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Historic Anzac XV against British, Irish Lions Test in 2015

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gregortree
LordDowlais
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Bathite
George Carlin
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Pal Joey
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Post by PerryGee Fri 10 May 2013, 2:24 am

http://www.foxsports.com.au/rugby/former-aru-chief-john-oneill-suggests-historic-anzac-xv-against-british-and-irish-lions-test-in-2015/story-e6frf4pu-1226639055581#.UYxJ6cpKNgh

Former ARU chief John O'Neill suggests Historic Anzac XV against British, Irish Lions Test in 2015

By Iain Payten
The Daily Telegraph
May 10, 2013 7:44AM

Former ARU supremo John O'Neill has called for a historic clash between the British and Irish Lions and an Anzac XV to be staged at Twickenham in 2015 to commemorate the centenary of World War I.

O'Neill believes unique circumstances of the 2015 world rugby schedule present an ideal opportunity for the Lions and a combined Wallabies-All Blacks side to play on or around Armistice Day, and honour fallen Commonwealth soldiers in the Great War.

"2015 is the centenary anniversary of Gallipoli and the rugby league guys and everyone are talking about how we're going to commemorate it," O'Neill said.

"The 2015 World Cup finishes on October 31, and as close as possible to November 11 - Remembrance Day - the British and Irish Lions should play a combined Wallabies-All Blacks side at Twickenham. It would be a fantastic event."

O'Neill said he'd had informal discussions about the idea with several parties before leaving the ARU last October, and had intended to press the idea hard with Lions bosses when they arrive in June.

He wants his successors at the ARU to lobby for the Lions-Anzacs blockbuster, which could see Trans-Tasman combinations like Will Genia and Dan Carter uniting at the home of rugby.

"I can't speak on the ARU's behalf now, so it is up to somebody else," O'Neill said. "It wouldn't be hard. The Lions never play at home, but to commemorate 100 years since World War I and Gallipoli ...

"You can't do it on April 25 because that's in the middle of Super Rugby.

"But a couple of weeks after the World Cup, assembling the British and Irish Lions to play the Anzacs at Twickenham would be a wonderful way to commemorate the 100 years."

History and tradition would need to flex enormously for the Lions-Anzacs to happen, not least for the fact the Lions have only ever played as a touring side.

But the Lions have shown some willingness to embrace new - and profitable - ideas, playing the Barbarians in Hong Kong before arriving in Australia.

Proposed North-South battles are often scuttled because of tight international calendars but players would be on leave and free to remain in London and play in November after the 2015 World Cup.

Twickenham would undoubtedly be a sell-out. This would be hugely attractive in a World Cup year, when there are no Test tours allowed and nations tend to suffer huge financial losses.

Though not discussing the prospect of them playing against the Lions, IRB boss Brett Gosper said recently he was sceptical an Anzac or combined SANZAR team could tour the north in the same fashion as the Lions.

"There have been discussions around that for a long time. But I think the Lions have such a history and a tradition, it would be very hard to replicate that with a southern team's tour in the north. It doesn't mean you shouldn't try but people have talked about it, and the realisation is it would be a very hard thing to do,'' Gosper said.

Gosper said the potential creation of a "Ryder Cup'' style points battle between north and south could re-energise discussions, however.

"We are certainly looking at the possibility of in those windows, June and November, of maybe applying a points system; a bit like Ryder Cup, to increase the competitiveness between the northern and southern hemisphere. Those matches are never friendlies, but it might help them not just feel like one-offs,'' Gosper said

Sounds good to me, money spinner, awareness raiser or whatever, I'd pay to watch. What do you think?

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Post by doctor_grey Fri 10 May 2013, 2:43 am

The 100th anniversary of Gallipoli should, without question, be commemorated by Rugby. It that means a special ANZAC XV v a NH team (Barbarians?), it would be great. In fact, an ANZAC team playing Barbarians is perfect. We need the guarantees each nation will ensure their best players remain available.

Amongst other things, the clothing sales would raise huge money for veteran's charities.

If right after the RWC final, so much the better. Only problem for the England players is they will have just come off another emotional RWC Finals voctory......

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Post by dallym Fri 10 May 2013, 2:45 am

I'd like to see it on ANZAC Day, but as JON says that'd be in the middle of super15, and Nov11 makes sense, with it being two weeks after the RWC finishes.

And an Australian or two will play well in the RWC so there'll be more than a couple of token wallabies in the team

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Post by dallym Fri 10 May 2013, 2:45 am

A match like this would be a fitting way for DC and King Richie to retire

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Post by doctor_grey Fri 10 May 2013, 3:00 am

How about having it on Remembrance Sunday?
The matching lineups for that match could be one for the ages..............

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Post by maestegmafia Fri 10 May 2013, 7:11 am

Fantastic idea and a wonderful way to remember those lost.

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Post by kiakahaaotearoa Fri 10 May 2013, 7:14 am

Good idea. Still think something needs to happen Down Under. As Super rugby is on still think a junior side is the way to go and have it as a curtain raiser for a super game between a nz and Oz side or have it like a test match in a big stadium.

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Post by aucklandlaurie Fri 10 May 2013, 9:25 am


This should be played,if it gets off the ground, in either Australia or New Zealand, because the Anzacs always had to travel or go to war, its about time the Brits put their hands in their pockets and paid for the trip for a change.

In so far as a venue goes, I cant think of anywhere better than Eden Park...

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Post by kiakahaaotearoa Fri 10 May 2013, 9:32 am

Feel like going to this match Laurie? Hug

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Post by aucklandlaurie Fri 10 May 2013, 9:40 am


Do I bludee ever....

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Post by fa0019 Fri 10 May 2013, 9:41 am

Remembrance sunday is 2 weeks after the RWC final.... could be done.

Paris could be an ideal setting? Given the history and neutrality of the event.

Would surely be played in Europe though given the RWC will only be 2 weeks completed... Crazy to host it half way across the world.

Would be nice if they could somehow incorporate Canadian & South African players too given their significant involvement.

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Post by aucklandlaurie Fri 10 May 2013, 9:47 am


If we are going to bring the Canadians and the South Africans into it then the appropriate venue should be El Alahmein or Tobruk.

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Post by kiakahaaotearoa Fri 10 May 2013, 9:55 am

That's closer to me. We often have problems in Galipolli though. John Farnham represents the suffering and agony but too often it's not a solemn enough occasion. Just a contiki p up. I suggest madrid. I too would like to go...


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Post by UlstermaninGlasgow Fri 10 May 2013, 7:07 pm

I'd have said Barbarians would have been a better pick than just the Lions as they'll be more representative of the countries that marched off to war in those dark times. Needs to be a Canadian, French, American, Russian and South African presence there...
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Post by Looseheaded Fri 10 May 2013, 7:34 pm

Yeah I agree with Ulsterman that an allied forces side in a Baabaas shirt would be better suited, but either way I would love to see this happen

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Post by kiakahaaotearoa Sat 11 May 2013, 9:24 am

Why has my post been morphed into another? I made a joke about having the match in Madrid because that's where I live. Who wrote the ANZ stadium part because it wasn't me?

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Post by aucklandlaurie Sat 11 May 2013, 9:28 am


kia i think one of your post has been breeding with one of Linebreakers.

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Post by Pal Joey Sat 11 May 2013, 9:30 am

Must have been me. I added the other joke which has now been removed. I was meant to quote yours but hit 'edit' instead of 'quote'.

Sorry mate.

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Post by kiakahaaotearoa Sat 11 May 2013, 9:33 am

Laugh That sounds innocent enough mate. Hug Just so long as all of us don't have those powers. That would be too tempting...

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Post by Pal Joey Sat 11 May 2013, 9:45 am

I make the odd blunder once in a while. Smile

Just glad it's all fixed now.

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Post by kiakahaaotearoa Sat 11 May 2013, 9:55 am

It seems we're all keen on seeing this event. There'd be some mouthwatering combinations with an ANZAC Lions that you just don't get to see but evidently would like to.

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Post by Pal Joey Sat 11 May 2013, 10:29 am

Remember we had a thread on the same subject last year... and the year before that on the old 606? Everyone wants to see it and it would be a perfect fixture to organise for 2015. Just glad O'Neill is gone but his replacements better get the ball rolling on this one.

The Nov 11 date seems like the best timing... a week or so after the RWC Final. It's a no-brainer!!! Wink

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Post by kiakahaaotearoa Sat 11 May 2013, 10:39 am

NZ will be up for it as we'll have won back to back RWCs but Australia might still be down in the dumps after not getting out of their pool of death. Wallaby Kiwi Hug

Still think April 25th needs something. Instead of a league test which Australia always wins how about a rugby league combined test team against an AB Wallaby combined team and like the Aussie rules Gaelic football we decide on a game in between and play that. Who knows, we might see a few rules that we can incorporate for both codes.

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Post by aucklandlaurie Sat 11 May 2013, 10:42 am


The League boys were talking about playing an ANZAC test near Gallipoli in 2015, but I think the RSL and the RSA told them No this is our show.

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Post by kiakahaaotearoa Sat 11 May 2013, 10:48 am

That seems fair enough. I have been to Gallipoli but not for ANZAC day. Didn't want masses of people around me. Seemed more poignant and from what I hear the conduct on ANZAC day there is not the same as the dawn parades in NZ and Oz. All the more reason to do something in Australia or NZ where it can be celebrated by the people of those countries. That's the only problem I have with the 11 November proposal and why I think we need to have something on our own shores.

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Post by aucklandlaurie Sat 11 May 2013, 10:51 am


The other thing is that League and Aussie Rules cash in on the Occassion in Australia, yet Union seems to not really be bothered.

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Post by Pal Joey Sat 11 May 2013, 10:52 am

Don't think that would be a good idea to play in Turkey. The April 25 date is 'holy' to us but so too is November 11. The latter date would be more convenient for the Brits & Co... they're not going to have it in the middle of their domestic seasons are they?

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Post by kiakahaaotearoa Sat 11 May 2013, 10:57 am

It is at an awkward time of the year slap bang in the middle of the Super season and no doubt the franchises wouldn't want to see their stars taken out in the middle of the year and risked to injury.

Hence my idea of an age group match. It can't be that hard to arrange something for the junior sides.

It seems to be a scheduling problem. But how about this? A combined age group team from Australia and NZ to play an age group team in South Africa. That way SA are included and we see something special that involves the nations who were affected.

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Post by SecretFly Sat 11 May 2013, 11:25 am

Never mind all the airy fairy stuff.....

Let's get to the knuckle duster. Who would coach the Anzac side? Wink

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Post by Pal Joey Sat 11 May 2013, 11:28 am

Gatland? Laugh

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Post by SecretFly Sat 11 May 2013, 11:29 am

Solid non-controversal decision there, Linebreaker. At least you know how it all gets done at the Lions Wink

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Post by kiakahaaotearoa Sat 11 May 2013, 11:30 am

We wouldn't have a coach. That would sum up Gallipoli. Our leaders would be within the squad and we'd improvise from there.

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Post by Pal Joey Sat 11 May 2013, 11:53 am

We'd just need a kiwi and a roo for mascots...

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Post by MotelMoneyMurderMadness Sat 11 May 2013, 12:15 pm

This is a splendid idea. Well done that man. I would suggest Paris as the venue.

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Post by Feckless Rogue Sat 11 May 2013, 12:59 pm

It would be appropriate if the anzac's were coached by a completely incompetent Englishman who told them to keep running mindlessly into contact.

And a handful of fanatical Irish players should make plans to start scoring tries against the Lions halfway through the match.
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Post by 123456789 Sat 11 May 2013, 2:47 pm

How about a test series, one on November 11Th, either at the Millenium stadium or Murrayfield, as Twickenham will already have had the world cup final and another in Australia or New Zealand on April 25th and a final game in June in Paris, potentially to decide the overall winner.

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Post by The Saint Sat 11 May 2013, 4:51 pm

Great idea. Could involve another match too, USA/Canada team versus the Pacific Islands. My history isn't good but they were all European colonies at the time right? India played a role in fighting for the allies too but I don't think they have any rugby players.

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Post by LeinsterFan4life Sat 11 May 2013, 4:53 pm

India do have a player Saint! That lad Khan in the NZ sevens team.

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Post by kiakahaaotearoa Sat 11 May 2013, 4:58 pm

The Ghurkas were ferocious fighters. Not sure they instil the same fear playing rugby...

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Post by The Saint Sat 11 May 2013, 4:58 pm

Oh yeah him, Indian parentage!

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Post by 100%beefy Sat 11 May 2013, 8:33 pm

i think this is a great idea but sadly i don't think it will happen officially...as a help for heroes type deal it might The home Unions won't be interested in it pre RWC because of the PR connotations for GB PLC and war; especially a campaign that was a disastrous debacle orchestrated by our greatest hero. Love the ANZAC spirit though and the bloody tough basterds who came to the aid of the motherland

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Post by GunsGerms Mon 13 May 2013, 11:32 am

Terrible idea as it is relevant only to the British section of the B&I Lions squad and wouldnt mean a lot to the Irish players even though lots of Irish did serve with the British forces its not something that gets much recognition today as it only serves as a reminder to Irish people of British rule. Ireland also isnt in the commonwealth so not sure why they would want to commemorate

"fallen Commonwealth soldiers in the Great War"


I also cant stand the idea of mixing sport and politics so dont agree with this sort of pompous circus at all.


Last edited by GunsGerms on Mon 13 May 2013, 12:10 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Post by George Carlin Mon 13 May 2013, 12:02 pm

kiakahaaotearoa wrote:The Ghurkas were ferocious fighters. Not sure they instil the same fear playing rugby...
Maybe if they were allowed to bring their kukris with them onto the pitch...
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Post by SecretFly Mon 13 May 2013, 2:06 pm

The South African World Cup 1995... now that was political with a Capital ANC.

Not speaking out against it at all !! (to those who might be over-sensitive Wink ) but merely outlining a political period that became a Legendary sporting moment.

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Post by MotelMoneyMurderMadness Mon 13 May 2013, 3:00 pm

GunsGerms, I understand your point, but I dont think it should be seen just as a British & commonwealth thing. Non commonwealth nations like the French, Americans and Italians would have to be included too.

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Post by GunsGerms Mon 13 May 2013, 3:39 pm

MotelMoneyMurderMadness wrote:GunsGerms, I understand your point, but I dont think it should be seen just as a British & commonwealth thing. Non commonwealth nations like the French, Americans and Italians would have to be included too.

Who would the proceeds raised go to? If it is for the families of war veterans in the UK and Australia etc. then I cant see how you can really expect Irish players to be involved in a charity work relating to war efforts that have nothing to do with Ireland.

I am all for player welfare charities matches etc. but think if Irish players are going to be asked to be involved there are much more deserving charities than war related flag waving processions.

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Post by Bathite Mon 13 May 2013, 3:50 pm

What might an ANZAC team look like?

Woodcock
Mealamu
Franks
Horwill
Whitelock
McCaw
Pocock
Read

Genia
Carter
Iaone
Nonu
Smith
Savea
JOC

Only 5 Oz in there, maybe a touch harsh?

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Post by kiakahaaotearoa Mon 13 May 2013, 4:31 pm

Perhaps but I didn't take offence mate. If we have an ANZAC Lions we have to fit in a few token Wallabies. Whistle

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Post by tigertattie Mon 13 May 2013, 4:52 pm

Due to the politics I can see this having to be a NH vs SH exhibition match with the proceeds going to Save the Children or Unicef or the like!

You cannot have the B&I lions vs Aus-NZ as it would leave out the French and the Saffas. Also the Itaians may want to be involved but is the war still a sore point or has the world moved on?

If you are going to include the French et al, then why not include the Americans, Canadians, Scandanvians, Japanese.........................

Or you could just make it a "commonwealth cup" and have all commonwealth countires playing in two mixed teams?

I like the NH vs SH idea myself. No historic buddying up or stereotypes.

Or a Barbarians vs rest of the world? Everyone just gets mixed together??? Could see Genia and Sexton facing off against Laidlaw and Carter!! Beale, Maitland and Massi against 1/2p, mermoz and Habana?
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Post by debaters1 Mon 13 May 2013, 6:56 pm

Love the idea and it is an event that binds both our hemipsheres, sadly. As for the Lions and breaking tradition, fairly sure that it has happened twice, the Centenary of the RFU or Webb Ellis in 1972?! (open to correction here) there was a NH v SH game that was all but officially a Lions team and more importantly, in 2005 the Lions played Aregentina in a warm up at Murrayfield I think. 25 all draw if memory serves!

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