Another Drive4show 'Anything goes' thread

[McLaren]

First topic message reminder :

Navy

And what super has also missed is that the statues and TV shows are not really the main focus of the protests. They are easy news bites to bring up but the meat of the protesters argument is about equality for black people.

I also don't think super is correct that just because you support BLM you don't also worry about atrocities committed in other spheres of life. It is just that currently the focus is on racism towards black people.

As much as he hates America, Super would really fit into their libertarian ways.

[westisbest]

Not much social distancing in Liverpool last night either.

Finally won the league.

[JAS]

'The tactics used by the police in America, kneeling on George Floyd's neck, that was learnt from seminars with Israeli secret services.'

Maybe, its not outright anti semitic, but its trying to pin something back on Israel, when its got nothing to do with them. If RLB wasn't aware, she had to be seen to be pretty clean, after her position in the previous regime and claims of AS. There was also a report about sonething during the leadership hustings.

But, what was maybe so hard to have tweeted, Maxibe Peake, what a diamond...unsure sbout the Israeli secret services but though. Sbe would have been fine.

Maxine Peake is a well known idiot to be fair, so RLB should have known better tobretweet anything from her. Furthermore she was given the opportunity to retract her tweet, but didn't and Peake's article was also condemnatory of Starmer's leadership.
I've never considered RLB to be bright, but that really confirms it. Good riddance.

Seeing those idiots on the beaches in England, covid or not, how can anyone enjoy being in such a crowded environment? It looks absolutely awful.
Then there's those idiots in Brixton who blamed the police for the disturbance.

Must admit I have no sympathy for RLB either. On the face of it it seems a bit of a harsh sacking but in the context of Labour trying to reestablish discipline and credibility it had to be seen to be done.

Boris will probably have a good laugh and joke about it next time he goes for tea with Lady Astors friends :-p

[super_realist]

What do you think of Starmer so far JAS. I find his PMQ's to be more effective than the woeful Corbyn but I find it rather awkward still. Labour dearly need a sense of humour.

[super_realist]

Now Comrade McDonnel has retweeted Peake's article. Its not that it was anti semitic, it's that it was a lie and she's refused to take it down.

Starmer needs to get rid of all those far left goons if he's going to get Labour anywhere close to winning an election.

[JAS]

What do you think of Starmer so far JAS. I find his PMQ's to be more effective than the woeful Corbyn but I find it rather awkward still. Labour dearly need a sense of humour.

I think the jury is still out to be fair, he’s clearly much better equipped than Corbyn as a strategist. The gulf he has to make up is huge, some would say insurmountable. Trouble is he somehow has to carry the whole indisciplined rabble as a disciplined cohesive unit, if he actually manages to achieve that then he would be worthy of a shot at PM. The right/centre never accepted Corbyn, despite to clear mandates from the membership. What the left cannot and MUST not do is enter into a tot for tat and undermine Starmer for the sake of it. MacDonnels idiocy with the retweet shows that ain’t going to be easy.

What I don’t agree with is that Starmer was waiting for RLB to trip up so he could sack her. He simply wouldn’t have had her in the shadow cabinet in the first place if he expected her to be that indisciplined. She’s tripped herself up, not by being anti Semitic but by being stupid. He’s acted decisively, even knowing full well that the left will now start a sniping match. It would appear that he’s ready for it. We shall see what happens

[super_realist]

What do you think of Starmer so far JAS. I find his PMQ's to be more effective than the woeful Corbyn but I find it rather awkward still. Labour dearly need a sense of humour.

I think the jury is still out to be fair, he’s clearly much better equipped than Corbyn as a strategist. The gulf he has to make up is huge, some would say insurmountable. Trouble is he somehow has to carry the whole indisciplined rabble as a disciplined cohesive unit, if he actually manages to achieve that then he would be worthy of a shot at PM. The right/centre never accepted Corbyn, despite to clear mandates from the membership. What the left cannot and MUST not do is enter into a tot for tat and undermine Starmer for the sake of it. MacDonnels idiocy with the retweet shows that ain’t going to be easy.

What I don’t agree with is that Starmer was waiting for RLB to trip up so he could sack her. He simply wouldn’t have had her in the shadow cabinet in the first place if he expected her to be that indisciplined.  She’s tripped herself up, not by being anti Semitic but by being stupid. He’s acted decisively, even knowing full well that the left will now start a sniping match. It would appear that he’s ready for it. We shall see what happens

Owen Jones, the self persecuted c*** is apparently apoplectic with rage, so I've got to like Starmer for that.

What I don't understand though is why Labour, or rather the illiberal hard left of Labour are so obsessed with Israel.

[superflyweight]

I really don't understand it either. As a party in opposition, they dont need to have any kind of policy on Israel or the Middle East - it's irrelevant to them and won't help them get elected.

[JAS]

What do you think of Starmer so far JAS. I find his PMQ's to be more effective than the woeful Corbyn but I find it rather awkward still. Labour dearly need a sense of humour.

I think the jury is still out to be fair, he’s clearly much better equipped than Corbyn as a strategist. The gulf he has to make up is huge, some would say insurmountable. Trouble is he somehow has to carry the whole indisciplined rabble as a disciplined cohesive unit, if he actually manages to achieve that then he would be worthy of a shot at PM. The right/centre never accepted Corbyn, despite to clear mandates from the membership. What the left cannot and MUST not do is enter into a tot for tat and undermine Starmer for the sake of it. MacDonnels idiocy with the retweet shows that ain’t going to be easy.

What I don’t agree with is that Starmer was waiting for RLB to trip up so he could sack her. He simply wouldn’t have had her in the shadow cabinet in the first place if he expected her to be that indisciplined.  She’s tripped herself up, not by being anti Semitic but by being stupid. He’s acted decisively, even knowing full well that the left will now start a sniping match. It would appear that he’s ready for it. We shall see what happens

Owen Jones, the self persecuted c*** is apparently apoplectic with rage, so I've got to like Starmer for that.

What I don't understand though is why Labour, or rather the illiberal hard left of Labour are so obsessed with Israel.

I really don't think they are, I think it that view might exist in some places but was magnified out of all proportion specifically to undermine Corbyn...clearly it worked a treat as he couldn't deal with all that came with it.

On a practical level there is legitimate concern about the way Israel treats Palestinians. It can't be anti semitic to observe some vile human rights abuses surely.

Not so much on Israel itself but on the wider aspect of high profile Jews in the financial elite in the world (The Rothschilds, Goldman Sachs, George Soros etc to name but a few) Maybe some in the strident hard left take the view that those people/families/institutions are huge barriers to achieving the aim that power, wealth and opportunity should be in the hands of the many not the few and conflate the fact that a disproportionately high percentage of the financial elite are in fact Jewish by heritage.

[super_realist]

Yeah, all Labour's shortcomings are simply a Tory ruse.
Come on Jas, no one needs to undermine Labour, they've stuck both feet in their mouth for years.

[JAS]

Yeah, all Labour's shortcomings are simply a Tory ruse.
Come on Jas, no one needs to undermine Labour, they've stuck both feet in their mouth for years.

Well as I eluded to earlier and nobody took the bait, both Johnson and May made much political capital amongst their own supporters by fawning over the Nancy Astor statue in Plymouth. Maybe she was the first woman MP (to take her seat) but she was also quite a rabid anti Semite and indeed Nazi appeaser. Now be objective here...if Corbyn had dared to show face anywhere near Astor, the right wing press would have had a field day, would they not?? Maybe no-one has needed to undermine them for a few years but that hasn’t stopped sections of the media ramming home and reinforcing their narrative anyway.

You can say all you like and I know we’re not as bad as North Korea but the elitist right have got the media in this country in their back pocket.

[super_realist]

There are right wing media and there are left wing media. It's not my fault if you continue to ignore the left wing media and pretend it doesn't exist.
As for Astor, I'm pretty sure most people simply aren't aware of that story or who Astor is.

Do you think that the sacking of RLB shouldn't have been reported? It's the media's job to do this, and Corbyn's reign was the gift that kept on giving.

I'm not quite sure why you can't just admit that Labour were a calamity of their own making instead of trying to pin it on someone else, although that seems to be the British attitude to everything these days.
Even Labour MP's are good enough to admit they were hopeless, but you always want to couch it with subterfuge and clandestine media working behind the scenes to bring Corbyn down.
The paranoid elitist right quip makes you sound like Maxine Peake.

[JAS]

There are right wing media and there are left wing media. It's not my fault if you continue to ignore the left wing media and pretend it doesn't exist.
As for Astor, I'm pretty sure most people simply aren't aware of that story or who Astor is.

Do you think that the sacking of RLB shouldn't have been reported? It's the media's job to do this, and Corbyn's reign was the gift that kept on giving.

I'm not quite sure why you can't just admit that Labour were a calamity of their own making instead of trying to pin it on someone else, although that seems to be the British attitude to everything these days.
Even Labour MP's are good enough to admit they were hopeless, but you always want to couch it with subterfuge and clandestine media working behind the scenes to bring Corbyn down.
The paranoid elitist right quip makes you sound like Maxine Peake.

Oh here we go, another dog chasing it’s own tail type argument
1. I NEVER said Labour weren’t a calamity of their own making. If you actually read what I said you’d see a broad acceptance that they’ve shot themselves in the foot in recent times. I personally think, and I’ve said it before, the downward spiral started with them electing the wrong Milliband and as an example of how far they fell Ed now looks relatively moderate.

2. Your comment on Astor illustrates my point perfectly, thanks for that :-p

3. Another example I never mentioned then but that Johnson and Gove got no flack for them meeting with that other populist anti Semite Steve Bannon. Had Corbyn met him (why would he) it would have been blown up and “Corbyn associates with disgusting anti Semite” Johnson and Gove got a free pass, no controversy, move on.

[super_realist]

I'm aware that you didn't rate the previous labour leader and party, but you always seem compelled to pin some of the blame for their failure on someone else.
If you ask a traditional Labour voter who voted Tory at the last election I bet you couldn't find one who did so because of some perceived smear campaign from the right . It would be because Labour had no direction on Brexit, useless policies and an atrocious leader.

Your point on Astor inferred that people were ignoring it and excusing anti semitism on the right rather than it not being reported.
Johnson et Al didn't meet Bannon on the premise of an anti semitic purpose or because he was anti semitic whereas numerous Labour MP's and members  have been exposed as being actively anti semitic.  That's the difference.

[superflyweight]

I wonder what was it about the racist, white supremacist, anti-semitic, populist dog whistler that made him such attractive person to have a meeting with?

[super_realist]

I wonder what was it about the racist, white supremacist, anti-semitic, populist dog whistler that made him such attractive person to have a meeting with?

Who knows, maybe he had expertise that was worth hearing about. I didn't see anyone retweeting his ideas though.

[JAS]

I'm aware that you didn't rate the previous labour leader and party, but you always seem compelled to pin some of the blame for their failure on someone else.

Not necessarily blaming something else, more making sure that contributing factors are recognised

If you ask a traditional Labour voter who voted Tory at the last election I bet you couldn't find one who did so because of some perceived smear campaign from the right .

Well nobodys going to wilfully own up to being THAT gullible are they??

It would be because Labour had no direction on Brexit, useless policies and an atrocious leader.

Yep probably

Your point on Astor inferred that people were ignoring it and excusing anti semitism on the right rather than it not being reported.

Still a valid point either way

Johnson et Al didn't meet Bannon on the premise of an anti semitic purpose or because he was anti semitic whereas numerous Labour MP's and members  have been exposed as being actively anti semitic.  That's the difference.

Examples??

[JAS]

So what’s your view now Super on the divergence between the Scottish stats and the U.K. stats as I saw as an emerging trend 2-3 weeks ago?

[McLaren]

Super

If tweeting an article where someone else said that Isreals defense force might not use the most kosher tactics counts as racist meets the bar of racism shouldn't we ask what else does?

For example saying have "watermelon smiles"? By the above standard that easily meets the criteria for racism and the person who said it should be removed from the front bench?

[super_realist]

Mac, As usual you have left your comprehension somewhere else.
Maxine Peake is rabidly anti Israel, trying to falsely claim that this tactic came from Israel is simply trying to make capital out of an horrific act.

[superflyweight]

I wonder what was it about the racist, white supremacist, anti-semitic, populist dog whistler that made him such attractive person to have a meeting with?

Who knows, maybe he had expertise that was worth hearing about. I didn't see anyone retweeting his ideas though.

Me neither, but retweeting someone is probably less worrying than a government meeting with someone like Bannon for non-disclosed reasons.

I assume that you would have some concerns about Bannon?

[McLaren]

Mac, As usual you have left your comprehension somewhere else.
Maxine Peake is rabidly anti Israel, trying to falsely claim that this tactic came from Israel is simply trying to make capital out of an horrific act.

What, are you really trying to convince us that you care about Maxine Peake "making capital" out of BLM? Aye right.

[super_realist]

So what’s your view now Super on the divergence between the Scottish stats and the U.K. stats as I saw as an emerging trend 2-3 weeks ago?

JAS. Its not a difference between Scottish stats and the UK at all JAS, because you'll find that NI and Wales also have better rates than the massively more densely populated England. The question is why England's rates are still proportionately higher than the other regions of the country.
There are of course many ways to look at it and many reasons why this is the case ( though I'm sure you will want it to just be one)
First of all you have to consider that you can't just multiply the number of cases by the population and expect to get parity between different countries. That would be incredibly stupid when you get down to such low numbers, as small hotpots easily skew the numbers.

England has a higher population density than China, Scotland has a population density which is 25% of England, therefore its far easier to spread in England.

One thing I would be concerned about though is that England's rate seems to have flattened rather than being on a gradual decrease. This could be due to the decreasing rates being masked by increases coming from illegal street parties, beach goers, illegal raves and protests/riots.

[super_realist]

Mac, As usual you have left your comprehension somewhere else.
Maxine Peake is rabidly anti Israel, trying to falsely claim that this tactic came from Israel is simply trying to make capital out of an horrific act.

What, are you really trying to convince us that you care about Maxine Peake "making capital" out of BLM? Aye right.

She's trying to add currency to her hatred of Israel by claiming that it was their policy that led to the death of George Floyd.

That's a pretty low act, even for her.

[super_realist]

I wonder what was it about the racist, white supremacist, anti-semitic, populist dog whistler that made him such attractive person to have a meeting with?

Who knows, maybe he had expertise that was worth hearing about. I didn't see anyone retweeting his ideas though.

Me neither, but retweeting someone is probably less worrying than a government meeting with someone like Bannon for non-disclosed reasons.  

I assume that you would have some concerns about Bannon?

Of course I would and I'm not sure why any government would have to meet him, but let's use Henry Ford as an example. He stood for pretty much exactly the same things as Bannon, but if you met him in regards to his car company, the meeting needn't have anything to do with his private beliefs.

[McLaren]

Mac, As usual you have left your comprehension somewhere else.
Maxine Peake is rabidly anti Israel, trying to falsely claim that this tactic came from Israel is simply trying to make capital out of an horrific act.

What, are you really trying to convince us that you care about Maxine Peake "making capital" out of BLM? Aye right.

She's trying to add currency to her hatred of Israel by claiming that it was their policy that led to the death of George Floyd.

That's a pretty low act, even for her.

If that were true it would be quite a low act. The question is would it bother you if she did that? It would be counter to almost everything we know about you.

[superflyweight]

I wonder what was it about the racist, white supremacist, anti-semitic, populist dog whistler that made him such attractive person to have a meeting with?

Who knows, maybe he had expertise that was worth hearing about. I didn't see anyone retweeting his ideas though.

Me neither, but retweeting someone is probably less worrying than a government meeting with someone like Bannon for non-disclosed reasons.  

I assume that you would have some concerns about Bannon?

Of course I would and I'm not sure why any government would have to meet him, but let's use Henry Ford as an example. He stood for pretty much exactly the same things as Bannon, but if you met him in regards to his car company, the meeting needn't have anything to do with his private beliefs.

Bannon doesn't have a car company. He is in the business of promoting white supremacy and populism and helping to form election strategies based on those beliefs.

[dynamark]

Afternoon the media all round channels spent all morning slagging off folk on Bournemouth beach based on a few long range pics.When you looked at the drone photos it wasn't so bad people in small groups trying to keep a bit of space for their group.There were other pics not so well shown of sparsley populated beaches.
Its a bit silly to get there and think Ill join in but it was a pretty poor effort from BBC.Funny how the scousers didn't get anywhere near the same stick for descending on Anfield and the police stood by That would have been unacceptable by the jpurnalists cant have a go at the Liverpool fans
Good film last night about the enigma code breakers probably well clear of the truth but the really interesting part was that once they had cracked the messages they couldn't let the germans know they had so another huge process began to fool the enemy without alarm

[super_realist]

Mac, As usual you have left your comprehension somewhere else.
Maxine Peake is rabidly anti Israel, trying to falsely claim that this tactic came from Israel is simply trying to make capital out of an horrific act.

What, are you really trying to convince us that you care about Maxine Peake "making capital" out of BLM? Aye right.

She's trying to add currency to her hatred of Israel by claiming that it was their policy that led to the death of George Floyd.

That's a pretty low act, even for her.

If that were true it would be quite a low act. The question is would it bother you if she did that? It would be counter to almost everything we know about you.

It clearly is true Mac because it is an outright lie that the US Police got this "tactic" from Israel.

She can say what she likes though, it doesn't bother me as everyone knows she's a loon and she has the freedom to say what she likes whether we like it or not.

The issue comes when a politician, even one as inept and stupid as RLB retweets the article with a positive endorsement attached, subsequently refuses to delete the tweet and also by default condones the criticism in the article of the party she is elected to represent and the leader with whom she reports to.

I'm not sure why you can't see that.

[McLaren]

Super

It's like you don't bother to go back and read what people have already said in a thread. Look at the first or second post I made on the matter, I get why she was sacked.


What I am curious about is why you seem in full agreement with the idea that what she posted was antisemitic?  

Given the tenuous link between a supposed tactic of Israels army (denied by them by the way and not an independent source) and jewish people, and the fact this was a retweet and not from the horses mouth, I am surprised you so readily accept it to be antisemitic. You would normally bend over backwards to excuse a racial misdemeanor.

[super_realist]

Super

It's like you don't bother to go back and read what people have already said in a thread. Look at the first or second post I made on the matter, I get why she was sacked.


What I am curious about is why you seem in full agreement with the idea that what she posted was antisemitic?  

Given the tenuous link between a supposed tactic of Israels army (denied by them by the way and not an independent source) and jewish people, and the fact this was a retweet and not from the horses mouth, I am surprised you so readily accept it to be antisemitic. You would normally bend over backwards to excuse a racial misdemeanor.

You are the one who should read Mac. It wasn't me who claimed it was anti semitic, it was Navy. I only said she had been sacked.
My point was that she is endorsing a lie, refused to pull it down and endorsed the article which criticised her boss.


You'd have to be a colossal moron to believe that in the current environment for many reasons and subjects  this was something which Starmer could let slide and RLB has shown that she is exactly that stupid.
I really don't know why any politicians have social media. It seems to be more harmful than it is gold for any of their careers.

[JAS]

So what’s your view now Super on the divergence between the Scottish stats and the U.K. stats as I saw as an emerging trend 2-3 weeks ago?

JAS. Its not a difference between Scottish stats and the UK at all JAS, because you'll find that NI and Wales also have better rates than the massively more densely populated England. The question is why England's rates are still proportionately higher than the other regions of the country.
There are of course many ways to look at it and many reasons why this is the case ( though I'm sure you will want it to just be one)
First of all you have to consider that you can't just multiply the number of cases by the population and expect to get parity between different countries. That would be incredibly stupid when you get down to such low numbers, as small hotpots easily skew the numbers.

England has a higher population density than China, Scotland has a population density which is 25% of England, therefore its far easier to spread in England.

One thing I would be concerned about though is that England's rate seems to have flattened rather than being on a gradual decrease. This could be due to the decreasing rates being masked by increases coming from illegal street parties, beach goers, illegal raves and protests/riots.

After a bit of an effort to be confrontational for the sake of it, you eventually got there in paragraph 4 :-p That was exactly my point, nothing else sinister, I’m not going to say oh look hasn’t wee Krankie done such a better job than Boris” (even if she has). The thing is the stats are now I believe now showing “Durdle Door” weekend and the following 2 protest weekends, not saying Jocks never protested or went to the beach as well but they clearly didn’t in the numbers that flocked to the Dorset beaches. A rainy 10 degrees on the Costa del Clyde doesnt quite have the same appeal as 30 degrees on the South coast. :-p
I think there is a bit more at play though than just the beach goers. I do think the lockdown has been followed better in NI, Scotland and to a point Wales and that is what is showing through now in the daily new cases count. England are lagging quite a bit behind, the fact that they are more densely populated is clearly a factor and a flag that they should be more cogniscant of Social distancing. Actually in saying that the population density isn’t as radical as you make out. There’s a significant swathe of the Scottish land mass that you can rule as mountainously uninhabitable. The central belt Which contains 4/5ths of the Scottish population? is probably as densely populated as any urban area in England.

[pedro]

I really don't understand it either.  As a party in opposition, they dont need to have any kind of policy on Israel or the Middle East - it's irrelevant to them and won't help them get elected.  

Catering to their base, as kwini would say.

[McLaren]

I really don't understand it either.  As a party in opposition, they dont need to have any kind of policy on Israel or the Middle East - it's irrelevant to them and won't help them get elected.  

Catering to their base, as kwini would say.

I miss Kwini.

[pedro]

Not much social distancing in Liverpool last night either.

Finally won the league.

I’m sure super can’t contain himself.

[pedro]

I wonder what was it about the racist, white supremacist, anti-semitic, populist dog whistler that made him such attractive person to have a meeting with?

Who knows, maybe he had expertise that was worth hearing about. I didn't see anyone retweeting his ideas though.

Me neither, but retweeting someone is probably less worrying than a government meeting with someone like Bannon for non-disclosed reasons.  

I assume that you would have some concerns about Bannon?

Of course I would and I'm not sure why any government would have to meet him, but let's use Henry Ford as an example. He stood for pretty much exactly the same things as Bannon, but if you met him in regards to his car company, the meeting needn't have anything to do with his private beliefs.

Bannon doesn't have a car company.  He is in the business of promoting white supremacy and populism and helping to form election strategies based on those beliefs.  

It’s the other way around.

[super_realist]

On the flip side JAS you could say the same for England population density actually being even greater if you take out Derbyshire, Yorkshire Dale's, Lake District, Peak District etc.

A very large % of England lives in the south East, north west and Midlands.

I also think that in a statistical sense when you get to a very low values then it gets even more difficult to make inferences from those figures without considering all aspects as to why that might be the case.
I don't think there's any doubt that we've seen more idiocy in England, although Glasgow flies the flag for Scotland in that respect, but I'd argue that was just part of the reason for the differences between Wales, NI and Scotland versus what we are seeing in England.

[super_realist]

Not much social distancing in Liverpool last night either.

Finally won the league.

I’m sure super can’t contain himself.

I'm actually pleased for them. They got rid of the players I didn't like and have been by far and away the best team in the league.

One question I would have to footballers in general though is how is it that every single team appears to have been to the hairdresser?

[pedro]

Remember that we have a free pass criticising jews/Israel and the US, because they are the favorite hate object of the same people who define the racism agenda, namely the left. Standards are good, double standards twice as good.

[pedro]

Not much social distancing in Liverpool last night either.

Finally won the league.

I’m sure super can’t contain himself.

I'm actually pleased for them. They got rid of the players I didn't like and have been by far and away the best team in the league.

One question I would have to footballers in general though is how is it that every single team appears to have been to the hairdresser?

I agree. This has just gone OTT. But I guess we should refrain from commenting further, as it can be deemed racist.

[McLaren]

Remember that we have a free pass criticising jews/Israel and the US, because they are the favorite hate object of the same people who define the racism agenda, namely the left. Standards are good, double standards twice as good.

Like I asked Super. Does that bother you. Don't you enjoy having at least one group of people you can take a free hit at?

[superflyweight]

Remember that we have a free pass criticising jews/Israel and the US, because they are the favorite hate object of the same people who define the racism agenda, namely the left. Standards are good, double standards twice as good.

Yeah, these days you get arrested and thrown into jail if you say you’re English, don’t you?

[navyblueshorts]

I get why Starmer has to be firm on anything surrounding Jews but I have just read the bit in the Maxine Peak interview that has been deemed anti semetic.

Born in Bolton to a lorry driver father and care worker mother, Peake is strident and expressive; if religion wasn’t anathema to her, she’d be perfect in the pulpit. “Systemic racism is a global issue,” she adds. “The tactics used by the police in America, kneeling on George Floyd’s neck, that was learnt from seminars with Israeli secret services.” (A spokesperson for the Israeli police has denied this, stating that “there is no tactic or protocol that calls to put pressure on the neck or airway”.)

Not exactly the lizard people or new world order stuff I was expecting to find.

Labour obviously dodged a bullet w/ Wrong-Daily. Not because of any anti-Semitism, but because she's plainly stupid. Run as the left candidate for Labour leadership vs. Starmer, get a Shadow Cabinet position as a sop to left, re-tweet a minor dodgy comment and give Starmer the ideal opportunity to kick you out for plausible reason.

[navyblueshorts]

Packed beaches again here in Bournemouth. Some folks are acting surprised.

Some, I’ve heard have come as far as the midlands.
Not really surprising when you can travel far distances.

I’ve seen a video of groups of people fighting.

This will continue until something changes.

A second spike wouldn't surprise me. Doubt if HMG could enforce a second lockdown.

Think not? There's always the Army...

[navyblueshorts]

Also aren't we always told not to equate Israel and Jews? Seems the Jewish interest groups are happy to do so when it suits them.

That's what I struggle with, I deplore racism, anti semitism, indeed all forms of discrimination and bigotry but where does the line get drawn? How can one state be criticised for certain actions but if anyone criticises Israel for the same actions they are then anti-semitic. Are Israel agitating for a free pass on human rights abuses?

I've even heard it in the banking world, criticise the behaviour of RBS, Citibank, Fanny Mae, Freddie Mac, Lehman etc leading up to the financial crisis...fine. Criticise Goldman Sachs for their role...how very dare you that is so anti semitic. At the risk of sounding anti semitic, Goldmans were at the very heart of the crisis and to use accusations of antisemitism to deflect away from their role in it is pathetic.

Re. Israel, problem is specifically (as I understand it) that people criticising Israel too often don't criticise the same from other régimes. I don't give a scheisse, because I'm happy to criticise others. What Israel is getting away w/ re. Palestinians is disgusting.

[super_realist]

I get why Starmer has to be firm on anything surrounding Jews but I have just read the bit in the Maxine Peak interview that has been deemed anti semetic.

Born in Bolton to a lorry driver father and care worker mother, Peake is strident and expressive; if religion wasn’t anathema to her, she’d be perfect in the pulpit. “Systemic racism is a global issue,” she adds. “The tactics used by the police in America, kneeling on George Floyd’s neck, that was learnt from seminars with Israeli secret services.” (A spokesperson for the Israeli police has denied this, stating that “there is no tactic or protocol that calls to put pressure on the neck or airway”.)

Not exactly the lizard people or new world order stuff I was expecting to find.

Labour obviously dodged a bullet w/ Wrong-Daily. Not because of any anti-Semitism, but because she's plainly stupid. Run as the left candidate for Labour leadership vs. Starmer, get a Shadow Cabinet position as a sop to left, re-tweet a minor dodgy comment and give Starmer the ideal opportunity to kick you out for plausible reason.

She looks like Feathers Mcgraw with those beady eyes so close together.

[navyblueshorts]

Super

It's like you don't bother to go back and read what people have already said in a thread. Look at the first or second post I made on the matter, I get why she was sacked.


What I am curious about is why you seem in full agreement with the idea that what she posted was antisemitic?  

Given the tenuous link between a supposed tactic of Israels army (denied by them by the way and not an independent source) and jewish people, and the fact this was a retweet and not from the horses mouth, I am surprised you so readily accept it to be antisemitic. You would normally bend over backwards to excuse a racial misdemeanor.

You are the one who should read Mac. It wasn't me who claimed it was anti semitic, it was Navy. I only said she had been sacked.
My point was that she is endorsing a lie, refused to pull it down and endorsed the article which criticised her boss.


You'd have to be a colossal moron to believe that in the current environment for many reasons and subjects  this was something which Starmer could let slide and RLB has shown that she is exactly that stupid.
I really don't know why any politicians have social media. It seems to be more harmful than it is gold for any of their careers.

It was not. I did not make that claim; I sarcastically suggested that Labour haven't got a problem on those lines.

[navyblueshorts]

I get why Starmer has to be firm on anything surrounding Jews but I have just read the bit in the Maxine Peak interview that has been deemed anti semetic.

Born in Bolton to a lorry driver father and care worker mother, Peake is strident and expressive; if religion wasn’t anathema to her, she’d be perfect in the pulpit. “Systemic racism is a global issue,” she adds. “The tactics used by the police in America, kneeling on George Floyd’s neck, that was learnt from seminars with Israeli secret services.” (A spokesperson for the Israeli police has denied this, stating that “there is no tactic or protocol that calls to put pressure on the neck or airway”.)

Not exactly the lizard people or new world order stuff I was expecting to find.

Labour obviously dodged a bullet w/ Wrong-Daily. Not because of any anti-Semitism, but because she's plainly stupid. Run as the left candidate for Labour leadership vs. Starmer, get a Shadow Cabinet position as a sop to left, re-tweet a minor dodgy comment and give Starmer the ideal opportunity to kick you out for plausible reason.

She looks like Feathers Mcgraw with those beady eyes so close together.

That's relevant, how?

[super_realist]

Super

It's like you don't bother to go back and read what people have already said in a thread. Look at the first or second post I made on the matter, I get why she was sacked.

You said something like "nah, never any anti semitism in the Labour Party"


What I am curious about is why you seem in full agreement with the idea that what she posted was antisemitic?  

Given the tenuous link between a supposed tactic of Israels army (denied by them by the way and not an independent source) and jewish people, and the fact this was a retweet and not from the horses mouth, I am surprised you so readily accept it to be antisemitic. You would normally bend over backwards to excuse a racial misdemeanor.

You are the one who should read Mac. It wasn't me who claimed it was anti semitic, it was Navy. I only said she had been sacked.
My point was that she is endorsing a lie, refused to pull it down and endorsed the article which criticised her boss.


You'd have to be a colossal moron to believe that in the current environment for many reasons and subjects  this was something which Starmer could let slide and RLB has shown that she is exactly that stupid.
I really don't know why any politicians have social media. It seems to be more harmful than it is gold for any of their careers.

It was not. I did not make that claim; I sarcastically suggested that Labour haven't got a problem on those lines.

[super_realist]

I get why Starmer has to be firm on anything surrounding Jews but I have just read the bit in the Maxine Peak interview that has been deemed anti semetic.

Born in Bolton to a lorry driver father and care worker mother, Peake is strident and expressive; if religion wasn’t anathema to her, she’d be perfect in the pulpit. “Systemic racism is a global issue,” she adds. “The tactics used by the police in America, kneeling on George Floyd’s neck, that was learnt from seminars with Israeli secret services.” (A spokesperson for the Israeli police has denied this, stating that “there is no tactic or protocol that calls to put pressure on the neck or airway”.)

Not exactly the lizard people or new world order stuff I was expecting to find.

Labour obviously dodged a bullet w/ Wrong-Daily. Not because of any anti-Semitism, but because she's plainly stupid. Run as the left candidate for Labour leadership vs. Starmer, get a Shadow Cabinet position as a sop to left, re-tweet a minor dodgy comment and give Starmer the ideal opportunity to kick you out for plausible reason.

She looks like Feathers Mcgraw with those beady eyes so close together.

That's relevant, how?

It's relevant because she looks as simple as she demonstrates herself to be.

[Soul Requiem]

Starmer is caught between a rock and a hard place right now, he needs to distance himself from the Corbyn faction as much as possible but alienating Momentum is going to end well either. All the Labour talent with the exception of Starmer and Nandy are on the back benches.

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