Sell me Mayweather's next opponent

by **Seanusarrilius** Tue 24 Sep 2013, 4:34 pm

First topic message reminder :

Who can he fight next? He needs to put bums on PPV seats and after his dismantling of Canelo, who can we be sold?

Thurman - Too soon, but build him as a name and he is possible for late 2013/early 2014.
Alexander - If he beats Khan, he is viable. But he sells minus 500k PPV's.
Khan - Probably won't beat Alexander, but if he does, a fairly easy sell in Englad due to his speeeeed and speeeeeed. That said, he looks shot to me. Bums are putting him down. May would dismantle him.
Garcia - Needs some fights at 147 first. Would be dismantled, but Garcia may be an option.
Bradley - He should be the next fight really, but will never happen due to TR feud.
Martinez at 154 - Possible. Martinez wants it (for $$$$), but is also shot now. That said, Martinez being the bigger man and a pretyy big name may sway it.
MAy at 160 - No. Can't see it happening.

by **Seanusarrilius** Wed 25 Sep 2013, 6:00 pm

azania wrote:Exactly. Floyd weighs in 150 after a huge meal. He cannot make 160. Heck he can barely fight at 154. He probably can make 140 if he wanted. His frame simply isn't big enough. Hatton was the bigger guy in their fight.

And he started at what, 126 or something? Couldn't agree with you more

by azania Wed 25 Sep 2013, 6:05 pm

130.

by catchweight Wed 25 Sep 2013, 6:05 pm

People just want to see him challenged. There arent really any fights out there that add to his legacy without looking upwards. If Martinez or Golovkin could move to light middleweight there shouldnt be anything stopping it. If Mayweather really wanted to add a major achievement he could challenge for the middleweight title.

by azania Wed 25 Sep 2013, 6:10 pm

catchweight wrote:People just want to see him challenged. There arent really any fights out there that add to his legacy without looking upwards. If Martinez or Golovkin could move to light middleweight there shouldnt be anything stopping it. If Mayweather really wanted to add a major achievement he could challenge for the middleweight title.

He can get a challenge if he fights Ward.

by **Seanusarrilius** Wed 25 Sep 2013, 6:12 pm

catchweight wrote:People just want to see him challenged. There arent really any fights out there that add to his legacy without looking upwards. If Martinez or Golovkin could move to light middleweight there shouldnt be anything stopping it. If Mayweather really wanted to add a major achievement he could challenge for the middleweight title.

It's only a major achievement if he beats someone worthy. How is he supposed to beat a killer like GGG at 160? And beyond that, what on earth would motivate him to try? Might motivate you and me, but it isn't what he wants, nor is it what he should do. 154 is the limit. Come on people. Next we'll be saying he should meet BHop at a CW of 170

by catchweight Wed 25 Sep 2013, 6:21 pm

Seanusarrilius wrote:
catchweight wrote:People just want to see him challenged. There arent really any fights out there that add to his legacy without looking upwards. If Martinez or Golovkin could move to light middleweight there shouldnt be anything stopping it. If Mayweather really wanted to add a major achievement he could challenge for the middleweight title.
It's only a major achievement if he beats someone worthy. How is he supposed to beat a killer like GGG at 160? And beyond that, what on earth would motivate him to try? Might motivate you and me, but it isn't what he wants, nor is it what he should do. 154 is the limit. Come on people. Next we'll be saying he should meet BHop at a CW of 170

How do you know he cant beat Golovkin or Martinez at middleweight? Why would Golovkin or Martinez at light middleweight not be viable if they agreed to it?

by azania Wed 25 Sep 2013, 6:24 pm

They should come down to 152 or there abouts.

by **Seanusarrilius** Wed 25 Sep 2013, 6:25 pm

catchweight wrote:
Seanusarrilius wrote:
catchweight wrote:People just want to see him challenged. There arent really any fights out there that add to his legacy without looking upwards. If Martinez or Golovkin could move to light middleweight there shouldnt be anything stopping it. If Mayweather really wanted to add a major achievement he could challenge for the middleweight title.
It's only a major achievement if he beats someone worthy. How is he supposed to beat a killer like GGG at 160? And beyond that, what on earth would motivate him to try? Might motivate you and me, but it isn't what he wants, nor is it what he should do. 154 is the limit. Come on people. Next we'll be saying he should meet BHop at a CW of 170
How do you know he cant beat Golovkin or Martinez at middleweight? Why would Golovkin or Martinez at light middleweight not be viable if they agreed to it?

154 is fair. 160 is too much weight.

by azania Wed 25 Sep 2013, 6:27 pm

Floyd cannot make 154. They want him so they come down. Martinez can easily make it.

by **Seanusarrilius** Wed 25 Sep 2013, 6:35 pm

azania wrote:Floyd cannot make 154. They want him so they come down. Martinez can easily make it.

True, but he can let them come in at 154 and he can come in his usual 150. Still bet on Floyd to beat them

by catchweight Wed 25 Sep 2013, 6:44 pm

Mayweather is a light middleweight champion so he is obliged to defend his title against an opponent who can make the the limit. Otherwise he should not be considered the champion at the weight class. The bigger opponent coming down doesnt necessarily have the advantage. Light middleweight might suit Mayweather more than Golovkin or Martinez. They will have to make the effort to make the weight and train on strict diets. Mayweather can make the weight comfortably and does not have to train with the aim of keeping his weight to a minimum.

by azania Wed 25 Sep 2013, 6:44 pm

I'd back Floyd to beat Martinez. GGG is a different matter altogether. Just too big and strong. He has decent skills but I can see him running through Floyd. Brawn over brains in this case.

by azania Wed 25 Sep 2013, 6:46 pm

Floyd has fought at LMW twice. He won a catchweight fight. I do not classify that as a championship fight. If I can call Pac a catchweight champ, then the same has to apply to Floyd. His win over Oscar and the Puerto Rican bloke whose name escapes me are the only legit fights at the weight.

by kingraf Wed 25 Sep 2013, 7:13 pm

Sergio weighed 167lbs vs JCC, only 2lbs more than Canelo weighed in vs Floyd and a whole 5lbs less than he weighed vs Trout. The "Martinez is too big" argument is Horsepoo.

Martinez may be hittable, but assuming that 5'8 Floyd, even with his speed, can catch him like 6'1 JCC jr. or 6'0 Murray is pretty presumptuous. Martinez doesnt come forward. You cant punch what isnt there, Mayweather will have to do the fighting.

GGG needs to fight Murray, then maybe Martinez, before he even looks Floyds way. BTW, he is only 5'9 and normally weighs 166-170 fight night, so I cant see why Alvarez is fair and he isnt...

by azania Wed 25 Sep 2013, 7:18 pm

Why would May and not Marvella have to do the fighting?

by kingraf Wed 25 Sep 2013, 7:25 pm

Because Maravilla isnt going to go looking for Floyd, especially if he just looking for a Retirement/coronation bout.

by azania Wed 25 Sep 2013, 7:26 pm

Floyd is hardly going to look for him either. It will be a stinker but when they do engage I expect Floyd to have the better of things.

Either that or it will be a stand off for 12 rounds.

by kingraf Wed 25 Sep 2013, 7:29 pm

I wouldnt be suprised if Floyd does win exchanges... but if Cotto could rough him up, Martinez should get a decent crack at it.
BTW - I fully expect it to be stand-off...

by Lance Wed 25 Sep 2013, 7:32 pm

Bradley is certainly the best fight if he beats Marquez. and I bet it turns out its much easier to make that fight with TR than it is to make a Pacman fight.

by STC Thu 26 Sep 2013, 8:53 am

All I said is that I'd like Mayweather to fight Martinez (not Ward or Hopkins, or a heavyweight). As has been pointed out, Martinez is not that much bigger than Canelo.

What's wrong with Mayweather fighting somebody a little bit bigger than himself to secure a legitimate world title at another weight?

What's wrong with facing such a challenge, especially when everyone around him at WW/LMW are not going to challenge him?

Fair enough if you all want to see him take Garcia apart for 12 rounds, spark Amir Khan out in 2, then fight Pacquiao a couple of times (four years too late).

Oooh I can't wait.

by STC Thu 26 Sep 2013, 9:06 am

Haye gives away 5 inches in height and 30 or 40 pounds in weight to Wlad or Fury but that's acceptable to people. Mayweather giving up 2 inches in height and 15 pounds to Martinez is far too much to ask the greatest fighter of his generation though isn't it?

by STC Thu 26 Sep 2013, 10:35 am

Seanusarrilius wrote:
STC wrote:
Scottrf wrote:Yeah I don't like the idea of stepping up a division until he eventually loses. The guy is small at Welterweight.
Where are the challenges at WW or LMW?

If he stays at WW/LMW then his career is going to go out like a damp squib. If he takes on a real challenge at MW and wins, it enhances his reputation and standing immensely. He's smart enough to know this.
So what. You are forgetting where he started. Do you want him to go up to SM if all Middleweight contenders fade? Ridiculous.

About as ridiculous as Duran fighting Hagler for the midleweight titles.

by All Time Great Thu 26 Sep 2013, 11:41 pm

I still believe Amir Khan is probably the only fighter in Floyd's weight category (I don't consider 160lbs viable) who would cause Floyd anything to worry about.

That's purely based on hand speed and accuracy. Khan's biggest problem is he's an awful inside fighter and I'm sure if they got close up he'd be eating right hands all day. Having said that, Khan would be able to take Floyd's best shots.

Therefore, I think this is the only fight that would actually be a decent watch, but Khan would have to beat Alexander (which I'm still not sure if he will) in order to deserve an opportunity.

A CV with wins over, Kotelnik, Mallinaggi, Judah, Maidana, Peterson (I consider that matchup a farce) and Alexander is worthy of a shot at Money Mayweather.

by AlexHuckerby Fri 27 Sep 2013, 4:27 am

Khan has generally been very good against tricky boxers which is what Alexander is, Malignaggi, Judah and Kotelnik are good fighters that have done good things but Khan made them look decidely average. Hopefully he can do the same with Alexander.

by Boxtthis Fri 27 Sep 2013, 8:02 am

All Time Great wrote:I still believe Amir Khan is probably the only fighter in Floyd's weight category (I don't consider 160lbs viable) who would cause Floyd anything to worry about.

That's purely based on hand speed and accuracy. Khan's biggest problem is he's an awful inside fighter and I'm sure if they got close up he'd be eating right hands all day.

Exactly the issue for Khan. If Floyd were to fight him at his preferred range then Khan would probably outpoint him. But, as soon as Floyd changes his gameplan, Khan has nothing else. Floyd is a good inside fighter. I'd imagine he'd just apply smart pressure, hit Khan while he's flustered, as well as land uppercuts and other short shots every time Khan tried to tie him up (which Amir is woeful at).

by Boxtthis Fri 27 Sep 2013, 8:06 am

AlexHuckerby wrote:Khan has generally been very good against tricky boxers which is what Alexander is, Malignaggi, Judah and Kotelnik are good fighters that have done good things but Khan made them look decidely average. Hopefully he can do the same with Alexander.

Agree with this. Better a boxer like Alexander than someone who pressures. Khan has a very good chance of beating Alexander. It's his type of opponent. Let's see if Devon is smart/capable enough to apply Peterson-style forward pressure. I don't think it's in him. He's a counter puncher at heart, and not as good a one as say Danny Garcia. Trying to counter someone with Khan's speed is a dangerous game. He could easily rack up a big points lead and do damage if you don't catch him with a big one.

by Strongback Fri 27 Sep 2013, 9:13 am

I wouldn't be surprised if it's Bradley next.

by STC Fri 27 Sep 2013, 10:02 am

I like how Mayweather can enjoy a size advantage over Marquez no problem but flip it around and propose that he could fight Martinez and all his fans have a hissy fit.

by hazharrison Fri 27 Sep 2013, 11:21 am

"Floyd made a show of saying that he’d fight Cotto at 154 pounds so Miguel would be at his best. But when Sergio Martinez offered to come down to 154, Floyd said that he’d only fight Martinez at 150 (an impossible weight for Sergio to make)."

by STC Fri 27 Sep 2013, 11:35 am

hazharrison wrote:"Floyd made a show of saying that he’d fight Cotto at 154 pounds so Miguel would be at his best. But when Sergio Martinez offered to come down to 154, Floyd said that he’d only fight Martinez at 150 (an impossible weight for Sergio to make)."

I agree 150 is ridiculous. 154 would be OK but I don't see why something like 157 for the middleweight title is so out of the question.

by STC Fri 27 Sep 2013, 11:37 am

I'm gonna stop banging on about this now because it seems I'm on my own.

by milkyboy Fri 27 Sep 2013, 12:02 pm

You're not stc. Mayweather has matured into a small welter, but has a huge reach. It's not ridiculous to suggest he challenge a middleweight at their weight. Plenty of welterweight champions down the years have given it a shot... some successfully. If there are no meaningful challenges below that weight then why not?

However, if he can still make money taking lower risk fights, then most likely he will. Money can't buy a legacy, but he's more interested in one than the other.

From a neutral perspective, its a shame Castillo didnt get the decision in the first mayweather fight. Floyd might have put greater emphasis on challenge over the '0'. I say 'might' as the dollar is his first love. Not a criticism, just an observation.

by catchweight Fri 27 Sep 2013, 12:17 pm

The reason for the difference between Cotto and Martinez is one guy will weigh close to the contracted limit while the other could be 15lbs above it. I would love to season Mayweather challenge for the middleweight title but its other boxers that are masquerading as middleweights but coming in well above the limit that makes the issue complicated. Mayweather cant really get above 154lbs max even eating a huge amount but his opponents could in excess of 170lbs on the night. It not like in the old days where if you fought at middleweight it actually meant middleweight.

by KingMonkey Fri 27 Sep 2013, 12:35 pm

If Floyd really feels the need to sell it's all about him being outside of his comfort zone. Unfortunately that is proving difficult as he couldn't be more comfortable in the ring than he is now and I mean that against anyone viable. The solution; fight away from home. Fight in the UK vs Khan and you can sell it.

by STC Fri 27 Sep 2013, 1:14 pm

milkyboy wrote:You're not stc....

Cheers.

by STC Fri 27 Sep 2013, 1:17 pm

What about Barker?

No offence to Barker, who I admire and respect enormously, but he's an easier way to a middleweight title for Mayweather than any of the other belt holders. As they are now I would back Mayweather to beat Barker. The IBF belt might not be so attractive though.

by All Time Great Fri 27 Sep 2013, 11:20 pm

STC wrote:What about Barker?

No offence to Barker, who I admire and respect enormously, but he's an easier way to a middleweight title for Mayweather than any of the other belt holders. As they are now I would back Mayweather to beat Barker. The IBF belt might not be so attractive though.

Barker vs. Mayweather? Yeah….. That will sell like hot cakes (actually maybe not).

I wouldn't place too much emphasis on division hoping and winning world titles. Jones won a HW title around 10 years ago against one of the worst heavyweight champions of all time, and it's virtually not even considered when people look back at his career.

by STC Mon 30 Sep 2013, 8:55 am

All Time Great wrote:
STC wrote:What about Barker?

No offence to Barker, who I admire and respect enormously, but he's an easier way to a middleweight title for Mayweather than any of the other belt holders. As they are now I would back Mayweather to beat Barker. The IBF belt might not be so attractive though.
Barker vs. Mayweather? Yeah….. That will sell like hot cakes (actually maybe not).

I wouldn't place too much emphasis on division hoping and winning world titles. Jones won a HW title around 10 years ago against one of the worst heavyweight champions of all time, and it's virtually not even considered when people look back at his career.

Every time Jones Jr's career is reviewed, the fact that he won the heavyweight title is mentioned. Every time. Just as much as him trying to regain the light heavyweight title is mentioned. Maybe you're talking to the wrong people.

How could it not be mentioned? It was historic.

Why would Mayweather, who's career and legacy is defined by winning world titles at different weights, not be interested in extending that further? The fact that he was attempting it would be more than enough to spark interest in the fight. Not that Mayweather needs a gimmick to sell tickets anyway.

by STC Mon 30 Sep 2013, 8:55 am

STC wrote:
All Time Great wrote:
STC wrote:What about Barker?

No offence to Barker, who I admire and respect enormously, but he's an easier way to a middleweight title for Mayweather than any of the other belt holders. As they are now I would back Mayweather to beat Barker. The IBF belt might not be so attractive though.
Barker vs. Mayweather? Yeah….. That will sell like hot cakes (actually maybe not).

I wouldn't place too much emphasis on division hoping and winning world titles. Jones won a HW title around 10 years ago against one of the worst heavyweight champions of all time, and it's virtually not even considered when people look back at his career.
Every time Jones Jr's career is reviewed, the fact that he won the heavyweight title is mentioned. Every time. Just as much as him unsuccessfully trying to regain the light heavyweight title is mentioned. Maybe you're talking to the wrong people.

How could it not be mentioned? It was historic.

Why would Mayweather, who's career and legacy is defined by winning world titles at different weights, not be interested in extending that further? The fact that he was attempting it would be more than enough to spark interest in the fight. Not that Mayweather needs a gimmick to sell tickets anyway.

by Guest Mon 30 Sep 2013, 10:53 am

Why would Mayweather, who's career and legacy is defined by winning world titles at different weights, not be interested in extending that further? The fact that he was attempting it would be more than enough to spark interest in the fight. Not that Mayweather needs a gimmick to sell tickets anyway. .

With all due respect to Barker, Mayweather is at that stage where he needs to start doing incredible things to secure that legacy he craves and beating a decent but not outstanding fighter like Barker is no better that Jones beating a decent but not outstanding fighter like Ruiz.

FLoyd has set the bar so high for himself that people will criticise his choice of someone like Barker as he's seen as one of the weaker Champions. Martinez may be on the slide but he's still good enough to beat the up and comers and whilst Golovkin is layng waste to all in his path he's still not been tested at the highest level.

Floyd needs to choose wisely

by KingMonkey Mon 30 Sep 2013, 11:01 am

Khan at the MGM is rubbish. Khan in the UK would be credible legcay-wise, just. Although quite what Khan has done to get the shot is beyond me.

by STC Mon 30 Sep 2013, 11:03 am

DAVE667 wrote:
Why would Mayweather, who's career and legacy is defined by winning world titles at different weights, not be interested in extending that further? The fact that he was attempting it would be more than enough to spark interest in the fight. Not that Mayweather needs a gimmick to sell tickets anyway. .
With all due respect to Barker, Mayweather is at that stage where he needs to start doing incredible things to secure that legacy he craves and beating a decent but not outstanding fighter like Barker is no better that Jones beating a decent but not outstanding fighter like Ruiz.

FLoyd has set the bar so high for himself that people will criticise his choice of someone like Barker as he's seen as one of the weaker Champions. Martinez may be on the slide but he's still good enough to beat the up and comers and whilst Golovkin is layng waste to all in his path he's still not been tested at the highest level.

Floyd needs to choose wisely

He does need to chose wisely. I also think he will be looking at these last few fights with a serious eye on his legacy. Khan, Garcia, Bradley, Pacquiao, Broner? I suppose beating these names and retiring undefeated isn't going to look too bad at the end of the day.

I still think any middleweight title on top will look a lot more impressive.

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