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New coach but not all roses

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formerly known as Sam
kiakahaaotearoa
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New coach but not all roses Empty New coach but not all roses

Post by kiakahaaotearoa Fri 09 Dec 2011, 4:27 pm

Well a new coach has been appointed at least for the 6N. It may well be a different coach that sees England take on all the 3N teams and Fiji at the end of the year.

I can´t help but feel that England is getting short changed here. Does the new coach Lancaster have a serious chance of retaining the role later in the year? If the answer is no, then the best thing he can wish for is the best result possible in the 6N. But will this be based on an all-out attack utilising space and getting quick ball? Or will it be one more conservative in approach based on playing to England´s previous strengths: picking a big pack that can intimidate teams and using big men in the backs to take the ball over the advantage line? One that betrays the fact that England are capable of a quick game.

If there´s a caretaker coach, is there more a chance of him appointing a caretaker captain? Is there more of a chance to stick with the tried and proven in problem areas like the backrow, centre combination and the halves? Should there be wholesale changes or is it more of a case of changing tactics? What is England´s ideal team with a mix of experience and also rewarding new talent?

If a new coach comes in at the end of the year, faced with facing Australia, South Africa and New Zealand in successive weeks, how will England be prepared as a team? Will there be new combinations? Will England have a new captain?

Just interested to know from English posters. What position would you be happy with in the 6N and how many tests would you like to see against the big three at the end of the year? What is the bare minimum for a team with such a proud history. World rugby needs nations like England to be at the top of their game. Is that possible with the situation they find themselves in?

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Post by formerly known as Sam Fri 09 Dec 2011, 4:50 pm

I think whoever the coach is they've got to play to the strengths of the players they have available. No point at trying to play a tight game plan and force penalties if you don't have a brilliant kicker, similarly no use playing expansive running rugby if you don't have a pack to keep up.

England have a powerful front five and a decent set piece (it's not the best but it's good). They have decent tactical kickers but not great ones and ditto for the points kicking. They have available to them two very powerful centres with soft hands who like to play flat and a fly half who can pass flat. There are plentiful options of counter attacking back three players but only two real tactical kicking back three players (and neither are capped).

So to my mind England need to play territory, use the set piece and the big boys to bosh holes and apply pressure.

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Post by formerly known as Sam Fri 09 Dec 2011, 4:52 pm

To finish that...

get the speedsters running off the ball carriers. Force the opposition to put boot to ball and let our counter attacking options run broken field. We were guilty of going to wide to early previously and made too many errors. Better to start with securing territory first and working from there.

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Post by kiakahaaotearoa Fri 09 Dec 2011, 4:55 pm

They should´ve made you coach mate. Sounds like sensible stuff. Who would your team be and your captain?

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Post by Comfort Fri 09 Dec 2011, 5:08 pm

England found the perfect balance to their game internationally under MJ for a (albeit brief) period, which to me says theres not a whole lot that actually needs changing on the tactical front.

More so on man-management and preparation.

Lancasters a sensible choice, hopefully he'll bring a few of the exciting talents in the saxons with him to give them a chance in the backline. That to me is why he was given the role, he'll know the players and the set-up, he'll be bringing through some fresh faces into the EPS I'd imagine.

Theres an abundance of international quality forwards in the AP, you could pick any number of combinations, you just need to get the balance right. The front 5 has traditionally been a strong point of the English game.

As Sam said, simple but effective rugby, big ball-carriers to punch down the middle, efficiently clear the ruck and the pacy and creative back 3 can be put to work. And with Ashton always looking for gaps against the grain, having the 2 big lumps with soft hands should be his wet dream.

Of course, this is all good and well as long as its played in the right areas of the pitch, then, any loose clearance kicking can be punished on the second wave, the counter attack.

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Post by aitchw Fri 09 Dec 2011, 5:11 pm

I don't have a problem with the temp appointments. The RFU has stumbled and bumbled on for long enough now and changes are needed. Rather than a hurried appointment I am happy that they are giving themselves breathing space to get it right. As for the Lancaster, Rountree and Farrell caretaker arrangement I think it could work and be a breath of fresh air. The Saxons have been pretty successful and scored plenty of points and conceded not too many. Farrell was just too old when he changed codes to shine in Union but he does bring a League approach to many aspects of the game and you can see it in his son's game. Provided Lancaster does his own thing then there is a chance we might see a slightly different England taking the field. If any current EPS members don't like it there's a full 22 Saxons squad waiting in the wings who know and work with Lancaster already. I am looking forward to the 6 Nations now, I wasn't before Jonno resigned, too stodgy by half.

I do think the 2012 AIs will come around too soon for any new coaching staff but it will depend a lot on how the 6Ns went and the personnel involved in that.

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Post by robbo277 Fri 09 Dec 2011, 7:07 pm

It all depends on how quickly we get a new chief executive in. We need to sort out the top first, and Lancaster should be able to hold the fort over the Six Nations, maybe take a squad down to South Africa too.

When we get the structure right at the top we can look at bringing in a coach on a long-term basis and, if Lancaster does well, he could put himself right in contention, even if he looks like a long shot for the job now.

I hope when we do get people in the top positions they have a proper search and make sure they get the right man before committing to anything. Then, once they are sure they've got the best available person for the job they can give him a long contract and back him over time to get the job done. There's no "quick fix", there's no short cuts, we need to start doing things properly and then we'll start to see results.

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Post by alcoombe Fri 09 Dec 2011, 8:30 pm

What I like about Lancaster coming in is that he's under no illusions about his longevity in the role. He's been involved in development rugby for the best part of a decade, that's what he does best and after the 6N he'll return to his role of heading up the Academy and running the Saxons. He's not under the same sort of pressure that other options would be and judging from his comments I think he sees this as an opportunity to give the young deserving talent he's coached over the last number of years their fair stab.

His Saxons sides certainly don't shy away from forward dominance, but he picks good backrow combinations (as you'd hope from a former flanker) and the whole team is usually pretty well balanced thoughout, with quality centres and pacy, skillful back 3s.

I'm not expecting big things result wise from the 6N, but I do think we will end the tournament having marked out some strong talent that plays with heart and that the incoming coach can focus on and build a team around. Those players hopefully having identified that this 6N under Lancaster is a great shop window to make their case for the future.

Just want to point out as well that the new coach will be taking England on a 3 test summer tour of SA prior to the AIs. The squad will be together for at least 6 weeks, so plenty of time to develop on what is learnt in the 6N.

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