Fighters remembered more for one loss than their entire career

There have been many fighters who have had long and successful careers, however rather than being praised for all the numerous achievements they accomplished they are more remembered for just one particular loss.

Examples of the above which spring to mind are:

1) Hatton - the PBF loss is normally not too heavily frowned upon and often seen as a valiant effort against the P4P king and a division above his best weight but his 2nd rd KO defeat against Pac is often used to belittle him.

I've never been Hatton's biggest fan but I think people dwell too much on the Pac fight.

2) Cuevas - an exceptional fighter who achieved a lot (he does has 15 losses to his name but I believe half of these were when he was just a 14-15 year old kid), including 11 defences of his WW belt, however you only really hear about him when people discuss Hearns demolition of him.

He also operated in probably the most impressive era of WW's but that is often overlooked.

3) M. Spinks - A career spanning from winning Olympic gold at MW to dethroning a previously undefeated Holmes at HW, he achieved much but is widely remembered for his 1st rd loss against Tyson.


Fighters should be judged by their losses as well as wins but some get scrutinised more than most.

Do you agree with the above fighters that their legacy is somewhat tarnished by a single defeat and do you know of others who fit this category?

All the tragic ones to a degree, Kim, McClellan, Owen.

Taylor vs Chavez.

Liston vs Ali.

I think Foreman gets a raw deal in this sense to due to the rumble in the jungle. Particulary by casual fans.

David Haye Vs Klitschko - Not a great but a good 2 weight champion whos careers been erased prior to this loss..

Some use the No mas or Hearns fights to belittle Duran and forget about his multiple achievements (thankfully not many do)

Naz's loss to Barrerra - Never been the Prince's biggest fan but had a lot of success prior to this loss to an ATG.

Frazier for the thriller, possibly.

Definitely Hamed/Barrera.

Good shouts about Haye and Frazier, agree with both of them.

Tommy Hearns and the Hagler fight...

Oh and Cotto with Margarito

Unbeatable Georgey Groves wrote:Oh and Cotto with Margarito

Hopefully that will change this weekend. Always liked Cotto.

alma wrote:

Dazstarr wrote:I think Foreman gets a raw deal in this sense to due to the rumble in the jungle. Particulary by casual fans.

Exactly. Ali's win arguably the greatest win in boxing history

So under rated it's untrue. Foreman was meant to smash him to bits. Due to people holding Ali in such high esteem - when people look back without knowing the facts, they will say "It was Ali, of course he should have won". Shame really as Foreman was a wrecking machine. Just ask Joe Frazier.

alma wrote:

paperbag_puncher wrote:
Naz's loss to Barrerra - Never been the Prince's biggest fan but had a lot of success prior to this loss to an ATG.

In my eyes it was the fact that he had the ability to beat Barrera but was too far up his own 'arris to train properly etc. Plus of course that he basically gave up after this and disappeared, only to resurface to kill someone in a car crash and get fat.

At least Haye is going to man up and face Vitali

Slight exaggeration!

Valero's Conscience wrote:

alma wrote:

paperbag_puncher wrote:
Naz's loss to Barrerra - Never been the Prince's biggest fan but had a lot of success prior to this loss to an ATG.

In my eyes it was the fact that he had the ability to beat Barrera but was too far up his own 'arris to train properly etc. Plus of course that he basically gave up after this and disappeared, only to resurface to kill someone in a car crash and get fat.

At least Haye is going to man up and face Vitali

Slight exaggeration!

Na.

Scottrf wrote:

Valero's Conscience wrote:

alma wrote:

paperbag_puncher wrote:
Naz's loss to Barrerra - Never been the Prince's biggest fan but had a lot of success prior to this loss to an ATG.

In my eyes it was the fact that he had the ability to beat Barrera but was too far up his own 'arris to train properly etc. Plus of course that he basically gave up after this and disappeared, only to resurface to kill someone in a car crash and get fat.

At least Haye is going to man up and face Vitali

Slight exaggeration!

Na.

Did he kill them though, I thought they were just injured?

Think he died about a year later.

Dazstarr wrote:Think he died about a year later.

Wasn't that the one Khan ran over, or both?

Hmmmm - i think a google search is in order.

If by manning up, he provided another display ala v's Wlad, I don't think he can be classed as manning up at all

Dazstarr wrote:

Hmmmm - i think a google search is in order.

Just checked Wiki and no mention of a death - Wiki is universally known to never have a shred of inaccuracy ever so I think we can take it as gospel!

I was just disagreeing for the sake of it on the Nas one but here's a story on the guy hit by Khan:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-563293/Boxer-Amir-Khan-blamed-drink-death-broken-man-steel-worker-ran-sports-car.html

Billy Conn aswell. ATG light heavy but many remember him as the man who threw away a win against Joe Louis...

James J. Jeffries, for me.

Had it not been for America's obsession with unseating Jack Johnson, Jeffries would have been the first heavyweight champion to have retired undefeated, having beaten every credible challenger and having racked up wins over HOF opposition in one third of his fights.

As it is, he was dragged from a near six year retirement at thirty five years old, needing to shed one hundred pounds to get down to fighting trim, and all to be offered up as cannon fodder to a Johnson who was at the height of his powers.

Terrible shame, and one with far reaching consequences. Once the most feared man on the planet, and the choice of many a historian as the best heavy of the lot, Jeffries is often completely overlooked when boxing fans compile their lists of the greatest heavyweights.

Excellent shout Windy, as you know I have read quite a bit about that era and it never fails to amaze me the esteem the boilermaker was held in, often hear guys like Hart saying I'd fight anyone, other than Jeffries obviously, similarly see countless reports of fighters where they are described as ready for anyone other than Jeff and so on and so on. To see him barely sneaking into top ten heavy lists or missing out as is often the case certainly suggests he hs been hurt by the Johnson loss.

Another thing that needs to be considered is Jeffries fought Johnson around the era that filming fights started to improve and so the footage we have of him in his pomp is pretty ordinary and incomplete but we can see an ageing shell of him in pretty decent quality and clarity, great pity as the reports of him at his best certainly suggest a far better fighter than the Johnson fight shows.

Great point about the film quality, jeff.

I have a wee bit of the second Jeffries v Fitz fight and the quality is very poor, and also one of the Sharkey fights which is nice to have from a historical perspective but is, to all intents and purposes, unwatchable. So frustrating to not be able to see the real Boilermaker in action.

Whilst I agree to an extent that Jeffries is hurt by the loss to Johnson, I would imagine that anyone with even a passing history in that era of boxing would recognise that Jeffries was past his best and that the victory for Johnson was symbolic rather than a true indicator of their respective abilities.

I think Jeffries misses out on a lot of lists because the the era he fought in is seen as a bit too dim and distant and that would probably be the case whether or not he had lost to Johnson. If anything, there is an argument that not coming back out of retirement for Johnson would have seen Jeffries reduced to the status of an obscure early champion (albeit an unbeaten one).

Is possible Super but I think the whole Johnson fight was so massive that virtually everyone with a knowledge of the sport has either seen it or is pretty aware of its outcome, unfortunately a lot of people who are aware of this are equally as unaware of just what Jeffries achieved in his pomp or how well regarded he was.

Jeff is by far from the only fighter to make an ill considered comeback or carry on too long but is perhaps unique in that the knowledge of his comeback is so disproportionate to knowledge of his earlier career.

People tend to use Lewis' losses as a stick to beat him with.

In recent months, David Haye has been the public's whipping boy due to his loss against Wlad.

Michael Spinks is the big one though.

HumanWindmill wrote:James J. Jeffries, for me.

Had it not been for America's obsession with unseating Jack Johnson, Jeffries would have been the first heavyweight champion to have retired undefeated, having beaten every credible challenger and having racked up wins over HOF opposition in one third of his fights.

As it is, he was dragged from a near six year retirement at thirty five years old, needing to shed one hundred pounds to get down to fighting trim, and all to be offered up as cannon fodder to a Johnson who was at the height of his powers.

Terrible shame, and one with far reaching consequences. Once the most feared man on the planet, and the choice of many a historian as the best heavy of the lot, Jeffries is often completely overlooked when boxing fans compile their lists of the greatest heavyweights.

Trust windy to come up with a boxer he saw in his youth.

Ha!

Just a young whippersnapper I was, az.

HumanWindmill wrote:Ha!

Just a young whippersnapper I was, az.

Was mid 20s considered young?

Anyway I congratulate you on your longevity old man. Must be the better nutrition nowadays.

I have Evan Fields on speed dial, mate.

Well there you go. Hope it works for you as well it allegedly worked for Mr Fields/

A reliable yet often neglected fact is that for a fighter to be remembered for a loss they must have built up a considerable reputation and amount of expectation beforehand, fighters who had enjoyed fairly successful careers and were seen as going on to something special before their momentum train was stopped in its tracks. It's a rather common pattern imo.

Henry Cooper without a doubt, though actually not for the reasons stated above. Arguably fellow Ali-victim Foreman was on the recieving end of one of the biggest shocks in sporting history having sprung almost as great a shock shortly before against Frazier.

Hopkins has shattered more than his share of reputations, Trinidad, Tarver, Pavlik and Pascal to name some.

Jeff Lacy must have sky-rocketed in recognition as a fighter to have suffered one of the most severe lickings ever.

Tommy Burns.................................

Michael Spinks...............................

Are two that spring to mind...............

McGuigan, lost to Steve Cruz in the 140 degree Nevada heat and is remembered for this loss,everything that could have gone wrong before the fight for McGuigan did.
McGuigan is considered overrated despite his wins against Pedroza,LaPorte,and the then unbeaten No1 contender Bernard Taylor and also boasting an 80%Ko ratio.

Think that Barry is judged about right by people with their wits about them, Nico. A wonderful front-foot fighter, irresistible when allowed to get into any sort of rhythm and throw those terrific left hooks to head or body; about half the boxer when the play was taken away from him. I give you Laporte as his finest hour - he looked a million dollars that night. He definitely got Pedroza at the right time, but certainly made the most of his opportunity. Taylor is an interesting one. Barry had his ears boxed off for four rounds, before a combination of his body shots and the overpowering heat took their toll on Taylor. I've always found it interesting that Barry just got stronger and stronger against the BT Express, despite the unbearable, steamy heat inside the King's Hall on that evening. It seemed so strange to me that the heat should have been offered as the primary excuse for his subsequent loss to Cruz.

I know that the heat wasn't the only reason for that loss. His ankle and ear injuries should have ensured that he didn't take that fight. However, the signs were there against Cabrera, an awful performance, that he was vulnerable. Barry was responsible for some of the most enjoyable fight nights that I've ever experienced, but I can't rank him any higher than around 22 in an all-time UK-qualified list. His prime was too short, the great wins too few. As for underrating or overrating him, well, I certainly don't think that he belongs in Canastota. Of modern British featherweights, I honestly believe that he'd have had his hands full against Winstone and would have been taken apart by Naz, for whom Barry's style was made. Still a fine fighter, but I'm not sure that he's underrated by too many.

Valero - excellent thread - might be interesting and a little more intriguing to see it the other way around. Which fighters are remembered for one win more than their entire career.

I offer three.

Vitali
Douglas
Ibeabuchi

captain carrantuohil wrote:Think that Barry is judged about right by people with their wits about them, Nico. A wonderful front-foot fighter, irresistible when allowed to get into any sort of rhythm and throw those terrific left hooks to head or body; about half the boxer when the play was taken away from him. I give you Laporte as his finest hour - he looked a million dollars that night. He definitely got Pedroza at the right time, but certainly made the most of his opportunity. Taylor is an interesting one. Barry had his ears boxed off for four rounds, before a combination of his body shots and the overpowering heat took their toll on Taylor. I've always found it interesting that Barry just got stronger and stronger against the BT Express, despite the unbearable, steamy heat inside the King's Hall on that evening. It seemed so strange to me that the heat should have been offered as the primary excuse for his subsequent loss to Cruz.

I know that the heat wasn't the only reason for that loss. His ankle and ear injuries should have ensured that he didn't take that fight. However, the signs were there against Cabrera, an awful performance, that he was vulnerable. Barry was responsible for some of the most enjoyable fight nights that I've ever experienced, but I can't rank him any higher than around 22 in an all-time UK-qualified list. His prime was too short, the great wins too few. As for underrating or overrating him, well, I certainly don't think that he belongs in Canastota. Of modern British featherweights, I honestly believe that he'd have had his hands full against Winstone and would have been taken apart by Naz, for whom Barry's style was made. Still a fine fighter, but I'm not sure that he's underrated by too many.

Perhaps getting carried to an ambulance on a stretcher suffering with dehydration and heat exhaustion might be the excuse for the heat and you've stated ankle and ear injuries ensured he shouldn't have taken the fight.Without a doubt McGuigan has his hands full against Winstone but Naz and McGuigan would have been a great fight,McGuigans chin was solid and had enough power to cause problems,not many decked Pedroza.
Barry was ordered to pay half a million pound costs to Barney Eastwood for the allegations he made about the Cruz fight.

Oh, Barry suffered alright in the Cruz fight, I'm not trying to say otherwise. I only wanted to make the point that he had been impressively strong on another night of boiling heat nine months previously, when his opponent withdrew, citing heat exhaustion and was roundly criticised for it. Barry presumably felt the heat as well, but didn't appear to show it. That's what made Cruz such a shocker to me; you're right, though, it does tend to be what he's remembered for by far too many.

I'll add three Englishmen to your little list, Shah - Turpin, Stracey and Honeyghan.

Haye losing to Wlad and Hamed losing to Barrera would be my choices. People forget how good Haye and Hamed were and focus too much on their losses imo. Naz should not have retired I think that was disappointing but I think Haye has learned from Naz and decided not to retire there is too much potential. Imo Naz should have got back into training and fought Barrera again he was far too young to retire tbh.

captain carrantuohil wrote:I'll add three Englishmen to your little list, Shah - Turpin, Stracey and Honeyghan.

L Spinks
Maybe a tentative case for Old Foreman?
Rahman (could be in both categories - remembered for beating lewis and getting totalled by the one two.

Felix Trinadad and Diego Corrales are recent examples.

Corrales is probably best remembered for the Castillo fights.

Corrales won the most talked about of his fights.

I tend to think of his loss to Mayweather first, simply because of the significance it had and the fact it established Floyd as one of the elite fighters around.

Really? Whenever I hear his name I think of his two great fights with Castillo.

prettyboykev wrote:Really? Whenever I hear his name I think of his two great fights with Castillo.

Obviously there is an element of personal choices when it comes to this topic.
For me, although his fights with Castillo were great, his loss to Mayweather took place when both fighters were unbeaten and Corrales was the betting favourite. Mayweather put on a clinic in what was possibly his best ever performance.

Corrales was betting favourite? Source?

Scottrf wrote:Corrales was betting favourite? Source?

Perhaps not a betting favourite but I recall many saw it as a toss-up with notable others (such as Max Kellerman) picking Corrales to win.