Wales v England - 6 February 2015 - Match thread

[BamBam]

First topic message reminder :


Wales v England
6 February 2015
Millennium Stadium, Cardiff
Kick off at 20.05

Referee: Jérôme Garcès (FFR)
AR1: Romain Poite (FFR)
AR2: Mathieu Raynal (FFR)
TMO: Simon McDowell (IRFU)

Live on BBC1

Wales

01. Gethin Jenkins
02. Richard Hibbard
03. Samson Lee
04. Alun Wyn Jones
05. Jake Ball
06. Dan Lydiate
07. Sam Warburton (c)
08. Toby Faletau

09. Rhys Webb
10. Dan Biggar
11. George North
12. Jamie Roberts
13. Jonathan Davies
14. Alex Cuthbert
15. Leigh Halfpenny

16. Scott Baldwin
17. Paul James
18. Aaron Jarvis
19. Luke Charteris
20. Justin Tipuric
21. Mike Phillips
22. Rhys Preistland
23. Liam Williams

England

15. Mike Brown
14. Anthony Watson
13. Jonathan Joseph
12. Luther Burrell
11. Jonny May
10. George Ford
09. Ben Youngs  

01. Joe Marler
02. Dylan Hartley
03. Dan Cole
04. David Attwood
05. George Kruis
06. James Haskell
07. Chris Robshaw (captain)
08. Billy Vunipola

16. Tom Youngs
17. Mako Vunipola
18. Kieran Brookes
19. Tom Croft
20. Nick Easter
21. Richard Wigglesworth
22. Danny Cipriani
23. Billy Twelvetrees

[TJ]

Totally deserved.

Two general points:

- England have two of the best packs in the world
- In Watson, Joseph, Ford, Brown and May England have a core of a world class backline. They all need to develop and we need to find a 12 with the full skill-set. The Welsh backs look big and ponderous in comparison.

LOL. But true.

have been banging on about joseph and ford for ages. they are the way forwards. watson was awesome too.

i reckon bath (whose strength is their pack) could well win the euro cup too with that backline.

I thought Ford was pretty poor. Charged down twice, some poor kicks and kicked away attacking ball. Joseph showed his class tho

[Rory_Gallagher]

JJ is going to be a world class outside centre. He put in a massive hit on Roberts as well, no question marks over his physicality or defence tonight. I wonder if Lancaster will immediately drop him for Tuilagi though..

[Sgt_Pooly]

Hopefully get Lawes & Wood back which will make us stronger, Ireland away is a tough one though.

[Guest]

Well done England good win, wales stuffed in scrum not sure it was the front row wales back row looked lightweight, the backs can t play without the ball and what they had they kicked it away, Phillips offered nothing.

Phillips was on for 10 minutes! Who else offered 'something' in that 10 mins???

[quinsforever]

the rules are clear. if the alleged abstruction player is behind the ball then there's no obstruction unless he created a clear advantage. which he didnt. mako was tackled on the line.

Sorry but this is wrong. Obstruction is basically another word for off-side in open play. A player is off-side if he is in front of the ball (you cannot be guilty of obstruction if you are behind the ball, clear offence or not; you can be guilty of offences like playing the man without the ball etc. but that is not obstruction). He is liable to be penalised if he has an effect on the game.

That Easter was behind the passer when he passed the ball is irrelevant. What is relevant is whether:
- he was in front of the ball at any stage (he clearly was)
- he had enough of an effect on the game to be penalised (debateable, I would say probably not on balance)

Overall:
- England thoroughly deserved the win. Wales had nothing in the second half.
- Garces had a decent game. Some of his decisions were contentious, and some were just wrong (in hindsight, and at the time), but I don't think you could say he had an effect on the overall nature or result of the game; as I said earlier, he was fair and balanced, in control, and didn't make any major howlers (if you accept the non award of the try could have gone either way) - don't think either side would have much to complain about. Garces is not the best referee around, but for him he had a good game.

agree, but only because england won. if wales had won, garces howlers would have been much more shrply in focus. several of which were clear.

i think you are wrong on obstruction. webb decided to tackle easter. if that makes it obstruction then every side is going to just tackler the runner and claim its obstruction. the reality is he got this completely wrong.

[Shifty]

Wales talked the talk, England walked the walk that's all you can really say about the game. Best team won.

[The Saint]

Ford started poor but grew into the game, a bit like the England team who took time to settle. Not sure why, nerves perhaps. Solid win in the end. This result may just be the kick up the backside I said Gatland needed going into this game.

[quinsforever]

haskell, jj, watson and ford nailing their places for england. deservedly so.

[nathan]

Totally deserved.

Two general points:

- England have two of the best packs in the world
- In Watson, Joseph, Ford, Brown and May England have a core of a world class backline. They all need to develop and we need to find a 12 with the full skill-set. The Welsh backs look big and ponderous in comparison.

LOL. But true.

have been banging on about joseph and ford for ages. they are the way forwards. watson was awesome too.

i reckon bath (whose strength is their pack) could well win the euro cup too with that backline.

I thought Ford was pretty poor.  Charged down twice, some poor kicks and kicked away attacking ball.  Joseph showed his class tho

Overly harsh to be fair. Don't think he was man of the match, but certainly didn't have a poor game. Yes he made errors, but he recovered straight away.

[TheRugbyMaster]

A good win for England. Took their chances and kept the noose tight in the second spell. Wales though... Just so one dimensional. So predictable. So slow behind the ruck, changes needed at 9, 10 and coach.

[nathan]

Ford started poor but grew into the game, a bit like the England team who took time to settle. Not sure why, nerves perhaps. Solid win in the end. This result may just be the kick up the backside I said Gatland needed going into this game.

Alot of new combinations is what I suspect.

[Steve_rugby]

What happened to the superior Wales fitness ? Did they miss out the cryotherapy sessions leading up to this game.

[Guest]

Stay gracious England...

[DaveM]

Haskell was interesting - poor start but got better and better. I think he's probably done enough to keep his place. England's backrow was excellent.

[quinsforever]

fair comments Warbs. gracious captain and can see why he is a leader. smart cookie

[The Saint]

A good win for England. Took their chances and kept the noose tight in the second spell. Wales though... Just so one dimensional. So predictable. So slow behind the ruck, changes needed at 9, 10 and coach.

9 and 10? That's an absolute baffling comment if I'm honest. The changes needed are front row, centre and wing. Some of the players I said should start going into this are Rob Evans, Scott Willams (over JD), Amos and Liam Williams - that and some variation in the game like the autumn.

[TJ]

Totally deserved.

Two general points:

- England have two of the best packs in the world
- In Watson, Joseph, Ford, Brown and May England have a core of a world class backline. They all need to develop and we need to find a 12 with the full skill-set. The Welsh backs look big and ponderous in comparison.

LOL. But true.

have been banging on about joseph and ford for ages. they are the way forwards. watson was awesome too.

i reckon bath (whose strength is their pack) could well win the euro cup too with that backline.

I thought Ford was pretty poor.  Charged down twice, some poor kicks and kicked away attacking ball.  Joseph showed his class tho

Overly harsh to be fair. Don't think he was man of the match, but certainly didn't have a poor game. Yes he made errors, but he recovered straight away.

He kept his head i suppose and maybe poor is a bit harsh but mediocre at best, My view from where I am sitting.

[nobbled]

Sorry Quins - I'd like to agree with you but Easter was offside. He was a bit too keen - over-ran and caused an obstruction.
Don't think it was a deliberate block - but that doesn't matter.
We won. Let's move on.
Thought Faleteau was immense today. Not had great form recently but without his great skill at the base of the scrum England would have dominated every scrum and gained possession.

[Mike Selig]

Anyway good start to the 6N. Can't say it was the greatest game in terms of quality, but there was tension, drama, mistakes, moments of quality and controversy. What more could you want as a neutral?

Forum briefly discussing North's potential concussion. Gotta say this is a massive issue for sport as a whole, not just rugby, but I do have a problem with how often this kind of thing happens.

[The Saint]

Stay gracious England...

That's nottins for you. Nowhere to be seen when his team lost, probably still blaming the ref for that one. I'm sure he will get another ban soon.

[TJ]

the rules are clear. if the alleged abstruction player is behind the ball then there's no obstruction unless he created a clear advantage. which he didnt. mako was tackled on the line.

Sorry but this is wrong. Obstruction is basically another word for off-side in open play. A player is off-side if he is in front of the ball (you cannot be guilty of obstruction if you are behind the ball, clear offence or not; you can be guilty of offences like playing the man without the ball etc. but that is not obstruction). He is liable to be penalised if he has an effect on the game.

That Easter was behind the passer when he passed the ball is irrelevant. What is relevant is whether:
- he was in front of the ball at any stage (he clearly was)
- he had enough of an effect on the game to be penalised (debateable, I would say probably not on balance)

Overall:
- England thoroughly deserved the win. Wales had nothing in the second half.
- Garces had a decent game. Some of his decisions were contentious, and some were just wrong (in hindsight, and at the time), but I don't think you could say he had an effect on the overall nature or result of the game; as I said earlier, he was fair and balanced, in control, and didn't make any major howlers (if you accept the non award of the try could have gone either way) - don't think either side would have much to complain about. Garces is not the best referee around, but for him he had a good game.

agree, but only because england won. if wales had won, garces howlers would have been much more shrply in focus. several of which were clear.

i think you are wrong on obstruction. webb decided to tackle easter. if that makes it obstruction then every side is going to just tackler the runner and claim its obstruction. the reality is he got this completely wrong.

Obvious obstruction Quins - one of the most blatant I have seen for awhile Have a look at the replay tommorrw. what howlers do You think Garcia made? From here I saw none bar a missed forward pass

[nathan]

Stay gracious England...

That's nottins for you. Nowhere to be seen when his team lost, probably still blaming the ref for that one. I'm sure he will get another ban soon.

Mate, glass houses

[Ozzy3213]

If it's any consolation to the Welsh amongst us, I thought you were really good at the pre game light display!

[DaveM]

easter was behind the ball when it was passed. therefore cannot be obstruction. shocking decision. shocking. needs to learn the rules.

Obvoious and clear obstruction Quins.  the ball was passed behind him and he blocked a tackler.  Correct decision

Personally I don't think he prevented a tackle. But it doesn't matter now.

[Guest]

A good win for England. Took their chances and kept the noose tight in the second spell. Wales though... Just so one dimensional. So predictable. So slow behind the ruck, changes needed at 9, 10 and coach.

9 and 10? That's an absolute baffling comment if I'm honest. The changes needed are front row, centre and wing. Some of the players I said should start going into this are Rob Evans, Scott Willams (over JD), Amos and Liam Williams - that and some variation in the game like the autumn.

I agree. I think a number of us beforehand called for form players to be picked, but knew what Gats would go for. The form players for me are Scott Williams at centre, Liam Williams at FB/wing, maybe Amos (playing better than Cuthbert). I too would have a look at Rob Evans?

[The Saint]

Stay gracious England...

That's nottins for you. Nowhere to be seen when his team lost, probably still blaming the ref for that one. I'm sure he will get another ban soon.

Mate, glass houses

You don't ever get bored of being a hypocrite do you? Why don't you set up that ref-blaming thread seeing as you were one of the culprits. Never seen such dumb and ungracious comments if I'm honest.

[Geordie]

Well that was a huge win.

I wasn't impressed first half but they turned It round. Well done.

Positive Gf!!!

I take my hat off to them. Second half they were excellent but first half they were poor.

Watson was outstanding as was Haskell.

And in his brief appearance Twelvetrees was excellent... Wow did I really say that...

[nathan]

Stay gracious England...

That's nottins for you. Nowhere to be seen when his team lost, probably still blaming the ref for that one. I'm sure he will get another ban soon.

Mate, glass houses

You don't ever get bored of being a hypocrite do you? Why don't you set up that ref-blaming thread seeing as you were one of the culprits. Never seen such dumb and ungracious comments if I'm honest.

I have, usually posted by you.

[Gwlad]

If it's any consolation to the Welsh amongst us, I thought you were really good at the pre game light display!

I thought attempts to wind up, gloat or personally attack were to be dealt with and bans handed out?

[Nachos Jones]

As an Irish fan, on the whole I felt England were the better team. It was a very deserved victory.

[Guest]

If it's any consolation to the Welsh amongst us, I thought you were really good at the pre game light display!

I thought attempts to wind up, gloat or personally attack were to be dealt with and bans handed out?

But not if you're Mod! Obvs

[2ndtimeround]

Well done England and a special well done to Stuart Lancaster who has just shown the benefit of intelligent play over bash it up the middle and kick it away when it doesn't work.

[The Saint]

Stay gracious England...

That's nottins for you. Nowhere to be seen when his team lost, probably still blaming the ref for that one. I'm sure he will get another ban soon.

Mate, glass houses

You don't ever get bored of being a hypocrite do you? Why don't you set up that ref-blaming thread seeing as you were one of the culprits. Never seen such dumb and ungracious comments if I'm honest.

I have, usually posted by you.

Oh well done! As expected such a mature and witty response!

[quinsforever]

Easter was not offside nobbled. arguably he obstructed. cant be offside in open play ball in hand unless theres an accidental knockon that goes to the player ahead 2.

regarding obstruction, did he prevent the player making the tackle? clearly not

(b) Running in front of a ball carrier. A player must not intentionally move or stand in front of a team-mate carrying the ball thereby preventing opponents from tackling the current ball carrier or the opportunity to tackle potential ball carriers when they gain possession.
Sanction: Penalty kick

(c) Blocking the tackler. A player must not intentionally move or stand in a position that prevents an opponent from tackling a ball carrier.
Sanction: Penalty kick

[Nachos Jones]

If it's any consolation to the Welsh amongst us, I thought you were really good at the pre game light display!

Surely on the new 6N rules set by the Mods, that's banning talk right there

Where is Banning Biltong?

[Guest]

As an Irish fan, on the whole I felt England were the better team. It was a very deserved victory.

k

On the whole? Try every facet of the game! I feel embarrassed by our performance to be honest. That looked and played out almost like an away game.

[nobbled]

If it's any consolation to the Welsh amongst us, I thought you were really good at the pre game light display!

I thought attempts to wind up, gloat or personally attack were to be dealt with and bans handed out?

Dammit - I was looking forward to a good gloat.

Spoilsports.

[TJ]

Stay gracious England...

That's nottins for you. Nowhere to be seen when his team lost, probably still blaming the ref for that one. I'm sure he will get another ban soon.

Mate, glass houses

You don't ever get bored of being a hypocrite do you? Why don't you set up that ref-blaming thread seeing as you were one of the culprits. Never seen such dumb and ungracious comments if I'm honest.

I have, usually posted by you.

Don't feed the troll

[nathan]

Stay gracious England...

That's nottins for you. Nowhere to be seen when his team lost, probably still blaming the ref for that one. I'm sure he will get another ban soon.

Mate, glass houses

You don't ever get bored of being a hypocrite do you? Why don't you set up that ref-blaming thread seeing as you were one of the culprits. Never seen such dumb and ungracious comments if I'm honest.

I have, usually posted by you.

Don't feed the troll

Trying my hardest not too!

[Duty281]

I thought it were a poor decision to penalise Easter; there would be an extra 15 transgressions, or so, a game if you were to penalise that each time.

And incidents such as that always look worse on the slow-motion video replay (x5).

Still, didn't matter in the end.

[Ozzy3213]

Stay gracious England...

That's nottins for you. Nowhere to be seen when his team lost, probably still blaming the ref for that one. I'm sure he will get another ban soon.

Mate, glass houses

You don't ever get bored of being a hypocrite do you? Why don't you set up that ref-blaming thread seeing as you were one of the culprits. Never seen such dumb and ungracious comments if I'm honest.

oh the irony

[lostinwales]

Well done England and a special well done to Stuart Lancaster who has just shown the benefit of intelligent play over bash it up the middle and kick it away when it doesn't work.

Best shortest sweetest summary of the game.

[nobbled]

Okay - George Ford man of the match?
Really? He was good....but MOM?
Not convinced - who do you think it should have been?

[Gwlad]

Stay gracious England...

That's nottins for you. Nowhere to be seen when his team lost, probably still blaming the ref for that one. I'm sure he will get another ban soon.

Mate, glass houses

You don't ever get bored of being a hypocrite do you? Why don't you set up that ref-blaming thread seeing as you were one of the culprits. Never seen such dumb and ungracious comments if I'm honest.

I have, usually posted by you.

Don't feed the troll

unless the food is poison as he seems to thrive off
that. sad man

[Hood83]

This is when I get to trot out my favourite comment about Joseph being a far better player than Tuilagi.

[DaveM]

I wonder if we'll now see a more stable England side. Suddenly things look like they are coming together. It's difficult to imagine Launchbury and Lawes won't get back in, but other players might need to wait for injuries or loss of form.

I was so pleased we had JJ at 13 instead of Barritt.

[quinsforever]

I thought it were a poor decision to penalise Easter; there would be an extra 15 transgressions, or so, a game if you were to penalise that each time.

And incidents such as that always look worse on the slow-motion video replay (x5).

Still, didn't matter in the end.

yes, but it could have done. England were 15-20 points better than Wales today without the home advantage

[The Saint]

Stay gracious England...

That's nottins for you. Nowhere to be seen when his team lost, probably still blaming the ref for that one. I'm sure he will get another ban soon.

Mate, glass houses

You don't ever get bored of being a hypocrite do you? Why don't you set up that ref-blaming thread seeing as you were one of the culprits. Never seen such dumb and ungracious comments if I'm honest.

oh the irony

Sigh. Want me to set it up for you? AlsoCould you point out any umgraciousness comments by myself on any recent thread? This one is full of them from 'england supporters.' It also seems that with recent warnings given out mods are above the law. It's pathetic, but was expected none the less.

[Hammersmith harrier]

Biggar committed himself to tackling Easter before the ball was released so for me it wasn't obstruction but Warburtons crying over decisions has no place on a Rugby pitch, an Englishmen should really know better.

[Ozzy3213]

If it's any consolation to the Welsh amongst us, I thought you were really good at the pre game light display!

I thought attempts to wind up, gloat or personally attack were to be dealt with and bans handed out?

But not if you're Mod! Obvs

Or you could get a sense of humour. It's called banter, found at most rugby grounds around the country.

[Sponsored content]