Silly Season Transfer Rumours 23/24

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I need rumours.....and I need them now!

king_carlos wrote:Especially when you have guys going and getting overseas experience like this who can then return. Goodman going to NZ, coming back to Leinster and taking over from Catt with Ireland for instance. ROG of course has won back to back Champions Cups at La Rochelle.

I'm interested to see how Erasmus does leading a third RWC in charge but losing Nienaber and Jones. They certainly seemed to be the biggest influences after Erasmus in that setup. Stick, Davids and Human are still there though. They weathered Aled Walters moving on pretty well considering they retained their RWC title!

There are a few big players in their early thirties too. An age where they can all keep making an impact in the coming RC but odds are quite a few wont make the 2027 RWC. Kitshoff (31), Malherbe (33), Koch (33), Nyakane (34), Mbonambi (33), Etzebeth (32), Mostert (33), Lood (31), PSdT (31), Kolisi (32), Faf (32), Reinach (33), de Allende (32). Then suddenly  you realise a few of the replacements are nearly 30 too but seem like up and comers as you're so used to the incumbents. Esterhuizen and Kriel are 29 for instance. Kwagga and Orie are 30.

It was an absolutely perfect age profile for a RWC. Young enough to have a ton of players in their peak years, but packed with experience as well.

Yeah exciting times with the rebuilding job required there. SA have got a lot of exciting talent but the challenge of bringing it through and keeping results good is going to be a challenge.

Big challenge for Flannery and tough for Quins that it's going to be on the 23rd of this month. A mid season loss is not what they'll have wanted.

Wyn Jones to the Dragons is a possibility.

Louis Lynagh rumoured heading to Benneton from Quins.

formerly known as Sam wrote:Louis Lynagh rumoured heading to Benneton from Quins.

Looks like he fancies an Italian cap then!

Oakdene wrote:Wyn Jones to the Dragons is a possibility.

If he's not always injured then I wouldn't mind that. Looks like you're losing two LHs if that's the case.

Oakdene wrote:Wyn Jones to the Dragons is a possibility.

Bit of a rant coming, but I’m fed up of getting old players, especially props, from other regions once they’re on the scrap heap. They never work out. No offence to Wyn Jones but if he’s still any good the Scarlets would keep him, right?

In the last few years we’ve had the likes of Rhodri Jones. Average at best. Rob Evans. Zero impact. Craig Mitchell. Dud. Greg Batmen. Did nothing. Sam Hobbs, Aaron Jarvis, Dan Suter, Nicky Thomas, etc. Any more to add to the list? If they’re overseas with a few miles on the clock then sometimes they’re ok e.g. Brok Harris. But if they’re Welsh then they tend to be awful for us. So I’m really reluctant to look at Wyn Jones, sorry.

TAFKA The Oracle wrote:

Oakdene wrote:Wyn Jones to the Dragons is a possibility.

Bit of a rant coming, but I’m fed up of getting old players, especially props, from other regions once they’re on the scrap heap. They never work out. No offence to Wyn Jones but if he’s still any good the Scarlets would keep him, right?

In the last few years we’ve had the likes of Rhodri Jones. Average at best. Rob Evans. Zero impact. Craig Mitchell. Dud. Greg Batmen. Did nothing. Sam Hobbs, Aaron Jarvis, Dan Suter, Nicky Thomas, etc. Any more to add to the list? If they’re overseas with a few miles on the clock then sometimes they’re ok e.g. Brok Harris. But if they’re Welsh then they tend to be awful for us. So I’m really reluctant to look at Wyn Jones, sorry.

Yep, Rhodri Jones still isn't any good and he's been around a few Regions now. Mitchell and Batemen had great potential, struggled with injury a lot though and it held them back (like Leon Brown I guess). The rest on your list were well known duds and we still picked them up. South Africans a good investment, as per.

Benetton confirm Lynagh

I think it's a great move for Lynagh. Benneton are a really good setup now, with a significant budget. I wouldn't be surprised if he's getting a decent pay rise. Whilst a good player I don't think he's that close to an England callup either. Murley from Quins alone should be significantly ahead of him. So it makes sense to look at Italy opportunities too. Ioane is locked into one wing for them but Lynagh is a similar style of player to Capuozzo or Minozzi (when he hopefully returns) that they've liked.

Scott Macleod back at the falcons as Lineout Coach...

What a debacle...but at least they've admitted they messed up...and rectified it I guess.

Diamond makes his first statement...strong Lineout! Ours is a shamblesthis season..but was always generally strong under Scott.

By the sounds of things, Codling didn't want to lose MacLeod in the first place. By most accounts Codling was working insane hours trying to basically keep up with multiple jobs. The coaching staff had been cut right back as well as the playing squad.

I'll be interested to see where Codling ends up. Obviously it didn't work out at Falcons with the huge disparity in budgets between them and the rest of the Prem. Codling has a great rep as a forwards coach though, worked so well with Joe El-Abd at Oyonnax. I think he'll do well longer term.

The whole thing has been a debacle KC...I won't lie. Yes Codling was working insane hours by all accounts. So why was he not given a decent backing?

If he's seen as a lineout expert fine...let him do that but bring in coaches elsewhere. Otherwise keep a very successful Macleod in and Codling can focus elsewhere.

Anyway it's done...They seem to be backing Diamond immediately so we see where we go.

Interestingly was talking to someone close to the club at the weekend and there seems to be a general feeling Blamires lineout is a problem...and wonder what Diamond will make of it...

Bath favourite to sign Pepper.

Geordie wrote:The whole thing has been a debacle KC...I won't lie. Yes Codling was working insane hours by all accounts. So why was he not given a decent backing?

If he's seen as a lineout expert fine...let him do that but bring in coaches elsewhere.  Otherwise keep a very successful Macleod in and Codling can focus elsewhere.  

Anyway it's done...They seem to be backing Diamond immediately so we see where we go.

Interestingly was talking to someone close to the club at the weekend and there seems to be a general feeling Blamires lineout is a problem...and wonder what Diamond will make of it...

It's odd. Either Codling didn't have the full view of how tight the budget now was. Or he was sold the full picture but didn't accurately estimate the challenges. Or a bit of both. It will come out in the wash at some point presumably.

LCD's lineout was hilariously bad at a stage. These things can improve quickly. Generally, I think hookers that are proficient in the scrum tend to improve their darts better than those that struggle at scrum time but hit lineouts early in their careers.

Rumours that Tigers are looking at Thomas Gallo, the Argentine LH. Plus Cronin potentially going back to Munster.

Rumours now about Guy Pepper signing for Bath next year.

Losing him and Brantingham is a blow...but im sure Diamond will deal with it.

RugbyPass saying Adam Hastings definitely back to Glasgow for next season. Talks with Gloucester stalled, likely because they wanted to offer him less money you would imagine!

Injuries have rather derailed his time down south, so let's hope he rediscovers his mojo at Scotstoun and can push back into the Scotland squad.


https://www.rugbypass.com/news/scotland-flyhalf-adam-hastings-to-leave-gloucester/

Regan Grace rehabbing with Bath, I know he was there a little while back but he must be close to a return if they’re talking about it. Jacques du Plessis is also there, I hadn’t heard that one previously. Neil le Roux too.

Crivens. Shucks. Jacques du Plessis had been linked to Bath but I was really hoping Tigers might get him. He's had horrid injury luck since returning to SA. At his best with Montpellier he was absolutely fantastic. If a club can rehab him to the point where you can get even get managed game time from him then that will be a brilliant bit of work. 

Sarries did that with Juan Figallo really astutely. Figallo went from fleetingly looking like one the best THs in international rugby to the verge of retirement. Sarries invested in his rehab, got him on the pitch, then managed his workload through a mix of bench apps and earlier substitution. Obviously, they were way over the cap at the time, so they had Koch and Lamositele. Which helps. Still good work from their team though. If Bath can get du Plessis fit, rotate him with Bayliss then it will be a cut price way of getting top end physicality into their side when needed.

I've had a soft spot for Regan Grace just because his name sounds like what Regan King would be called on a video game that didn't have the rights to use certain players real names. It's not the most rational reason to like a player I admit.

Saints have signed Lawes replacement for next season, Josh Kemeny from Melbourne Rebels. At 6'4" and 17.5 stone he is a like for like replacement and even quicker than Courtney, for the last RWC he was selected by Australia as a ‘utility player – covering ‘seven, six and the wing’.

He is going to be an interesting one to watch.

Falcons have apparently signed Gloucester winger Alex Hearl for next season in a two year deal...

Geordie wrote:Falcons have apparently signed Gloucester winger Alex Hearl for next season in a two year deal...

Can play wing or centre. Has been a squad player at Glaws. Still only 25. Not a bad addition, Diamond will know him from his Wuss days. Bit of an odd addition unless someone is going.

Unsurprisingly Mercer is being linked with a move back to France.

formerly known as Sam wrote:

Geordie wrote:Falcons have apparently signed Gloucester winger Alex Hearl for next season in a two year deal...

Can play wing or centre. Has been a squad player at Glaws. Still only 25. Not a bad addition, Diamond will know him from his Wuss days. Bit of an odd addition unless someone is going.

Well Carerras is already away...

king_carlos wrote:Crivens. Shucks. Jacques du Plessis had been linked to Bath but I was really hoping Tigers might get him. He's had horrid injury luck since returning to SA. At his best with Montpellier he was absolutely fantastic. If a club can rehab him to the point where you can get even get managed game time from him then that will be a brilliant bit of work. 

Sarries did that with Juan Figallo really astutely. Figallo went from fleetingly looking like one the best THs in international rugby to the verge of retirement. Sarries invested in his rehab, got him on the pitch, then managed his workload through a mix of bench apps and earlier substitution. Obviously, they were way over the cap at the time, so they had Koch and Lamositele. Which helps. Still good work from their team though. If Bath can get du Plessis fit, rotate him with Bayliss then it will be a cut price way of getting top end physicality into their side when needed.

I've had a soft spot for Regan Grace just because his name sounds like what Regan King would be called on a video game that didn't have the rights to use certain players real names. It's not the most rational reason to like a player I admit.

Bath must have a lot of money. It's a good coaching team that they've assembled but they're also continuing to build a strong squad. du Plessis is a fantastic player at lock and back-row, I do wonder why he hasn't been capped by the Boks but I guess their depth is ridiculous now anyway.

Rob Carmichael to Edinburgh https://www.leicestertigers.com/news/carmichael-joins-edinburgh-on-loan-ahead-of-permanent-move

Rugby Pass mooting a move for Magnus back to Edinburgh. It sounds like Bristol want to cut his wages a proportion of which are now presumably going to go to Bill Mata!

May not be a bad move all round he has grown as a player at Bristol and now back in the Scotland squad.

broadlandboy wrote:Rob Carmichael to Edinburgh https://www.leicestertigers.com/news/carmichael-joins-edinburgh-on-loan-ahead-of-permanent-move

He played England under 20s. He's a big lad at 6ft10. Has been playing for Notts Uni this season of memory serves. There's a number of good young locks at Tigers and he couldn't force his way up the pecking order. If Edinburgh need locks he's certainly got potential and his dad's Scottish so he's SQ.

mikey_dragon wrote:

king_carlos wrote:Crivens. Shucks. Jacques du Plessis had been linked to Bath but I was really hoping Tigers might get him. He's had horrid injury luck since returning to SA. At his best with Montpellier he was absolutely fantastic. If a club can rehab him to the point where you can get even get managed game time from him then that will be a brilliant bit of work. 

Sarries did that with Juan Figallo really astutely. Figallo went from fleetingly looking like one the best THs in international rugby to the verge of retirement. Sarries invested in his rehab, got him on the pitch, then managed his workload through a mix of bench apps and earlier substitution. Obviously, they were way over the cap at the time, so they had Koch and Lamositele. Which helps. Still good work from their team though. If Bath can get du Plessis fit, rotate him with Bayliss then it will be a cut price way of getting top end physicality into their side when needed.

I've had a soft spot for Regan Grace just because his name sounds like what Regan King would be called on a video game that didn't have the rights to use certain players real names. It's not the most rational reason to like a player I admit.

Bath must have a lot of money. It's a good coaching team that they've assembled but they're also continuing to build a strong squad. du Plessis is a fantastic player at lock and back-row, I do wonder why he hasn't been capped by the Boks but I guess their depth is ridiculous now anyway.

Jacques du Plessis was a beast when at Montpellier. I remember his really doing for Tigers rolling maul in the lesser Euro final. He's been mainly injured when back in SA (quick check shows 7 games in two years) and I suspect he went back to try and push his name forward for Bok selection. If Bath can get him fit and back to his best that's a fantastic signing for them.

Out of interest who's out of contract and likely to leave at Leicester - cant see much about any of their squad but would have thought they must be letting some players go in the off season.

I know Watson is due up and Cronin has been mentioned to Munster. But anyone else leaving?

Welshmushroom wrote:Out of interest who's out of contract and likely to leave at Leicester - cant see much about any of their squad but would have thought they must be letting some players go in the off season.

I know Watson is due up and Cronin has been mentioned to Munster.  But anyone else leaving?

From memory it's something like:

Cronin, van Wyk, Rogerson, Cracknell, Carter, Watson, Cokanasiga, Scott that are out of contract and possible leavers.

Most of the additional players held in the squad have already been released. Loosehead stable needs an overhaul but otherwise I don't think there will be masses of change. A centre and a wing might be useful. I suspect one of the two of the backrows will be retained and then the other spot filled from the development squad. Carter may also be replaced by some of the guys from the development squad though having some experience in that position is useful as the first three choices are all under 24.

Weise is obviously going which will free up a good chunk of change though well probably need that for his replacement.

I saw Guy Porter was being linked with a move to Australia earlier in the season, did he end up going or did he re-sign with the club?

Tigers never release contract lengths so it's a bit of guesswork but I think Sam is probably right there.

Porter has been rumoured as in talks with Super Rugby sides. I could see that being similar to Harry Potter just fancying moving back to Oz. For a strong Prem player just below international level there won't be a big difference in wages. Whilst he's out the England frame now. There were the usual moronic conspiracy theories around Potter being promised Australia caps that didn't materialise but from all I heard he just fancied being back home in the sun. Australia isn't a bad place to be mid-twenties with some disposable income!

A lot of players sign 2+1 deals rather than 3-year contracts now. So either player or club have that get out before the 3rd year if desired. Porter has been on an enforced layoff due to concussion as well, which will obviously factor into his decision.

formerly known as Sam wrote:

Welshmushroom wrote:Out of interest who's out of contract and likely to leave at Leicester - cant see much about any of their squad but would have thought they must be letting some players go in the off season.

I know Watson is due up and Cronin has been mentioned to Munster.  But anyone else leaving?

From memory it's something like:

Cronin, van Wyk, Rogerson, Cracknell, Carter, Watson, Cokanasiga, Scott that are out of contract and possible leavers.

Most of the additional players held in the squad have already been released. Loosehead stable needs an overhaul but otherwise I don't think there will be masses of change. A centre and a wing might be useful. I suspect one of the two of the backrows will be retained and then the other spot filled from the development squad. Carter may also be replaced by some of the guys from the development squad though having some experience in that position is useful as the first three choices are all under 24.

Weise is obviously going which will free up a good chunk of change though well probably need that for his replacement.

Could be a good bit of business to keep hold of Cracknell. Not as good as Wiese but I think Tigers could make it work, and probably far more affordable, although Wiese wasn't well known at the time he joined Tigers from Cheetahs.

Weise signed a new longer term deal with Tigers after he'd been there six months as it was blatantly obvious he was a perfect fit and it was rumoured that was a sizeable uplift.

The Porter rumour came about after he'd been back to Australia over Christmas and had been seen with Potter. As KC said he'd been on a lay off due to concussion so couldn't play and some rest time seeing family and friends in the sunshine was probably good for him. Porter unlike Potter won't be eligible for the Wallabies and with the financial difficulties over in Aussie Rugby I can see the ARU trying to promote retaining Wallaby available talent as the Rebels fold. I'd still take Potter back at Tigers in a heartbeat.

Cracknell has had an injury or two and just looks a bit ploddy now. There's few big hits, he struggles to jackle and the carries have lost their bite. He's probably favourite to go with Rogerson playing backup 6/8 to Hatherall, Liebenburg and whomever else comes in. Hopefully we stop deploying Rogerson at 7 once Ilione bulks up a touch more.

2 LHs - Tomas Gallo of Benneton has been linked, very optimistically a return for Genge as well was rumoured.
8 - Evan Roos has been linked somewhat loosely.
Centre - Waisea Nayacalevu was linked after it was announced his contract wouldn't be renewed in France.

Are the only substantial murmurings so far. Not much to them either. Tigers do have a very good pair of looseheads and Whitcombe developing nicely, two good young hookers, a good selection of locks some of whom can play 6, a couple of good 9 prospects and a very classy 12 in the development squad. Those areas look bright for the future and outside of loosehead I wouldn't expect to see recruitment there.

Luan de Bruin linked with Tigers as well.

I do wonder if Hurd might head the other way to Edinburgh though. Scotland and Edinburgh need THs, Hurd is well behind Cole and Heyes despite being a good player. Nothing rumoured there, just speculation on my part. If offered the chance at more game time I could see a release being agreed.

king_carlos wrote:Luan de Bruin linked with Tigers as well.

I do wonder if Hurd might head the other way to Edinburgh though. Scotland and Edinburgh need THs, Hurd is well behind Cole and Heyes despite being a good player. Nothing rumoured there, just speculation on my part. If offered the chance at more game time I could see a release being agreed.

Edinburgh will be glad to be shot of de Bruin.

He was much touted and has managed about half a game in his whole time there.

Tigers would be taking a big chance on signing him back, presumably he would not cost a lot now.

14 games last season isn't atrocious to be fair. There are 18 URC games, 4 Champions Cup in the regular season. Then Edinburgh's only KO involvement was the ERCC round of 16. So 23 games total and 14 played. He's only returned this season in the weekend just gone though. So obviously struggling more there.

I'd take de Bruin back. He can genuinely cover both sides of the scrum, which is rare now and very useful in a cash strapped league. He'd be 3rd choice LH and 4th choice TH in the squad as recruitment currently looks. I'd be very happy with a player of his quality and versatility at that depth.

formerly known as Sam wrote:

broadlandboy wrote:Rob Carmichael to Edinburgh https://www.leicestertigers.com/news/carmichael-joins-edinburgh-on-loan-ahead-of-permanent-move

He played England under 20s. He's a big lad at 6ft10. Has been playing for Notts Uni this season of memory serves. There's a number of good young locks at Tigers and he couldn't force his way up the pecking order. If Edinburgh need locks he's certainly got potential and his dad's Scottish so he's SQ.

Talented player from what I've seen. The nature of a smaller player pool is that players of Carmichael's size are harder to find, so the SRU will generally offer longer contracts to stage 3 academy age players to give them time to develop. Tigers would be unlikely to offer a 3-year deal with Lewis Chessum and Carnduff also in the development squad and even more highly rated. It's a really good opportunity for Carmichael in that regard.

A few Tigers academy grads have ended up playing in Scotland around this age in recent years. Muncaster and Grahamslaw. Now Carmichael. Jed Gelderbloom was in Scotland last I knew. Going further back, Sam Yawayawa moved to Glasgow.

The Mish is the most famous by far of course. Whilst Scott Steele was Tigers academy before his time at LI and Quins.

Andre Esterhuizen linked with a move to Sharks (RSA)
Trevor Nyakane to leave Racing for the very same Sharks as well.

Fluxy wrote:Andre Esterhuizen linked with a move to Sharks (RSA)
Trevor Nyakane to leave Racing for the very same Sharks as well.

I think both of those are confirmed. Bulls were also trying to get Nyakane but it seems Sharks got there in the end, and they've already got a fine squad (still bottom of the URC though).

KC, not sure on Hurd. Whilst it would be good for him to play more he moved North from the Tigers junior academy because he was given the chance to represent Scotland age grade. When he didn't get much in the way of chances he came back, much to the delight of his mother who lives in North Leicestershire (he's an Ashby lad). Cole isn't getting any younger and can't keep playing every week (he hasn't his season). Hurd may confirm with McKellar he's in the succession plans and no other THs are incoming. If that's the case stay close to home. If we're bringing in another tighthead then he'd be better off heading north again.

Losing Andre Esterhuizen is a blow to Quins but Sharks are apparently paying up towards £500k to get him out of contract. That is a bit chunky of change and might help them land Lawrence as rumoured.

Alex Hearle Confirmed on a two year deal....whilst looks like Mateo Carreras's move to Bayonne is now from immediate effect.

Geordie wrote:Alex Hearle Confirmed on a two year deal....whilst looks like Mateo Carreras's move to Bayonne is now from immediate effect.

Oosh, losing him with immediate effect really does rub salt in the wound. I suppose it gets some salary off the books and allows Diamond to concentrate on those that are staying.

Gareth Williams, Scarlets defence coach, has been removed from his role and redistributed to the academy team! A sure sign that they're not happy with the way the defence has gone so far this season!

formerly known as Sam wrote:

Geordie wrote:Alex Hearle Confirmed on a two year deal....whilst looks like Mateo Carreras's move to Bayonne is now from immediate effect.

Oosh, losing him with immediate effect really does rub salt in the wound. I suppose it gets some salary off the books and allows Diamond to concentrate on those that are staying.

He's barely played this season Sam so,in that regards he's not actually a loss. However no doubt one hell of a player!
But we turned him in to what he is and time to do the same with Nathan Greenwood...

Apparently Diamond made this signing of Hearle so bringing in a bit more physicality already and hopes he'll get Ben Stevenson back to performing at his best...

Add in Iwan Stephens and Radders and we have a decent set of wingers...just need to get them some ball in positions they can do something with it...

TAFKA The Oracle wrote:Gareth Williams, Scarlets defence coach, has been removed from his role and redistributed to the academy team!  A sure sign that they're not happy with the way the defence has gone so far this season!

Yeah presumably the only reason he is going to the academy is we can't afford to pay him the rest of his contract. Peel to attack coach & Payne to defence.

Oakdene wrote:

TAFKA The Oracle wrote:Gareth Williams, Scarlets defence coach, has been removed from his role and redistributed to the academy team!  A sure sign that they're not happy with the way the defence has gone so far this season!

Yeah presumably the only reason he is going to the academy is we can't afford to pay him the rest of his contract. Peel to attack coach & Payne to defence.

Rumour is that Peel was given another 3 years? Not sure when, or how tbh...

Your scrum is bad, I'd also give Phillips the boot and give it to Van den Berg. I would have given Peel the boot long ago. Let's face it, Scarlets have been poor under him since he came in except for the time Lee Blackett was there.

mikey_dragon wrote:

Oakdene wrote:

TAFKA The Oracle wrote:Gareth Williams, Scarlets defence coach, has been removed from his role and redistributed to the academy team!  A sure sign that they're not happy with the way the defence has gone so far this season!

Yeah presumably the only reason he is going to the academy is we can't afford to pay him the rest of his contract. Peel to attack coach & Payne to defence.

Rumour is that Peel was given another 3 years? Not sure when, or how tbh...

Your scrum is bad, I'd also give Phillips the boot and give it to Van den Berg. I would have given Peel the boot long ago. Let's face it, Scarlets have been poor under him since he came in except for the time Lee Blackett was there.

Was signed in November by all accounts....

No way...

Is the coaching restructure you allude to also happening?