Ulster Rugby 2017-2018 Part 2

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Ulster Rugby

Final Table
               GP   Points
Leinster    21     70
Scarlets    21     70
Edinburgh 21     68
Ulster       21     62
Benetton   21     55
Dragons    21     20
Kings        21     11

Season Outcome: Playoff for Champions Cup Spot

Ulster are in the Champions Cup

No9 wrote:
So I have a opinion and I’m a prat. Well, as we are throwing insults, guess that makes you a tw@t.
As for you thinking it was a neck rolll, suggest you don’t waste your money at Specsavers, but apply straight away for a guide dog.

Ulster where very lucky with the final interception, or that could have gone the other way. As for the referee, he was shocking. In the last 10 mins or so, every time Ospreys attacked, Ulster was offside, but got away with it. I need to reload at the final interception but would be surprised if Stockdale was offside. But eh, why let the laws get in the way when you can have Irish refs.. oops. Not supposed to criticise or have an opposing opinion to do with Irish rugby am I, that makes me a prat

No you're a prat for making stuff up, calling what AWJs did a non neck roll is laughable and claiming that Ulster got all the decisions is a joke. Ospreys were constantly offside and it went unpunished, Deysel was pinged for hands in the ruck when Ospreys failed to clear him out yet AWJs went back in after being cleared out and wasn't penalised. So much for getting all the decisions, not to mention Timoneys try being ruled out

Ospreys got into the Ulster half once, maybe twice in the second half of the game? If Ulster had kicked 50% of their penalties they'd be 15 points up. The only time Ospreys tried to attack they threw a pass to nowhere which Stockdale pounced on.

You can argue about the ref all you like but Ulster did everything but score. To steal the sentiment from a few Planet Rugby posters - Leinster or Scarlets would have put 40 points on Ospreys last night.

Brace was poor and there were decisions which would have baffled both teams. If it was football, he would probably have been stood down this week after his error in the Treviso v Dragons game, that Greg Garner has said was a strange decision. Again it comes back to the fact that a lot of referees are not up to scratch, but are forced to take charge of games that they probably shouldn't be doing.

Ospreys were poor last night too. It did say a lot that Ulster were comfortable with a 3-0 lead and didn't have to build any more of a score.

I been here long enough to know if it walks like a duck, talks like a duck its a duck.
If it posts like a prat, has the objectivity of a prat its a prat.
You sir are a prat.

That as clear a neck role as you will see - the arms were round the neck and the players was rolled.
the referee was poor but poor for both sides and to claim Ulster got all the decisions is an equally stupid claim
I've been on this planet too long to waste myself talking to idiots

Who will we get as a 10. Lealifano is a 12 so I dont think he is a great call. We could buy Sopoaga off wasps, very unlikely. Maybe Quade Cooper will come.
Joey Carberry maybe, Leinster messing him around

we need an established 10 which Carbery is not. Great talent but if we are having a 10 learn on the job it may as well be one of our own youngsters and not someone who will be looking down the road in a year or two

Just wondering off the top of my head, what fly halves are available? I'm not sure if I want carberry. He's a cracking talent but I almost want a seasoned pro who can control the game. I would like someone like Steenson. Exeter have brought through a a young fly half Simmonds under his tuition. He could do the same for ulster with mcphillips.

The IRFU will want to get Carberry as much gametime at 10 as possible before the RWC Cullen and Lancaster have a spine and obviously have their own ideas about their pecking order. I wouldn't want Carberry now as a seasoned pro would be much better and also the IRFU can F right off to be honest. I've always put Ulster just before Ireland but now there's no competition, not even close. I'd like to see only what's best for Ulster for now on.

I have no clue who is available but i say again we could do a lot worse than Lealiafano again. He isnt a ten i get that but he is vastly experienced and given the reason why we are looking he appears to be a person of tremendous integrity. Sopoaga would have been teriffic obviously and even Ihaia West could have done a job albeit possibly light on the experience front.

As it stands i honestly dont know but Steenson wont be back i dont know. Barrett or Pollard could do a job i suppose or Richie Mo'unga.

Carbery has said a flat no.
IRFU may want it but he has dug his heels in

Lealiafano is probably our best bet at this stage, if he is interested, which I understand he may well be.
Him and a credible LH are all I can see us signing at this stage - as that would fill up out NIQ (assumes Dooley also not interested in heading North and that one has gone quiet also)

Steenson will never play for Ulster

Maybe Bank of Ireland will stump up some cash to buy out someones contract since they've shafted everybody

We'd kill for Lealiifano back.

We could play him at 10 for big games. 12 for lesser games, with McPhillips at 10. We literally wouldn't want him playing too much either so that'd suit everyone well (he'd be playing non-stop for 2 years if that was the case).

I'm sure he was well paid when he was here last time. He's a media darling, a top bloke on and off the pitch ...... you really couldn't find a better fit to come and help us out.

https://www.smh.com.au/sport/rugby-union/super-rugby-christian-lealiifano-helps-act-brumbies-flyhalf-wharenui-hawera-reach-next-level-20180318-h0xmkt.html

I mean there's an article literally saying the same thing. Lealiifano supporting from 12 the new Brumbies 10.

It would also improve our depth at centre which isnt what it was

Standulstermen wrote:It would also improve our depth at centre which isnt what it was

Indeed. An injury to McCloskey and we've got ........ move Cave or Marshall?

This isn't great, to recruit a NIQ fly half the worse time in a WC year, the best next year after the WC.

Which means we may get an interm FH or develop McP and hope to get a quality one after the WC, which again makes another bedding in period.

This year give new coach time to settle, next year give new FH time to bed in.

I don't know for first time in years I'm really down about Ulster and the future.

If Logan goes, a top coach comes in, and we do get quality players in the positions needed and not stop gaps. I would feel positive again, but I don't think that will happen. I actually think it would be good if Teviso overtook us, I kinda hope they do.

It would be great for the league. but more importantly the challenge cup may serve us better next year. Let a coach bed in and for the first half of the season concentrate on the league. Lets be fair the big players can be rested for group stage Challenge cup games which will give younger players more games and keep the bigger ones fresher for the league.

If things go well we have a realistic chance of silverware, which would be a big confidence boost for a new coaches first year.

Redman wrote:

Standulstermen wrote:It would also improve our depth at centre which isnt what it was

Indeed.  An injury to McCloskey and we've got ........ move Cave or Marshall?

Allinson

geoff999rugby wrote:

Redman wrote:

Standulstermen wrote:It would also improve our depth at centre which isnt what it was

Indeed.  An injury to McCloskey and we've got ........ move Cave or Marshall?

Allinson

Ah yes. But as a utility back I had it in my head he was a 13 who could cover wing and fullback. Is he playing 12 regularly?

Planet Rugby are saying Larkham is the implication for interviews. Rated as a young coach but a hell of a job to step into without a lot of experience. If true, would suggest Bryn stepping up to DoR you'd have to think.

That'll explain KOTH's comments

Actually I take that back. Reading about his coaching credentials I'm actually starting to wonder why he'd come to Ulster. He's the current Aussie national backs/attack coach, working for Cheika. Google talk that he was being lined up to take over Cheika .... maybe that's changed?

everything will be coming from the UAFC. The only thing he said definitively was that nucifora didnt interview the three frontrunners. If there was good news i imagine they would have released it

For what its worth....

https://www.change.org/p/ulster-rugby-shane-logan-to-resign-from-ulster-rugby-with-immediate-effect?utm_medium=email&utm_source=petition_signer_receipt&utm_campaign=triggered&j=296089&sfmc_sub=33280048&l=32_HTML&u=53444679&mid=7233052&jb=613107

The idiot inititially included a picture of Jackson and Olding and the spiel included a bit about them. Thankfully he wised up and realised he would get more signatures if he just kept it general and spoke of Logan's general ineptitude.

Still though, His title doesn't make it very clear it's a petition and reads more like a news headline.

Something to cheer everyone up

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-43784682

Redman wrote:Actually I take that back.  Reading about his coaching credentials I'm actually starting to wonder why he'd come to Ulster.  He's the current Aussie national backs/attack coach, working for Cheika.  Google talk that he was being lined up to take over Cheika .... maybe that's changed?

Why wouldn't he?

He has 3 years as head coach of the Brumbies, might be considered insufficient for the top job. Given where the Wallabies are at and where Ulster are it might be a good opportunity to show what he can do as a coach and lay a marker down

Let's face it, there's surely no way he could make the team any worse. Win Win.

Sounds like a challenge Pete, Im sure Logan would be happy to find someone to prove you wrong

Imagine to arrogance to say "My position is not at risk". After your public promise for world domination fell flat on its arse. Right in the midst of Ulster Rugby at an all time low. Refusing to step out and face the fans who deserve answers. Publicly burying two young men and branding them persona non grata after the Ulster committee voting 10-2 against him in letting them stay. Where are Shane Logan's Christian values of humility and forgiveness? Ulster cannot begin any kind of healing process until the spineless, arrogant liar Shane Logan is gone.

marty2086 wrote:Sounds like a challenge Pete, Im sure Logan would be happy to find someone to prove you wrong

Don't jinx it Marty, you know how easily that could come true

We're not already jinxed?

I think things are looking pretty good, not sure what all the fuss is about.

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/paddy-jackson-will-never-play-for-ireland-again-says-ulster-rugby-head-1.3463699

It is fitting how the Irish Times have interpreted the words of Shane Logan, considering they are the self-appointed ‘Matthew Hopkins’ of this witch hunt. This organisation allegedly telephoned dozens of people in any way connected to the story demanding statements and making clear that a ‘no comment’ response would be published in the most negative light they could spin it.
The manipulation of words in their headline is not something they are usually adept at, but in this case there is a world of difference between ‘Paddy Jackson will never play for Ireland again’ and what Logan actually said “That is not something that is being envisaged”.  So at least the IT are reinforcing where they stand by doing their best to ensure the public will never envisage Paddy in green in the future tense and not just the present one.

Logan had lost credibility with hard core supporters some time ago due to his lack of rugby empathy and his penchant to only surface for the cameras in fair weather. His platitudes and grand statements lost all weight over time, as they proved to have little basis in reality, and his leadership in times of crisis notable by its absence. He is often referred to as the invisible man, but undoubtedly there is a much larger invisible man behind him orchestrating his moves. He appears to be such a puppet of the IRFU that he is often photographed in semi-darkness in case someone notices the strings. He can confidently say “My position is not at risk”, or rather his Godfather can.

It is therefore completely understandable that he followed the IRFU script to the letter, “No sponsor including Bank of Ireland drove the decision” and  neither money nor pressure from sponsors drove the decision – pull the other one. In the next breath he says they took on board the views of “our sponsor group”, thus playing with semantics between “drove the decision” and “taken on board”.
“We have taken on board everybody’s views right across society, right across our supporter group, our sponsor group, our players, clubs, volunteers, we are part of society.” Fair enough but how many were listened to? The branch vote was 10-2 in favour of reinstatement, and the fans petition was also in favour, as were the URSC, so was it only the sponsor group that were listened to and maybe the Dublin media?

“But at the end of the day, having looked at all those things, the decision was based on alignment with what it is we stand for, in particular the value of respect.
Does saying one thing and doing another indicate the “value of respect”? If respect was in any way important, why has Craig Gilroy not suffered the same fate? Could it be that the IRFU don’t actually consider his comments undermine the value of respect as they define it, and he is only still in the system because they didn’t want another big bill to buy him out when no one was calling for it?

Logan is calling for the fans to unite behind the team, but the team is more than just the players on the pitch. The values of integrity and respect are instilled into the culture of an organisation right from the top. The IRFU have thrown Jackson and Olding on the scrapheap hoping it masks their failings to instil the very values they now supposedly embrace. Who are they trying to fool? They deserve no respect for their faux integrity and hollow words.

Well said Aukster, not only Gilroy though where were the values when they first resigned Wilson then kept him on board after he was convicted of drink driving for a second time? What about when Herron was convicted?

The Great Aukster wrote:https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/paddy-jackson-will-never-play-for-ireland-again-says-ulster-rugby-head-1.3463699

It is fitting how the Irish Times have interpreted the words of Shane Logan, considering they are the self-appointed ‘Matthew Hopkins’ of this witch hunt. This organisation allegedly telephoned dozens of people in any way connected to the story demanding statements and making clear that a ‘no comment’ response would be published in the most negative light they could spin it.
The manipulation of words in their headline is not something they are usually adept at, but in this case there is a world of difference between ‘Paddy Jackson will never play for Ireland again’ and what Logan actually said “That is not something that is being envisaged”.  So at least the IT are reinforcing where they stand by doing their best to ensure the public will never envisage Paddy in green in the future tense and not just the present one.

Logan had lost credibility with hard core supporters some time ago due to his lack of rugby empathy and his penchant to only surface for the cameras in fair weather. His platitudes and grand statements lost all weight over time, as they proved to have little basis in reality, and his leadership in times of crisis notable by its absence. He is often referred to as the invisible man, but undoubtedly there is a much larger invisible man behind him orchestrating his moves. He appears to be such a puppet of the IRFU that he is often photographed in semi-darkness in case someone notices the strings. He can confidently say “My position is not at risk”, or rather his Godfather can.

It is therefore completely understandable that he followed the IRFU script to the letter, “No sponsor including Bank of Ireland drove the decision” and  neither money nor pressure from sponsors drove the decision – pull the other one. In the next breath he says they took on board the views of “our sponsor group”, thus playing with semantics between “drove the decision” and “taken on board”.
“We have taken on board everybody’s views right across society, right across our supporter group, our sponsor group, our players, clubs, volunteers, we are part of society.” Fair enough but how many were listened to? The branch vote was 10-2 in favour of reinstatement, and the fans petition was also in favour, as were the URSC, so was it only the sponsor group that were listened to and maybe the Dublin media?

“But at the end of the day, having looked at all those things, the decision was based on alignment with what it is we stand for, in particular the value of respect.
Does saying one thing and doing another indicate the “value of respect”? If respect was in any way important, why has Craig Gilroy not suffered the same fate? Could it be that the IRFU don’t actually consider his comments undermine the value of respect as they define it, and he is only still in the system because they didn’t want another big bill to buy him out when no one was calling for it?

Logan is calling for the fans to unite behind the team, but the team is more than just the players on the pitch. The values of integrity and respect are instilled into the culture of an organisation right from the top. The IRFU have thrown Jackson and Olding on the scrapheap hoping it masks their failings to instil the very values they now supposedly embrace. Who are they trying to fool? They deserve no respect for their faux integrity and hollow words.

Well said. 100% agree.

When you look at some of the great European sports clubs - like Barca ("més que un club") Bayern ("mia sans mia"), even Munster - there is a symbiotic relationship between the fans and the team/club. There is a bond that is so inseparable that, in times of crisis, the club actually grows in strength. Weak, superficial clubs become divided and distracted - strong clubs circle the wagons and adopt an "us against the world" attitude.

Ulster will never have that under the 'leadership' of Shane Logan (and the IRFU).

Time for a change.

On here, on t'other forum and amongst my friends etc I've only heard one message. There is no confidence in Shane Logan as CEO and change is essential if there is to be any circling of wagons going forward. His standing down would benefit the club but just as importantly, the general spirit of the fans. We need some small iota of positive news to seep out from Ulster Rugby, his resignation would be a start.

Any word on ST numbers for next season? If they take a big enough hit Logan may start to feel the heat but if he's Dublins puppet will it matter?

No word marty. For me the discussion has to move on from Jackson and Olding to what supporters want and can actually achieve. If Logan Out is the message im all for it but there needs to be a cohesive message and one that isnt diluted. What im more concerned about is the lack of movement in terms of a coaching staff and therefore our squad is still not anywhere near ready for next season.

Logan didnt seem to be too forthcoming on our NIQ situation in his interview so what the F*$k is going on with our squad for next season. It needs to be right but it also needs to be done before the only two players left are the two we just binned

You know how these things generally work though. People will let it be known to all and sundry that there's not way they will renew while Logan is still in his job whilst actually renewing on the sly

i renewed prior to the Jackson and olding verdict and when i think about it why should i not. Im not going to let a prick like Logan stop me supporting my team and while i understand the best way to hit logan is to not renew the realities are as you mention. I think a protest at the ground by a vociferous support sounds better

Standulstermen wrote:i renewed prior to the Jackson and olding verdict and when i think about it why should i not. Im not going to let a prick like Logan stop me supporting my team and while i understand the best way to hit logan is to not renew the realities are as you mention. I think a protest at the ground by a vociferous support sounds better

Very true. As fans we all have to get behind the team, I mean who else can we support? Logan will know by now what the fanbase thinks of him I'm sure.

Standulstermen wrote:i renewed prior to the Jackson and olding verdict and when i think about it why should i not. Im not going to let a prick like Logan stop me supporting my team and while i understand the best way to hit logan is to not renew the realities are as you mention. I think a protest at the ground by a vociferous support sounds better

I read an article yesterday about the Glasgow game a bit about staying away isn't fair on someone like Tommy Bowe who deserves a rousing send off which is a fair comment but if you think Ulster are best served without Logan, is taking action that'll help expedite his exit, not a way of showing support in the long term?

It's a real shame for Bowe, one of the best players ever to play for Ulster, and perhaps some of the other departing/retiring players and staff that all the talk is about the departure of Jackson and Olding and sacking of the CEO.

theres two ways of looking at it marty. I dont think anything has been organised enough that it will make a difference in regards to logan. Personally i think the players need the support

So... Andy Friend.

Don Alfonso wrote:So... Andy Friend.

Unimpressed if true....

I'm willing to give anyone a chance.

I was massively impressed with the appointment of Gibbes. Needn't have been. The coach who has recently brought us furthest was a local schoolteacher.

Aaaaaaaaaah now KOTH's clue makes perfect sense.

in fairness Anscombe was essentially a bolt from the blue and went on a 13 game unbeaten streak. Gibbes work with the pack i think you can see in the last few games Don. The rucking is better than i can recall in many a year and the raw materials a hell of a lot worse in comparison to what we had