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Post by GSC on Tue 06 May 2014, 10:51 am

I wouldn't be upset, if it were limited to League 2 and below, and had a quota of English players with an age cap.
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Post by Duty281 on Tue 06 May 2014, 10:52 am

And what if fans of Oldham Athletic don't want to support Manchester United's youth team?

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Post by CFCNick on Tue 06 May 2014, 10:53 am

Well it's just an example. There'd be a mix of veterans and youth players. I just Oldham for proximity.

Not only would it benefit England but the standard of football in those leagues would dramatically improve.


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Post by Duty281 on Tue 06 May 2014, 10:54 am

GSC wrote:I wouldn't be upset, if it were limited to League 2 and below, and had a quota of English players with an age cap.

Quotas of English players are not allowed due to the fascist EU.

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Post by Duty281 on Tue 06 May 2014, 10:55 am

CFCNick wrote:Well it's just an example. There'd be a mix of veterans and youth players. I just Oldham for proximity.

Not only would it benefit England but the standard of football in those leagues would dramatically improve.

There's already reserve and youth leagues, you know.

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Post by CFCNick on Tue 06 May 2014, 10:56 am

Duty281 wrote:
GSC wrote:I wouldn't be upset, if it were limited to League 2 and below, and had a quota of English players with an age cap.

Quotas of English players are not allowed due to the fascist EU.

Well the FA and Football League could implement a transfer restriction on foreign imports like Serie A and MLS.

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Post by CFCNick on Tue 06 May 2014, 10:57 am

Duty281 wrote:
CFCNick wrote:Well it's just an example. There'd be a mix of veterans and youth players. I just Oldham for proximity.

Not only would it benefit England but the standard of football in those leagues would dramatically improve.

There's already reserve and youth leagues, you know.

And if they worked we wouldn't be having this discussion.

Established football league players playing in sides with the top youth players would be good. Reserve players aren't as good as most football league players. If they were they'd be in the football league.

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Post by GSC on Tue 06 May 2014, 10:58 am

You get a lot more from playing competitive games than youth or reserve leagues
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Post by CFCNick on Tue 06 May 2014, 11:01 am

Plus in this format the young players will get more exposure to playing in front of near full stadiums and pressure situations and that will help them when they make the breakthrough.


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Post by Duty281 on Tue 06 May 2014, 11:02 am

Which is why bigger clubs loan out players with potential to Football League teams.

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Post by GSC on Tue 06 May 2014, 11:04 am

Who have to learn a new style and gel with new teammates almost immediately on what might only be a 1 month loan.
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Post by Duty281 on Tue 06 May 2014, 11:04 am

It's a good learning curve and experience for them then, isn't it?

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Post by Dolphin Ziggler on Tue 06 May 2014, 11:05 am

Elitist fans at their best. Let's just get rid of league football because what the hell do those teams matter anyway?

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Post by CFCNick on Tue 06 May 2014, 11:07 am

Duty281 wrote:Which is why clubs loan out players to Football League teams.

It clearly doesn't work. Imagine not just having one player from a Prem club at a lower league team but say 10+ mixed in with 10+ established players of the minor league team. These players will grow with each other. You could call up top performers to test there growth and in turn send down players in ruts to get a change of scenery and get back on form.

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Post by Duty281 on Tue 06 May 2014, 11:11 am

CFCNick wrote:
Duty281 wrote:Which is why clubs loan out players to Football League teams.

It clearly doesn't work. Imagine not just having one player from a Prem club at a lower league team but say 10+ mixed in with 10+ established players of the minor league team. These players will grow with each other. You could call up top performers to test there growth and in turn send down players in ruts to get a change of scenery and get back on form.

And to the fans (do you remember that type of person?) of lower-league teams like Plymouth, Exeter, Luton, all with their own history, who don't wish their teams to become a Chelsea 'B' team, you say...?

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Post by CFCNick on Tue 06 May 2014, 11:20 am

Duty281 wrote:
CFCNick wrote:
Duty281 wrote:Which is why clubs loan out players to Football League teams.

It clearly doesn't work. Imagine not just having one player from a Prem club at a lower league team but say 10+ mixed in with 10+ established players of the minor league team. These players will grow with each other. You could call up top performers to test there growth and in turn send down players in ruts to get a change of scenery and get back on form.

And to the fans (do you remember that type of person?) of lower-league teams like Plymouth, Exeter, Luton, all with their own history, who don't wish their teams to become a Chelsea 'B' team, you say...?

I already said. It's not about creating B teams. All clubs will keep their identity and history. They'd just have half the team made up of a certain bigger clubs top youth prospects + the best players in their current squad at the time of changing to this format.

The only things changing would be no promotion from League 1, and no relegation from the Championship.

Other than that the lower leagues would still run as promotion and relegation between the two plus they have the FL Trophy. They'd just have 50% of all players coming from bigger clubs.

Luton Town will still be Luton Town, and so on and so forth. Just that everyone involved with the club would be paid and contracted to whatever big club they're initially assigned to.

My suggestion that the parent clubs take on the lower league clubs financial responsibilities is also more sustainable than the current model. All the lower clubs would have to worry about is gate and merchandise income.

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Post by Duty281 on Tue 06 May 2014, 11:24 am

What an awful, awful idea that is.

Murdering the Football League after 125 years.

So Plymouth and Yeovil would have no chance of getting back to English football's second tier? Or Portsmouth? Or Bradford?

And 50% of their players would be...no, I'm sorry I can't go on.

Disgraceful idea.

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Post by CFCNick on Tue 06 May 2014, 11:26 am

Ok. So keep promotion and relegation as it is. So say the youth players that would have been at Wolves and Brentford this season will be assigned to Yeovil and Barnsley next season.

Does that sound better?

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Post by Duty281 on Tue 06 May 2014, 11:29 am

How about we maintain the present system and, as Olly alluded to, start to invest in some more top-level coaching?

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Post by CFCNick on Tue 06 May 2014, 11:31 am

You can throw all the money you want at coaching. It won't make magical football geniuses appear.

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Post by Duty281 on Tue 06 May 2014, 11:35 am

It would, however, nurture talent, and top-level coaching is something that England is massively behind on compared to nations such as Spain and Germany.

And it is a better idea, I would say, than having Liverpool 'B' play in League Two/The Conference.

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Post by CFCNick on Tue 06 May 2014, 11:46 am

But my idea doesn't involve the conference or B teams

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Post by Ent on Tue 06 May 2014, 11:53 am

Works in other countries as the equivalent lower league sides play in stronger regional leagues due to the land mass of said countries.

Fans would just go mad here if b sides were introduced.

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Post by Duty281 on Tue 06 May 2014, 12:12 pm

CFCNick wrote:But my idea doesn't involve the conference or B teams

But the FA's idea, being discussed tomorrow, does.

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Post by Hero on Tue 06 May 2014, 12:44 pm

Have to say as the parent of an 8 year old that is pretty decent football wise that the issue with the game in this country still lies with the very basic grassroots level.
Teaching the simple things to children is just not there, my son has played at City, Utd and Everton as well as for a couple of clubs in Macclesfield, he's been playing league football for 2 years and having coaching since he was 3. Man City was the worst, one training session the children played football cricket and most children got 2 touches of the ball in a 2 hour session. This weekend I took him along to Crewe, for the very first time I've heard uttered was for him to receive the ball with the foot raised and toes pointing down.
He then scored 6 and assisted in 5 in a 14-2 win  Very Happy 

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Post by mystiroakey on Tue 06 May 2014, 12:46 pm

Have you had a bet on him to represent england by 20xx???

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Post by mystiroakey on Tue 06 May 2014, 1:02 pm

so man citeh face a fine of 50m.

and they have a limited CL squad.

OK fair play- but what have are they going to do with barca, PSG, Real Madrid or more importantly Atletico Madrid!

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Post by Ent on Tue 06 May 2014, 1:02 pm

Martinez rumoured to have requested a transfer from bayern.

United should get in for him, think he is a top player and was a huge part of bayerns success last season at centre half and centre mid.

Shame pep preferred to play lamb in there...

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Post by Ent on Tue 06 May 2014, 1:03 pm

I don't imagine the Spanish clubs will have broken ffp despite crippling debt as it's related to losses over 3 years isn't it.

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Post by Crimey on Tue 06 May 2014, 1:03 pm

Ridiculous result last night that was really disappointing. Pressure got to the players, Rodgers didn't know what to do once it started going wrong, was silent on the touchline from the moment the first goal went in, his changes were odd. Can't believe anybody has ever said that Sakho is better than Agger.

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Post by mystiroakey on Tue 06 May 2014, 1:04 pm

athletico have broken the rules, so have PSG- not sure about barca(in ffp but they have been banned for something ffp or misconduct and are limited in transfer dealings), but i would assume RM have as well.

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Post by Ent on Tue 06 May 2014, 1:06 pm

It's interesting as atletico won't have broken it this year with cl prize money I imagine.

Real have huge revenues so even the most incompetent accountant could show profit for them.

Psg are negotiating with Uefa much like city are.

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Post by Crimey on Tue 06 May 2014, 1:07 pm

Also the glee at Liverpool not getting over the line is very odd considering the cries of the league becoming boring with the same three sides winning it and Manchester City "buying the league" and teams with no Englishmen winning the league.

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Post by mystiroakey on Tue 06 May 2014, 1:09 pm

Ent wrote:It's interesting as atletico won't have broken it this year with cl prize money I imagine.

Real have huge revenues so even the most incompetent accountant could show profit for them.

Psg are negotiating with Uefa much like city are.

psg have much less revenues than citeh- so i have no idea how they will get out of it..

but if the only club that gets stitched up is Citeh there is something seriously wrong going on

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Post by mystiroakey on Tue 06 May 2014, 1:10 pm

Crimey wrote:Also the glee at Liverpool not getting over the line is very odd considering the cries of the league becoming boring with the same three sides winning it and Manchester City "buying the league" and teams with no Englishmen winning the league.

There is no glee from me mate- I loved watching us come back- but still really felt for you lot... Gutted for you

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Post by Ent on Tue 06 May 2014, 1:12 pm

Don't think anyone has said the league is boring.

Take heart, people only hate/care when you are doing well.

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Post by mystiroakey on Tue 06 May 2014, 1:13 pm

Actually just read that PSG have faced exactly the same punishment but have no haggling position over it so will have to accept it. Man citeh are going to try there hardest to get out of it due to having much better financials

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Post by TRUSSMAN66 on Tue 06 May 2014, 1:13 pm

City haven't bought the league anymore than Utd and chelsea did.........

Think the problem is Liverpool seemed to think it was a done deal a couple of weeks ago and It may have peed a few souls off......I certainly thought City were out of it as I didn't see you losing to Chelsea..

However I still think Liverpool can win the league...Never write off my club's habit of shooting itself in the foot......I can see us hitting the Villa post three times and losing a late one...

If we do win however take some consolation in the fact that people like me would much prefer Liverpool to come second rather than the vile Chelsea with it's vile Manager..

Much to be proud of Crimey regardless.....Great football with a classy Manager..

Just cut out the diving Mate..

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Post by Ent on Tue 06 May 2014, 1:14 pm

mystiroakey wrote:
Ent wrote:It's interesting as atletico won't have broken it this year with cl prize money I imagine.

Real have huge revenues so even the most incompetent accountant could show profit for them.

Psg are negotiating with Uefa much like city are.

psg have much less revenues than citeh- so i have no idea how they will get out of it..

but if the only club that gets stitched up is Citeh there is something seriously wrong going on

They are negotiating their punishment with Uefa like city.

It wouldn't surprise me to see them get a lesser punishment, city seem a bit amateurish behind the scenes to me.

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Post by mystiroakey on Tue 06 May 2014, 1:15 pm

Ent wrote:
mystiroakey wrote:
Ent wrote:It's interesting as atletico won't have broken it this year with cl prize money I imagine.

Real have huge revenues so even the most incompetent accountant could show profit for them.

Psg are negotiating with Uefa much like city are.

psg have much less revenues than citeh- so i have no idea how they will get out of it..

but if the only club that gets stitched up is Citeh there is something seriously wrong going on

They are negotiating their punishment with Uefa like city.

It wouldn't surprise me to see them get a lesser punishment, city seem a bit amateurish behind the scenes to me.

no its completely the other way around .

PSG have completely written off being able to get out of it as they only have 2 3rds of citehs revenues and much less assets..

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Post by GSC on Tue 06 May 2014, 1:18 pm

PSG have a 200m a year sponsorship deal
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Post by Ent on Tue 06 May 2014, 1:19 pm

The mainstream sites are reporting it slightly differently.

All clubs breaching ffp are in negotiations, only city are planning to dispute it on past the deadline as they see the punishment as excessive.

Psg could well have a lesser financial punishment due to lesser revenues.

The financial thing seems ridiculous to me- you are losing money, punishment = huge fine...

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Post by Crimey on Tue 06 May 2014, 1:20 pm

GSC wrote:PSG have a 200m a year sponsorship deal

Which UEFA found to be not be legitimate, did they not?

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Post by mystiroakey on Tue 06 May 2014, 1:21 pm

GSC wrote:PSG have a 200m a year sponsorship deal

uefa haven't bought it and have written it down to 100m
.

This is what we have been talking about previously that UEFA were going to look into..(sponsorship deals with parent companies)

So they have done what they said they were going to do. and it seems like PSG have agreed on a 60m euro fine- CL limit squad and future transfer limitations.

Man citeh have been fined the same- however have more room to play with from reports to get out of it. as there get much more revenues from non sponsorship ventures(PL money, merchandising etc)

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Post by Ent on Tue 06 May 2014, 1:24 pm

If psg have accepted an equally harsh punishment city need to be very careful.

Whilst they've huge money and a great squad, they are small fry in European competition and not an elite club. It would be very easy to exclude them from European competition if they don't comply.

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Post by mystiroakey on Tue 06 May 2014, 1:25 pm

Ent wrote:If psg have accepted an equally harsh punishment city need to be very careful.

Whilst they've huge money and a great squad, they are small fry in European competition and not an elite club. It would be very easy to exclude them from European competition if they don't comply.

they will off course comply if they have to- however they are going to appeal- UEFA will not increase the punishment if they appeal!

The owners dont care about the 50m fine- its the transfer limitations and cl squad limitations that will hurt them

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Post by Ent on Tue 06 May 2014, 1:28 pm

They might be going into arbitration, Uefa could well take an our way or the highway approach.

They need to be very careful, everyone knows they don't care about money so a fine just makes a mockery of ffp.

In general I think fining is a stupid punishment.

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Post by Dolphin Ziggler on Tue 06 May 2014, 1:33 pm

Woah woah woah, I hated Liverpool last season too. Not being accused of some Jonny come lately hate.

I know we're on the Premier League side of the forum but the total disrespect of lower league teams is astonishing. Barnsley don't want to be a breeding pool for someone else. Maybe they want players they can take some pride and ownership of who won't jump away once fingers are clicked. Maybe professional footballers earning wages at Cambridge don't deserve to have a raft of Premier League youngsters take their places as they nurture their future fortunes.

English league system > English national team.

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Post by Ent on Tue 06 May 2014, 1:39 pm

Yeah football isn't fair dolph, these same pros lower down the leagues kick the Poopie out of youngsters and screw their team mates over for financial gain.

One of the football associations main jobs is development of the national side. The pfa can look after players.

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Barclays Premier League 13/14 Thread Part 'x' Empty Re: Barclays Premier League 13/14 Thread Part 'x'

Post by mystiroakey on Tue 06 May 2014, 1:39 pm

Ent wrote:They might be going into arbitration, Uefa could well take an our way or the highway approach.

They need to be very careful, everyone knows they don't care about money so a fine just makes a mockery of ffp.

In general I think fining is a stupid punishment.

well actually thinking about it- the fine will affect them because it will be an added loss to the accounts(not in one year spread over 3 years) which will give them less room to play with to try and comply again with the ffp in future years..


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