Haye Fury off - Haye to retire

First topic message reminder :

Haye just released a statement, told to retire on doctors advice due to a shoulder injury... Says the fight in Feb cancelled defo!!!

Shocking tea cosy.

And a few doubts for me.

NOT FOR ME.....HE LOOKS LUVERLEY  

He can be proud of what he has done in boxing. I don't think he was scared of fighting Fury just scared to lose to King Muppet.

Still not convinced at all by the suddenness and the timing of it all, its all to convenient for me. We all know Strongy has strong anti Haye feelings I along with others dont go that far but I wont 100% buy in to what we have been told by Haye and his pals about this.

Haito wrote:Still not convinced at all by the suddenness and the timing of it all, its all to convenient for me. We all know Strongy has strong anti Haye feelings I along with others dont go that far but I wont 100% buy in to what we have been told by Haye and his pals about this.  

I've never seen any indication of this, are you sure you're not on drugs?

Why would Haye duck Fury?

Haye wouldnt avoid Fury in a million years. It was his dream easy money payday. But its perfectly believable that he discovered his shoulder injury before the fist fiht and decided to use a cut to try and postpone it and keep surgery under the radar to give himself time to recover. Its a hell of a coincidence that he first gets a cut and then postpones while he discovers a little niggle is actually a career threatning injury that needs surgery. This is Haye here, a guy with a track record for making up BS and pulling out of fights when its suits him. All kept so quiet. A niggle discovered during a scan and then 24hrs later he is already on the operating table? Sounds mighty suspicious. If Haye had cancelled his fight with Fury initially saying he needed shoulder surgery then Fury would have moved on so Haye could easily have used the cut to try and postpone and keep Fury at the table. Haye was only hanging around boxing because of these pay day fights. I dont think he cared at all about winning titles. Once his Fury fight went up in smoke I dont think he would be arsed hanging around and actually taking tougher fights for less money.

catchweight wrote:Haye wouldnt avoid Fury in a million years. It was his dream easy money payday. But its perfectly believable that he discovered his shoulder injury before the fist fiht and decided to use a cut to try and postpone it and keep surgery under the radar to give himself time to recover. Its a hell of a coincidence that he first gets a cut and then postpones while he discovers a little niggle is actually a career threatning injury that needs surgery. This is Haye here, a guy with a track record for making up BS and pulling out of fights when its suits him. All kept so quiet. A niggle discovered during a scan and then 24hrs later he is already on the operating table? Sounds mighty suspicious. If Haye had cancelled his fight with Fury initially saying he needed shoulder surgery then Fury would have moved on so Haye could easily have used the cut to try and postpone and keep Fury at the table. Haye was only hanging around boxing because of these pay day fights. I dont think he cared at all about winning titles. Once his Fury fight went up in smoke I dont think he would be arsed hanging around and actually taking tougher fights for less money.

This is pretty much my take on it.

 A week and a bit away from the board and it's like coming back to an episode of Boxing X-Files with all these conspiracy theories.

You have people saying 'how can he suddenly need major surgery'..then in the exact same argument talk about how he has previous for pulling out of fights with injuries. Surely this actually suggests he has a career spanned with injuries which have forced him to pull out of fights and finally they have taken it's toll?

He has always been a bit of a buffoon at times when promoting fights but I don't think for one minute this makes him the type to lie his way out of a bout with Fury..as has been mentioned it was hardly like he was stepping into the ring with the 2nd coming of Ali (despite what Tyson himself may think).

Unless anyone on here is a physician, which I don't think we have to my knowledge, I don't think anyone is in a position to say whether a niggling injury can turn into a career threatening one in the space of 48 hours. Whose to say the injury can't be a follow on from the back injury which many doubted a few years ago?

Then their is his inactivity...something which nearly everyone, including myself hold against him, yet plenty here seem to have completely forgotten about that when it comes to the increased potential of injury which it creates. Whilst he may have kept himself in good shape he wouldn't be doing the sparring or same weight intensity training he did every day as he would when in camp. It is plausible that after 15 months out of the ring and very few fights in the last 3 years that his body just couldn't cope with the explosive power that he relies upon. He is also 33 years old now...not old in today's heavyweight era but Haye isn't like most of today's hevyweights, in fact he is a throwback to the old who were light, mobile and with fast hands..all things which limits the longevity of a fighters peak.

I mean I know it's David Haye and history suggests it's very difficult to get a rational view on the guy on this board but jesus some of the posts on this topic are bordering on the white coats getting a call to lock some people up. If he came out and moaned about injuries...i.e. his toe, his back, his hand...people moaned and held it against him. Now we have the same people saying 'why didn't he come out and say it's been a niggling injury'?? Exasperating is the word I would use to read some of this guff!

He was more talk than substance when it came to his heavyweight reign and ultimately it didn't deliver to the standard many had hoped. However he gave boxings 'prize' division a shot in the arm which it very much needed as before he stepped up it was on deaths door and had been for years. As a result of him spouting his mouth off it gave the division the platform needed to grab casual fans interest...you'd have to argue that on the grand scheme of things he was good for the division. He has given the Brits...such as Fury...someone to aim for and call out (increasing their hype/profile)...put the Klitchsko's into the media's glare..something they were incapable of doing on their own..and ended his career as a 2 weight world champion. Not to bad I would say.

Im on the same page as you owen. Im not his biggest fan but dont buy in to the conspiracy theory of him cutting himself and definitely dont see that he yas bottled it. The only thing I can see as being not factual is the career ending bit. There is a chance he has had word from vitali and been offered more money for a fight later next year so exaggerated the exact extent of the injury. This way he can go with the old plucky brit tale of risking his health to fight the evil eastern European.

Im not convinced we have heard the last of mr haye. Lets see how the recovery gpes

owen10ozzy wrote: A week and a bit away from the board and it's like coming back to an episode of Boxing X-Files with all these conspiracy theories.

You have people saying 'how can he suddenly need major surgery'..then in the exact same argument talk about how he has previous for pulling out of fights with injuries. Surely this actually suggests he has a career spanned with injuries which have forced him to pull out of fights and finally they have taken it's toll?

He has always been a bit of a buffoon at times when promoting fights but I don't think for one minute this makes him the type to lie his way out of a bout with Fury..as has been mentioned it was hardly like he was stepping into the ring with the 2nd coming of Ali (despite what Tyson himself may think).

Unless anyone on here is a physician, which I don't think we have to my knowledge, I don't think anyone is in a position to say whether a niggling injury can turn into a career threatening one in the space of 48 hours. Whose to say the injury can't be a follow on from the back injury which many doubted a few years ago?

I mean I know it's David Haye and history suggests it's very difficult to get a rational view on the guy on this board but jesus some of the posts on this topic are bordering on the white coats getting a call to lock some people up. If he came out and moaned about injuries...i.e. his toe, his back, his hand...people moaned and held it against him. Now we have the same people saying 'why didn't he come out and say it's been a niggling injury'?? Exasperating is the word I would use to read some of this guff!

Have to take anything you say with a pinch of salt. You have the impartiality of an Arab.

I would take a sportsman's view and on the radio last night one in particular said this just does not happen. A niggle doesn't end a career. It is either a longstanding problem or a major trauma that ends careers.

I do not believe Haye is ducking Fury but I do think he either has something else lined up or simply doesn't have the motivation for boxing anymore.

spencerclarke wrote:Im on the same page as you owen. Im not his biggest fan but dont buy in to the conspiracy theory of him cutting himself and definitely dont see that he yas bottled it. The only thing I can see as being not factual is the career ending bit. There is a chance he has had word from vitali and been offered more money for a fight later next year so exaggerated the exact extent of the injury. This way he can go with the old plucky brit tale of risking his health to fight the evil eastern European.

Im not convinced we have heard the last of mr haye. Lets see how the recovery gpes

Only problem I see with that is that the Fury fight was such easy money, why not take £5m for wiping him out and then another £5-10m for taking on Fury after 6 months recuperation?

What a terrible career from such a promising start. Who'd have though that the only highlight Haye would have after beating Mormeck (and Macca) all those years ago would be a boring points win over Valuev.

So it's not the toe, or the back, or the eye this time - it's the shoulder. For as much Poopie as Fury spouts, he was right about Haye.

Not sure you can call unified cruiserweight world champion, heavyweight champion, a terrible career personally MC. A lot of fighters would give their left nut to be able to call themselves that.

hampo171 wrote:Not sure you can call unified cruiserweight world champion, heavyweight champion, a terrible career personally MC. A lot of fighters would give their left nut to be able to call themselves that.

Yeah because fight fans will be remembering Hayes stella Cruiserweight stint in 20 years time along with such great names.

Really?

He had the tools to be something but not the heart to go all the way and make a real name for himself.

I don’t think it is a terrible career but there is an air of disappointment hanging over it to some respect. As most of us will recall, based on his style at cruiser, most of us genuinely thought and hoped he would be the guy to bring some much needed excitement to the heavyweight division, which has not really happened. Suspect when most of us look back on his heavyweight career we will remember it for inactivity, withdrawals from fights and as many dull performances as there were high spots, which tended only to come against overmatched opponents.

People fondly remember fighters much worse than Haye.

Unfortunately people cannot act rational when his name is mentioned.

ONETWOFOREVER wrote:

hampo171 wrote:Not sure you can call unified cruiserweight world champion, heavyweight champion, a terrible career personally MC. A lot of fighters would give their left nut to be able to call themselves that.

Yeah because fight fans will be remembering Hayes stella Cruiserweight stint in 20 years time along with such great names.

Really?

He had the tools to be something but not the heart to go all the way and make a real name for himself.

But it wasn't if he would be remembered, it was whether it was a terrible career, which it clearly wasn't. Could of done more, but not something I'd describe as terrible.

He's the second greatest cruiser of alltime.............Though It's not the greatest division...

But the fact he managed to win a WBA heavy as well..................Puts him in the great Brit category....

Well managed for sure................But he achieved.

Lumbering_Jack wrote:People fondly remember fighters much worse than Haye.

This is very true, to pick up on the point the Captain has made on another thread one only needs to look at Cooper, pretty much openly acknowledged he avoided Liston like the plague but has done him no harm in terms of the affection held for him. 101 perfectly valid criticisms can be leveled at Haye but irrespective of what we think of his performance Haye did step in the ring with the best heavy of his generation.

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:He's the second greatest cruiser of alltime.............Though It's not the greatest division...

But the fact he managed to win a WBA heavy as well..................Puts him in the great Brit category....

Well managed for sure................But he achieved.

A great Brit who would be an average American is what I suspect you mean.

Not at cruiserweight..

Like it or not Mate..........He would be an average American..........

But that wasn't my point....Don't be precious.

Rowley wrote:

Lumbering_Jack wrote:People fondly remember fighters much worse than Haye.

This is very true, to pick up on the point the Captain has made on another thread one only needs to look at Cooper, pretty much openly acknowledged he avoided Liston like the plague but has done him no harm in terms of the affection held for him. 101 perfectly valid criticisms can be leveled at Haye but irrespective of what we think of his performance Haye did step in the ring with the best heavy of his generation.

I don't see how that merits Haye inclusion into the BHOF as you clearly allude to jeff.

Clearly allude to, really? I would picket Canastota to see them not vote Haye into the HOF so god only knows how you got that from what I wrote.

owen10ozzy wrote:Unless anyone on here is a physician, which I don't think we have to my knowledge

You called...

The first issue here is that we are unaware of the full medical details.  He may have sustained a sudden rupture in training requiring emergency surgery and retirement.

Of course - as we understand it, in terms of his training cycle he should not be peaking at this point, decreasing, but by no means eliminating the possibility of sudden rupture.

The implication from his words and press releases is that this has been a problem that has been bothering him for some time.  This would be supported by the fact that he flat out refused cancellation compensation in the fight contract with Fury.

I do not believe that Haye has ducked Fury here - that, I feel, is improbable.  However - to suggest that he has not messed Fury around is incongruous with the facts as we know them.

There's a few doctors about fyi Ozzy - emancipator used to be around 18 months ago (haven't seen him of late, but haven't been here much of late either) and is a bit more senior than me, so could shed some light on the situation.

emancipator was a doctor?????  

ONETWOFOREVER wrote:

Rowley wrote:

Lumbering_Jack wrote:People fondly remember fighters much worse than Haye.

This is very true, to pick up on the point the Captain has made on another thread one only needs to look at Cooper, pretty much openly acknowledged he avoided Liston like the plague but has done him no harm in terms of the affection held for him. 101 perfectly valid criticisms can be leveled at Haye but irrespective of what we think of his performance Haye did step in the ring with the best heavy of his generation.

I don't see how that merits Haye inclusion into the BHOF as you clearly allude to jeff.

And yet we're expected to believe he's ducked that oaf Tyson Fury...twice!

hampo171 wrote:Not sure you can call unified cruiserweight world champion, heavyweight champion, a terrible career personally MC. A lot of fighters would give their left nut to be able to call themselves that.

Haye had all of two title fights @ CW, and one of them was vs Maccaranelli!. For all the talent and hype Haye had, his career at heavyweight was pretty awful. The only memorable part of Haye's HW career was when Monte Barratt tried jumping over the top rope and landed on his face.

Won four belts........More than anyone else.........I believe........

Two weight champion.........

No one is asying he's ray Leonard but that's enough to put him in the hat with other modern greats on this spectred isle........

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:Won four belts........More than anyone else.........I believe........

Two weight champion.........

No one is asying he's ray Leonard but that's enough to put him in the hat with other modern greats on this spectred isle........

So the UK is haunted but Haye wouldn't be capable of cutting his face.   It's hard to know what's make believe.

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:Won four belts........More than anyone else.........I believe........

Two weight champion.........

No one is asying he's ray Leonard but that's enough to put him in the hat with other modern greats on this spectred isle........

He's up there with the likes of Herbie Hide. So much potential so few memorable moments.

Mayweathers cellmate wrote:

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:Won four belts........More than anyone else.........I believe........

Two weight champion.........

No one is asying he's ray Leonard but that's enough to put him in the hat with other modern greats on this spectred isle........

He's up there with the likes of Herbie Hide. So much potential so few memorable moments.

He believed the world waited on his every move. Big ego's lead to serious delusion.


He'll be back in the ring again. He's no good at anything else.

I dont think Haye is deluded at all. Hes been lucky enough to come along at a time where talent is nearly non existent in the divisions he boxes in and he has exploited peoples desire for interest in a good exciting heavyweight champion shamelessly through though media while his own actual contribution has been mainly stinking rip off ppv fights against crap opposition. He should have been given them bums rush after his effort against Klitschko but that lack of any alternative to the Klitschko drudgery means it doesnt really matter how often he is exposed as boxings equivalent of a tourist trap he can can keep coming back. I think Haye knows all this and if anything probably cant believe his luck.

It's surely up to Haye Whether he takes his Doctors advice. I'm sure he would have preferred to make a few million pounds for an easy fight with Fury but what would you do if you had the choice? risk the chance of stuffing your shoulder up properly or retire.