Go back to 5 Nations

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Go back to 5 Nations

Post by international198 on Fri 24 Feb 2017, 5:49 pm

Let's go back to the 5 Nations. Let's have a 5 Nations A tournament and 5 Nations B tournament. Either we include only Europe here or we include the whole Northern Hemisphere. I think we should include the whole Northern Hemisphere because we're living in the 21st century not in the stone age. We have aeroplanes. There's no reason to stick to just Europe.

5 Nations A Tournament:

1. England
2. Wales
3. Ireland
4. France
5. Scotland

5 Nations B Tournament:

1. Italy
2. Georgia
3. Japan
4. Romania
5. USA

Then, whoever finishes last in the 5 Nations A tournament has a home play off against whoever finishes first in the 5 Nations B tournament. The winner of that play-off plays in the A tournament and the loser of that play off plays in the B tournament the following season.

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Re: Go back to 5 Nations

Post by Griff on Fri 24 Feb 2017, 5:51 pm

ghost

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Re: Go back to 5 Nations

Post by international198 on Fri 24 Feb 2017, 6:08 pm

Or if we decide to stick to just Europe then these will be the leagues:

5 Nations A Tournament:

1. England
2. Wales
3. Ireland
4. France
5. Scotland

5 Nations B Tournament:

1. Italy
2. Georgia
3. Romania
4. Russia
5. Spain

with relegation/promotion between the leagues.

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Re: Go back to 5 Nations

Post by international198 on Fri 24 Feb 2017, 6:34 pm

Or simply go back to the 5 Nations with no promotion/relegation. Italy are simply not good enough to be mixing with England, France, Wales, Scotland and Ireland.

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Re: Go back to 5 Nations

Post by Gwlad on Fri 24 Feb 2017, 6:44 pm

We can call it the ghost Nations tournament

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Re: Go back to 5 Nations

Post by Shifty on Fri 24 Feb 2017, 6:56 pm

The whole point of involving Italy is to cover the extra weekend. Secondly the tournament would have less value with 5 teams. Personally I'd rather expand it to 8 teams and have it as East and West.
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Re: Go back to 5 Nations

Post by Hammersmith harrier on Fri 24 Feb 2017, 7:01 pm

international198 wrote:Or if we decide to stick to just Europe then these will be the leagues:

5 Nations A Tournament:

1. England
2. Wales
3. Ireland
4. France
5. Scotland

5 Nations B Tournament:

1. Italy
2. Georgia
3. Romania
4. Russia
5. Spain

with relegation/promotion between the leagues.

You're not aware then that the Europe Championship has multiple divisions and relegation/promotion play offs already, basic lack of understanding you're showing on every level.

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Re: Go back to 5 Nations

Post by Portnoy's Complaint on Fri 24 Feb 2017, 7:07 pm

Nah. Go back to 4 nations with home and away fixtures
Portnoy wrote:    

Re: World Rugby Rankings

Post by Portnoy's Complaint on Wed Feb 01, 2017 3:39 am
Well for me, it'd be just on the European rankings. So taking from the current world ranking positions (of course, in reality they'd have to strip out any games involving non European sides) there would be Div 1 Eng Ire Wal Sco, Div 2 Fra, Geo Ita Rom.

6 games per team - home and away.


Promotion/relegation based entirely on rankings - not position in previous 4Ns.

http://www.606v2.com/t37299p700-world-rugby-rankings#3521167

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Re: Go back to 5 Nations

Post by Hammersmith harrier on Fri 24 Feb 2017, 7:11 pm

Portnoy's Complaint wrote:Nah. Go back to 4 nations with home and away fixtures
Portnoy wrote:    

Re: World Rugby Rankings

Post by Portnoy's Complaint on Wed Feb 01, 2017 3:39 am
Well for me, it'd be just on the European rankings. So taking from the current world ranking positions (of course, in reality they'd have to strip out any games involving non European sides) there would be Div 1 Eng Ire Wal Sco, Div 2 Fra, Geo Ita Rom.

6 games per team - home and away.


Promotion/relegation based entirely on rankings - not position in previous 4Ns.

http://www.606v2.com/t37299p700-world-rugby-rankings#3521167

Let's be honest here that's a crap idea, any suggestion that sees any of the five nations not involved isn't worth talking about.

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Re: Go back to 5 Nations

Post by Shifty on Fri 24 Feb 2017, 7:26 pm

Really we should scrap the Lions and build European rugby in the same way it was done with football. I.E. create a European Cup for rugby.
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Re: Go back to 5 Nations

Post by Portnoy's Complaint on Fri 24 Feb 2017, 7:27 pm

Hammersmith harrier,

Are you Donald Trump?

Did you consider anything before rejecting the idea.

It would pitch equivalent teams together on a home/away basis.

And promotion/relegation would be entirely on european performance and merit. No limit on ups and downs, just rankings positions.

Free access. No glass ceilings and no fences.

Just take a moment before 'thinking(?)'
any suggestion that sees any of the five nations not involved isn't worth talking about.



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Re: Go back to 5 Nations

Post by Portnoy's Complaint on Fri 24 Feb 2017, 7:31 pm

And Shifty, You are correct. We should dump the Lions.

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Re: Go back to 5 Nations

Post by international198 on Fri 24 Feb 2017, 7:50 pm

I don't think we should dump the Lions.

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Re: Go back to 5 Nations

Post by Gwlad on Fri 24 Feb 2017, 7:53 pm

Players all still champing at the bit to get on a tour, its only certain fans have become disillusioned due to Welsh dominance of Lions. If you don't get the Lions you aren't a true fan, have a quiet word with yourself and go on a tour.

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Re: Go back to 5 Nations

Post by SecretFly on Fri 24 Feb 2017, 8:27 pm

As long as they keep the scrum I don't care if they pare it all down to three and half sides.

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Re: Go back to 5 Nations

Post by Hammersmith harrier on Fri 24 Feb 2017, 9:52 pm

Portnoy's Complaint wrote: Hammersmith harrier,

Are you Donald Trump?

Did you consider anything before rejecting the idea.

It would pitch equivalent teams together on a home/away basis.

And promotion/relegation would be entirely on european performance and merit. No limit on ups and downs, just rankings positions.

Free access. No glass ceilings and no fences.

Just take a moment before 'thinking(?)'
any suggestion that sees any of the five nations not involved isn't worth talking about.



You're right I didn't give it a seconds thought, any suggestion that splits up the five nations isn't worth considering.

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Re: Go back to 5 Nations

Post by doctor_grey on Sat 25 Feb 2017, 1:59 pm

I think the money in it will prevent any reduction in the number of games. So we have six teams, and to me, the question is how to get the best Rugby out of it.

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Re: Go back to 5 Nations

Post by Portnoy's Complaint on Sat 25 Feb 2017, 3:31 pm

Except of course, Doc, a 4Ns h/a tourney would result in an increase in games.

What would hold it back would be the squeals of the deseving needy.

Like Scotland and Italy who would clearly and happily shove their shiny blades into the intercostals of Georgia and Russia.

Money trumps sport.

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Re: Go back to 5 Nations

Post by Hammersmith harrier on Sat 25 Feb 2017, 4:52 pm

Rivalries trump money; the thrill of the 6 nations is trying to beat Scotland, Wales, France and Ireland as an Englishmen, take one of them out and it simply isn't the same. Lets be honest here one of those teams under your suggestion would have a whole season of sub standard rugby to play; Italy, Georgia and Romania are no competition for any of the five.

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Re: Go back to 5 Nations

Post by Shifty on Sat 25 Feb 2017, 5:01 pm

I really don't like these topics. You could of made a case for kicking Wales out in the early 90's when our entire team who finished third in the 1987 World Cup, and won the 1988 triple crown went to rugby league, we were losing players every year up North.

Scotland made bad financial decisions at the start of professionalism and have suffered from those SRU mistakes since the turn of the century. A case could of been made for them to be slung out.

We could of thrown England out in the 70's or never given France a chance.

Bottom line is slinging out a country just because the chips are down isn't the answer.

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Re: Go back to 5 Nations

Post by Portnoy's Complaint on Sat 25 Feb 2017, 5:04 pm

Nobody's suggesting throwing any nation out of anything.

Just contemplating a valid competition.


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Re: Go back to 5 Nations

Post by Gwlad on Sat 25 Feb 2017, 6:09 pm

Sack Howley

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Re: Go back to 5 Nations

Post by quinsforever on Sat 25 Feb 2017, 9:44 pm

go back to 5 nations only? thats a bit harsh on wales surely?

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Re: Go back to 5 Nations

Post by majesticimperialman on Sat 25 Feb 2017, 10:31 pm

quinsforever wrote:go back to 5 nations only? thats a bit harsh on wales surely?

erm, not too sure to be honest. Smile

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Re: Go back to 5 Nations

Post by RiscaGame on Sat 25 Feb 2017, 10:44 pm

Oh good. Top quality shanter on show again.

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Re: Go back to 5 Nations

Post by doctor_grey on Sat 25 Feb 2017, 11:58 pm

Portnoy's Complaint wrote:Except of course, Doc, a 4Ns h/a tourney would result in an increase in games.

What would hold it back would be the squeals of the deseving needy.

Like Scotland and Italy who would clearly and happily shove their shiny blades into the intercostals of Georgia and Russia.

Money trumps sport.
home and away? Must have missed that point. That would be a huge money making machine.

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Re: Go back to 5 Nations

Post by Shifty on Sun 26 Feb 2017, 5:29 pm

Portnoy's Complaint wrote:Nobody's suggesting throwing any nation out of anything.

Just contemplating a valid competition.

For me I'd prefer to leave the 6 nations alone, and simply scrap the Lions and bring in a European Cup and build European rugby that way.  Everyone laughed at the football world cup at the start and were proved wrong, people laughed at the football european championships and were proved wrong.  Most countries didn't want a rugby world cup, but it has been a success.  A European Cup would be a success in a few tournaments as well:

I posted this on another topic and this might be a good start:

Have 4 pools of 4 (16 teams), With one team in each region hosting a pool based on rotation:

Pool 1 - British Conference, (hosted by England):
1 England
2 Scotland
3 Ireland
4 Wales

Pool 2 - Mediterranean Conference, (hosted by France):
1 France
2 Italy
3 Spain
4 Portugal

Pool 3 - Central Conference, (hosted by Germany):
1 Germany
2 Poland
3 Holland
4 Belgium

Pool 4 - Eastern Conference, (hosted by Georgia):
1 Georgia
2 Romania
3 Russia
4 Moldova

After the pool stages have taken place, all the teams go to the Uk, and get moved into new pools based on their final standings. Lets assume the above way the teams are listed above, is how the teams finished after playing 3 games against each other.  Now it would look like this, and everyone would play 6 games in total.  Three games in the regional section, and 3 more when you qualify for Phase 2.

Cup:
1 England, (hosted by England):
2 France
3 Germany
4 Georgia

Shield:
1 Scotland, (hosted by Scotland):
2 Italy
3 Poland
4 Romania

Plate:
1 Ireland, (hosted by Ireland):
2 Spain
3 Holland
4 Russia

Bowl:
1 Wales, (hosted by Wales):
2 Portugal
3 Belgium
4 Moldova
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Re: Go back to 5 Nations

Post by TightHEAD on Sun 26 Feb 2017, 5:43 pm

Shifty wrote:
Portnoy's Complaint wrote:Nobody's suggesting throwing any nation out of anything.

Just contemplating a valid competition.

For me I'd prefer to leave the 6 nations alone, and simply scrap the Lions and bring in a European Cup and build European rugby that way.  Everyone laughed at the football world cup at the start and were proved wrong, people laughed at the football european championships and were proved wrong.  Most countries didn't want a rugby world cup, but it has been a success.  A European Cup would be a success in a few tournaments as well:

I posted this on another topic and this might be a good start:

Have 4 pools of 4 (16 teams), With one team in each region hosting a pool based on rotation:

Pool 1 - British Conference, (hosted by England):
1 England
2 Scotland
3 Ireland
4 Wales

Pool 2 - Mediterranean Conference, (hosted by France):
1 France
2 Italy
3 Spain
4 Portugal

Pool 3 - Central Conference, (hosted by Germany):
1 Germany
2 Poland
3 Holland
4 Belgium

Pool 4 - Eastern Conference, (hosted by Georgia):
1 Georgia
2 Romania
3 Russia
4 Moldova

After the pool stages have taken place, all the teams go to the Uk, and get moved into new pools based on their final standings. Lets assume the above way the teams are listed above, is how the teams finished after playing 3 games against each other.  Now it would look like this, and everyone would play 6 games in total.  Three games in the regional section, and 3 more when you qualify for Phase 2.

Cup:
1 England, (hosted by England):
2 France
3 Germany
4 Georgia

Shield:
1 Scotland, (hosted by Scotland):
2 Italy
3 Poland
4 Romania

Plate:
1 Ireland, (hosted by Ireland):
2 Spain
3 Holland
4 Russia

Bowl:
1 Wales, (hosted by Wales):
2 Portugal
3 Belgium
4 Moldova


Zzzzzzzzzzz.
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Re: Go back to 5 Nations

Post by Portnoy's Complaint on Sun 26 Feb 2017, 6:15 pm

An interesting proposition which would confuse most rugby supporters.

Just imagine how that would be sold to your average punter.

They can't cope with simple decisions like Brexit or Trump or the forthcming French/German/Dutch elections.

Highly skilled, professional (English) rugby players get confused by the laws of their own game and top (Australian) coaches call playing to the laws "not rugby".

Not a f*cking hope of selling this brainteaser to the average punter.

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Re: Go back to 5 Nations

Post by Shifty on Sun 26 Feb 2017, 7:07 pm

Portnoy's Complaint wrote:An interesting proposition which would confuse most rugby supporters.

Just imagine how that would be sold to your average punter.

They can't cope with simple decisions like Brexit or Trump or the forthcming French/German/Dutch elections.

Highly skilled, professional (English) rugby players get confused by the laws of their own game and top (Australian) coaches call playing to the laws "not rugby".

Not a f*cking hope of selling this brainteaser to the average punter.

Brexit was easy, I made a good few hundred quid betting on it.

I'd also like to see more being done to grow European rugby. It's not really going anywhere at the moment. I don't think relegating Italy to a B tournament is the answer myself.
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Re: Go back to 5 Nations

Post by Shifty on Sun 26 Feb 2017, 7:08 pm

TightHEAD wrote:Zzzzzzzzzzz.

Great post, very rational, you contribute a lot to the topic, I can see why your a prop. laughing
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Re: Go back to 5 Nations

Post by geoff999rugby on Mon 27 Feb 2017, 9:34 am

He has a point though your suggestion is utter garbage

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Re: Go back to 5 Nations

Post by Gwlad on Mon 27 Feb 2017, 1:37 pm

Congratulations Tighthead, finally learned the entire alphabet. thumbsup

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Re: Go back to 5 Nations

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