Is Vasyl Lomachenko that good or just plain crazy?

I have just seen who Vasyl Lomachenko will be fighting on his pro debut and it makes for some interesting reading:

His opponent Jose Ramirez has a record of W25 (KO 15) L3 (KO 0)

If Vasyl Lomachenko wins his fight, then he is talking about taking on the winner of Orlando Salido vs Orlando Cruz.

In my opinion that is insane and incredibly risky. The pro debut is going to be hard enough, but then getting a world title in the next fight and having the likes of Donaire in your sights!

If he pulls it off, it will probably be one of the most incredible rises in boxing history!

He was the best amature around. Fought all over the world. Time to crack on.

He is a very special talent. Has he turned pro 5 years ago he would be the unified champion by now.

His movement is exceptional, hard to hit clean, and a good variety of punches which is quite unusual for a lot of amateurs. Accurate too, which you'd expect from someone with such an amateur record. Have to wonder if he will be able to adjust quick enough for the pro game though if this is the pace he will be moving at, especially his workrate.

I would not fight Salido tho if he wins. Salido comes to fight.

Matched extremely tough for his first pro fight even given his amateur pedigree as one of the best ever. Definitely doesn't have a Wazza type managing him.

His opponent after this one will depend on how well he does in his first outing.

I don't know if it is a cultural trait or not but a lot of the young Eastern European fighters are very confident to the point of arrogance. Time will tell, I'm expecting big things.

Will be interesting to see how his stamina holds out as particularly salido will apply pressure for 12 rounds

I don't watch much amateur boxing, but what I've seen of him he can be very aggressive and likes to fight like a pro, which is admirable but in the pro game he can get cleaned out if he slugs it out

Whatever happens his skill is unquestionable and he should go far, and with his experience he can be fast tracked

How many rounds has he been fighting in WSB? Are they 10 rounders?

I don't follow it so I don't know

5 IIRC.

Just found this, missed it at the time:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o83e0jQHPRo

This guy is absolute class and has turned pro at the perfect time in my view. 25 years old, plenty of experience and a good 12 months or so spent boxing in more of a pro surrounding in the form of the WSB.

His skills are exceptional; from his accuracy to his shot selection to his footwork to his punch variety. Everything screams that he will be P4P fighter in the pro game.

I usually try not to get to excited about amateurs going pro...and would normally advocate a steady passage through the ranks (something which far to many of the Brits don't do and then end up being exposed).

This guy though is a different level, when I hear about someone like DeGale being called a gifted fighter and having excellent natural talent, I struggle to comprehend what that makes Lomachenko.

The main concern is whether he has the power in the pro ranks (didn't stop anyone in the WSB) however he is the type of fighter who will chip away at opponents and would most likely be an accumulative damage type of boxer.

Can not wait to see his debut and really hope he doesn't get found wanting, especially after writing this whole post backing him!

He's going to get starched in 1 after that eulogy Owen!

I haven't seen that much of him, but the record is unbelievable. I worry a little bit about guys who come to fight like he does, but don't carry great power. In the pro's there are a lot of tough guys who will still be swinging in the later rounds. So, the way he fights, his heart and durability are going to get tested in a way they haven't been to date. That said, no one has got to him in 300 amateur fights, so there's nothing to suggest he won't be up to it.

I like his attitude of wanting to get straight to business as a pro, though it comes with risk, it clearly shows the self belief. At 25 he still has time to make a lasting impression if he gets down to business early. As a benchmark, Rigondeaux was much older but fought cordoba in only his 6th or 7th fight I think, (and nearly came unstuck), and that was considered moving quickly.

He didn't stop anyone in the WSB, but he came close to it. He would have gotten rid of Maxwell the first time round but Maxwell was given a standing eight then the bell rang. Same scenario with Charlie Suarez. Worth noting that he fought naturally bigger men too. He only moved up to Lightweight when feather was abolished, while Maxwell and Selimov both campaign at 64kg.

I haven't seen anything of Ramirez, but from his record he seems tough. If Lomachenko stops him then he makes quite a statement. If he goes into the late rounds then i would be a bit nervous. One thing I've noticed from the WSB is that he can win rounds while coasting. He doesn't fight at a million miles an hour but goes through the gears when he needs to. He apparently trains like a demon, so he should have enough in the tank to go ten rounds. I'm looking forward to this fight more than the main event.

6oldenbhoy wrote:He didn't stop anyone in the WSB, but he came close to it. He would have gotten rid of Maxwell the first time round but Maxwell was given a standing eight then the bell rang. Same scenario with Charlie Suarez. Worth noting that he fought naturally bigger men too. He only moved up to Lightweight when feather was abolished, while Maxwell and Selimov both campaign at 64kg.

I haven't seen anything of Ramirez, but from his record he seems tough. If Lomachenko stops him then he makes quite a statement. If he goes into the late rounds then i would be a bit nervous. One thing I've noticed from the WSB is that he can win rounds while coasting. He doesn't fight at a million miles an hour but goes through the gears when he needs to. He apparently trains like a demon, so he should have enough in the tank to go ten rounds. I'm looking forward to this fight more than the main event.

He did put some people on the floor as well. Seen some highlights of him and he looks great, I think they are moving him too fast though.

I think Ramirez hasn't fought too many guys with decent records but he's never been stopped. He has an average ko record too, so I think they've picked someone that will either make lomachenko look good if he stops him.. Or give him a good workout over pro distance... Without having the skill set to be too much of a challenge.

At least that would be my take on the opponent choice!

milkyboy wrote:I think Ramirez hasn't fought too many guys with decent records but he's never been stopped. He has an average ko record too, so I think they've picked someone that will either make lomachenko look good if he stops him.. Or give him a good workout over pro distance... Without having the skill set to be too much of a challenge.

At least that would be my take on the opponent choice!

Ramirez is knocking on the door of world level Milky and is pretty seasoned. For Lomachenko's first 10 rounder he's a very able opponent.

Lomachenko is super confident. He wanted his first pro fight to be for a world title but that couldn't be made. My feeling though is he will be learning the pro game is a different animal to the amateurs. Sometimes confidence can be misplaced. I expect him to win but to tested. This isn't a gimme.

Maybe strongy, but he's not knocking that loudly. The best win I could find was Bautista, and the only time he put his head above the parapet it was nearly decapitation by ponce de Leon.

Don't get me wrong, a very tough first opponent.. I was merely highlighting why I thought they'd picked him

milkyboy wrote:Maybe strongy, but he's not knocking that loudly. The best win I could find was Bautista, and the only time he put his head above the parapet it was nearly decapitation by ponce de Leon.

Don't get me wrong, a very tough first opponent.. I was merely highlighting why I thought they'd picked him

I hear what you are saying but I think picking Raminez as a first fight is a bit foolhardy, The fact that he holds an international belt says he's no ordinary fighter. He's 25 and has been fighting in Mexico for 8 or 9 years which means he will be well schooled. He's also ranked No.7 by the WBO and even if that doesn't carry a lot of weight it does suggest he's not a muppet. I think its an incredibly ambitious fight to take as a first pro outing.. I do think there might be a case of over confidence, I've seen it before with some young Eastern Europeans.

I believe Lomachenko has now been cleared by the WBO to fight for a world title. If he rolls over Ramirez then it looks like he'll be fighting the winner of the Cruz v Solida wbo world title fight. Arum is saying a potential Lomochenko world title fight will generate a lot of interest and money.

I love it, bold move.

Is this true, a record of 396-1? His only defeat being in the final of the world amateur championships in 2007 (as a 19 year-old) which he has gone on to avenge twice.

If so the sky is the limit...

All Time Great wrote:Is this true, a record of 396-1? His only defeat being in the final of the world amateur championships in 2007 (as a 19 year-old) which he has gone on to avenge twice.

If so the sky is the limit...

According to him, yes that is his amateur record. Lost to Selimov, the Russian, in the World Finals in 07 (though he still thinks he won it) then defeated him in the first round of the Beijing Olympics, then again in a recent WSB bout.

When is he fighting?

http://boxrec.com/list_bouts.php?human_id=659771&cat=boxer

azania wrote:When is he fighting?

Bradley v Marquez undercard

i cant find odds for his fight, how are they looking

Just had a thought on this, for arguments sake Lomachenko does win a world title in his second fight could that pave the way for a mouthwatering fight with Rigondeaux? Imagine it a battle between the amateur greats.

Lom will be too big won't he?

Expect he'll only have a few fights at FW, then maybe stop via Mickey Garcia at SFW on his way to LW.

Potential to be a 3 weight world champ in about a dozen fights.....

I don't think so he only fought at lightweight because featherweight was scrapped and Rigo isn't the smallest of super bantamweights.

I think if Rigo wants him he's going to have to chase him up the weights as it's clear Lom wants to move fast so he isn't going to be hanging around at FW long, especially if he knows he's comfortable at heavier weights anyway.

Hammersmith harrier wrote:I don't think so he only fought at lightweight because featherweight was scrapped and Rigo isn't the smallest of super bantamweights.

I think Rigo only weighs about 5 pounds heavy than the SBW limit come fight night, so I think he's comfortable at the weight.

Was reading Dan Rafael's blog earlier in the week and provided Lomachenko wins his next two, he's looking to match him with Rigo next spring. Would love to see it.

Really looking forward to seeing him fight tonight. Let's hope he is as good a pro as he was an amateur otherwise this could backfire massively.

This could be one of the greatest moves or greatest mistakes.

I can't wait for this fight, what a great great card!

Must admit I'm very impressed with him.......and pick him to win..........

looks the business.....Hope he is.......Boxing needs stars.

He is a superb fighter and i wont be surprised if he is a 2 weight champion before his 10th fight, very risky first fight though, however he has likely been having full on behind closed doors fights professional style for a long time in preparation so i have little doubt he is ready.

Paddy Power have gone ultra defensive on Lomachenko. He's 50-1 on. 16-1 on Ramirez looks a decent bet.

Wow.

Those body shots are viscous.

Very impressive stuff, still don't think he is ready for Salido yet though. If Cruz had won I think he would have won that fight.

He needs a few more fights at that level and then step up.

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=y9UYP-Ng3AA

Didn't stay up late to watch as had to be up early infront of the computer. Not too sure Ramirez didn't take a dive, couldn't see a clearly landed bomb in there? Rolled around like some waste of oxygen footballer to boot

Izzi wrote:http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=y9UYP-Ng3AA

Didn't stay up late to watch as had to be up early infront of the computer. Not too sure Ramirez didn't take a dive, couldn't see a clearly landed bomb in there? Rolled around like some waste of oxygen footballer to boot

Dive? Ramirez clearly came to win and got right in his face from the start and let his punches go, 2 short lefts to the body caught him at the end and it just done for him.

Think he looked class. Ramirez was just plowing forward obviously trying to see if Vasyl lacked pro power to stop him in his tracks, but there was plenty of sting in his punches.

While Ramirez came forward, he was just trying to smother Vasyl but I think his defense was very good and Ramirez could not really land any clean shots on him and threw a lot at him in those opening rounds. When Vasyl let his hands go he landed some beautiful combinations.

I think maybe Vasyl could have countered a bit more than he did but over all I think he is ready for the challenge..

Izzi wrote:http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=y9UYP-Ng3AA

Didn't stay up late to watch as had to be up early infront of the computer. Not too sure Ramirez didn't take a dive, couldn't see a clearly landed bomb in there? Rolled around like some waste of oxygen footballer to boot

He rolled because it hurt so bad. If you watch the next couple of minutes after the stoppage, he keeps trying to get up and can't even bring himself to get back onto his stool he's in so much pain.

djlovesyou wrote:

Izzi wrote:http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=y9UYP-Ng3AA

Didn't stay up late to watch as had to be up early infront of the computer. Not too sure Ramirez didn't take a dive, couldn't see a clearly landed bomb in there? Rolled around like some waste of oxygen footballer to boot

He rolled because it hurt so bad. If you watch the next couple of minutes after the stoppage, he keeps trying to get up and can't even bring himself to get back onto his stool he's in so much pain.

Just saying I didn't see a punch that looked like he even rolled through with it.

Body shots often have delayed effects.

Aye, Look at Hatton's on Castillo, Khans on Maidana for reference. Takes a couple seconds for the pain to kick in and they drop to the canvas.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_DI5aktum7g

Looks like i'm alone in thinking he was a shade disappointing. I thought he lost the 2nd and 3rd. Very good win for a debut, and once Ramirez slowed he took him apart very well in the fourth. However, he Shipped a lot of leather to the body when pressured back. I'm sure it's something they can work on, because I'm fairly sure that future opponents will think if they can pressure him they can get to him. Though clearly, in order to do that, they'll be shipping some themselves.

Obviously a very talented fighter, and Ramirez came to fight. I'm sure he'll go far, and his style is box office, but I'm not sure I'd be looking at a world title in his next fight if I was managing him.

In fairness to the guy I suppose it's like turning pro as a tennis player and getting a top 50 rank Tennis player instead of a 300/400 guy........

Learn at the deep end quickly..

Milky is right that he did look a bit sloppy at times.........But I for one thought he did very well considering who he fought first up.........

I had it 29-27.........at the time of the stoppage.

There is a good side to this - if he goes on as he means to .... He might be the first boxer who's record can't be dismissed

ShahenshahG wrote:Aye, Look at Hatton's on Castillo, Khans on Maidana for reference. Takes a couple seconds for the pain to kick in and they drop to the canvas.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_DI5aktum7g

Seen both before, live. Am just saying he didn't appear to snap/roll through the punch which led me to the original thought I posted.