The so-called "Phantom Punch" in Ali-Liston Two

Now I'd have thought that this topic would have been done to death on the old 606 board, but I haven't seen it mentioned directly for a long old time.Maybe because it is perhaps THE cliched fight topic.However, there's been discussion of "The Long Count" recently, and not forgetting the "Jack Johnson /Ketchell"result....which I enjoyed reading so I wanna take a deep breath and ask for your opinions on this hoary old chestnut of a subject.

Ali rematches Liston. Midway through the first round, Liston is floored...in what many pundits have since claimed as not a legitimate knockdown. Referee Jersey Joe Walcott starts a count,makes a hash of it as Ali has not gone back to a neutral corner and is in fact towering over Liston, a blatant disregard for the rules in itself.Joe's inexperience as a ref contributes to his poor decision making. Twenty seconds had passed and Liston was by now on his feet ready to resume fighting.However,Nat Fleischer (publisher of The Ring magazine)took it upon himself to enter the ring and declare that Liston had been down for over ten seconds,therefore he should be not allowed to continue.This was incorrect.As Ali had not gone to a neutral corner, Walcott had been quite correct in not starting the count. And so it was that two fights between the two fighters ended somewhat anti-clamactically.The rematch was supposed to be when the first decision "corrected" itself, and Liston regain the title-in the eyes of many. Liston's career never really recovered and he died ignominiously a few years later, not much missed and with his reputation besmirched with Mob link rumours.
Liston apparently did not like to talk about the second fight, which lends me to believe that Ali really did catch him a good 'un, and he really did go over.He was off balance, and Ali's short (as he called it) "anchor punch" could do real damage..like a martial artists' "one inch throw" can do.
I always believed that Ali was an under-rated puncher, who could on occasion do damage such as this without apparently doing much.
However, when I showed the fight footage to a relative newcomer to the sport of boxing, his reply was instant disbelief at the sight of Liston rolling around the floor."That punch wouldn't have knocked the skin off a rice pudding", or words to that effect, he said, and not for the last time!
Whilst in an ideal world, an Ali-liston match -up(prime,natch) should be an all-time classic, they patently were not.My feeling was that Sonny, as a man of indetermined age, had peaked quietly but undeniably by the time he met the man then known as Cassius Clay.He looked momentarily like an old man even in the first fight.
However......I recall an old "Playboy" interview with George Foreman (can't reference it unfortunately as there's no internet record),whereby as a disciple of Sonny Liston, Big George maintained that Sonny Liston DID take a dive.The reason was ,that he simply wanted out, from a game where he felt he deserved plaudits and respect and had never really been given his due of either.Goeorge also said that he was there, and noted that, oddly the hall was barely half full...my feeling is that he was hinting at more Mob/ betting wrong-doings at the occasion.

What do you think?Have you watched the fight in recent years, and changed your mind at all? My feeling is that it is generally accepted that Sonny "took a dive"- as stated above, not my reading of the vent at all, however I must admit that I find watching the "phantom/anchor"punch land, then deciding on how dangerous it really was, quite a poser.

It pretty clear to me that it was the punch that put him down, whether it kept him down is a different matter as the though of getting his head boxed of and getting KOed a few rounds later might have done that.


Great punch by Ali.

I've always been of the view that Liston, who had gotten himself into tip top shape, only to see the fight postponed due to Ali's hernia, suddenly grew old and, having chased Ali for a minute or so, realized he wasn't going to catch him and was facing a protracted humiliation, so took the easy way out.

That's MY take.

However, Floyd Patterson visited Liston in his dressing room immediately after the fight and claimed that Sonny had exhibited all the signs of having been kayoed. His explanation was that Liston had been caught cold.

Jack Dempsey and Rocky Marciano were positively scathing about it all, and were convinced that Liston dived.

My views on this differ slightly to a lot of people in that I am never overly convinced this was a fix. Have read a lot about the fight and on the night most of the fuss came from journalists and fans most of the ex fighters who were ringside such as Patterson and Louis called the punch valid.

Also the thing that makes me sceptical is you have to bear in mind how Liston was perceived at the time. His mob links were well known and the authorities had little to no time for him. Liston whilst not an educated man was smart enough to know this and the thing I always come back to is with all this in mind if he was going to take a fall would he do such a poor job of it. Is not hard to make something like that look a damned sight more convincing than he did.

Personally I think knowing was the fix to come to light Liston knew his career and reputation would be in tatters he would have made a far better job. However can fully see why people would think otherwise because whilst I agree with you that Ali was a better puncher than often given credit for he was by no means a nuclear puncher and when a guy with a great chin goes over so easily it does raise suspiscions.

The other thing to bear in mind is the fight was postponed and apparently Sonny had got himself in terrific shape but the dealy hit him hard and he struggled to get himself motivated for the rescheduled date, couple this with rumours he started drinking and potentially using drugs in the intervening period (should stress these are only rumours) and is not beyond imagination he was just caught cold.

Still a fascinating subject that is always a pleasure to discuss, just a pity we will perhaps never know the truth.

The punch reminded me a bit of Pacquiao's first knockdown of Hatton. From the original angle it look like it doesn't land.

But with all the cameras around these day is was easy to see from another angle it landed perferctly.

Same with with Ali vs Liston, it was just the camera angle that made it look like a glancing blow.

It was just a perfect punch.

D4thincarnation wrote:The punch reminded me a bit of Pacquiao's first knockdown of Hatton. From the original angle it look like it doesn't land.

But with all the cameras around these day is was easy to see from another angle it landed perferctly.

Same with with Ali vs Liston, it was just the camera angle that made it look like a glancing blow.

It was just a perfect punch.

There's a surprise.

Congratulations D4 even by your standards this is one of your finest ever attempts to shoehorn Manny into a discussion. Your resiliance and creativity is truly inspiring, if only you could turn these energies to something useful am fairly sure you could have solve the middle east within a couple of days.

HumanWindmill wrote:

D4thincarnation wrote:The punch reminded me a bit of Pacquiao's first knockdown of Hatton. From the original angle it look like it doesn't land.

But with all the cameras around these day is was easy to see from another angle it landed perferctly.

Same with with Ali vs Liston, it was just the camera angle that made it look like a glancing blow.

It was just a perfect punch.

There's a surprise.

Beat me to it. Is there anything that DOESN'T remind him of the hallowed one, I wonder?

BALTIMORA wrote:

HumanWindmill wrote:

D4thincarnation wrote:The punch reminded me a bit of Pacquiao's first knockdown of Hatton. From the original angle it look like it doesn't land.

But with all the cameras around these day is was easy to see from another angle it landed perferctly.

Same with with Ali vs Liston, it was just the camera angle that made it look like a glancing blow.

It was just a perfect punch.

There's a surprise.

Beat me to it. Is there anything that DOESN'T remind him of the hallowed one, I wonder?

Marital infidelity, I believe, BALTI.

Unbelievable. If this thread gets derailed I would recommend a temporary ban on those who contribute to what seems a deliberate attempt to bring a certain boxer into a thread which has absolutely zero to do with him.

Enough is enough. It is getting beyond a joke now. And please D4, do not try and justify yourself on the thread. If you have a problem with this, PM me.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yEPtojKdQuU

Look at the first KO, from the angle you first see it looks like Hatton just swing misses and Pacquiao does not land anything significant.

But from another angle is is clear the devastating of the punch.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZIY9T8zFjAI

Same with Ali's punch, because it is view from behind Liston it is difficult to see.

Both shots throw with speed and both short punches, both fighters Liston and Hatton are moving into the punch which will increase the power and the punch lands perfectly.

didn't know that Jack and The Rock thought it was a dive.I take this as fighters' mentality of " nobody is as good as I used to be!",like old boxers say there is no "intestinal fortitude" any more.
Seems about right to me that Sonny wasn't prepared for the rearrangement.
I have heard the story from Floyd as well, and I think this has the ring of truth to it.Perhaps though there is something of the "six of one, half a dozen of the other " to it, ie., Sonny was caught cold, but was still opportunistic. Maybe Ali being so close to him, saw that in Liston's body language, which is why he implored him to get back up...

I'm of the opinion that, as has been stated IF Liston did take a dive, he could have done it much more convincingly.

D4thincarnation wrote:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yEPtojKdQuU

Look at the first KO, from the angle you first see it looks like Hatton just swing misses and Pacquiao does not land anything significant.

But from another angle is is clear the devastating of the punch.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZIY9T8zFjAI

Same with Ali's punch, because it is view from behind Liston it is difficult to see.

Both shots throw with speed and both short punches, both fighters Liston and Hatton are moving into the punch which will increase the power and the punch lands perfectly.

Have you taken into account this startling evidence though?

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=pacquiao+fan

I have no doubt that if there had been more camera on that fight, this would not even be a topic.

Ali caught Liston with some heavy blows in the first round also.

andygf wrote:didn't know that Jack and The Rock thought it was a dive.I take this as fighters' mentality of " nobody is as good as I used to be!",like old boxers say there is no "intestinal fortitude" any more.
Seems about right to me that Sonny wasn't prepared for the rearrangement.
I have heard the story from Floyd as well, and I think this has the ring of truth to it.Perhaps though there is something of the "six of one, half a dozen of the other " to it, ie., Sonny was caught cold, but was still opportunistic. Maybe Ali being so close to him, saw that in Liston's body language, which is why he implored him to get back up...

I believe there is a youtube clip of their TV studio discussion concerning the subject, andy. I have it on my hard drive. Dempsey was also asked about the punch when he was a guest at ' What's My Line ? ' ( probably also at youtube, ) and, if memory serves, he laughed out loud.

I am confused about this. I've sene it several times and the punch was legit. I am incliden to believe that Liston was caught cold.

But Ali's reaction suggests that even Ali didn't think it was a hard enough punch to KD him let alone keep him there.

HumanWindmill wrote:

andygf wrote:didn't know that Jack and The Rock thought it was a dive.I take this as fighters' mentality of " nobody is as good as I used to be!",like old boxers say there is no "intestinal fortitude" any more.
Seems about right to me that Sonny wasn't prepared for the rearrangement.
I have heard the story from Floyd as well, and I think this has the ring of truth to it.Perhaps though there is something of the "six of one, half a dozen of the other " to it, ie., Sonny was caught cold, but was still opportunistic. Maybe Ali being so close to him, saw that in Liston's body language, which is why he implored him to get back up...

I believe there is a youtube clip of their TV studio discussion concerning the subject, andy. I have it on my hard drive. Dempsey was also asked about the punch when he was a guest at ' What's My Line ? ' ( probably also at youtube, ) and, if memory serves, he laughed out loud.

Jack Dempsey: LOL

Doesn't sit right, somehow.

Fair dues guys, I can see how it may just be worth a comparison....Just call me Mr-Sit-on -the-fence today.
Would have been good if you noted the exact time though Mr4..

I thought the fight was stopped rather prematurely there.

It didnt seem much of a punch.

azania wrote:Unbelievable. If this thread gets derailed I would recommend a temporary ban on those who contribute to what seems a deliberate attempt to bring a certain boxer into a thread which has absolutely zero to do with him.

Enough is enough. It is getting beyond a joke now. And please D4, do not try and justify yourself on the thread. If you have a problem with this, PM me.

Oh that's very rich, considering you did EXACTLY the same thing in a thread unrelated to Pacquaio the other day.

Regarding the punch, I'm not too sure. I'm of the opinion it was deceptive and perhaps as D4 said, the angle didn't do it justice.

Fists of Fury wrote:

azania wrote:Unbelievable. If this thread gets derailed I would recommend a temporary ban on those who contribute to what seems a deliberate attempt to bring a certain boxer into a thread which has absolutely zero to do with him.

Enough is enough. It is getting beyond a joke now. And please D4, do not try and justify yourself on the thread. If you have a problem with this, PM me.

Oh that's very rich, considering you did EXACTLY the same thing in a thread unrelated to Pacquaio the other day.

So what are you complaining about then? Do you want that sort of stuff to continue? Enough anyway. This thread should not be derailed. If you have any complaints, you can use the PM facility.

Stay on topic.

D4thincarnation wrote:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yEPtojKdQuU

Look at the first KO, from the angle you first see it looks like Hatton just swing misses and Pacquiao does not land anything significant.

But from another angle is is clear the devastating of the punch.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZIY9T8zFjAI

Same with Ali's punch, because it is view from behind Liston it is difficult to see.

Both shots throw with speed and both short punches, both fighters Liston and Hatton are moving into the punch which will increase the power and the punch lands perfectly.

Just putting in the times so they can be easily found 0.36 for the Pacquiao fight, Ali vs Liston 4.00 mark.

Fists of Fury wrote:

azania wrote:Unbelievable. If this thread gets derailed I would recommend a temporary ban on those who contribute to what seems a deliberate attempt to bring a certain boxer into a thread which has absolutely zero to do with him.

Enough is enough. It is getting beyond a joke now. And please D4, do not try and justify yourself on the thread. If you have a problem with this, PM me.

Oh that's very rich, considering you did EXACTLY the same thing in a thread unrelated to Pacquaio the other day.

Az has asked for this not to be derailed.

He is a mod and has done the right thing.

If you feel that he derails any threads in the futre, please let one of the other moderators or admins know and we will act.

For the time being, he has asked, quite rightly, that this thread stays on topic.

D4thincarnation wrote:

D4thincarnation wrote:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yEPtojKdQuU

Look at the first KO, from the angle you first see it looks like Hatton just swing misses and Pacquiao does not land anything significant.

But from another angle is is clear the devastating of the punch.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZIY9T8zFjAI

Same with Ali's punch, because it is view from behind Liston it is difficult to see.

Both shots throw with speed and both short punches, both fighters Liston and Hatton are moving into the punch which will increase the power and the punch lands perfectly.

Just putting in the times so they can be easily found 0.36 for the Pacquiao fight, Ali vs Liston 4.00 mark.

You can do (presuming this works, can't access youtube).
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yEPtojKdQuU#t=0m36s
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZIY9T8zFjAI#t=4m00s

Scottrf wrote:

HumanWindmill wrote:

andygf wrote:didn't know that Jack and The Rock thought it was a dive.I take this as fighters' mentality of " nobody is as good as I used to be!",like old boxers say there is no "intestinal fortitude" any more.
Seems about right to me that Sonny wasn't prepared for the rearrangement.
I have heard the story from Floyd as well, and I think this has the ring of truth to it.Perhaps though there is something of the "six of one, half a dozen of the other " to it, ie., Sonny was caught cold, but was still opportunistic. Maybe Ali being so close to him, saw that in Liston's body language, which is why he implored him to get back up...

I believe there is a youtube clip of their TV studio discussion concerning the subject, andy. I have it on my hard drive. Dempsey was also asked about the punch when he was a guest at ' What's My Line ? ' ( probably also at youtube, ) and, if memory serves, he laughed out loud.

Jack Dempsey: LOL

Doesn't sit right, somehow.

Does seem a bit incongruous, doesn't it ? Pretty sure he did, though, although I haven't seen it in a while.

Scottrf wrote:

D4thincarnation wrote:

D4thincarnation wrote:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yEPtojKdQuU

Look at the first KO, from the angle you first see it looks like Hatton just swing misses and Pacquiao does not land anything significant.

But from another angle is is clear the devastating of the punch.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZIY9T8zFjAI

Same with Ali's punch, because it is view from behind Liston it is difficult to see.

Both shots throw with speed and both short punches, both fighters Liston and Hatton are moving into the punch which will increase the power and the punch lands perfectly.

Just putting in the times so they can be easily found 0.36 for the Pacquiao fight, Ali vs Liston 4.00 mark.

You can do (presuming this works, can't access youtube).
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yEPtojKdQuU#t=0m36s
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZIY9T8zFjAI#t=4m00s

Nice one, you something new everyday.

HumanWindmill wrote:Does seem a bit incongruous, doesn't it ? Pretty sure he did, though, although I haven't seen it in a while.

No, I believe you. It's just the internet language, laugh out loud mixed with Jack Dempsey amused me.

The punch was enough to cause a legitimate knock down in my eyes. First round, still caught a little cold, a punch which Liston certainly didn't see coming over the top.

But enough to cause a genuine knockout? Never in a million years for me. A fighter on the end of a genuine knockout punch simply doesn't put their arms out to soften their fall the way that Liston did, in my book. I generally go along with the idea that Windy offered; Liston could have got up and could have fought on, but simply didn't want to. I don't think any money was passed to 'fix' the fight, mind you. Patterson's testimony may be true, but having not seen Liston after the fight I'll probably never be convinced that it was anything other than a case of him wanting out.

Bill Cannon, a New York columnist of the times, appeared on a show with both Marciano and Dempsey in which he also stated that, apparently, Liston (or his father-in-law) owned part of the company which had promoted the fight, too. Read in to that what you will, but I'd think that Liston stood to earn well from the fight regardless taking all of that in to consideration, so why take another sustained beating and earn well when you can do the last bit while going home without a mark on you, too?

Scottrf wrote:

HumanWindmill wrote:Does seem a bit incongruous, doesn't it ? Pretty sure he did, though, although I haven't seen it in a while.

No, I believe you. It's just the internet language, laugh out loud mixed with Jack Dempsey amused me.

Yes, I know what you meant, mate. Didn't interpret it as a ' pop ' and I may be wrong, anyway.

I believe the punch landed and did hurt Liston. Whether he could have continued is certainly up for debate but I don't believe he would have won the fight.

88Chris05 wrote:The punch was enough to cause a legitimate knock down in my eyes. First round, still caught a little cold, a punch which Liston certainly didn't see coming over the top.

But enough to cause a genuine knockout? Never in a million years for me. A fighter on the end of a genuine knockout punch simply doesn't put their arms out to soften their fall the way that Liston did, in my book. I generally go along with the idea that Windy offered; Liston could have got up and could have fought on, but simply didn't want to. I don't think any money was passed to 'fix' the fight, mind you. Patterson's testimony may be true, but having not seen Liston after the fight I'll probably never be convinced that it was anything other than a case of him wanting out.

Bill Cannon, a New York columnist of the times, appeared on a show with both Marciano and Dempsey in which he also stated that, apparently, Liston (or his father-in-law) owned part of the company which had promoted the fight, too. Read in to that what you will, but I'd think that Liston stood to earn well from the fight regardless taking all of that in to consideration, so why take another sustained beating and earn well when you can do the last bit while going home without a mark on you, too?

If that was the case - I would have thought Liston would have some pride, especially being heavyweight champ, a very feared man and a respected puncher. If what you are saying is true then he went out like a chump and destroyed his own entire legacy in 1 round of boxing.

Dazstarr wrote:

88Chris05 wrote:The punch was enough to cause a legitimate knock down in my eyes. First round, still caught a little cold, a punch which Liston certainly didn't see coming over the top.

But enough to cause a genuine knockout? Never in a million years for me. A fighter on the end of a genuine knockout punch simply doesn't put their arms out to soften their fall the way that Liston did, in my book. I generally go along with the idea that Windy offered; Liston could have got up and could have fought on, but simply didn't want to. I don't think any money was passed to 'fix' the fight, mind you. Patterson's testimony may be true, but having not seen Liston after the fight I'll probably never be convinced that it was anything other than a case of him wanting out.

Bill Cannon, a New York columnist of the times, appeared on a show with both Marciano and Dempsey in which he also stated that, apparently, Liston (or his father-in-law) owned part of the company which had promoted the fight, too. Read in to that what you will, but I'd think that Liston stood to earn well from the fight regardless taking all of that in to consideration, so why take another sustained beating and earn well when you can do the last bit while going home without a mark on you, too?

If that was the case - I would have thought Liston would have some pride, especially being heavyweight champ, a very feared man and a respected puncher. If what you are saying is true then he went out like a chump and destroyed his own entire legacy in 1 round of boxing.

He wasn't heavyweight champion at the time and quit on his stool last time out against Ali.

I know that - didnt mean at the time - he was a heavyweight champ in his career. Had he won - he could have made plenty more money. In the first match i think he knew he couldnt win after Ali's eyes cleared.

Dazstarr wrote:I know that - didnt mean at the time - he was a heavyweight champ in his career. Had he won - he could have made plenty more money. In the first match i think he knew he couldnt win after Ali's eyes cleared.

It was a legit KD but Liston knew the score and knew he would take a beaten for maybe a few more rounds before getting a KO after a brutal beating.

Ali beat him up mentally in the first fight.

D4thincarnation wrote:

Dazstarr wrote:I know that - didnt mean at the time - he was a heavyweight champ in his career. Had he won - he could have made plenty more money. In the first match i think he knew he couldnt win after Ali's eyes cleared.

It was a legit KD but Liston knew the score and knew he would take a beaten for maybe a few more rounds before getting a KO after a brutal beating.

Ali beat him up mentally in the first fight.

I agree. It's shame we will never know. Mind you - if things like that didnt happen then we wouldnt have much to debate!

No one truly knows and that's why 46 years on, the debate continues and no one is any nearer to the truth.

I read a book on Liston and close friends and even his own team appear to differ in opinion with differing stories.

The truth died with Liston, although IMO I think he took a dive. My own reasons were he was connected to shady people and boxing was very shady back then and they probably knew that Liston's reign as the top dog was gone and wanted one last big payday from him so the dive was arranged albeit I don't think Liston would have wanted to take the dive but his hand was forced.

Having read his biography I only feel sympathy for Liston, a bad upbringing with no hope and even when he wanted to turn his life around, there were people blocking him and dragging him down at every turn.

Even his death is a sad mystery.

If Manny comes up again - I'll be deleting the post - even if you can offer me a signed affidavit from all parties concerned explaining what happened, combined with the precise force Ali's punch carried as it connected with Liston's head...
---------------------------------------------------------
The last time I discussed this (old606) people became very cross and started saying naughty words. I'll say the same thing, in a different style.

POSSIBILITY 1
Sonny is training hard for the fight. This is his shout at redemption. America has found a champion, who is fast becoming less popular than he was - so if he whups him, then he'll get some credit surely? His sweat soaked gym echoes to the sound of the speedball and heavy bag. When in walk a couple of guys in suits. "Sonny; you're going down in the first".

There were rumours of betting swings in the run-up to the fight. Liston was a mob fighter and the odds on Liston to be kayoed in the first were fantastic. It was a truly unbelievable victory. 1 week later, about 10 policemen tried and failed to subdue an angry Liston by beating him around the head with truncheons (nightsticks to Truss). That powderpuff punch wouldn't have stopped the big bear.

POSSIBILITY 2
Sonny has trained hard for this - but as he gets to the middle of the ring, he feels tired. Everything hurts. His body aches. He just wants to get back to the ring. No matter - where he lays his hands; men fall. Except he can't lay his hands. He can't touch him. Everything still hurts. And this is embarrassing - he's meant to be a former world champ dammit. Finally, a punch comes along hard enough for him to go down. Except he realises as he lies there that it wasn't hard enough. And he can't get up - cos Ali is dancing around him like a lunatic. By the time he can get up - the fights over.

An eminently plausible scenario. Everyone loves a conspiracy (including me) and so might lean towards 1. The major issue with this is whether the punch was sufficient to deck Liston. In my opinion - the answer is no. Not at all. I know there's a lot of theory about the "anchor punch"/1 inch punch force. However - for a proper 1-inch-punch - your body needs to be in line as a unit. Ali's punch doesn't fit the bill

POSSIBILITY 3
Sonny comes out, hoping and expecting to win. Ali punches him. He gets knocked out.

This is the least likely for me - for all the reasons previously discussed

The one thing I would say is - that if it was a fix, Ali knew nothing about it.

IMO Liston was still feeling the first beating.

He had been embarassed, couldn't even win when Ali couldn't see (Ail not seeing, worth a topic of its own?) and was just feeling like an old man in the second fight.

Maybe, although it sounds strange it was his pride that kept him on the floor, he didn't want to be shown up again.

Could have been a fix and maybe knowing after the first fight that he was going to be beaten he figured he'd make the most money possible from the fight by staying down in the first.

It could also be that his age had caught up with him. For many boxers their ability to take a punch seems to go overnight.

Ali was student and very good friend of George Dillman, one of the first western Karate Masters to learn Kyusho back in those days. If you people do a little googling on Kyusho, you'd know how easy it is to knock a guy out.  It's just the timing and the spot to hit. It doesn't take much power to put a person out. This is big secret at that time.

Liston took a dive - to what end we don't know -- but that "punch" from Ali wasn't nearly enough to fell a brute like Liston.

From Ali's "I didn't get you properly dummy!" reaction to Liston's woeful interpretation of a woozy boxer -- even Ali's subsequent tongue-in-cheek assertions about an "anchor" punch -- the fight was rigged.

The first fight also looked odd. Liston appeared to pull his punches. Whether a gambling coup or something more sinister both fights looked highly suspicious -- the second a flat out fix of some nature.