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An Evening with...

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Post by Guest on Wed 05 Oct 2016, 1:30 pm

First topic message reminder :

Sugar Ray Leonard - November 28th Richard Dunn Sports Centre, Bradford.

Tickets £20 - VIP tickets £40 (including photo with Sugar Ray

Organized by MJK Sports events

Some of you may be interested although may not be prepared to travel to Bradford!!

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Post by hazharrison on Fri 21 Oct 2016, 5:18 pm

milkyboy wrote:
hazharrison wrote:
milkyboy wrote:
Atila wrote:
milkyboy wrote:
Atila wrote:Then haven't you been conned? You're supposed to score the whole round, and how long a fighter has been out of the ring shouldn't affect your judgement.

Fighters are taught to finish the round strongly to impress the judges in a close round , but ultimately I agree, you should score the whole round or you've been conned.

I scored the whole rounds. Thought Leonard won enough of them. Two judges gave credible cards, one lost the plot.

Leonard's a divisive figure and plenty of cards in both directions probably reflect personal like or dislike for him as well as personal taste in what you favour in close rounds. Hagler offered pressure and workrate, Leonard offered more moments of quality.

I agree with haz, that if you didn't know who they were you'd likely see a close fight. I'd suggest that if you swapped hearns for Leonard it probably wouldn't be seen as so controversial - just a close fight and somebody gets the decision.

I think I may have made my opinions on the mcilvanney piece known once or twice before... Possibly three times Whistle
Myself, I'd suggest that if it wasn't for Leonard's layoff, he wouldn't have got the decision. He threw less but landed a mere 15 more punches over the fight, but somehow, according some posters it was an easy fight to score for Leonard?

Here's a wild theory of mine. Very Happy If Hagler did blow the first 4 rounds as I constantly hear, it's quite possible that that's were Leonard's 15 punch advantage was made. Hagler might very well have outlanded Leonard during the rest of the fight.

If anyone has a link or any info on the punchstats for this fight that were done round by round, please post it.

Think you underlined my point there. Everyone who thinks hagler won has a theory on why Leonard got the decision, but most of the same people saw a close fight. Why does there have to be a reason, other than two judges who saw the same fight as most of us, who favoured different things... And one who was erm, a bit blinkered.

Larry Merchant cracked a great line when he said Leonard stole the fight, legitimately stole the fight.

Caught an ESPN doc the other day (looking for those punch stats) where Leonard claimed to have taken Hagler out to dinner after the Mugabi fight. Real old pals act. He then managed to get Hagler to admit he no longer had it anymore, admit that he cut too easily and had lost his mojo - at which point he made the fight. Can that possibly be true? That's brinksmanship on another level!

Well he certainly said it! You'd imagine it probably helped Marv get his mojo back for their fight. Don't imagine he lacked desire for the fight... Just the legs maybe.

SRL reckons he was half cut in that press conference where he invited hagler along for a big announcement.. and then retired... Claims he didn't actually know what he was going to say. Who knows, he obviously wasn't in a great place at that time!

I quite like the story about almost getting starched by Quincy Taylor in sparring and changing his strategy from standing his ground to sticking and moving at the last minute. Best punch he ever took he says.

Who needs to go to 'the evening with' we've heard all the stories already!

Think Quincy Taylor ended up as a delivery driver. Useless fact of the day.

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Post by Atila on Wed 30 Nov 2016, 10:27 am

Well, who went to this evening with Ray Leonard? If anyone went, how was it?

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Post by milkyboy on Wed 30 Nov 2016, 10:47 am

I went, haz went. By the time 250 people had their photos taken with him and they'd auctioned a bunch of stuff, he wasn't in the ring telling stories for long. You could bid for two minutes of pad work with him, which was pretty cool for the 4 lads that did it.

He had a permanent smile and looked in pretty good shape for 60. You'd have left hating him even more Atila. We're such a thing possible!

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Post by hazharrison on Wed 30 Nov 2016, 11:10 am

I changed my Hagler-Leonard score to 115-113 SRL after seeing him.

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Post by Atila on Wed 30 Nov 2016, 11:11 am

hazharrison wrote:I changed my Hagler-Leonard score to 115-113 SRL after seeing him.
Traitor.

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Post by milkyboy on Wed 30 Nov 2016, 11:15 am

hazharrison wrote:I changed my Hagler-Leonard score to 115-113 SRL after seeing him.
Quiet beating? What quiet beating? I never saw one.

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Post by hazharrison on Wed 30 Nov 2016, 11:16 am

Atila wrote:
hazharrison wrote:I changed my Hagler-Leonard score to 115-113 SRL after seeing him.
Traitor.

Ha! It was pretty awesome to get a pic with him and just see him in the flesh. Routine was well rehearsed and his brain is sharp as a tack. After the mere mention of Hagler received applause, Ray was quick to start praising him as "the greatest middleweight in history". Still knows how to make an audience dance to his tune.

They're talking about doing a Fab Four tour over here. That would be pretty cool.


Last edited by hazharrison on Wed 30 Nov 2016, 11:17 am; edited 1 time in total

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Post by hazharrison on Wed 30 Nov 2016, 11:16 am

milkyboy wrote:
hazharrison wrote:I changed my Hagler-Leonard score to 115-113 SRL after seeing him.
Quiet beating? What quiet beating? I never saw one.

Ha. Quiet beating? Quiet shmeating.

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Post by milkyboy on Wed 30 Nov 2016, 11:17 am

Just occurred to me Atila, for about £150 you could have two minutes in the ring with Leonard... a chance to try and lamp him with a clean shot....


... do what Marvin couldn't.


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Post by AdamT on Wed 30 Nov 2016, 11:19 am

What makes the Ray win even more awesome, is the inactivity.

Surely the greatest MW in history doesn't lose to an inactive Welter, no matter how great.

Though Marvin definitely is one of the greatest!

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Post by hazharrison on Wed 30 Nov 2016, 11:28 am

AdamT wrote:What makes the Ray win even more awesome, is the inactivity.

Surely the greatest MW in history doesn't lose to an inactive Welter, no matter how great.

Though Marvin definitely is the greatest!

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Post by AdamT on Wed 30 Nov 2016, 11:30 am

hazharrison wrote:
AdamT wrote:What makes the Ray win even more awesome, is the inactivity.

Surely the greatest MW in history doesn't lose to an inactive Welter, no matter how great.

Though Marvin definitely is the greatest!

How is he the greatest? I would be interested to hear your take. I am not going to criticize, but I can't see it. He struggled with smaller fighters and couldn't beat the second best Welter ever. The best Lightweight in recent memory also pushed him all the way.

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Post by milkyboy on Wed 30 Nov 2016, 11:34 am

hazharrison wrote:
Atila wrote:
hazharrison wrote:I changed my Hagler-Leonard score to 115-113 SRL after seeing him.
Traitor.

Ha! It was pretty awesome to get a pic with him and just see him in the flesh. Routine was well rehearsed and his brain is sharp as a tack. After the mere mention of Hagler received applause, Ray was quick to start praising him as "the greatest middleweight in history". Still knows how to make an audience dance to his tune.

They're talking about doing a Fab Four tour over here. That would be pretty cool.

Yes, praise the guys you beat as the best ever!

It's interesting he accepts hearns beat him in the return, doesnt say that about the hagler fight.... but is also pretty non-committal... with his cryptic responses about 'it's not what the judges say, it's how you feel when you look in the mirror' (paraphrasing) I.e. He felt like a winner because he was proud of his performance but if others feel he lost the fight he's fine with that.

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Post by hazharrison on Wed 30 Nov 2016, 12:14 pm

milkyboy wrote:
hazharrison wrote:
Atila wrote:
hazharrison wrote:I changed my Hagler-Leonard score to 115-113 SRL after seeing him.
Traitor.

Ha! It was pretty awesome to get a pic with him and just see him in the flesh. Routine was well rehearsed and his brain is sharp as a tack. After the mere mention of Hagler received applause, Ray was quick to start praising him as "the greatest middleweight in history". Still knows how to make an audience dance to his tune.

They're talking about doing a Fab Four tour over here. That would be pretty cool.

Yes, praise the guys you beat as the best ever!

It's interesting he accepts hearns beat him in the return, doesnt say that about the hagler fight.... but is also pretty non-committal... with his cryptic responses about 'it's not what the judges say, it's how you feel when you look in the mirror' (paraphrasing) I.e. He felt like a winner because he was proud of his performance but if others feel he lost the fight he's fine with that.

Leonard has peace of mind - he doesn't care what anyone thinks.

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Post by Hammersmith harrier on Wed 30 Nov 2016, 12:20 pm

Leonard has always come across with class when he's commentating or on chat shows and there's no denying his greatness; Benitez, Duran, Hearns and Hagler is almost unmatched as a quartet of wins.

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Post by milkyboy on Wed 30 Nov 2016, 12:25 pm

Let's hope Marv feels the same, and it's just s bunch of old farts on the internet who still get hung up on it!

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Post by AdamT on Wed 30 Nov 2016, 12:45 pm

Marv is very bitter about the defeat. Maybe he believes he won. Though I think he is kicking himself, because deep down he knows he didn't do enough and shouldn't of lost the fight.

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Post by hazharrison on Wed 30 Nov 2016, 12:54 pm

AdamT wrote:Marv is very bitter about the defeat. Maybe he believes he won. Though I think he is kicking himself, because deep down he knows he didn't do enough and shouldn't of lost the fight.

Well, you do know him best Adam...

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Post by Atila on Wed 30 Nov 2016, 7:00 pm

milkyboy wrote:I went, haz went. By the time 250 people had their photos taken with him and they'd auctioned a bunch of stuff, he wasn't in the ring telling stories for long. You could bid for two minutes of pad work with him, which was pretty cool for the 4 lads that did it.

He had a permanent smile and looked in pretty good shape for 60. You'd have left hating him even more Atila. We're such a thing possible!
I don't hate anybody in this world, not even you Milky.

Seriously though, it sounds like you and Haz had a good time. Pleased for you both. OK

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Post by AdamT on Wed 30 Nov 2016, 8:08 pm

Look at the jig and the body language after the fight. He looked like a man that lost. Ray Leonard won that fight.


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Post by milkyboy on Wed 30 Nov 2016, 8:27 pm

Atila wrote:
milkyboy wrote:I went, haz went. By the time 250 people had their photos taken with him and they'd auctioned a bunch of stuff, he wasn't in the ring telling stories for long. You could bid for two minutes of pad work with him, which was pretty cool for the 4 lads that did it.

He had a permanent smile and looked in pretty good shape for 60. You'd have left hating him even more Atila. We're such a thing possible!
I don't hate anybody in this world, not even you Milky.  

Seriously though, it sounds like you and Haz had a good time. Pleased for you both. OK

You don't hate anybody? Not even DJ Steve wright with his big show and factoids? I admire people at peace with themselves like you Atila...  You can't call a fight, but I admire you regardless Wink

We're getting all philosophical and Adam is trying his hardest to rake over old coals. Adam, we don't care it was just a fight.  Whistle

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