Boxing News Top 25 Fighters Last 25 Years

Great issue of BN out today - won't spoil the mag for subscribers but there'll be a few tantrums on 606 when it comes out!

Floyd better be number one or there will be a riot.

Don't read it and don't care If he's number 1 or not...

Means sweet FA to me what a bunch of Brit writers think....

I have my own opinion..........

Haz seems happy.............so Floyd isn't number 1.....

Is this the list haz?

Top 25 Fighters of the last 25 Years

1. Roy Jones Jr
2. Floyd Mayweather
3. Manny Pacquiao
4. Bernard Hopkins
5. Lennox Lewis
6. Ricardo Lopez
7. Pernell Whittaker
8. Julio Cesar Chavez
9. Juan Manuel Marquez
10. Evander Holyfield
11. Marco Antonio Barrera
12. Erik Morales
13. Felix Trinidad
14. Miguel Cotto
15. Shane Mosley
16. Oscar De La Hoya
17. Wlad Klitschko
18. Michael Carbajal
19. Vitali Klitschko
20. James Toney
21. Joe Calzaghe
22. Andre Ward
23. Kosta Tszyu
24. Michael Moorer
25. Dariusz Michalczewski

Atila wrote:Is this the list haz?

Top 25 Fighters of the last 25 Years

1. Roy Jones Jr
2. Floyd Mayweather
3. Manny Pacquiao
4. Bernard Hopkins
5. Lennox Lewis
6. Ricardo Lopez
7. Pernell Whittaker
8. Julio Cesar Chavez
9. Juan Manuel Marquez
10. Evander Holyfield
11. Marco Antonio Barrera
12. Erik Morales
13. Felix Trinidad
14. Miguel Cotto
15. Shane Mosley
16. Oscar De La Hoya
17. Wlad Klitschko
18. Michael Carbajal
19. Vitali Klitschko
20. James Toney
21. Joe Calzaghe
22. Andre Ward
23. Kosta Tszyu
24. Michael Moorer
25. Dariusz Michalczewski

Oscar is a joke...So is Lewis at 5..........HTF is Calzaghe behind Carbajal and Vitali ???

1 and 2 I'm happy with...Jones jr was an amazing talent.................Whittaker should be higher and above Lewis..

Atila wrote:Is this the list haz?

Top 25 Fighters of the last 25 Years

1. Roy Jones Jr
2. Floyd Mayweather
3. Manny Pacquiao
4. Bernard Hopkins
5. Lennox Lewis
6. Ricardo Lopez
7. Pernell Whittaker
8. Julio Cesar Chavez
9. Juan Manuel Marquez
10. Evander Holyfield
11. Marco Antonio Barrera
12. Erik Morales
13. Felix Trinidad
14. Miguel Cotto
15. Shane Mosley
16. Oscar De La Hoya
17. Wlad Klitschko
18. Michael Carbajal
19. Vitali Klitschko
20. James Toney
21. Joe Calzaghe
22. Andre Ward
23. Kosta Tszyu
24. Michael Moorer
25. Dariusz Michalczewski

That's the one. Vitali and Moorer seem odd picks but I'm glad Tito trumped Oscar!

I wouldn't have been bothered If Manny was number 1...

Just a list mate......Written by biased journos....like all the others..

Still fairplay and all that...

Doesn't Golden boy run a rival publication in "THE RING" magazine ???

Sure that has nothing to do with him at 16....

Michael Moorer. I can think of a fair few fighters I'd have above Moorer. Winky Wright anyone?

Just glad they got Tito/Oscar and Barrera/Morales the right way round.

Moorer went from WBO light heavy to the Undisputed heavy crown...........I can understand why he's in a top 25.......

It's a big achievement....

The biggest omission is Terry Norris.............Curry, Leonard, Mugabi Taylor, Brown ......7 years 14 defences..

Criminally underrated..

I have no real problem with the list but I probably would put Chavez above Hopkins and Lewis. Whitaker also above Hopkins and Lewis.

RJJ at #1?! Christ

Talented yes, a record oozing with the best of the best? Nope. FFS, I'd have Froch ahead of him! At least he has beaten a better calibre of fighter and didn't go on a bum of the month crusade. Toney - yes. Bhop - 5 years green. Erm.... Erm..... Run of the mill apart from that, admittedly in a poor division at the time.

Froch is more deserving of squeezing in the top 25. And I'm not on the wind up, my complete and utter contempt for Jones 'record' (or lack of when you think someone like Manny has Marquez, MAB, Morales, Cotto, Hatton, Bradley and co on it). When you put the records side by side with a big chunk of that list he hasn't got a pot to p!ss in!!

If its 25 years maybe Chavez is okay where he is...

His 130 and 135 career were before 90..

Behave Coxy

I'd have Moorer nowhere near a top 25 - nor Vitali. The heavyweights are too high - and that goes for Lewis. Winky Wright and Sergio Martinez both belong above Moorer (who scored one top win over Holyfield - who suffered heart problems mid-fight).

AND Johnny Tapia. AND Mark Johnson!

Couldn't agree more Coxy to be honest!! Well put!

Were the f..k is Tucker Pudwill and Martin Rogan?

Coxy001 wrote:RJJ at #1?! Christ

Talented yes, a record oozing with the best of the best? Nope. FFS, I'd have Froch ahead of him! At least he has beaten a better calibre of fighter and didn't go on a bum of the month crusade. Toney - yes. Bhop - 5 years green. Erm.... Erm..... Run of the mill apart from that, admittedly in a poor division at the time.

Froch is more deserving of squeezing in the top 25. And I'm not on the wind up, my complete and utter contempt for Jones 'record' (or lack of when you think someone like Manny has Marquez, MAB, Morales, Cotto, Hatton, Bradley and co on it). When you put the records side by side with a big chunk of that list he hasn't got a pot to p!ss in!!

The what now ? As impressive as a resume Mr Froch has this is an absurd comment, lets not forget Carl hasn't even been top dog in his own division ever.  Not going to bleat on about Jones Jnr Cv we all know it and it is of a high standard, always makes me laugh nowadays the sheer adulation Mayweather gets for beating someone outweighing him on fight night. Jones stood John Ruiz on his head and was outweighed by a whopping 33lbs on the scales (not fight night) granted Ruiz not going to be in our echelons of a top HW but he was a solid fighter of a decent standard and what Jones Jnr did to him is as good as Mayweather will ever do.

Overall its a good list (agreed Moorer and Vitali are strange picks)

Agree with Truss, Norris is a definite omission - Moorer could've been on of the greatest LH if he'd stuck to it but great accomplishment.

Cheers, Rodders

Coxy001 wrote:RJJ at #1?! Christ

Talented yes, a record oozing with the best of the best? Nope. FFS, I'd have Froch ahead of him! At least he has beaten a better calibre of fighter and didn't go on a bum of the month crusade. Toney - yes. Bhop - 5 years green. Erm.... Erm..... Run of the mill apart from that, admittedly in a poor division at the time.

Froch is more deserving of squeezing in the top 25. And I'm not on the wind up, my complete and utter contempt for Jones 'record' (or lack of when you think someone like Manny has Marquez, MAB, Morales, Cotto, Hatton, Bradley and co on it). When you put the records side by side with a big chunk of that list he hasn't got a pot to p!ss in!!

Hopkins, Toney then respectable names like Hill, Griffin. Titles from Middleweight to Heavy.

You're a joke on this subject.

Scottrf wrote:

Coxy001 wrote:RJJ at #1?! Christ

Talented yes, a record oozing with the best of the best? Nope. FFS, I'd have Froch ahead of him! At least he has beaten a better calibre of fighter and didn't go on a bum of the month crusade. Toney - yes. Bhop - 5 years green. Erm.... Erm..... Run of the mill apart from that, admittedly in a poor division at the time.

Froch is more deserving of squeezing in the top 25. And I'm not on the wind up, my complete and utter contempt for Jones 'record' (or lack of when you think someone like Manny has Marquez, MAB, Morales, Cotto, Hatton, Bradley and co on it). When you put the records side by side with a big chunk of that list he hasn't got a pot to p!ss in!!

Hopkins, Toney then respectable names like Hill, Griffin. Titles from Middleweight to Heavy.

You're a joke on this subject.

When you're padding a record out with such names as Bryont Brannon, Merqui Sosa, Richard Frazier and co it doesn't matter two jots in my eyes what titles he won. And he went up against one of the most woeful HW champs in history... If he'd fought and beat someone like Lewis then I wouldn't have the view that I do. As it stands he has a record full of average fighters barring Toney, a win that I obviously give him as he was the #1 P4P fighter.

He certainly isn't #1 on the list and you'd have to be a mad man to have him near it.

In 20 years time I'm not sure we'll be rating Abraham, Johnson, Groves above Hill and Griffin.

Coxy001 wrote:He certainly isn't #1 on the list and you'd have to be a mad man to have him near it.

Not even a fraction as mad as you'd have to be to try and argue that Froch ranks above him, though.

Will copy and paste what I've said about Jones' resume before. Not elite in terms of names but your take on it is basically a joke Coxy, as is more or less every comment you've ever posted about Jones.

Castro: Won a world title and defended if a few times in the years after losing to Jones, beating John David Jackson twice. Dominated and shut out by Jones.

Hopkins: Didn't lose for another twelve years after being beaten by Jones, was a world champion within the next two years.

Malinga: Beat Nigel Benn, dropped a controversial split decision to Eubank and went on to beat Robin Reid to become a world champion, but outclassed and knocked out in six by Jones (his first stoppage loss, and he didn't have another until he was forty-three).

Thomas Tate: Gives Julian Jackson, one of the greatest ko artists in history, a hell of a fight en route to losing a close decision, standing up to his legendary power well. Gets blasted out in two rounds by Jones, though - the only stoppage loss of his career.

Toney: Pound for pound number two at the time, in the best and most consistent form of his career, won world titles and a Ring Magazine 'Fighter of the Year' award in years to come - humiliated by Jones.

Griffin: Unbeaten, two wins over Toney (albeit one of them a bit dodgy) and dominated Michalczewski for three rounds before that contentious stoppage in the fourth - obliterated in one round by Jones in their rematch.

Hill: Only prior defeats had been close points losses to top fighters like Hearns and Michalczewski, and would go on to win another world title in years to come. Flattened inside four rounds by Jones.

Reggie Johnson: Two-weight titlist, beat good fighters like Steve Collins and supposedly can't-miss prospects like Parks and Guthrie with most of his losses to guys such as Castro, Toney and John David Jackson being questionable to say the least. Lost every minute of every round against Jones.

Hall: Good enough to give Michalczewski two very interesting scraps, but was on the end of one of the worst and most sustained beat downs you'll ever see against Jones.

Harding: Was able to beat good fighters such as a previously undefeated Tarver and Griffin. After some early problems, eventually figured out by Jones, has his main weapon taken away from him and is pulled out by his corner against Jones.

Harmon: Outscored Glen Johnson, was a mile ahead against Michalczewski before getting stopped, but lost every round against Jones before the corner retirement.

Gonzalez: Undefeated at the time, went on to beat Glen Johnson and then overthrow Michalczewski in Germany a couple of years later - dropped multiple times and dominated by Jones.

Woods: Would go on to win a world title later in his career and beat Gonzalez twice, but was well outclassed and stopped in six rounds (his only ever stoppage loss) against Jones.

That's all before beating Ruiz (not a great Heavy by any means, but it makes you wonder why a load of other Middles haven't ended up beating 230 pounders, given the plentitude of trash Heavyweight title holders we've had and given how much of a hype job Jones apparently was) and then reclaiming his old Light-Heavy title from Tarver in 2003.

But yeah, Froch is higher.

Wow was it really worth all that for Coxy ??

Coxy001 wrote:

When you're padding a record out with such names as Bryont Brannon, Merqui Sosa, Richard Frazier and co it doesn't matter two jots in my eyes what titles he won.

Ali's record is padded out with Coopman, Dunn and Wepner among others, he must have been rubbish as well. Comfortably one of the worst arguments I have ever seen on here.

Rowley wrote:

Coxy001 wrote:

When you're padding a record out with such names as Bryont Brannon, Merqui Sosa, Richard Frazier and co it doesn't matter two jots in my eyes what titles he won.

Ali's record is padded out with Coopman, Dunn and Wepner among others, he must have been rubbish as well. Comfortably one of the worst arguments I have ever seen on here.

To be honest I could have gone on, and on, and on with a shed load of the many other average guys he fought.

Bhop
Toney
Worst HW champ in history

Not much of a resume for me, just a Poopie load of average inbetween those fights.

He's not top 10 worthy, certainly not #1 and whoever thinks that should be taken to a darkened room and beaten.

Good luck in believing that Coxy.....

Could be lonely on that island..

But yeah, Froch is higher.

We can all tear or build up a fighters resume. You Chris have simply done the latter.

We could describe Arthur Abrahams as the "man who destroyed the ex undisputed MW champ Jermain Taylor, the man who destroyed Miranda in quicker time than the legendary Pavlik did" etc. etc. etc.

Lets get back to my original point: "RJJ at #1?! Christ". And yes I would have Froch above him. By the way, namedropping Clinton Woods (among quite a number of the guys you mentioned as being something they weren't i.e. quality) gave me a right good old chuckle.

If RJJ was Eastern European he'd be accused of beating up the same old rubbish like Wlad does. Because he was a drugged up yank there is a myth surrounding his record due to the incessant hype from the yanks media. And I'm assuming I can call him a drugs cheat as he failed a test for a steroid.

Does anyone on here seriously have him as #1?! I'll 100% fully admit I'll probably be on my own with Froch being above him, but #1? Someone take me out of the oven because I am effing done.

Clinton Woods beat a better Johnson than Froch did.

Scottrf wrote:Clinton Woods beat a better Johnson than Froch did.

I'm just hoping he's wumming for his sake !!..No one can be this much of an idiot !!..

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:

Scottrf wrote:Clinton Woods beat a better Johnson than Froch did.

I'm just hoping he's wumming for his sake !!..No one can be this much of an idiot !!..

Johnson sparked RJJ, ergo old Woody must've been injured or something to lose to RJJ bearing in mind he has a 1-1-1 record against someone that dealt with RJJ.

Froch will never make a list like this because he lost to a past his best Kessler. You don't make lists like this by losing to Kessler. Doesn't make it talent either.

Heart, guts and will is what he's got going for him and that's not enough.

Just highlighting the flaw in your 'Hopkins, Toney, naff all else' argument, Coxy. You presumably rate Froch's wins over Abraham, Taylor, Johnson etc so just enlightening you on some of Jones' other wins outside of Bernard and Fat Toney. It'd be a bit hypocritical of you to slate those wins given that they're easily comparable and in many cases better than the wins Froch has accumulated to make himself the better fighter in your eyes.

Moreover, I tried to highlight how much more dominant Jones was than his peers at his various weights, Heavyweight aside, throughout his career. Something Froch has never been. Jones wasn't just beating good fighters, he was totally embarrassing them. Someone like Calzaghe beating Kessler about 8-4 in rounds gets praised to the hilt, whereas if Jones at his peak had lost four rounds to a figher like Kessler it would have been deemed a questionable and underwhelming performance. Not a dig at Kessler at all, who was an excellent fighter, and not a dig at Calzaghe, either. Just highlighting the standards Jones set for himself and how he's judged by ridiculously agenda-ridden and unfair standards by those who clearly have it in for him.

You'll be rating Glen Catley ahead of him soon at this rate. Easy to say that Jones' completely dismantling and humiliating the opponents listed above was 'easy' or whatever you call it, but as you can see by how those 'bums' as you call them did against other leading Middles, Super-Middles and Light-Heavies of the day, it clearly isn't easy at all.

As for the overall list, will take a deeper look later. Mayweather, Whitaker and Jones are the solid top three for me, each with a claim to top spot albeit I'd go with Mayweather based on all factors. Lopez just too high, and to have him ahead of Whitaker is poor, for me. Pernell beat some of the best fighters in the world, regardless of weight. While he usually beat them very well, Lopez was simply beating the best Strawweights and Light-Flyweights, and there's no way I can have him as high as that considering some of the fights he didn't press for which were a) more appealing than the ones he was actually taking, and b) only required him to move up 3, or at the most 7 lb. He had over a decade to do it. Brilliant fighter and I'd say he's a great, but not that great.

Whitaker deserves to be higher for me but you can't exclude Pacquiao from the 606 holy trinity. His record is pretty astonishing.

I'd have put Pacquiao as a solid #4, Haz. Either Chavez or Hopkins next depending on your interpretation of the rules. If all things pre-1990 go out the window then of course you'd have to put Bernard above Julio. If you're allowing any fighter who showed at least some of their peak form at any stage after 1990 but still counted what they did before that point, then I might be more inclined to put Chavez in front.

88Chris05 wrote:I'd have put Pacquiao as a solid #4, Haz. Either Chavez or Hopkins next depending on your interpretation of the rules. If all things pre-1990 go out the window then of course you'd have to put Bernard above Julio. If you're allowing any fighter who showed at least some of their peak form at any stage after 1990 but still counted what they did before that point, then I might be more inclined to put Chavez in front.

That list was based only on work done after 1990 (otherwise Chavez would have to be way higher).

Top 5

1.Floyd
2.Jones
3.Whitaker
4.Manny
5.Hopkins