Burns splits with Nelson

After the last thread turned to crap I've started a new one, rumours are that Burns will move to Sims however there is also talk he could move to be trained in the States which would be a surprising move.

Very harsh on Nelson this move who has really turned Burns around since joining up with him.

If this thread goes the same way then the ban hammer will come out for the instigators.

Harsh on Nelson, indeed, but something has looked amiss recently with Ricky and I'm not sure if maybe Nelson has taken him as far as he can and Ricky could benefit from a freshen up.

Maybe even an 'over-achiever' argument for Ricky, so could argue what will a new trainer achieve?

Nice guy Ricky, but he's in/around competitive divisions where I just can't see him ever being a top guy, hopefully he'll get a useful twighlight career as a gatekeeper, can't see him challenging for honours again.

I think that's the big question, Toppy - what can Sims or anyone else do to really improve or repackage Burns at this stage? Obviously the last twelve months haven't been great for him, but for three years before that the success he had was pretty remarkable considering his no-frills style and skill set. You shouldn't tamper with success too much and I think Nelson has been treated pretty harshly here.

I guess there are two arguments, the first that Burns has only been struggling badly over the last year because he's simply facing better fighters than the likes of Martinez, Moses and Katsidis, or because the relationship (and in turn performances) between trainer and fighter has gone stale. I think it's hard to fall emphatically on either side of the fence, but staying with Nelson a little longer would have told us for sure, as his next fight seems likely to be against the winner of Murray-Crolla, and the Burns of a couple of years back would have been a big, big favourite over either of those two.

Personally I don't see any real reason for him to have switched trainers just yet, unless there is some kind of dispute behind the scenes, but hopefully Burns has thought about this long and hard because I still feel there's a chance that Burns can fight for world honours again one day. He can't afford any slip ups or mistakes in his next few bouts for that to happen though, so if he genuinely feels that doing this gives him the best chance of success, then so be it.

There has obviously been something that has went wrong with Ricky over the past year or two. When he was with Warren he looked great against Martinez, Katsidas and Mitchell. But he really did slide into "shot" mode rather quick after leaving Warren.

Burns is well known to be a gym rat and says he over trained when facing Ghonzales but then compare that to the likes of other fighters who have good longitivity by stating they constantly train and look after themselves.

He not only lacks power now but in the Crawford fight he seemed like he was afraid to throw his own shots in case he got tagged. This may be down to the jaw. But its not a good sign. The writing is on the wall for him in my eyes.

Had a good run for a few years but the lack of power has caught up with him. He is too easy to hit as well. I see the domestic lightweights beating him now, Crolla, Murray etc.

I think he beats all the domestic lot with ease, far too simplistic to say he's shot which is what Mosley and Jones are.

I thinks Burns has peaked much like Scott Harrison and Alex Arthur did way back when. They looked as though they'd go on to bigger and better things but Arthur altered his style after the loss to Gomez and he was never the same, Harrison had his much publicized personal issues and Burns, well, I think he's hit that glass ceiling and lacks the ability to take him any further.

I think the same about John Murray (before anyone accuses me of anti-Scottish bias). Murray talks of being reinvigorated and better than ever in the lead up to his fight with Crolla (but don't they all say that) however, again I feel that Murray is just short of World level and at 29 there's nothing to be done to his style to get him over that final hurdle. he lacks sufficient head movement to avoid getting hit by the punchers and his face doesn't react well to being hit so even the guys without much pop in their punches have a chance to bust him up.

Anyway, as for Burns, again I don't see what actual REAL changes will be made by Sims although I'm sure Burns will FEEL different I'm not convinced any changes will be significant enough to make a difference to his career.

Harsh on his coach who took him to heights no one thought he would and then get ditched after two losses....well that's how it appears but there may be more to it.

He may just feel he only has 2-3 biggish fights left to bank his retirement fund and wants to try something different for those fights.

I'm with team Nelson on this for the reasons that have been highlighted above.

How many fighters have changed trainers this late in their careers and gone on to better things?

Can't be too many.

Nelson's reading of a fight and corner advice are second to none in my view.

Strongback wrote:I'm with team Nelson on this for the reasons that have been highlighted above.

How many fighters have changed trainers this late in their careers and gone on to better things?

Can't be too many.

Nelson's reading of a fight and corner advice are second to none in my view.

How did Burns fare in his last few fights again?

DAVE667 wrote:

Strongback wrote:I'm with team Nelson on this for the reasons that have been highlighted above.

How many fighters have changed trainers this late in their careers and gone on to better things?

Can't be too many.

Nelson's reading of a fight and corner advice are second to none in my view.

How did Burns fare in his last few fights again?

Nelson got Burns with a broken jaw through the Beltran fight by giving excellent advice.


The corner man can't get in the ring and fight. Does Wlad making a laugh out of Haye in their fight reflect badly on Booth's corner advice?

Strongback wrote:

DAVE667 wrote:

Strongback wrote:I'm with team Nelson on this for the reasons that have been highlighted above.

How many fighters have changed trainers this late in their careers and gone on to better things?

Can't be too many.

Nelson's reading of a fight and corner advice are second to none in my view.

How did Burns fare in his last few fights again?

Nelson got Burns with a broken jaw through the Beltran fight by giving excellent advice.


The corner man can't get in the ring and fight.  Does Wlad making a laugh out of Haye in their fight reflect badly on Booth's corner advice?

How did Burns do last time out STRONGY...what was Nelson's advice again? Ali got through against Norton with a broken jaw, Abrahams against Miranda....is it such a miracle?

DAVE667 wrote:Ali got through against Norton with a broken jaw, Abrahams against Miranda....is it such a miracle?

Don't forget that Audley did it against Rogan too, Dave.....According to Audley anyway.

Puts it into some sort of perspective then doesn't it?

DAVE667 wrote:

Strongback wrote:

DAVE667 wrote:

Strongback wrote:I'm with team Nelson on this for the reasons that have been highlighted above.

How many fighters have changed trainers this late in their careers and gone on to better things?

Can't be too many.

Nelson's reading of a fight and corner advice are second to none in my view.

How did Burns fare in his last few fights again?

Nelson got Burns with a broken jaw through the Beltran fight by giving excellent advice.


The corner man can't get in the ring and fight.  Does Wlad making a laugh out of Haye in their fight reflect badly on Booth's corner advice?

How did Burns do last time out STRONGY...what was Nelson's advice again? Ali got through against Norton with a broken jaw, Abrahams against Miranda....is it such a miracle?

Wouldn't have mattered if Burns had Eddie Futch, Manny Stewart and Ray Arcel in his corner that night he was getting beaten hands down by a much superior fighter.

DAVE667 wrote:

Strongback wrote:

DAVE667 wrote:

Strongback wrote:I'm with team Nelson on this for the reasons that have been highlighted above.

How many fighters have changed trainers this late in their careers and gone on to better things?

Can't be too many.

Nelson's reading of a fight and corner advice are second to none in my view.

How did Burns fare in his last few fights again?

Nelson got Burns with a broken jaw through the Beltran fight by giving excellent advice.


The corner man can't get in the ring and fight.  Does Wlad making a laugh out of Haye in their fight reflect badly on Booth's corner advice?

How did Burns do last time out STRONGY...what was Nelson's advice again? Ali got through against Norton with a broken jaw, Abrahams against Miranda....is it such a miracle?

Nelson reads a fight well and is calm in the corner. He talked Burns through the Beltran fight when others would have panicked. I have no idea if Nelson is a good trainer but he is an excellent corner man based on the fights I have seen.

Strongback wrote:

DAVE667 wrote:

Strongback wrote:

DAVE667 wrote:

Strongback wrote:I'm with team Nelson on this for the reasons that have been highlighted above.

How many fighters have changed trainers this late in their careers and gone on to better things?

Can't be too many.

Nelson's reading of a fight and corner advice are second to none in my view.

How did Burns fare in his last few fights again?

Nelson got Burns with a broken jaw through the Beltran fight by giving excellent advice.


The corner man can't get in the ring and fight.  Does Wlad making a laugh out of Haye in their fight reflect badly on Booth's corner advice?

How did Burns do last time out STRONGY...what was Nelson's advice again? Ali got through against Norton with a broken jaw, Abrahams against Miranda....is it such a miracle?

Nelson reads a fight well and is calm in the corner.  He talked Burns through the Beltran fight when others would have panicked.  I have no idea if Nelson is a good trainer but he is an excellent corner man based on the fights I have seen.

Again, what was the result when Burns fought last time?

MORE BLEACH IN CUBICLE THREE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

DAVE667 wrote:

Strongback wrote:

DAVE667 wrote:

Strongback wrote:

DAVE667 wrote:

Strongback wrote:I'm with team Nelson on this for the reasons that have been highlighted above.

How many fighters have changed trainers this late in their careers and gone on to better things?

Can't be too many.

Nelson's reading of a fight and corner advice are second to none in my view.

How did Burns fare in his last few fights again?

Nelson got Burns with a broken jaw through the Beltran fight by giving excellent advice.


The corner man can't get in the ring and fight.  Does Wlad making a laugh out of Haye in their fight reflect badly on Booth's corner advice?

How did Burns do last time out STRONGY...what was Nelson's advice again? Ali got through against Norton with a broken jaw, Abrahams against Miranda....is it such a miracle?

Nelson reads a fight well and is calm in the corner.  He talked Burns through the Beltran fight when others would have panicked.  I have no idea if Nelson is a good trainer but he is an excellent corner man based on the fights I have seen.

Again, what was the result when Burns fought last time?

MORE BLEACH IN CUBICLE THREE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

It was similar to when Haye fought Wlad only Haye won less rounds.

What are you doing in cubicle three that requires so much bleach? Since you found out how to access porn on your phone you've practically moved into that cubicle.

Could potentially be a good move for Burns, in his past few fights he's regressed as a boxer and needs reinvigorating and maybe a change of trainer will do that. He has nothing to lose but a lot to gain.

Do feel for Nelson who has not done a lot wrong. However we should not lose sight of the fact boxing is a job. Am sure we have all been there when we get bored. A change of trainer is no different to a boxer than moving department or team is for us, not sure it will make a huge difference this late in the day but can understand why Burns would try.

For once I agree with Strongback, doesn't matter who was in Burns' corner in his last fight he would have lost due to Crawford being too good, would also say that Nelson is generally a very good cornerman from what I've seen.