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Anthony Joshua 11-0 v Mike Tyson 11-0

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Anthony Joshua 11-0 v Mike Tyson 11-0 - Page 3 Empty Anthony Joshua 11-0 v Mike Tyson 11-0

Post by ONETWOFOREVER Mon 06 Apr 2015, 3:27 pm

First topic message reminder :

I was thinking the other day that Joshua at this early stage of his career looks like the best prospect I have seen since Mike Tyson. I was too young back in 1985 when Tyson koed Sterling Benjamin in the 1st round but I have seen most of his early fights since on the net or DVD to be impressed by that young heavyweight prospect.

Tyson today would look completely on another planet compared to the lumps in the H/W division. The young Tyson had immense power, devastating speed, and also a well schooled technical ability which enabled him to dominate opponents as the shorter fighter by closing distance with the head roll and throwing combinations behind his quick jab.

Both Tyson and Joshua in their first 11 fights faced less then average opposition and ended their bouts early. Joshua it has to be said looks the part. He is very dedicated and you can tell that by just looking at him. He has a good technical base, quick hands and ko power but what would happen if we put both these 2 prospects in the ring.

Who is you're money on????

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Post by ONETWOFOREVER Thu 09 Apr 2015, 2:29 pm

Hammersmith harrier wrote:Raf, don't forget the only Tyson fights you've watched are the ones he lost, none of us have watched his fights with Berbick, Ferguson, Holmes or Spinks.

Silly comment.

TRUSS lived through that era and knows a darn more then you do on the early Mike Tyson plus TRUSS has been a dedicated fan of boxing before you knew how to tie up your laces.

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Post by kingraf Thu 09 Apr 2015, 2:34 pm

This is my problem with the debate. Seems constructed for a Tyson win. We're allowed to look at what he did after he went 11-0 (rightfully so) to account for how good he must have been at 11-0 (reasonable guesswork I concede, but reasonable guesswork is still guesswork). We can't however, discuss his weaknesses which popped up, because you know, this was an 11-0, those weaknesses didnt exist in that beast.

I can understand the argument behind an 11-0 Tyson only being 18 months away from a title etc... But
- 18 months is a reasonably long time. Especially when you fight with the regularity Tyson did. Lots of lessons could be learnt. And a guy who Rooney said picked things up quicker than anyone he ever saw to learn them.

Long as we play a game of accentuate his strength and ignore his weaknesses... then sure Tyson wins. The reasons he wasn't facing Olympic Champions or even Olympic contenders at 11-0 will remain forever mysterious.
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Post by AdamT Thu 09 Apr 2015, 2:36 pm

If I am judging Tyson on his first 11 fights I still pick him to win. I think he would be too elusive for Joshua going by what I seen thus far.

Though it is only my opinion. Perhaps I am biased because I ama huge Tyson fan

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Post by tunes666 Fri 10 Apr 2015, 12:34 am

Impossible to answer this question as we do not know how good AJ is at the moment.

If we are to go by their first 11 fights then its still up in the air as they have both had cannon fodder in their first 11 and blew them all away.

AJ might go on to be a great champ that could have beaten Tyson.

As good as Tyson was I always feel he was a tad over rated and people just assumed when he lost it was because he was not the same fighter... well thats what happens when you are worked out a little and have tasted defeat. I think once bigger guys worked out how to keep Tyson at bay a little more and he started to taste more leather, this tamed him a little... When we see "Tyson at his best" ... well we can say that about any great fighter.. but fighters are not usually always at their best and sometimes not aloud to be.

I think if AJ has a good chin then he may well go on to be a great champ.

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Post by 88Chris05 Fri 10 Apr 2015, 2:26 pm

'Tis a fair point, tunes.

No fighter is completely unbeatable and if you cast an ultra-critical eye over Tyson's reign you could argue that, if you pieced together all the slight problems he encountered against guys like Smith, Thomas and Bruno (and they were only very, very slight!) you could come up with enough evidence to suggest that a truly exceptional fighter would be able to beat him even if he was in top form - and the Douglas who turned up in Tokyo that night was truly exceptional. For me, a completely focussed Tyson with Rooney in his corner could still have lost to that version of Douglas - that's how good Buster was that night.

But while this isn't an excuse for Tyson, and nor does it give his fantatics a right to say that he never lost in his 'prime', Tyson did look a bit off-colour from the start in Tokyo and while Douglas might still have won, he'd never have been able to completely dominate and banjo the best version of Tyson who wasn't neglecting the odd part of his game in my opinion. That version of Tyson was still a top, top fighter but there is evidence to suggest he was maybe just dipping by 1990, backed up by his two fights the next year against Ruddock where he didn't look anywhere near his best, either.

Douglas and Holyfield (although in hindsight, maybe the latter shouldn't have been viewed as such a cataclysmic upset) definitely highlighted vulnerabilities in Tyson's game, mind you. I just think they perhaps gave a false impression of how easy it'd have been for all other great Heavies to have done the same if we're talking about matching them at their very best against Tyson at his.
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Post by Marlonz Mon 13 Apr 2015, 7:09 pm

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:Kids who weren't around to see the skillful animal that was a young Tyson will probably pick Joshua...

For me watch Tyson v Bruno and that's a carbon copy of this fight...

Interesting comparison. Whilst I think Joshua has better coordination, he's certainly more like Bruno than he is like Lewis.

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Post by milkyboy Mon 13 Apr 2015, 9:19 pm

How do you rate anybody who's won their first 11 fights against no- marks by early ko? Joshua could turn out to have the lungs of Henry Armstrong and the whiskers of George chuvalo. Or those big muscles might have him gassing after 4 rounds and he might get pancaked the first time someone tags him.

Given how relatively easy he is to hit, and given what we know Tyson went on to achieve by far the most likely scenario is that Tyson malus him. But we don't know that, we have hindsight on our side with one of them.

Incidentally, the tillis fight was close... The young Tyson could potentially be 'old manned' but out fought?

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Post by ONETWOFOREVER Mon 13 Apr 2015, 9:34 pm

milkyboy wrote:How do you rate anybody who's won their first 11 fights against no- marks by early ko? Joshua could turn out to have the lungs of Henry Armstrong and the whiskers of George chuvalo. Or those big muscles might have him gassing after 4 rounds and he might get pancaked the first time someone tags him.

Given how relatively easy he is to hit, and given what we know Tyson went on to achieve by far the most likely scenario is that Tyson malus him. But we don't know that, we have hindsight on our side with one of them.

Incidentally, the tillis fight was close... The young Tyson could potentially be 'old manned' but out fought?

The main reason I wanted to match them up at the 11-0 stage was because they both look/looked tremendous and both have/are koing tomato cans. Tyson never faced anyone like AJ in those first 11 fights but this was a young Tyson with all the technical ability we all know about and a Tyson who was deliberatly fed much bigger guys in sparring and was matched with bigger guys in his early fights.

I have been looking back at young Tyson these past few days and have to agree with most that Tyson would destroy Joshua. Saying that Joshua has been spoon fed fighters who just can't match him in any way. That Gavern fight was pointless and just a gimmie because he could not have learned anything.

Clayton and Jacobs were better match makers then Hearn who really has no clue. I can see Joshua heading for a Price like shock when he steps up in class.

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Post by 88Chris05 Mon 13 Apr 2015, 9:46 pm

Well as a side note on that issue - did anyone else see that Tony Thompson seems to think he'll be fighting Joshua soon? This is what he wrote on his Facebook last week:

"Looks like Anthony Joshua wants some of the old fella after all so umma (sic!) say sorry early to all my brit fans lol and don't boo my national anthem again see yall soon hopefully and no I don't know the date yet so please don't ask me a 1000 times I'll post it when it comes 100 percent certain."
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Post by ONETWOFOREVER Mon 13 Apr 2015, 9:55 pm

88Chris05 wrote:Well as a side note on that issue - did anyone else see that Tony Thompson seems to think he'll be fighting Joshua soon? This is what he wrote on his Facebook last week:

"Looks like Anthony Joshua wants some of the old fella after all so umma (sic!) say sorry early to all my brit fans lol and don't boo my national anthem again see yall soon hopefully and no I don't know the date yet so please don't ask me a 1000 times I'll post it when it comes 100 percent certain."

I like Thompson.

Lucky in the first Price fight but his expeariance showed in the 2nd. Can't make a case for him winning against AJ should this be made but can see him doing a Bonecrusher Smith v Tyson on Joshua

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Post by TRUSSMAN66 Mon 13 Apr 2015, 10:57 pm

ONETWOFOREVER wrote:
milkyboy wrote:How do you rate anybody who's won their first 11 fights against no- marks by early ko? Joshua could turn out to have the lungs of Henry Armstrong and the whiskers of George chuvalo. Or those big muscles might have him gassing after 4 rounds and he might get pancaked the first time someone tags him.

Given how relatively easy he is to hit, and given what we know Tyson went on to achieve by far the most likely scenario is that Tyson malus him. But we don't know that, we have hindsight on our side with one of them.

Incidentally, the tillis fight was close... The young Tyson could potentially be 'old manned' but out fought?

The main reason I wanted to match them up at the 11-0 stage was because they both look/looked tremendous and both have/are koing tomato cans. Tyson never faced anyone like AJ in those first 11 fights but this was a young Tyson with all the technical ability we all know about and a Tyson who was deliberatly fed much bigger guys in sparring and was matched with bigger guys in his early fights.

I have been looking back at young Tyson these past few days and have to agree with most that Tyson would destroy Joshua. Saying that Joshua has been spoon fed fighters who just can't match him in any way. That Gavern fight was pointless and just a gimmie because he could not have learned anything.

Clayton and Jacobs were better match makers then Hearn who really has no clue. I can see Joshua heading for a Price like shock when he steps up in class.

The only time he moves up in class is to fight for a world title.

He's Bruno mark 2

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Post by kingraf Tue 14 Apr 2015, 7:02 am

Being a Bruno Mk2 is not the worst possible combo. Bruno was beating Lewis until a combo of his chin, and engine did him in. Also had openings against a post prime, but near peak Tyson. An improvement on Bruno may have finished the job. Especially if he has the killer instinct of a
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