Scotland 6N's Buildup Thread

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Post by bsando on Wed 09 Jan 2019, 12:19 pm

First topic message reminder :

Scotland's 2019 6N Fixtures

Sat, 2 Feb, 14:15
Murrayfield Stadium
Scotland vs Italy

Sat, 9 Feb, 14:15
Murrayfield Stadium
Scotland vs Ireland

Sat, 23 Feb, 14:15
Stade de France
France vs Scotland

Sat, 9 Mar, 14:15
Murrayfield Stadium
Scotland vs Wales

Sat, 16 Mar, 17:00
Twickenham Stadium
England vs Scotland

2019 6N Squad
Scotland 6N's Buildup Thread - Page 5 Sru_la10

2019 6N Call ups

Matt Smith, Rob Harley, Alex Dunbar, Luke Crosbie, Henry Pyrgos, Stafford McDowall, Rory Hughes

2018 6N Squad

Scott Lawson, Stuart McInally, George Turner, Simon Berghan, Jamie Bhatti, Murray McCallum, Gordon Reid, D'Arcy Rae, Jon Welsh, Grant Gilchrist, Jonny Gray, Richie Gray, Ben Toolis, John Barclay (c), Magnus Bradbury, Luke Hamilton, Rob Harley, Hamish Watson, David Denton, Cornell du Preez, Ryan Wilson,

Nathan Fowles, Greig Laidlaw, Ali Price, Henry Pyrgos, Peter Horne, Ruaridh Jackson, Finn Russell, Mark Bennett, Alex Dunbar, Nick Grigg, Chris Harris, Huw Jones, Duncan Taylor, Lee Jones, Sean Maitland, Byron McGuigan, Tommy Seymour, Stuart Hogg, Blair Kinghorn

2018 6N Call ups

Neil Cochrane, Fraser Brown, James Malcolm, Zander Fagerson, Darryl Marfo, WP Nel, Scott Cummings, Tim Swinson, Matt Fagerson, John Hardie, Josh Strauss, George Horne, Adam Hastings, Matt Scott, Richie Vernon, Tim Visser

Recent Final Placings

2018 3rd GT
2017 4th VC
2016 4th VC
2015 6th VC
2014 5th SJ


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Post by RDW on Mon 28 Jan 2019, 9:36 am

Meh, it's always good to have a specific match thread for big games like this.

This thread has been the build up thread.

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Post by BigGee on Mon 28 Jan 2019, 9:42 am

Hughes, HP and the wonderkid Stafford McDowell added to the Scotland squad.

Jones L and Matt Smith now out injured and Harley released back to Glasgow.

Fagerson and Brown also join the squad in a training capacity, so they must be nearly ready!

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Post by EWT Spoons on Mon 28 Jan 2019, 9:48 am

RDW wrote:Meh, it's always good to have a specific match thread for big games like this.

This thread has been the build up thread.

Sold

Here you go

http://www.606v2.com/t68374-scotland-vs-italy-6-nations-sat-2nd-feb#3772953

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Post by RDW on Mon 28 Jan 2019, 9:49 am


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Post by Interested party on Mon 28 Jan 2019, 10:58 am

With the Scotland hookers having a surge of try scoring over the last year 8 tries in a 6 game period from last 6N Italy match through summer tour to Fiji Autumn test. I was thinking on the non productivity from the No.8’s.
Can some of the stato’s out there enlightened me when last a Scotland no 8 scored a try.

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Post by tigertattie on Mon 28 Jan 2019, 11:22 am

Interested party wrote:With the Scotland hookers having a surge of try scoring over the last year 8 tries in a 6 game period from last 6N Italy match through summer tour to Fiji Autumn test. I was thinking on the non productivity from the No.8’s.
Can some of the stato’s out there enlightened me when last a Scotland no 8 scored a try.

Well first of all you need to find out when we last had a number 8!
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Post by George Carlin on Mon 28 Jan 2019, 11:39 am

Interested party wrote:With the Scotland hookers having a surge of try scoring over the last year 8 tries in a 6 game period from last 6N Italy match through summer tour to Fiji Autumn test. I was thinking on the non productivity from the No.8’s.
Can some of the stato’s out there enlightened me when last a Scotland no 8 scored a try.
Surely it wasn't Johnnie Beattie against Ireland in 2010?

Barclay scored in 2016 but he was playing flanker at the time.
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Post by NeilyBroon on Mon 28 Jan 2019, 11:44 am

The depressing thing is that's not even an exaggeration
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Post by tigertattie on Mon 28 Jan 2019, 11:48 am

I'm checking but I think it is going to be beattie.

Ryan Wilson - 41 caps Nae Tries
Dave Denton - 42 caps Nae Tries
Even the Great Ritchie Veron - 24 caps nae Tries (not even at Centre)
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Post by tigertattie on Mon 28 Jan 2019, 11:51 am

Kelly Brown vs France in Feb 2011 (playing at No 8 at the time)

Thats bloomin depressing.
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Post by Interested party on Mon 28 Jan 2019, 11:55 am

Correct, that’s approx 90 odd tests and over 200 Scotland tries since the last time a No 8, or a player wearing no 8 shirt crossed the try line. I’m not getting into the discussion about the - is he a real 8 or not. I was just curious about our productivity or lack of from a certain position.

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Post by Interested party on Mon 28 Jan 2019, 11:56 am

Even the Kelly Brown try was 2011, the Johnnie Beattie one , that’s approx 90 odd tests and over 200 Scotland tries since the last time a No 8, or a player wearing no 8 shirt crossed the try line. I’m not getting into the discussion about the - is he a real 8 or not. I was just curious about our productivity or lack of from a certain position.

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Post by tigertattie on Mon 28 Jan 2019, 11:57 am

Just to compare

Bill V - 36 Caps - 6 Tries
Sergio - 134 Caps - 15 Tries
Picamoles - 72 Caps - 9 Tries
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Post by tigertattie on Mon 28 Jan 2019, 12:02 pm

Oh it's no debate. Kelly Brown was a jack of all trades who played 6,7 or 8 for us.

It was like turning up for your local team and you played wherever there wasnt another player. Such was our mediocrity in the backrow back then.

Now we're blessed with 7s but struggling for 6s and utterly devoid of 8s.

We had Ally Hogg who was a try scoring machine (10 tries in 48 caps) but he was frozen out of the Scotland team 10 years ago when aged only 26.

We've not had a good No 8 since Simon Taylor, Ally Hogg and Jonhnny Beattie (who all sadly didnt live up to their potential due to injury/not being picked)
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Post by EWT Spoons on Mon 28 Jan 2019, 12:28 pm

BigGee wrote:Hughes, HP and the wonderkid Stafford McDowell added to the Scotland squad.

Jones L and Matt Smith now out injured and Harley released back to Glasgow.

Fagerson and Brown also join the squad in a training capacity, so they must be nearly ready!

Dunbar has been released as well.

There is no mention of injuries with him and he wasn't part of the original setup.  I wonder if he's just fallen way down the pecking order.

EDIT: I wonder if the rotation of these players has nothing to do with them coming into contention for a matchday place, but purely to give some players experience of being in the scotland squad, without making the group too big. I assume they'll be holding tackle bags and the like, rather than troubling selection.


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Post by RDW on Mon 28 Jan 2019, 12:31 pm

Welcome to the forum Interested Party  OK

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Post by 123456789. on Mon 28 Jan 2019, 3:07 pm

I imagine Dunbar was sent home due to injury and MacDowall called up as a direct replacement for him. I doubt we’ll see him anytime soon.

Another thought I had was about post World Cup retirements. Laidlaw is the big one I can think of and maybe John Barclay. Then Seymour and Maitland are the next ones off the rank. I do think some players will be pencilled in to come in post World Cup and MacDowall will be up there. But I reckon in the Scotland stakes he’s probably behind Horne, Scott, Dunbar, Taylor (although he’s surely reaching a point that he’s out of the pecking order due to injury) and maybe Dean and rightly so. We’ve moved past the point we were at when Scott and Bennett were called up when we literally had no suitable Scottish qualified inside centres. At one point we had Laidlaw at 10 and Lamont at 12 so basically no one in Scotland was capable of playing in the two playmaking positions.

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Post by BigGee on Mon 28 Jan 2019, 3:20 pm

Make no mistake, McDowell is moving quickly up the pecking order, both with Glasgow and Scotland.

He was one of the few players who had a really good game in the debacle against Ospreys on Friday night and he is a point of difference when you need someone who can just truck the ball up at 12 in weather effected games like that, but he is also big, strong, skilful and fast. He is a point of difference to the other ball playing 12s like Horne and Johnson and probably has greater potential than Dean. Taylor and Scott can also play like that, but just struggle to stay fit and unfortunately, I think Dunbar is struggling for his whole career now and I am not sure he will play for Scotland again.

I suspect that Toonie just wants to have a better look at him and to test him a bit in the international environment. He also seems to have been looking for a player like that, having already tried James Lang in a similar role over he summer.

He is probably still a long shot to either play in the 6N or go to the WC and more likely one for the future, but 12 is one of our problem positions and you feel that Toonie is the kind of coach who would not be afraid to chuck him in if he felt he was the one.

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Post by George Carlin on Tue 29 Jan 2019, 5:28 am

I think that we're all ignoring the most important issue, which is whether I can ever truly love a Scotland player called "Stafford", whom until now I assumed was a character in Dynasty (look it up, young people).
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Post by tigertattie on Tue 29 Jan 2019, 9:26 am

George Carlin wrote:I think that we're all ignoring the most important issue, which is whether I can ever truly love a Scotland player called "Stafford", whom until now I assumed was a character in Dynasty (look it up, young people).

Yup. Posh boy name! Cleary suited for the new look Glasgow with a 9, 10, 12 axis of Perma-Tan Price, Hairdo Hastings and Metrosexual McDowell

Luvvies, Luvvies I tell ya!
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Post by IanBru on Tue 29 Jan 2019, 9:33 am

On the subject of perma-tanning, I can only apologise for my occasional jokes about Damien Hoyland's apparent use of it. Having learned from reports this week about the his Iranian grandparents, and their plight on facing deportation from the UK despite having lived here off-and-on for 40-ish years... I feel like a massive tool.
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Post by Tramptastic on Tue 29 Jan 2019, 10:10 am

tigertattie wrote:
George Carlin wrote:I think that we're all ignoring the most important issue, which is whether I can ever truly love a Scotland player called "Stafford", whom until now I assumed was a character in Dynasty (look it up, young people).

Yup. Posh boy name! Cleary suited for the new look Glasgow with a 9, 10, 12 axis of Perma-Tan Price, Hairdo Hastings and Metrosexual McDowell

Luvvies, Luvvies I tell ya!

Aye but he's from Castle Douglas/Kirkcudbright area, nobody from there is posh!

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Post by RDW on Tue 29 Jan 2019, 10:16 am

Whenever I hear the name Stafford McDowell I imagine it being said in a Billy Connolly doing a Morningside accent.

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Post by tigertattie on Tue 29 Jan 2019, 10:21 am

Whenever I see the name Kirkcudbright, I pronouce it in my head a Kirk Cud Bright

We have some bloomin stupid names for places in our country:

Milngarvie - Try explaining that to someone in a call centre in Englandshire.
Ecclefecken - At least it's pronounced how it's written
Auchtermuchty - Completely inaudible to non-natives
Glasgow - I mean come on!!!
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Post by Tramptastic on Tue 29 Jan 2019, 10:32 am

Achiltibuie is a personal favourite of mine

Sanquhar - What even is this?
Ballachulish - Lol
Kirkgunzeon - good luck

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Post by NeilyBroon on Tue 29 Jan 2019, 11:19 am

I was going to say stafford is part of the surname clan. "Crawford! Have you seen Stafford? He was supposed to message Finlay with his plans for high tea"

We should have no problems with McDowall stepping in. The opposition will be shaking just at the mention of the anointed's name. Christine who?
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Post by tigertattie on Tue 29 Jan 2019, 11:20 am

Tramptastic wrote:Achiltibuie is a personal favourite of mine

Sanquhar - What even is this?
Ballachulish - Lol
Kirkgunzeon - good luck

they have a ferry ya know!
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Post by IanBru on Tue 29 Jan 2019, 12:11 pm

tigertattie wrote:
Tramptastic wrote:Achiltibuie is a personal favourite of mine

Sanquhar - What even is this?
Ballachulish - Lol
Kirkgunzeon - good luck

they have a ferry ya know!
My great-uncle (not Dougie) died last week, a proper Gaelic-speaking Isle of Mull man. In his eulogy, a story was told about him driving the tourist bus past the Fishnish to Lochaline ferry. He'd say "That shore over there is Lochaline. It's pronounced Lochaline, not 'Lock A Leen'. If you can't say it right, you'd best not try, and you'd be safer not going." He was on the Wiki page for Mull under 'Famous Residents', until he got bumped off by Lachlan Macquarie, the 'Father of Australia'.
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Post by Tramptastic on Tue 29 Jan 2019, 1:23 pm

IanBru wrote:
tigertattie wrote:
Tramptastic wrote:Achiltibuie is a personal favourite of mine

Sanquhar - What even is this?
Ballachulish - Lol
Kirkgunzeon - good luck

they have a ferry ya know!
My great-uncle (not Dougie) died last week, a proper Gaelic-speaking Isle of Mull man. In his eulogy, a story was told about him driving the tourist bus past the Fishnish to Lochaline ferry. He'd say "That shore over there is Lochaline. It's pronounced Lochaline, not 'Lock A Leen'. If you can't say it right, you'd best not try, and you'd be safer not going." He was on the Wiki page for Mull under 'Famous Residents', until he got bumped off by Lachlan Macquarie, the 'Father of Australia'.

Thats the ferry I always used to take, rather than going through oban I'd go to the Corran-Ardgour crossing and then down to Lochaline over to Fishnish, always an enjoyable drive!

Sorry to hear he passed away, there's not enough gaelic speaking islanders left - I was always disappointed when I went to Skye and everybody I bumped in to (shop owners, B&B owners etc) spoke with a southern english accent which I found a bit sad.

Getting in to a slightly right-wing/nazi swing here but coming from a very quiet, underpopulated part of Scotland, the village I'm from is now a gutted shell with no locals anymore and all the housing is now used for holiday homes - not a single local left in comparison to my parents and grandparents upbringing where there were 500 people in the village and a real community. Ach well, such is the changing of times with no obvious solution.

Otherwise my favourite wee ferry crossing is still Gourock to Dunoon - on a sunny day (quite rare) its a lovely wee 25 minute trip with good views!

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Post by bsando on Wed 30 Jan 2019, 10:02 am

Off the topic of Scotland, but French team is up for the Wales match and it’s full of Clermont players. A beefy, destructive pack with not one but two flankers who can also play lock. Wether that will work who knows but Brunel is clearly going with brute force paired with a sensible controlled Clermont 9/10 pairing in Para and Lopez. The back line looks really good too depending on how Fofana and Ntamack get on as a centre pairing, but that’s got a lot of potential in my opinion. Serin benches but I really think Dupont might have been a good option as he’s been in some good form for Toulouse.

Have to say, if I were a Wales fan I’d be nervous and hope that French pack gets tired quickly.

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Post by George Carlin on Wed 30 Jan 2019, 3:21 pm

Tramptastic wrote:
IanBru wrote:
tigertattie wrote:
Tramptastic wrote:Achiltibuie is a personal favourite of mine

Sanquhar - What even is this?
Ballachulish - Lol
Kirkgunzeon - good luck

they have a ferry ya know!
My great-uncle (not Dougie) died last week, a proper Gaelic-speaking Isle of Mull man. In his eulogy, a story was told about him driving the tourist bus past the Fishnish to Lochaline ferry. He'd say "That shore over there is Lochaline. It's pronounced Lochaline, not 'Lock A Leen'. If you can't say it right, you'd best not try, and you'd be safer not going." He was on the Wiki page for Mull under 'Famous Residents', until he got bumped off by Lachlan Macquarie, the 'Father of Australia'.

Thats the ferry I always used to take, rather than going through oban I'd go to the Corran-Ardgour crossing and then down to Lochaline over to Fishnish, always an enjoyable drive!

Sorry to hear he passed away, there's not enough gaelic speaking islanders left - I was always disappointed when I went to Skye and everybody I bumped in to  (shop owners, B&B owners etc) spoke with a southern english accent which I found a bit sad.

Getting in to a slightly right-wing/nazi swing here but coming from a very quiet, underpopulated part of Scotland, the village I'm from is now a gutted shell with no locals anymore and all the housing is now used for holiday homes - not a single local left in comparison to my parents and grandparents upbringing where there were 500 people in the village and a real community. Ach well, such is the changing of times with no obvious solution.

Otherwise my favourite wee ferry crossing is still Gourock to Dunoon - on a sunny day (quite rare) its a lovely wee 25 minute trip with good views!
I'll see your ferry crossing and raise you Ardrossan to Brodick.

Ah, summer holidays in Arran. In knitwear looking through the horizontal rain at boats lashed to the beach at Whiting Bay to stop them from blowing away.
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Post by Tramptastic on Wed 30 Jan 2019, 3:24 pm

George Carlin wrote: I'll see your ferry crossing and raise you Ardrossan to Brodick.

Ah, summer holidays in Arran. In knitwear looking through the horizontal rain at boats lashed to the beach at Whiting Bay to stop them from blowing away.

My favourite part of that return trip is the quiet deck up top where hungover adults can hide away from screaming bairns and nurse their hangovers with a nap

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Post by George Carlin on Wed 30 Jan 2019, 8:00 pm

Tramptastic wrote:
George Carlin wrote: I'll see your ferry crossing and raise you Ardrossan to Brodick.

Ah, summer holidays in Arran. In knitwear looking through the horizontal rain at boats lashed to the beach at Whiting Bay to stop them from blowing away.

My favourite part of that return trip is the quiet deck up top where hungover adults can hide away from screaming bairns and nurse their hangovers with a nap
That boat also services fantastic chips in white polystyrene cups. Hopefully that's still available so I can introduce it to my kids as the Greatest Thing Ever.

#OldFartNostalgia
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Post by 123456789. on Wed 30 Jan 2019, 9:25 pm

bsando wrote:Off the topic of Scotland, but French team is up for the Wales match and it’s full of Clermont players. A beefy, destructive pack with not one but two flankers who can also play lock. Wether that will work who knows but Brunel is clearly going with brute force paired with a sensible controlled Clermont 9/10 pairing in Para and Lopez. The back line looks really good too depending on how Fofana and Ntamack get on as a centre pairing, but that’s got a lot  of potential in my opinion. Serin benches but I really think Dupont might have been a good option as he’s been in some good form for Toulouse.

Have to say, if I were a Wales fan I’d be nervous and hope that French pack gets tired quickly.

Is it Parra or Laidlaw that starts for Clermont?

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Post by IanBru on Thu 31 Jan 2019, 9:50 am

George Carlin wrote:
Tramptastic wrote:
George Carlin wrote: I'll see your ferry crossing and raise you Ardrossan to Brodick.

Ah, summer holidays in Arran. In knitwear looking through the horizontal rain at boats lashed to the beach at Whiting Bay to stop them from blowing away.

My favourite part of that return trip is the quiet deck up top where hungover adults can hide away from screaming bairns and nurse their hangovers with a nap
That boat also services fantastic chips in white polystyrene cups. Hopefully that's still available so I can introduce it to my kids as the Greatest Thing Ever.

#OldFartNostalgia
You're so right on the chips!

We used to be similarly nostalgic about the CalMac food on the Oban-Craignure ferry, until my dad got food poisoning from a steak pie (it was extra-runny...) and had to sit nervously by the door of the McEwan Hall during my sister's uni graduation that evening. He made it, but only just.
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