Has the Italian inclusion into the 6Ns been a success?

I thought at the time that a spanish-based Argentinian side would have better.

As time passes and results accrue historically, it's looking like we're back to a four-nations format with a couple of invitational sides.

I think that it has been a sucess. A weekend away in rome is far more attractive a prospect than one away in Wales, England or Scotland

Rugby wise i also feel that its been very good for Italy.

eirebilly wrote:I think that it has been a sucess. A weekend away in rome is far more attractive a prospect than one away in Wales, England or Scotland

Rugby wise i also feel that its been very good for Italy.

But rugby-wise it's been worse for the NH.

Madrid/Barcelona in the springtime was the alternative..

How has it been worse Portnoy? Italy have come along in leaps and bounds and are actually becomming a very competitive side.

Oh, and Spanish women arent as sexy as Italian women in my view

Don't see how basing Argentina in Spain could work

Give it time,look at how long it took France to be competitive when they first made it the 5 Nations.

Italy will emerge as a rugby superpower imo but it'll take 20 or 30 years if I had to guess a timeline.

T

eirebilly wrote:How has it been worse Portnoy? Italy have come along in leaps and bounds and are actually becomming a very competitive side.

Really?

So far as I can see Italy has been a soft landing area for the rest.

Also as an answer to a previous poster - why Argentina based in Spain? Common language. Too late now though.

I cant see Italy being a super power but i can see them being even more competitive towards the end of this decade.

Asking scotland theyd probably say yes, gives them a chance to not finish last every year.

A soft landing? Beaten Wales, Scotland and even France.

I think that they have had some pretty good finishes for their first 11 years in the tournement.

Would be very expensive for Argentinian rugby fans though.. There not exactly a rich country

not amazingly on the face of it, but its helping a nation- its all about getting more countries involved.

id like to have a euro cup every 2 years instead of a 6 nations, because we cant just stop with italy

I think that the inclusion has been well worth it.... ok Treviso are the only team from Italy putting in good performances, but give it time and I'm sure it will work out.

asoreleftshoulder wrote:Give it time,look at how long it took France to be competitive when they first made it the 5 Nations.

Many people do forget that it took a really long time for France to find there feet.

I would like to see a comparison between France's first 10 years in the 5N and Italy's first 10 years in the 6N
I am not sure there would be much difference.

eirebilly wrote:Oh, and Spanish women arent as sexy as Italian women in my view

As I´m married to a Madrileña I would have to disagree with you there sir.

Italy beat France last year. That´s not too shabby a result. Italy have yet to bring their A game with them away but they are becoming increasingly a handful at home. I´m sure many teams who go to Rome recognise that they have to bring their A game with them and that is a good indication that they are worthy of being in the tournament.

Yes because we had a spare weekend free anyway, so if there was no Italy, then one team would have the week off. The Italy game in Cardiff is always a sell out like any other so revenue is generated.

Personal taste Kia

I have a Viking lady from Norway.... Cant beat Scandanavians

For me, Italy has gone from a team where i thought 'how many try's will Ireland score' to a team where i get nervous. Thats how well i think that they have blended in.

You certainly don't get many blonde women in Spain. I used to have Swedish flatmates when I lived in Paris. Both girls had no qualms about nudity. I came back to the flat and caught them having a bath together when I made a quick beeline for the bathroon. They insisted I use the facilities. It seemed like I was standing there for hours from stage fright. I actually had to fight to resist the urge to sit down and have a pee.

If you tried that in Italy and Spain, you´d get your eyes scratched out and your balls removed with pliers. That is walking in on a woman having a bath. Not sitting down to pee.

sit down?

For various motives.

a) Hide the evidence.

b) Relax myself and actually go.

c) Make it seem more justified spending so long in the bathroom.

you do realise you had a 'game on' situation dont you!

Try Saunas in Norway Kia............. Nice

I guess it depends exactly what the girls were doing having a bath together. Did you ask to join in?

doctor_grey wrote:I guess it depends exactly what the girls were doing having a bath together. Did you ask to join in?

Tell me, as a doctor would you condone bathing together?

I was well aware of that situation mate. They were just talking together. I imagine at some stage they washed themselves but I feel you guys are failing to see they could have been washing the dishes together naked. Nudity comes naturally to them if you´ll excuse the pun. Of course when we Anglo-Saxons think of two girls in a bath we think of other things. Besides they knew my French girfriend and they were good friends. You don´t screw the crew. You just take a quick looky when you´re trying to go pee-pee.

Have tried saunas in Sweden. Nice but the nudity thing got to me. I was so panicky about growing in stature that I kept on thinking about a woman´s rugby front row and it spoiled the experience for me. They should allow strategically placed towels and hand lotion but only full nudity without any foreign material or materials are tolerated.

eirebilly wrote:

asoreleftshoulder wrote:Give it time,look at how long it took France to be competitive when they first made it the 5 Nations.

Many people do forget that it took a really long time for France to find there feet.

I would like to see a comparison between France's first 10 years in the 5N and Italy's first 10 years in the 6N
I am not sure there would be much difference.

France joined the Five Nations in 1910. There were a couple of years where no championship was played due to WW1. Between 1910 and 1931 after which France were expelled until 1939, they only won 11 games, and were perennial wooden spooners for most seasons.

Agree Pot people seem to forget France were gash for ages. And Italy are improving , no one has absolutely thumped them in this years competition yet.

The sole purpose of the Italians' presence is to gum up the trapdoor for the Scots and therefore prevent a competitive Euro league.

France made the 5Ns almost a hundred years ago (OK - the did get suspended for a decade or so because of claims of professionalism some time later).

But this is now an age of instant media. Who has traditionally relied most on imported players?

Thanks Pot, i knew that France had several years of misery when they first joined.

eirebilly wrote:

doctor_grey wrote:I guess it depends exactly what the girls were doing having a bath together. Did you ask to join in?

Tell me, as a doctor would you condone bathing together?

From a medical point of view, it is most unsanitary. But, I am sure if that was explained to them they would understand. Therefore you would all need to work together to ensure everyone was really clean. Lots of scrubbing.

Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler wrote:Asking scotland theyd probably say yes, gives them a chance to not finish last every year.

Well it didn't help Wales in 2003, or scotland in 2004 and 2007.

doctor_grey wrote:
From a medical point of view, it is most unsanitary. But, I am sure if that was explained to them they would understand. Therefore you would all need to work together to ensure everyone was really clean. Lots of scrubbing.

I personally believe a sponge bath would be more exotic.

Look at this:

10(10) SAMOA 75.81
11(11) SCOTLAND 75.30
12(12) ITALY 73.53
13(13) CANADA 72.92
14(14) JAPAN 70.45
15(15) GEORGIA 69.32
16(16) FIJI 68.78
17(17) USA 65.63
18(18) ROMANIA 64.21
19(19) SPAIN 62.10
20(20) RUSSIA 61.69
21(21) NAMIBIA 61.24
22(22) URUGUAY 60.47
23(23) CHL 59.52
24(24) PORTUGAL 57.91
25(25) BELGIUM 57.02

If you strip out the non-europeans (of which there are thankfully many) you'd notice that there are a number of nations who know only too well that however well they play or win, they'd need a sledgehammer to even crack the glass ceiling.

Football's got no such institutional problems. Neither has Tennis via the Davis Cup etc. Golf is developing a similar attitude. Gymnastics. Swimming. Cycling. Judo. Whatever.

Why is rugby a completely different species of sport that requires closed competitions?

its abit unfair- we have to start branching out for the sake oif the world game- we need a euro championship that incorporates all- my idea would be every other year- and only have a 6 nations on the off year.

mystiroakey wrote:its abit unfair- we have to start branching out for the sake oif the world game- we need a euro championship that incorporates all- my idea would be every other year- and only have a 6 nations on the off year.

One step at a time misti. A comprehensive European league structure must get established first. 3x4Ns divisions first. With promotion/relegation.

The problem about that would be whether it becomes a full H/A competition. i.e. six games rather than the current five in the 6Ns.

Come on guys be realistic,do you think amateur players can be gettin weeks off work just to get manshamed by the pros every year and possibly being injured and need more time off.

What's the point?

Portnoy wrote:

mystiroakey wrote:its abit unfair- we have to start branching out for the sake oif the world game- we need a euro championship that incorporates all- my idea would be every other year- and only have a 6 nations on the off year.

One step at a time misti. A comprehensive European league structure must get established first. 3x4Ns divisions first. With promotion/relegation.

The problem about that would be whether it becomes a full H/A competition. i.e. six games rather than the current five in the 6Ns.

so you wpould be happy with relegation from all groups- i personally would be fine with it!

asoreleftshoulder wrote:Come on guys be realistic,do you think amateur players can be gettin weeks off work just to get manshamed by the pros every year and possibly being injured and need more time off.

What's the point?

That is a real problem but somehow there is a T2 European competition bubbling away basically for no reason,

For Italy, yes. For everyone else. Not yet.

I still think that its a massive discredit to question Italy's inclusion like this. They are still finding their feet and are certainly not the easybeats they once were.

Its not as if they have got the wooden spoon every year now is it.

Rome is a belting away trip...

I have been lucky enough to go there twice Tommy and its been simply amazing. God crowds, great support and the fans in the pubs before and after have been excellent.