The Greatest 6 Nation’s Rivalry of Them All - Eng v Fra....

Not long to wait for the greatest fixture in the 6 nations, No game stirs the emotions as much as this bad boy.

How do people see it going this term?

I fancy England to pull this one off, I believe France will crumble under the pressure that England will put on them, and as we all know the Paris crowd soon turn on their own team if they haven’t racked up a cricket score by half time.

It will be close it won’t be pretty to watch but England will pull through.

That will only leave Ireland once again standing in England’s way, I know the title is beyond us this time but I fancy we could finish joint top with Wales if France pull off a win in the MS.

Hersh.

England may well beat France in Paris, but dont forget because of the cancelled game against Ireland, France and Ireland have to play this week, and the next 2 weeks with out a break. That could well be in Englands favour.

I honestly would not like to try and predict what the score will be. Englands deffence so far as been good, better than i thought it would be with a new team and a new coach. But in order for England to beat France they will have to up their game, not only in deffence but also in attack.

France by 7+.

The title should have been "A team that might win the 6 Nations versus the team that will finish Fourth-Last."

If England beat France, and Wales lose, or England win by more, or lose by less, does that confirm that England are actually better than Wales?

Maybe!

if the worst performance by wales in a year is enough to beat england at twik'num by 7, then france will manage more than 7, i think.

Or...It was probably the best performance by wales in 10 years, it's just that when you see them next to a young England team loaded with potential but light on experience it was easy to see how average they really are.

HERSH wrote: but I fancy we could finish joint top with Wales if France pull off a win in the MS.

if that were to happen at least the tournament would get some tv coverage in england.

miteyironpaw wrote:Or...It was probably the best performance by wales in 10 years,

no, i wouldnt agree with that. it really wasnt our best performance. it was our worst for a long time. a bad performance. not a good one, certainly not our best.

dogtooth wrote:if the worst performance by wales in a year is enough to beat england at twik'num by 7, then france will manage more than 7, i think.

If the English are good enough to almost get a draw out of the best team in Europe, then France might be easy pickings.

So many ways of looking at the one matematical problem

SecretFly wrote:

dogtooth wrote:if the worst performance by wales in a year is enough to beat england at twik'num by 7, then france will manage more than 7, i think.

If the English are good enough to almost get a draw out of the best team in Europe, then France might be easy pickings.

So many ways of looking at the one matematical problem

7 points behind isnt nearly a draw. its a loss by a full score. not really a nearly draw

What is all this talk of Wales's worst performance within a year?

True they struggled to beat a scratch England team that have only been around each other for a few weeks, but surely their worst performance was losing to Aus at the MS, that was the time they needed to lay down a marker and they failed miserably.

They might well go on and win the Slam and if they do then well done, but if they fail to win a series in Aus then once again they would have failed to make any real progress.

HERSH wrote:
What is all this talk of Wales's worst performance within a year?

True they struggled to beat a scratch England team that have only been around each other for a few weeks, but surely their worst performance was losing to Aus at the MS, that was the time they needed to lay down a marker and they failed miserably.

They might well go on and win the Slam and if they do then well done, but if they fail to win a series in Aus then once again they would have failed to make any real progress.

hersh, this is your thread. if you cant stay on topic what hope do the rest of us have.

I like to let topics go with the flow, that is why my application to be a mod failed.

International rugby is much like high jump.

some can clear 2.45 meters at their best, but even when they aren't at their best can still clear 2.30 meters. On a bad day they might struggle and only clear 2.20 meters.

Others may average 2.10 meters and no matter how hard they try will never even get to 2.30 meters.

So sometimes on the very odd ocassion they could have a brilliant day and clear 2.25, their best ever to beat the top dog.

alas, soon enough the euphoria dissipates and everything goes back to normal.

HERSH wrote:I like to let topics go with the flow, that is why my application to be a mod failed.

thats not why it failed hershy baby.

nah, sorry to hear that if its true.

HERSH wrote:What is all this talk of Wales's worst performance within a year?

True they struggled to beat a scratch England team that have only been around each other for a few weeks, but surely their worst performance was losing to Aus at the MS, that was the time they needed to lay down a marker and they failed miserably.

They might well go on and win the Slam and if they do then well done, but if they fail to win a series in Aus then once again they would have failed to make any real progress.

Too right. Home and away losses for Wales against Australia, contrasting to England's home and away victories. That is what gives me confidence that after watching Welsh indiscipline let them down in the RWC semi-final, England can achieve victory in Paris. England historically tend to keep their composure on the big stage, which is why we have 3 world cup finals and a world cup to our name.

dogtooth wrote:

SecretFly wrote:

dogtooth wrote:if the worst performance by wales in a year is enough to beat england at twik'num by 7, then france will manage more than 7, i think.

If the English are good enough to almost get a draw out of the best team in Europe, then France might be easy pickings.

So many ways of looking at the one matematical problem

7 points behind isnt nearly a draw. its a loss by a full score. not really a nearly draw

A TMO eyesight issue made it a 7 pointer, dogtooth. Wales didn't play badly...England stopped them playing for large sections. No, not good enough to keep it up or to turn that into a sizeable win.

Some Welshman had the stats on another thread. Virtually in all departments, Wales were beating the English.... it should have been a landslide of sorts but it wasn't one because England negated the importance of most of the superior stats...by containing the only stat that means anything - the scoring. Failed in the end. But if Wales considers themselves the best side in Europe, that was a nice display by a new England coach and his team.

is it a three test series?

If it is Aus will win 2-1.

Once they go 2-0 up they'll play a weakened team to give them a chance.

SecretFly wrote:
Some Welshman had the stats on another thread. Virtually in all departments, Wales were beating the English.... it should have been a landslide of sorts but it wasn't one because England negated the importance of most of the superior stats...by containing the only stat that means anything - the scoring. Failed in the end. But if Wales considers themselves the best side in Europe, that was a nice display by a new England coach and his team.

surely it wouldn't have been Taffin?

Could have been, biltong.............. it was a beautifully precise, curt and neat set of stats. So, if it was him, he's learning fast!

SecretFly wrote:

A TMO eyesight issue made it a 7 pointer, dogtooth.

no, the scott williams try and 1/2p conversion made it a seven point win

secretfly wrote:
Virtually in all departments, Wales were beating the English.... it should have been a landslide of sorts but it wasn't one because England negated the importance of most of the superior stats...by containing the only stat that means anything - the scoring.

england played very well and we knew it was possible but we didnt really expect it. still we secured the only important stat, the score and so won.

SecretFly wrote:Could have been, biltong.............. it was a beautifully precise, curt and neat set of stats. So, if it was him, he's learning fast!

I am proud of the young lad, It brings tears to my eyes. If he can change, anybody can change.

dogtooth wrote:

secretfly wrote:
Virtually in all departments, Wales were beating the English.... it should have been a landslide of sorts but it wasn't one because England negated the importance of most of the superior stats...by containing the only stat that means anything - the scoring.

england played very well and we knew it was possible but we didnt really expect it. still we secured the only important stat, the score and so won.

Glad we finally agree, you secured the final stat and no, not by playing badly but by finally grinding down a side that gave Wales a real test.
.....................................................

Anyway, the ball is in Wale's court...an easy Italy game to amass the points required should the final Championship come down to points difference and then a buoyant mood and a home game (roof closed!) with France to close the deal.

They should win the Slam...

It's the rest of us who still have something of a shot at something - England, France and Ireland - who have a duty to show we're serious about making the Welsh journey a nervy one.

secretfly, i wouldnt want it any other way. 6N roks

I'm actually predicting that Italy will run Wales very, very, very close. I'm tempted to put money on a draw.

If Wales again profit from favourable refereeing, especially in their trademark Off-side defensive line manouvre then they might be a tough ask for Italy to overcome; but Italy have a history of upsetting someone once per year and haven't pulled that out yet.

yes, good luck to italy. we all wish them good sport during their visit to the capital

Can't see Italy doing anything in Cardiff, if it was in Rome I'd say they would push Wales close until the Ref decides to gift them the win.

I don't know HERSH, they might feel quite at home there. Cardiff, quite similar to Rome in many respects isn't it?

I will be breeding Coq's this week ready for the match

miteyironpaw wrote:I don't know HERSH, they might feel quite at home there. Cardiff, quite similar to Rome in many respects isn't it?

Same amount of ruins and litter.

The Coliseum's closing roof was destroyed in 22AD, but apart from that, the similarities are striking.

So anyway, back to France versus England... how many tries do we think England are going to score?

Two.

Thanks. You can all get back to talking about Wales now.

Whats the weather like in Wales today?

It's bright this morning, in Newport at least.

France have class all over the pitch, if we had more of the players from the rwc playing i'd say England as we'd be looking for revenge.

but with this side...

I expect to see les Bleus put two or three tries past our own score, it won't be pretty.

SecretFly wrote:

dogtooth wrote:

SecretFly wrote:

dogtooth wrote:if the worst performance by wales in a year is enough to beat england at twik'num by 7, then france will manage more than 7, i think.

If the English are good enough to almost get a draw out of the best team in Europe, then France might be easy pickings.

So many ways of looking at the one matematical problem

7 points behind isnt nearly a draw. its a loss by a full score. not really a nearly draw

A TMO eyesight issue made it a 7 pointer, dogtooth. Wales didn't play badly...England stopped them playing for large sections. No, not good enough to keep it up or to turn that into a sizeable win.

Some Welshman had the stats on another thread. Virtually in all departments, Wales were beating the English.... it should have been a landslide of sorts but it wasn't one because England negated the importance of most of the superior stats...by containing the only stat that means anything - the scoring. Failed in the end. But if Wales considers themselves the best side in Europe, that was a nice display by a new England coach and his team.

So what you're saying is Englands intention was to keep the score down and not to win the game? Heck no wonder they lost. Bunch of losers with a loser attitude, France by more than 7 is inevitable.

I think it was England's intention was to keep Wales' score down and increase their own. It's innovation like that which Lancaster brings to the squad.

Morgannwg wrote:

SecretFly wrote:

dogtooth wrote:

SecretFly wrote:

dogtooth wrote:if the worst performance by wales in a year is enough to beat england at twik'num by 7, then france will manage more than 7, i think.

If the English are good enough to almost get a draw out of the best team in Europe, then France might be easy pickings.

So many ways of looking at the one matematical problem

7 points behind isnt nearly a draw. its a loss by a full score. not really a nearly draw

A TMO eyesight issue made it a 7 pointer, dogtooth. Wales didn't play badly...England stopped them playing for large sections. No, not good enough to keep it up or to turn that into a sizeable win.

Some Welshman had the stats on another thread. Virtually in all departments, Wales were beating the English.... it should have been a landslide of sorts but it wasn't one because England negated the importance of most of the superior stats...by containing the only stat that means anything - the scoring. Failed in the end. But if Wales considers themselves the best side in Europe, that was a nice display by a new England coach and his team.

So what you're saying is Englands intention was to keep the score down and not to win the game? Heck no wonder they lost. Bunch of losers with a loser attitude, France by more than 7 is inevitable.

I'm saying I saw what happened Morg. I have eyes and I saw a game Wales tried to win and England tried to spoil - the party (it's allowable in rugby, you know - you could say NZ were eventually demoted to that role in the WC final!... and it just about succeeded for them ) England nearly spoiled the game Wales were trying to win.

It's easy to see what I mean when you break it down into tiny chewable pieces.

I wouldn't bother secretfly, especially not using the RWC as an example.

The general take on the RWC in wales seems to be that after a brilliant almost victory over Aus in the 3rd place play off, wales advanced to the final where they beat both France and New Zealand (as they always almost do) before beginning their long journey down the beanstalk and back to wales.

SecretFly wrote:Some Welshman had the stats on another thread. Virtually in all departments, Wales were beating the English.... it should have been a landslide of sorts but it wasn't one because England negated the importance of most of the superior stats...by containing the only stat that means anything - the scoring. Failed in the end. But if Wales considers themselves the best side in Europe, that was a nice display by a new England coach and his team.

This precisely why I view stats with disdain and distrust.

Err, how did this article start about France v England and degenerate onto a Wales v England slanging match?

It's OK - no need to answer that. But it's just like the old 606 in here, with nearly every 6N thread getting hijacked.

Tell me about it!

France are definitely favourites for this one... Home advantage in Paris is massive, its a magnificent stadium very daunting.

England's game is based on a defence, they seem unable to score tries at the moment. Progress was made from the first two matches with all the changes in the backline. I would think Foden and Ashton are in their last chance saloon at the moment, neither playing well.

France stumbled a bit in Edinburgh, they also have Ireland at home this weekend so will not be as rested as England. But on paper they have a far superior team.

If England can pull this off I would be very very impressed.

Will be interesting to see how the new look side does in France, under MJ the team had no fear of going over there and I hope the new side can keep that belief. Whether they will or not is something entirely different, though i do think we might edge it. If we can shut down the french like we managed to with wales i think we can take the win. The french will get nervy and try to force it if things are a bit tight, which will play to our advantage.

damngoodOvalball wrote:I wouldn't bother secretfly, especially not using the RWC as an example.

The general take on the RWC in wales seems to be that after a brilliant almost victory over Aus in the 3rd place play off, wales advanced to the final where they beat both France and New Zealand (as they always almost do) before beginning their long journey down the beanstalk and back to wales.

That's just a lie

The resentment towards Wales relative success makes me smile, keep it coming!

Bingo...'relative'. Relative to scotland? yep...to italy....suppose so.

Back to the original post, as a long time student of history, england-france is indeed the biggest rivalry out there..from an english point of view at least. The 'brotherhood' haven't posed a threat in centuries but those pesky frenchies!!
Sometimes its about more than rugby

(and the south of france is about the only place I felt less welcome than a certain sports bar in cardiff!)

ultra wrote:Bingo...'relative'. Relative to scotland? yep...to italy....suppose so.

Back to the original post, as a long time student of history, england-france is indeed the biggest rivalry out there..from an english point of view at least. The 'brotherhood' haven't posed a threat in centuries but those pesky frenchies!!
Sometimes its about more than rugby

(and the south of france is about the only place I felt less welcome than a certain sports bar in cardiff!)

Bingo?