Wales vs Argentina

First topic message reminder :

Date: Saturday, November 16

Kick-off: 14:30 GMT

Venue: Millennium Stadium, Cardiff

Referee: John Lacey (Ireland)

Assistant referees: Steve Walsh (Australia), Lourens van der Merwe (South Africa)

Television match official: Simon McDowell (Ireland)

Assessor: Lyndon Bray (SANZAR)


The teams:

Wales:

15 Leigh Halfpenny, 14 George North, 13 Cory Allen, 12 Scott Williams, 11 Liam Williams, 10 Dan Biggar, 9 Mike Phillips, 8 Toby Faletau, 7 Justin Tipuric, 6 Sam Warburton (c), 5 Alun-Wyn Jones, 4 Bradley Davies, 3 Rhodri Jones, 2 Richard Hibbard, 1 Gethin Jenkins.

Replacements: 16 Ken Owens, 17 Paul James, 18 Samson Lee, 19 Luke Charteris, 20 Ryan Jones, 21 Lloyd Williams, 22 James Hook, 23 Ashley Beck.


Argentina:

15 Joaquín Tuculet, 14 Horacio Agulla, 13 Marcelo Bosch, 12 Santiago Fernández, 11 Santiago Cordero, 10 Nicolás Sanchez, 9 Martin Landajo, 8 Juan Manuel Leguizamón (c), 7 Julio Farias Cabello, 6 Pablo Matera, 5 Patricio Albacete, 4 Manuel Carizza, 3 Maximiliano Bustos, 2 Eusebio Guiñazú, 1 Marcos Ayerza.

Replacements: 16 Santiago Iglesias Valdez, 17 Nahuel Lobo, 18 Matías Díaz, 19 Tomás Lavanini, 20 Leonardo Senatore, 21 Tomas Cubelli, 22 Gabriel Ascárate, 23 Lucas González Amorosino.

Definitely at odds with the reported tactics of kick in own half, run in the opposition half  

I can't see them risking Sc Williams next week, if he's likely to be fit for th Oz game then I very much doubt he will play.

Hook was due to play 10 but I would expect to see him in the centre now.

Gatland has said there will be wholesale changes and he's going to give a lot of the 1st teamers a rest, maybe some will back up off the bench.

bedfordwelsh wrote:I can't see them risking Sc Williams next week, if he's likely to be fit for th Oz game then I very much doubt he will play.

Hook was due to play 10 but I would expect to see him in the centre now.

Perhaps the old Ospreys line of
13 Beck
12 Hook
10 Biggar
9 Phillips

and
Front row
3 Lee
2 Owens
1 James

I can see Tuperic continuing at 7, with Ryan Jones at 6 or 8, maybe resting AWJ or making him captain and resting Warbs, and bringing in Charteris

1. Paul James
2. Ken Owen
3. Samson Lee
4. Luke Charteris
5. Ian Evans
6. Andrew Coombes
7. Justin Tipuric
8. Ryan Jones (c)
9. Lloyd Williams
10. James Hook
11. Eli Walker (Is he fit? - Hallam Amos )
12. Ashley Beck
13. Owen Williams (back training this week)
14. Tom Prydie
15. Liam Williams

16. Emyr Phillips
17. Ryan Bevington
18. Rhodri Jones
19. Alun Wyn Jones
20. Dan Lydiate
21. Rhodri Jones
22. Rhys Priestland
23. George North

bedfordwelsh wrote:Gatland has said there will be wholesale changes and he's going to give a lot of the 1st teamers a rest, maybe some will back up off the bench.

I do not like that one bit. Has he not learned from past experience? Drawing with Fiji, losing out in Japan. Tonga beat Scotland last year and France in the World Cup. I don't feel we learn much by a development team struggling against another team. It's unrealistic too as the development team is never likely to play together again - I can't see a situation where all 15/22 first team players are injured at the same time, so why put a team out with wholesale changes that will never actually be a 'team' in the future?! Keep a core of players in and yes, certainly add a few inexperienced guys, but I really dislike completely 2nd string teams.

Surely Wales will have to rest some players? If not there will be players who have played 4 games of 80 minutes in 4 weeks, surely that's a recipe for burn out.

Gatland has said he will go to the regions for reinforcements so, Gareth Maul, probably the best centre not in the squad, or his team mate Warren or one of the Dragons youngsters could fill a gap.

Hook, Liam Williams, Owen Williams (or Maul Scarlets), Beck, Prydie, Priestland/Biggar (40 mins each), Phillips, Bevington, Owen, R. Jones, Charteris, Evans (Coombs if not fit), Lydiate, Ryan (Capt), Tipuric.

Bench, Gethin, Hibbard, Lee, Davies/Coombs, Warburton, Rhod Williams, Priestland/Biggar, Maul? (or Amos)

wales606 wrote:1. Paul James
2. Ken Owen
3. Samson Lee
4. Luke Charteris
5. Ian Evans
6. Andrew Coombes
7. Justin Tipuric
8. Ryan Jones (c)
9. Lloyd Williams
10. James Hook
11. Eli Walker (Is he fit? - Hallam Amos )
12. Ashley Beck
13. Owen Williams (back training this week)
14. Tom Prydie
15. Liam Williams

16. Emyr Phillips
17. Ryan Bevington
18. Rhodri Jones
19. Alun Wyn Jones
20. Dan Lydiate
21. Rhodri Jones
22. Rhys Priestland
23. George North

606,

James isn't available he's going back to Bath so he's free for the Oz game.

This is a good game to try a few fringe players and give a few lads who have only played one game another run out.

If James has to go back to Bath during the international window then so be it but if not he has to start.

We need to keep some core experience in the team so the balance has to be right. I'd be keen to see Gethin and AWJ start but maybe give and Phillips a rest.

Geth
Owens
Jones
AWJ
Davies
Shingler
Tipuric
Jones
R Williams
Priestland
Amos
Hook
S Williams
North
Halfpenny

Yes north at 13, now is the time to try it v Tinga

Scratch wrote:Yes north at 13, now is the time to try it v Tinga

It was mentioned on Scrum V earlier..

maestegmafia wrote:

Scratch wrote:Yes north at 13, now is the time to try it v Tinga

It was mentioned on Scrum V earlier..

Cheeky old Lyn Jones (with smirk on his face) also mentioned there's a certain Welsh centre playing at Bath.

I would've though he would have bigged up a few Dragons players to be honest

Just saw the highlights on the YouTube. Funny how Phillips had the legs to run 70 metres, but didn't again last week when chasing back an SA break.

Particularly enjoyed North and Faletau's tries.

Possibly because we were under the cosh from the get go against SA ?

munkian wrote:Possibly because we were under the cosh from the get go against SA ?

No disagreement there. SA were a phenominal force last week. Looks like there is little between SA and NZ.

Loads of positives on Scrum V about the attacking and defencive work that the squad had done in between the two games.

maestegmafia wrote: Looks like there is little between SA and NZ.

  It's a real shame Wales aren't playing NZ.  

Scrumpy wrote:

maestegmafia wrote: Looks like there is little between SA and NZ.

  It's a real shame Wales aren't playing NZ.  

Why?

I think four internationals is more than enough.

He's on some kind of jingoist crusade that England's hard fought loss was considerably better than Wale's

At least you'd get to see how close SA are to NZ.

munkian wrote:He's on some kind of jingoist crusade that England's hard fought loss was considerably better than Wale's

 
Whatever fella. At least I'm not trying to de-rail this thread unlike others that are doing just that else where.

Scrumpy wrote:At least you'd get to see how close SA are to NZ.

You've beaten NZ much more recently than you have SA.

I would've rather played NZ - may have some centres left standing

munkian wrote:He's on some kind of jingoist crusade that England's hard fought loss was considerably better than Wale's

Ha ha ha...! That's amusing, not meaning to let him drag this thread too far off topic but. surely England need to beat Wales for anyone to consider them a better team? It's been a few years since they have done that and a very long time since they consistently did so.

Maybe Wales have been lucky in those games and have papered over some cracks!

Looking at the IRB rankings I believe England should put all their efforts into beating the teams above them and not worry to much about lower ranked teams, those wins will come, but its a shame Wales can't raise their game to those level when they play SH teams, you never know you might get lucky their too.

Scrumpy, you are doing the exact same thing as others on other threads, Im trying to decide if you're being a very clever wum or worse, not doing it purposefully  

Scrumpy is probably feeling a little awkward/embarrassed for predicting Argentina would be the ones with a point to prove.

He's not doing any harm.

What is going on with argentina though. There are not just bad this year . I would be asking serious questions in regards to the coaching staff if I was a fan..

To be honest I thought Arg would put in a performance and my pride is hurt, good win for Wales as you can only play what is in front of you.

No comment isn't really about Wales. There performed well and deserve credit. But that doesn't tell us the full story about Argentina.. they are totally demoralised

"Maybe Wales have been lucky in those games"

You've got a point, we only scraped past you by 27 points last time out.

If England want to kid themselves that because they are higher in the rankings than Wales that somehow they are a side in a better position to compete for the RWC then have at it, with just 1 x 6 Nations under their belt in 10 years and numerous squandered opportunities, that would be as foolish as Wales saying we are only losing to SH teams by a couple of points so things can't be all bad.

I didn't think this thread was about England dude.

But yep we will have a shot. We are devolping nicely and have home advantage

Its always about England!  

Agree re Arg, they looked tired in the second half. they dont really hav an 'off-season' as most do though as the players are all over the place?

mystiroakey wrote:I didn't think this thread was about England dude.

But yep we will have a shot. We are devolping nicely and have home advantage

 

Should've given us a Cardiff game v you guys, blydi selfish RFU

Well if you did that I think we would be asking for a lot more in return. Perhaps you could side with us on the HC deal!!

Scrumpy wrote:Maybe Wales have been lucky in those games and have papered over some cracks!

Looking at the IRB rankings I believe England should put all their efforts into beating the teams above them and not worry to much about lower ranked teams, those wins will come, but its a shame Wales can't raise their game to those level when they play SH teams, you never know you might get lucky their too.

That will be a big mistake Scrumpy.

Firstly when you forget to focus on the teams below you, they catch you. Secondly Wales and England has to get out of the same group to get further in the RWC, the second placed team faces SA in the semi final.

If they beat SA then they meet NZ in the semi final.

Would you rather play SA and NZ before getting to the final, or an easier route?

Think this is right….Win group A and based on results you would expect to play Samoa in the 1/4 and France or ireland in the semi.

winner of the group gets to the final.

but its one tough group!!

looks that way, so if wales can't beat AUs now then i can't see them doing it - at twickenham - in a RWC…..Eng Wales will therefore be a massive game and i think this 6 Nations is the last time Wales will meet England there pre roc

mystiroakey wrote:What is going on with argentina though. There are not just bad this year . I would be asking serious questions in regards to the coaching staff if I was a fan..

Argentina just changed their coach and are blooding a few young players during the injury absence of the more famed ones.

Scratch wrote:looks that way, so if wales can't beat AUs now then i can't see them doing it - at twickenham - in a RWC…..Eng Wales will therefore be a massive game and i think this 6  Nations is the last time Wales will meet England there pre roc

Wales play England in the 2015 six nations before the RWC.

but that is in cardiff right?

Your right mate, sorry misread your post..

Scratch wrote:looks that way, so if wales can't beat AUs now then i can't see them doing it - at twickenham - in a RWC…..Eng Wales will therefore be a massive game and i think this 6  Nations is the last time Wales will meet England there pre roc

if we all beat each other you may not even need to beat AUS to top the group!!

wales won't beat aux unless they do it now, just can't see how we could unless england hammer them the week before and even that would probably mean they were smarting….key game for us is v england.

they will have 'home' and 'host' advantage but, if the last time we played them there we won, then we would expect to offset that advantage.