Is a 50% win ratio good enough for Welsh fans?

First topic message reminder :

Since June Wales's record is Played 10, Won 5, Lost 5, Is that good enough for the reigning 6 Nation champions?

Wins against - Japan, Argentina, Tonga, Italy and France
Defeats against - Aus, SA, Japan, Ireland and England


To keep some of you happier!

Since October Wales's record is Played 8, Won 4, Lost 4, Is that good enough for the reigning 6 Nation champions?

Wins against - Argentina, Tonga, Italy and France
Defeats against - Aus, SA, Ireland and England

  


I know teams go through rough patches now and then but even so with the players they have they should be doing better than a 50% win ratio.
Has Gatland taken this golden generation as far as he can?

This isn't a wind up so please don't take it as such, I just think a team like Wales should be doing better with the players they have. With the RWC getting closer is it time to ring the changes or stick with what you have, which you already know isn't good enough against the big teams?

Biltong wrote:Gentlemen, you are starting to try my patience, each and every one of you who has been involved with winding up other posters, making remarks of a snide, unpleasant or sarcastic manner towards another are in line for some corrective measures.

I don't really care whether you are anti English, Anti Welsh, Anti Irish or for that matter anti human race.

It is becoming pathetic to say the least, we are trying not to take action against every minor infringement (ie. letting the game flow) and rather taking action against repeat infringements.

If these petty squabbles continue, we may have to call the game off and all have a quiet final six nations weekend.

Start using your foe buttons, or alternatively simply learn not to respond when you are being offended.

And most of all, behave like adults, this is enough now.

As of this moment I will be collating data on every poster who ignores this request for proper adult behaviour, he mods will discuss each individual whether he/she was reported or not and decide upon the approriate action.

Decided whether you want to be around for this coming weekend.

      

And not just on this thread Bil.

Some of you really need calm down and accept that not all rugby fans opinion about a country that isn't there own is a wum, dig, etc...

Some of you need to learn to contribute in a more positive manner, this is a perfectly sensible topic if people are willing to contribute to it and not attack the poster Just because they have pre conceived ideas planted in their minds by other posters!

Don't always believe the hype!

Scrumpy out of interest an apologies if been asked but why just pick results from June?

Why not!

Also why worry!


10 games is a nice round number to work out percentages  

I've altered the OP to help some of you feel happier

Unfortunately it's still a 50 percent record since October, is that good enough for the champions?

I wouldn't be happy if it was England and I would want something to change quickly. I'd also want my fellow rugby fans to talk about it on sites such as this.

Is continually coming second good enough for England fans?
This isn't a wum but a serious question based on recent history.

Taffineastbourne wrote:Is continually coming second good enough for England fans?
This isn't a wum but a serious question based on recent history.

Tackle out taff.   

Stay on topic dear chap or start you own topic, you are allowed!

But seeing as you asked I'm very happy, as it's clear we have made progress and apart from a few moments of Indecision from a couple of new caps and a poor player we have performed well, here's to great a 2015.

When is wales going to blood some new props?

You were looking for trouble with this one Scrumpy

Not intentionally sarg, I was hoping as rugby fans we could discuss this topical topic in a sensible way.

Scrumpy wrote:Stay on topic dear chap or start you own topic, you are allowed!

But seeing as you asked I'm very happy, as it's clear we have made progress and apart from a few moments of Indecision from a couple of new caps and a poor player we have performed well, here's to great a 2015.

When is wales going to blood some new props?

That is the question.  

Sgt_Pooly wrote:You were looking for trouble with this one Scrumpy

Most people agree with you.Oh How I miss Hersh  

So am I 'as an England fan' allowed o talk about Wales?   

On a more positive note for Wales fans   : Wales recent win ratio is 75% vs England (and I'm English).
Wales has been England's bogey side for a while (was Ireland before that) but I'm relieved to have got that off our backs last Sunday. Not quite enough to win the 6N I fear, so no, Taff I E coming 2nd is not really good enough, and we rue not putting away a poor French side when we had them by the throat.

But I am very encouraged at the general direction of travel for Bomber's young squad, plus those returning from injury soon. We will need this depth of players and the hard experiences we can expect in NZ this 'summer' to temper further toughness into the young squad. I think the future is rosy  the future is England's.

gregortree wrote:On a more positive note for Wales fans   : Wales recent win ratio is 75% vs England (and I'm English).

Surely 0% (and Im 1/4 Welsh)?

Joking aside this is the eternal looping debate isnt it. Many Welsh fans genuinely do believe that a head to head record and number of 6 nations trophies in a given period is a fairer indicator of who is the better side than looking at performances and results in all games. The IRB rankings (the target of their vitriol after Scrumpy) have consistently argued the other case, that the better teams are measured by their success against all opponents and England have rarely fallen behind Wales in these during the last few years.
Are Japan as good as "Wales B" recent record? Nah.

The win loss record thing is a bit of a canard in many ways when looking at such a small sample of results, the simple fact is though that the Welsh fans are clearly expecting better from their side. Sad thing is someone has to lose, and when the sides are as evenly matrched as they are in the 6 nations even decent teams cant afford to take their foot off the gas if they wish to retain a positive winning record.
Which Wales will most likely finish the tournament with despite being off the boil for 3 of the 4 played so far.

 

I think if Wales had beaten England and proven that they still had the psychological edge then I believe Welsh fans would be satisfied.

Now it seems that Ireland and England are progressing better than Wales.

Wales still have issues that Gatland has not resolved like that of halfbacks and the lineout.

Lancaster and Schmidt seem to have long term plans for their teams.

Gatland has proven himself to be a competent coach though has his shortcomings. If he makes the right tweaks than him and Wales can develop just as successfully as England and Ireland in my opinion.

The consolation I suppose is that Gatland is still head and shoulders above the Scottish,French and Italian coaches.

If I was Welsh I would hope that Wales' loss to Ireland and England in this 6 nations made Gatland see that he needs to make the necessary changes. Wales are a good side but are not performing as well as they could be. This is down to Gatland and the coaches.

I see the mods have taped him up for a while for his own good.

So Wales earned a 66% win ratio not 50% and are unbeaten at home this year and only once last year with an 80% win ratio since the last RWC, 1 Slam, 2 Championships and, ahem, 2 Triple Crowns. The 6 Nations take care of itself with this sort of incomparable performance.

Our challenge is now to beat SA and Aus this year. One will do, both would be better.

gregortree wrote:

     

Scrumpy wrote:Not intentionally sarg, I was hoping  as rugby fans we could discuss this topical topic in a sensible way.

As a despondent Scot having registered yet another damn poor spring tournament from a team who but for our go to (and sent off) player was the only first "Lion" playing..... then I think the "Lions Factor" has to be seriously considered as a sensible indicator in the analysis of the Welsh performance. Fatigue, Complacency, Unawareness can be the deadly characters in this pantomime.

Fatigue
Wales looked knackered during this 6Ns and as a number of ex players and referees have stated its not so much the physical tiredness but the mental fatigue. Players like AWJ, Halfpenny, Cuthbert, Adam Jones, Jenkins and Hibbard were a shadow of their pre Lions version. It was no major surprise that Liam Williams was the best welsh player last week-end.

Complacency.
The other major factor is Gatland has more or less played the same 23 for the best part of 24 months, he loves this tight ship of close knit group of players. He promotes inward confidence but the bi-product of that is his favoured sons seem to have become complacent of their place and hence not as hungry for success. There is no bigger motivator than losing your international jersey.

Unawareness
The circus that is currently the WRU, central contracts, player power etc. All this is distracting from Gatlands main mission and that is the 2015 WC, but it certainly didn't help this years 6Ns.

Finally Wales have not looked the same since Edwards was told he wasn't on the Lions coaching team (and I believe that was a few months before the 2013 6Ns).

If I look at say England or Ireland players and compare like for like positions in Wales, I would still say Wales are the better team when the players are on top of their game.

Looks like scrumpy has dropped into the psyche of he is now better than everyone because the team he supports won the triple crown! Aww bless him.