTS: Lions man of the series
WARBURTON: Double grandslam winner and captain
ADAM JONES: 4 six nations titles, 3 grandslams, 4 celtic leagues

You need characters like this in your side come lions time.

Funny because that's not what Gatland has stated or how he has selected when he asked Wilkinson to tour because of his form only last week in the HC semi, when he picked POC Lydiate Bowe Stevens etc etc etc

What like Wales played last year in the very same place AUSTRALIA and against the very same nation AUSTRALIA.... remind me how they performed? did they win a game? perhaps it was an astounding win? close draw maybe? narrow 2-1 loss no? oh sorry it was a 3-0 whitewash, oh never mind it was against one of the best fully fit Aussie side yes?.......... Oh sorry I thought you said these players can and are used to winning international games

Ahhhhh I see what you are getting at now............. Selective memory syndrome

Let me jog it for you

2012 Grand Slam champions
then
8 (That's EIGHT) losses on the bounce ahem I wonder how many were against SH teams, more importantly how did they do against Australia
then
2013 6Ns chumps sorry champs

Yes that's what after 4 years a lot of us have been waiting for
The form coach Shaun Edwards not selected and
The form players not been selected

Sour grapes from a Jock.

Rainbow Warrior
The man with naff all to say........ so spouts a one-liner which makes us all smile from time to time

As opposed to you, an essay of pure grape's that make you cringe. Stick to 'tossing' the caber.

mankiaow wrote:What is it with the term 'Lions' anyway. Surely a team from these islands should be represented by and indigenous animal.....Stags(sorry Munster), Bears or maybe Wolves........or Woolly Mammoths!

The Lions is a reference to the Royal coat of Arms. I suspect a few of the Ireland lads don't realise they're Queen's ambassadors to the colonies?

The Lions was formed before the Republic of Ireland.

The Great Aukster wrote:

mankiaow wrote:What is it with the term 'Lions' anyway. Surely a team from these islands should be represented by and indigenous animal.....Stags(sorry Munster), Bears or maybe Wolves........or Woolly Mammoths!

The Lions is a reference to the Royal coat of Arms. I suspect a few of the Ireland lads don't realise they're Queen's ambassadors to the colonies?

Nice try.

maestegmafia wrote:The Lions was formed before the Republic of Ireland.

This is true I spose. As was the IRFU.

The Great Aukster wrote:

mankiaow wrote:What is it with the term 'Lions' anyway. Surely a team from these islands should be represented by and indigenous animal.....Stags(sorry Munster), Bears or maybe Wolves........or Woolly Mammoths!

The Lions is a reference to the Royal coat of Arms. I suspect a few of the Ireland lads don't realise they're Queen's ambassadors to the colonies?

We realise some of the Queen's subjects think that way....yes. But given that the Aussies are also Queen's subjects, we realise we're the only outsiders at the party in real terms

Should be a bulldogs really

Flyhalffactory

1. You questioned if I have watched much rugby, well as a Blues ticket holder I will grant you that I haven't seen as much quality rugby as i would like to have this year. But as a long term ticket holder with Bridgend, going back to the pre JPR and Fenwick era, I have seen some great play and have a few reference points to call on.
2. I was wrong to say my selection was based on form, rather its a combination of form and observation of Gatland's selection policy. He is a conservative and likes to stick with players he knows and where possible to select players who have been there and got the tee shirt, which combined with form is why I think the Welsh and experienced Irish players will fill the first 15 selection.
3. the line you didn't like - 'Second row POC and a Welshman' wasn't meant to be disparging about the English and Scottish boys, it is just that I think POC is the best second row that we have and that AWJ and Evans are numbers 2 and 3. I think, for the reasons I mentioned above that he will pick AWJ, after all he played in all 3 of the tests on the last Lions tour, has 70 odd caps, won 6 nations titles, etc. However, I think Evans would make a better team with POC. Gray is a great player but on either experience or form its hard to see him getting picked before one of the Welsh boys.

As others have pointed out anything can happen during the first month of the tour so the starting 15 for the first test may end up being very different to the one I suggested. Also, the political pressure to pick a more balanced side is likely to ensure that whatever Gatland would like to do there will be a greater mix. But the good thing is that whoever starts this squad can win ......come on Lions its only the Australians

The Great Aukster wrote:

mankiaow wrote:What is it with the term 'Lions' anyway. Surely a team from these islands should be represented by and indigenous animal.....Stags(sorry Munster), Bears or maybe Wolves........or Woolly Mammoths!

The Lions is a reference to the Royal coat of Arms. I suspect a few of the Ireland lads don't realise they're Queen's ambassadors to the colonies?

I suspect they're well enough aware of it but are willing to put up with the idea just as players from NI stand for the Irish anthem at home games.

maestegmafia wrote:The Lions was formed before the Republic of Ireland.

What kind of a stupid comment is that?

Until 2001 the Lions were still only referred to as the British Lions. Since 2001 the Irish part has been included to reflect the fact that obviously the Lions represents two soverign states.

GunsGerms wrote:Until 2001 the Lions were still only referred to as the British Lions. Since 2001 the Irish part has been included to reflect the fact that obviously the Lions represents to soverign states.

And that's also because rugby began to diversify and the Irish people who up until then hadn't taken too much interest in, or had much knowledge of, The Lions, they looked at the title and didn't like what they saw. It was something that slid under the radar for a long time because rugby was a more closested sport for a long time. The growth of rugby popularity in Ireland helped Ireland gain the 'Irish' bit.

flyhalffactory wrote:

100%beefy wrote:

t1000advancedprototype wrote:The argument about recent form is irrelevant.

International form is what matters. Players play differently when playing for rubbish regional sides playing along and against substandard opposition.

How their recent international form is what matters and how they play with other international players and combinations.

We all know how good these lions are individually and we know how much they will raise their game.

MIKE PHILLIPS: Match winner, game changer, passion, aggression and intensity.
POC: Born winner, Lions expert, inspirational
HALFPENNY: Never plays bad, puts body on the line
BOD: He is the lions
ROBERTS: Lions man of the series
WARBURTON: Double grandslam winner and captain
ADAM JONES: 4 six nations titles, 3 grandslams, 4 celtic leagues

You need characters like this in your side come lions time.

thank fork someone gets it, fhf take note

Think we should rename you from 100%beefy to "1linebeefy"


By the way
I would play POC Warbs Jones BOD Phillips in the test side anyway but not for the reasons Mr Poll Creator has highlighted but because they are the current best options

just because someone rambles on endlessly doesn't make their 'argument' right. fhf.....fully half functional?

I can see newsilure is fighting an uphill battle here. It's a delightful read.

I bet the actual squad will be more accommodating with whomever is selected though. They are professionals and besides one or two characters perhaps - you'd expect them to all get along well and respect each other's special talents.

Either way; i) Wales + or ii) a more balanced representation from all the Home Nations - both scenarios can work for you.

For i) - We might see some (non-Wales) players putting it all on the line in the lead up / dirt-tracker matches to try and cast a few shadows of doubt in Gatland's mind. That's a positive thing and should help galvanise the squad after each successive game leading up to the 1st Test. WG would be silly to deny somebody who stands up in those early matches and leads the way in terms of attitude and dedication to the cause and who personifies a fault-free example to others.

Actions on the field speak louder than 'our' (or your) words. Will Gatland acknowledge this if that occurs?

For ii) - If WG wants to more closely examine a few 'borderline' Welsh players under the spotlight in these lead up games... and they do satisfy his expectations for selecting them ahead of others; then they will have more confidence going into the 1st test and WG can feel vindicated having realised that his initial gut instincts were correct. The other non-Wales players in those matches will also naturally have to lift their work rates to prove otherwise in order to grab WG's attention.

I'm sure the players themselves will seek to share any spoils for all of the games anyway. That's what successful Lions tours have done in the past - the best performing Lions sides have been the most unified (and of course the most skilled & motivated) as well.