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Most avoided fighters of the last 25 years

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BoxingFan88
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Post by hazharrison Thu 25 Feb 2016, 10:10 am

Guillermo Rigondeaux

The Cuban maestro has simply been unable to land a marquee name since dominating Nonito Donaire in 2013. Subsequently stripped of alphabet belts (who ended up around the waist of a more marketable fighters) and now Ring Magazine’s belt as a result. Rival title holders such as Carl Frampton concede that ‘Rigo’ is the true champion at 122 lbs. Potentially the world's best fighter, Rigondeaux has been left to face British champion James Dickens (rated somewhere in the region of 70th in the world) on the undercard of Terry Flanagan vs Derry Mathews in Manchester.

Gennady Golovkin

The list of fighters reluctant or flat out rejecting a fight with Golovkin continues to grow. The last three linear champions: Sergio Martinez, Miguel Cotto and Saul Alvarez all chose to face naturally lighter men than their most obvious one contender. The likes of Felix Sturm, Julio Cesar Chavez Jr., Carl Froch and most recently, BJ Saunders have all rejected fight offers. Golovkin has stuck doggedly to his quest of unifying the middleweight division, yet may have to take on bigger men such as James DeGale, Gilberto Ramirez and Bernard Hopkins as his options at 160 run dry.

Roy Jones Jr.

In the mid-90s, Jones was so good, so other-worldly that he very quickly ran out of rivals at 168 lbs. In 1996, Jones was struggling for an opponent - resulting in the 39-year-old (possibly 40, 42 or 43 depending who you ask) Mike McCallum stepped up to the plate. Jones carried McCallum through twelve rounds before relocating to 175 lbs full-time in order to land more competitive fights.

Winky Wright

A left hander with a watertight defence, Wright struggled to land the big fights junior middleweight – leading trainer Dan Goossen to declare him the “most avoided” fighter he’d ever seen. After twice defeating Shane Mosley in 2004 at 154, Wright had to move up to middleweight and beyond to land bouts against the likes of Jermain Taylor, Bernard Hopkins and Felix Trinidad.

Paul Williams

In 2009, Williams was reduced to fighting Winky Wright - the other most avoided boxer around - in in order to land a TV date. A physical freak at 6' 1" with a 79" reach, Williams decalred himself willing to fight anyone from 147-to-160 lbs after defeating Antonio Margarito and avenging a loss to Carlos Quintana in emphatic fashion. A stunning knock-out loss to Sergio Martinez in 2010 appeared to send Williams on a downward spiral. He finally landed a marquee name in a PPV fight in 2012 – Saul Alvarez – only to suffer career-ending injuries in a motorcycle crash.

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Post by AdamT Thu 25 Feb 2016, 10:17 am

I think I feel more sorry for Rigo than anyone else. I also think GGG is being avoided like the plague.

Paul Williams was high risk, low reward. He looked a freak at Welter.

Winky Wright was one fighter, you would not want any part of, unless necessary. He was a great fighter about a decade ago. Even if you could beat him, you are hardly going to look great doing it.

Roy Jones was avoided at 168. Did Eubank not admit to avoiding him??

What about Lara? Can't see too many wanting to fight him.

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Post by Coxy001 Thu 25 Feb 2016, 10:30 am

Most avoided fighter: RJJ

Dear. Christ. Lord.

My dislike and rating view of him aside... And I know you're young Adam, but at the time DLH was credited with being 'the' guy to drag boxing through one of its darker eras. An era where the supposed best weren't fighting the best they could. RJJ doesn't fall in to that category and his list of C fighters he fought weren't due to him being avoided. Benn was desperate to fight him, Collins the same. Liles, Nunn etc. Obvious statement is that he was not exactly chasing fights and ended up happy with c rated guys, hence why boxing was credited to being dragged along by DLH due to his willingness to take on the best.

If anyone can hand on heart say that Roy was avoided like the plague I will pay the psychiatrist fees myself! Wink

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Post by AdamT Thu 25 Feb 2016, 10:32 am

He was at 168. Then I was young then, but I doubt Eubank wanted anything to do with him.

I think Rigo has been disgracefully avoided. Hopefully after Carl despatches with Quigg, he will fight Rigo.

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Post by Coxy001 Thu 25 Feb 2016, 10:34 am

Let's sub out RJJ for murderers row? Or in more modern times P-Will? Or Kell brook? Wink

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Post by hazharrison Thu 25 Feb 2016, 10:53 am

Coxy001 wrote:Most avoided fighter: RJJ

Dear. Christ. Lord.

My dislike and rating view of him aside... And I know you're young Adam, but at the time DLH was credited with being 'the' guy to drag boxing through one of its darker eras. An era where the supposed best weren't fighting the best they could. RJJ doesn't fall in to that category and his list of C fighters he fought weren't due to him being avoided. Benn was desperate to fight him, Collins the same. Liles, Nunn etc. Obvious statement is that he was not exactly chasing fights and ended up happy with c rated guys, hence why boxing was credited to being dragged along by DLH due to his willingness to take on the best.

If anyone can hand on heart say that Roy was avoided like the plague I will pay the psychiatrist fees myself! Wink

Benn declared an interest in fighting Jones in '95 after struggling to defeat Vinz Nardiello and Danny Perez. King wanted a three-fight option on Jones (so we know who he thought was going to win). Jones said he'd do a one-fight deal with no strings or options and King parked it. Benn fell apart soon after.

Liles was also with King - see above.

Jones was at '68 between '94 and '96. Nunn - another King fighter - had lost interest in the sport by this point. He sleepwalked to defeat to Steve Little and Frank Liles (the first of those was an audition to face Benn).

Collins wasn't on anyone's radar outside of the UK and Ireland in all honesty and Eubank was on record as saying he wouldn't fight someone (Jones) who had no apparent weakness.

Both Benn and Eubank were perfectly happy to continue their careers without James Toney (Nunn, the other belt holder was in the mix to face the winner of their rematch until the draw verdict voided the contract with King). And then Jones dominated Toney.

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Post by Rodney Thu 25 Feb 2016, 10:57 am

Coxy001 wrote:Most avoided fighter: RJJ

Dear. Christ. Lord.

My dislike and rating view of him aside... And I know you're young Adam, but at the time DLH was credited with being 'the' guy to drag boxing through one of its darker eras. An era where the supposed best weren't fighting the best they could. RJJ doesn't fall in to that category and his list of C fighters he fought weren't due to him being avoided. Benn was desperate to fight him, Collins the same. Liles, Nunn etc. Obvious statement is that he was not exactly chasing fights and ended up happy with c rated guys, hence why boxing was credited to being dragged along by DLH due to his willingness to take on the best.

If anyone can hand on heart say that Roy was avoided like the plague I will pay the psychiatrist fees myself! Wink

Not everybody with a meal ticket back in the day was really lining up to face him. It's easy to point the blame at Roy now, but the onus was on both he and his preferred opponent - points often overlooked today. Eubank said in his biography that he would never have fought Jones unless Jones was made his mandatory. He also said that if the fight had taken place it is "highly unlikley" that he would have won. However I do wish Roy Jones had thrown caution to the wind in his prime and decided to chase down all of the most dangerous opponents available from middleweight to heavyweight? He was good enough to beat them and would be a nailed on top 3 ATG imagined if he'd faced Fabriozio Tiozzi ,Sven Ottke ,Gerald Mcclellan, Nigel Benn,Chris Eubank ,Steve Collins ,Julian Jackson and Mike Tyson/Holyfield.

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Post by Coxy001 Thu 25 Feb 2016, 10:59 am

If he had Rodders I'm pretty sure my view on his record would be different.

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Post by ShahenshahG Thu 25 Feb 2016, 11:01 am

He'd probably also be dead

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Post by Coxy001 Thu 25 Feb 2016, 11:04 am

Tyson was 15 years past his 5 month peak by then Shah

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Post by ShahenshahG Thu 25 Feb 2016, 11:05 am

Holyfield?

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Post by ShahenshahG Thu 25 Feb 2016, 11:07 am

Lewis? Any fighter who wasn't just a decently schooled fighter with no great strengths would have splattered him.

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Post by ShahenshahG Thu 25 Feb 2016, 11:07 am

Up at heavy I mean

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Post by Rodney Thu 25 Feb 2016, 11:08 am

ShahenshahG wrote:Holyfield?

This was mooted after he boxed the lugs off Ruiz.

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Post by ShahenshahG Thu 25 Feb 2016, 11:10 am

Aye I wouldn't dispute that he would named in the same breath but I don't think he would have won that one.

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Post by Rodney Thu 25 Feb 2016, 11:14 am

ShahenshahG wrote:Aye I wouldn't dispute that he would named in the same breath but I don't think he would have won that one.

Holyfield was useful not fully spent *but almost in the early noughties. I think Jones Jnr would've started favourite after his showing against Ruiz and possibly against Tyson also around that time.

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Post by hazharrison Thu 25 Feb 2016, 11:24 am

Rodney wrote:
ShahenshahG wrote:Aye I wouldn't dispute that he would named in the same breath but I don't think he would have won that one.

Holyfield was useful not fully spent *but almost in the early noughties. I think Jones Jnr would've started favourite after his showing against Ruiz and possibly against Tyson also around that time.

Cheers, Rodders

The Tyson fight was being mooted, however, Jones's father - who was overly cautious with regard to his son's matchmaking early in his career - advised him not to fight Buster Douglas in 1998 because he'd be "risking his life". I think Ruiz was always a 'one fight and out' proposition for Roy in all honesty. I bet he couldn't believe his luck when Ruiz landed the WBA belt!

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Post by Rodney Thu 25 Feb 2016, 11:41 am

hazharrison wrote:
Rodney wrote:
ShahenshahG wrote:Aye I wouldn't dispute that he would named in the same breath but I don't think he would have won that one.

Holyfield was useful not fully spent *but almost in the early noughties. I think Jones Jnr would've started favourite after his showing against Ruiz and possibly against Tyson also around that time.

Cheers, Rodders

The Tyson fight was being mooted, however, Jones's father - who was overly cautious with regard to his son's matchmaking early in his career - advised him not to fight Buster Douglas in 1998 because he'd be "risking his life". I think Ruiz was always a 'one fight and out' proposition for Roy in all honesty. I bet he couldn't believe his luck when Ruiz landed the WBA belt!

Yeah I remember the Buster Douglas fight being on the table at one stage. Would've been interesting to see how Jones career would've panned out of he decided to stay up at HW. Bar the exception of the giants Lewis and Klitschko's he could've mixed it with some nice names, the Toney rematch at HW would've been a good watch
.
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Post by Lance Thu 25 Feb 2016, 11:56 am

Plenty of top fighters took on Winky.

Rigo has had decent fights, unfortunately nobody cares so he doesn't earn a great amount.

Rubbish analysis of RJJ.

GGG was offered a Sturm fight but rejected it. Some disagree with that chain of events but it's certainly not factual that Sturm avoided GGG. Canelo has had one fight at the weight, still time with BJS and Froch was weight above. Why do all the smaller guys like Cotto have to fight GGG, but GGG is given a green light to fight mismatched fighters for five years instead of stepping up?

Any why bother mentioning the other guys anyway? Another poorly disguised GGG article. Worse than D4 with Pacman




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Post by hazharrison Thu 25 Feb 2016, 12:26 pm

Lance wrote:Plenty of top fighters took on Winky.

Rigo has had decent fights, unfortunately nobody cares so he doesn't earn a great amount.

Rubbish analysis of RJJ.

GGG was offered a Sturm fight but rejected it. Some disagree with that chain of events but it's certainly not factual that Sturm avoided GGG. Canelo has had one fight at the weight, still time with BJS and Froch was weight above. Why do all the smaller guys like Cotto have to fight GGG, but GGG is given a green light to fight mismatched fighters for five years instead of stepping up?

Any why bother mentioning the other guys anyway? Another poorly disguised GGG article. Worse than D4 with Pacman




Plenty of top names took on Winky after the Mosley break-out wins, however, most of those came above 154 (and some once he was past his best – Williams and Quillin for example).

Winky was a road warrior during his peak years – fighting away from home until he landed the Vargas fight (which many felt at the time would have allowed him to break through against the major players). In fact, the Vargas performance has the opposite effect and he never got anywhere near a Vargas rematch or a fight with De la Hoya.

Do you have an alternative take on Jones?

Golovkin wasn’t ever offered a Sturm fight. In fact, he left Universum as a result of being made to play second fiddle to Sturm and Zbik. Golovkin was Sturm’s mandatory for years – allegedly Sturm paid Ahmet Oner a wad of cash to get himself elevated to “super champ” with the WBA to avoid a Golovkin fight.

I was actually thinking about Rigondeaux when I wrote it - his name has cropped up a lot this week during the Frampton-Quigg build up. His career has virtually been shut down because his more marketable rivals deem him too good to risk their titles against.

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Post by TRUSSMAN66 Thu 25 Feb 2016, 1:38 pm

Lance wrote:
Any why bother mentioning the other guys anyway? Another poorly disguised GGG article. Worse than D4 with Pacman




D4 could be subtle at times.

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Post by hazharrison Thu 25 Feb 2016, 1:53 pm

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:
Lance wrote:
Any why bother mentioning the other guys anyway? Another poorly disguised GGG article. Worse than D4 with Pacman




D4 could be subtle at times.

Thanks for the input. Probably one of your more lucid posts!

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Post by AdamT Thu 25 Feb 2016, 1:54 pm

I think it is clear to see, Rigondeaux is heavily avoided .

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Post by TRUSSMAN66 Thu 25 Feb 2016, 1:59 pm

Rigo brings no money to the table..

Not just boring but Cuban too....Fatal combination. .

But it's not about Rigo is it ??

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Post by TRUSSMAN66 Thu 25 Feb 2016, 2:09 pm

Reminds me of Nelson..Rigo..He was avoided too ask Mcguigan.

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Post by hazharrison Thu 25 Feb 2016, 2:19 pm

AdamT wrote:I think it is clear to see, Rigondeaux is heavily avoided .

He's the most avoided fighter in boxing. Santa Cruz bought out his own contract to avoid that fight! Carl Frampton is candid enough to admit that Rigondeaux is the best. These fighters aren't avoiding him because he's boring, or because he's Cuban, or because he doesn't draw - they're avoiding him because he's too good.


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Post by milkyboy Thu 25 Feb 2016, 2:51 pm

It's a bit of both. If he was american and called Floyd, they'd be queuing up to lose to him for the pay check. As it is, they likely lose... in a fight that is likely not fan friendly, and get paid no more than they would for fighting a stiff.

Risk reward. That's the whole premise of matchmaking. He's all risk no reward. Is it unfair? absolutely.

Interesting to read the GGG interview... assuming the translator didn't take too many liberties/make it all up for a laugh. He doesn't seem to think fighters really duck him.... it's all just promoter games.

The vast majority of fighters are pawns in the game.

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Post by hazharrison Thu 25 Feb 2016, 3:05 pm

I've said that previously: fighters don't tend to duck fighters. Unless they have the autonomy over their careers that Floyd had, then usually, it's the promotional team who call the shots.


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Post by TRUSSMAN66 Thu 25 Feb 2016, 3:08 pm

milkyboy wrote:It's a bit of both. If he was american and called Floyd, they'd be queuing up to lose to him for the pay check. As it is, they likely lose... in a fight that is likely not fan friendly, and get paid no more than they would for fighting a stiff.

Risk reward. That's the whole premise of matchmaking. He's all risk no reward. Is it unfair? absolutely.

Interesting to read the GGG interview... assuming the translator didn't take too many liberties/make it all up for a laugh. He doesn't seem to think fighters really duck him.... it's all just promoter games.

The vast majority of fighters are pawns in the game.

I think GGG's handlers are superb businessmen...............Earn top dollar fighting crap and blame it on being ducked.......

This site shows plenty of gullible idiots will lap it up.....

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Post by BoxingFan88 Thu 25 Feb 2016, 3:20 pm

If you don't think the rest of the division is ducking GGG then I don't know what to say.

He is the best fighter in the division and he will KO the rest

Haters gonna hate

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Post by RanjitPatel Thu 25 Feb 2016, 3:20 pm

Nice to see the GGG interview comments popping up everywhere but the thread I made. Times are hard.

Haven't seen it mentioned anywhere on here but Kiko is fighting Santa Cruz this weekend too at featherweight. Could be a good one. Always thought Frampton would beat Santa Cruz but SC really impressed me in his last fight. Showed skills I didn't know he had.

Kell Brook for avoided? Takes 2 to make the fights but I can't fathom that he can't find better opponents than the ones he's fought recently.

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Post by TRUSSMAN66 Thu 25 Feb 2016, 3:21 pm

BoxingFan88 wrote:

Haters gonna hate

Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes


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Post by RanjitPatel Thu 25 Feb 2016, 3:23 pm

Golovkin would beat every single middleweight out there and they all know it. Jacobs and Saunders won't even entertain the idea. They've got a belt each now and can make some money fighting lesser fighters.

Why lose that for a guaranteed loss?

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Post by TRUSSMAN66 Thu 25 Feb 2016, 3:26 pm

RanjitPatel wrote:Nice to see the GGG interview comments popping up everywhere but the thread I made. Times are hard.

Haven't seen it mentioned anywhere on here but Kiko is fighting Santa Cruz this weekend too at featherweight. Could be a good one. Always thought Frampton would beat Santa Cruz but SC really impressed me in his last fight. Showed skills I didn't know he had.

Kell Brook for avoided? Takes 2 to make the fights but I can't fathom that he can't find better opponents than the ones he's fought recently.

We are in the era of milking......All about PPV numbers.......

Cleverley - Bellew opened many eyes as to what the general sports fan will fork out for over here.....

If you have an investment why not protect it...

I can understand it....Just don't blame everybody else though when you've been protecting it for five and a half years....

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Post by TRUSSMAN66 Thu 25 Feb 2016, 3:27 pm

Yes the lesser fighters all fancy their chances and the cream think they'll get hammered...


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Post by milkyboy Thu 25 Feb 2016, 3:28 pm

RanjitPatel wrote:Nice to see the GGG interview comments popping up everywhere but the thread I made. Times are hard.

Feeling guilty, I've now sucked up to you on your thread Very Happy

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Post by Coxy001 Thu 25 Feb 2016, 3:29 pm

Lineal MW "champ" chooses blown up LW who hasn't won a big fight at WW to fight for the MW title.... Yet the man at MW doesn't get a look in and Canelo doesn't exactly sound like he's biting at the bit to get it on with him.

And it takes some sort of idiot to label others as idiots yet presses the whinge button when someone calls him an idiot.

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Post by TRUSSMAN66 Thu 25 Feb 2016, 3:31 pm

Coxy001 wrote:Lineal MW "champ" chooses blown up LW who hasn't won a big fight at WW to fight for the MW title.... Yet the man at MW doesn't get a look in and Canelo doesn't exactly sound like he's biting at the bit to get it on with him.

And it takes some sort of idiot to label others as idiots yet presses the whinge button when someone calls him an idiot.

I don't waste my time with you....You know that. Cool

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Post by RanjitPatel Thu 25 Feb 2016, 3:33 pm

Golovkin would beat every single middleweight out there and they all know it. Jacobs and Saunders won't even entertain the idea. They've got a belt each now and can make some money fighting lesser fighters.

Why lose that for a guaranteed loss?

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Post by RanjitPatel Thu 25 Feb 2016, 3:34 pm

Don't know why that's repeated.

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Post by TRUSSMAN66 Thu 25 Feb 2016, 3:37 pm

RanjitPatel wrote:Don't know why that's repeated.

If that's irony.....Remember I don't understand it !!.. Cool

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Post by RanjitPatel Thu 25 Feb 2016, 3:40 pm

It's not fella. I wrote a new comment but that one got posted. Reposting the same thing could have been misconstrued as having a pop (somehow knowing this forum) so just wanted to explain.

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Post by hazharrison Thu 25 Feb 2016, 3:44 pm

Coxy001 wrote:Lineal MW "champ" chooses blown up LW who hasn't won a big fight at WW to fight for the MW title.... Yet the man at MW doesn't get a look in and Canelo doesn't exactly sound like he's biting at the bit to get it on with him.

And it takes some sort of idiot to label others as idiots yet presses the whinge button when someone calls him an idiot.

Does he report people when they give him some back? Ha, that's hilarious.

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Post by TRUSSMAN66 Thu 25 Feb 2016, 3:57 pm

hazharrison wrote:
Coxy001 wrote:Lineal MW "champ" chooses blown up LW who hasn't won a big fight at WW to fight for the MW title.... Yet the man at MW doesn't get a look in and Canelo doesn't exactly sound like he's biting at the bit to get it on with him.

And it takes some sort of idiot to label others as idiots yet presses the whinge button when someone calls him an idiot.

Does he report people when they give him some back? Ha, that's hilarious.

Small minds and all that... Rolling Eyes


More than happy for anybody to believe I'd waste my time reporting a troll to the mods..


Last edited by TRUSSMAN66 on Thu 25 Feb 2016, 4:06 pm; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : ....)

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Post by shenglong2015 Thu 25 Feb 2016, 4:33 pm

Ryu

In the old days people would have selected Ryu and lost just to have him out of the equation, rather than fight a computer version of him.

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Post by TRUSSMAN66 Thu 25 Feb 2016, 4:42 pm

Blame it on Ryu

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Post by shenglong2015 Thu 25 Feb 2016, 4:43 pm

Its about time he took some of the blame, it started with him.

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Post by ShahenshahG Thu 25 Feb 2016, 4:52 pm

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pcMNzxeArRc

Peace, Love and chill out

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Post by catchweight Thu 25 Feb 2016, 7:04 pm

I used to have sympathy for Rigondeaux but the guy is his own worst enemy. They have given some opponents and the chance to put in a show but its like he deliberately tries to bore the crowd. Whilst undoubtadly a quality boxer, I have never been over sold on his infallibility. Partly because he seems pretty fragile so a good boxer with a decent punch should always be in with a shout.

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Post by Lance Fri 26 Feb 2016, 6:06 am

The Donaire fight was far less one sided than many care to remember. Not like Rigo is untouchable. But there were some awful rounds there too. I'm a fan of Hopkins and Winky so I don't mind tactical fights, but some rounds Rigo just stops the fight altogether.

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