The Ashes - official thread

[KP_fan]

First topic message reminder :

Cummins was out no doubt about that, not sure what he was complaining about to be honest, a clear noise and deviation off the bat.

why were there 2 deviations?
one clearly before the ball had passed the bat and nothing seemed to be touching anything then...and the second when ball passes the bat.
Both deviations looking similar...put a question mark over the correct functioning of Snicko

that said 3rd umpire could have done nothing different than upholding the onfield ump

[GSC]

320 feels like an impossible task when you get bowled out for 60 odd on day 2...

[JDizzle]

Who are the others waiting? I always felt Malan had something about him and I’d have thought he would be suited to playing against the bounce fest.

Northeast, Malan, Sibley, Crawley, Ballance, Foakes? Bit of Curran? Keaton is probably dead now

Sam Hain is a player. Joe Clarke, if he gets himself together this winter is still a talent on the field. A bit early for Tom Banton but he's the most KP player since KP - lofty aspirations, I know. George Bartlett has also had a good season at Somerset aged 21, but again, needs a huge one next year to press his claim. Rob Yates at Warks is one to keep an eye on, made his maiden FC century vs Somerset last week at 19. Obviously Ollie Pope too - you can put all the caveats by it you want (plays at the Oval, doesn't bat top order etc.) but the fact is he averages nearly 60 in 28 FC games which is ridiculous.

[Duty281]

Jerusalem to start. I think an especially morose rendition of Abide With Me would be more appropriate.

[alfie]

Jerusalem to start. I think an especially morose rendition of Abide With Me would be more appropriate.

How about " Always Look on the Bright Side " ?

[Duty281]

We'd have to find the bright side first!

[alfie]

We'd have to find the bright side first!

Well I heard it was going to be sunny today...

[Soul Requiem]

Hussain is a truly awful commentator.

[alfie]

Stokes saddling up again this morning...

Glutton for punishment . Still trying to atone for that horrible dismissal yesterday morning

Get one early and they could roll the tail over quite smartly. But if these two get set it could be happy hour for the bats as the bowlers are going to be feeling their workloads...and likely to get a bit discouraged.

[Duty281]

We'd have to find the bright side first!

Well I heard it was going to be sunny today...

Only sunny for Australia, alas, as England shell another chance. Lead over 300 now.

[Soul Requiem]

Bairstow showing his worth again.

[alfie]

Aargh... Bairstow dives in front of Root and spills Labuschagne again ! Would just about have carried to Root I think.

Oh dear. Great bowling from Broad... No joy. Labuschagne now on life number four ...

[Good Golly I'm Olly]

Time for Ben Foakes me thinks

[Soul Requiem]

Time for Ben Foakes me thinks

It's been time for Ben Foakes for about two frickin years but lets stick with the inept keeper instead

[Nathaniel Jacobs]

Bairstow's glove work hasn't improved since he first got the gloves. He's mediocre yet his continued hissy fits seem to intimidate the management

[alfie]

Pattinson gone...

[Soul Requiem]

Labuschagne is a sucker for punishment, what's that the fifth time he's been hit in a week?

Starc has apparently hit him twice in the nets, growing a fondness for the guy in fairness, seems a real competitor and really showing up my earlier comments about him.

[alfie]

Cummins falls to Stokes...Burns with an excellent catch

The only one they can't catch seems to be Labuschagne

[AlciG]

Can somebody tell me why Archer has bowled so few overs in the 2nd innings?

[Nathaniel Jacobs]

Can somebody tell me why Archer has bowled so few overs in the 2nd innings?

Archer had cramp last night

[AlciG]

Can somebody tell me why Archer has bowled so few overs in the 2nd innings?

Archer had cramp last night

Thanks

[Duty281]

First run-out of the series. Good throw from Denly in the deep. Courageous innings from Labuschagne.

Trouble is, Australia have already added 66 to their overnight total!

[Soul Requiem]

We're not going to win this game but we need to take the game into tomorrow at least.

[No name Bertie]

Can somebody tell me why Archer has bowled so few overs in the 2nd innings?

Archer had cramp last night

Which is a sign that Root did overbowl him as some suggested and cramp can be caused by or be a cause of muscle damage (lasting a few days).

[alfie]

Bairstow's glove work hasn't improved since he first got the gloves. He's mediocre yet his continued hissy fits seem to intimidate the management

Considered ignoring this but feel I can't leave it stand :

1/ Statement really not correct . Bairstow improved his keeping out of sight through working with Bruce French.
2/ There is absolutely no evidence that Bairstow has ever had a "hissy fit" to pressure the management . Michael Vaughan accused him of sulking when he had to play a match as a pure batsman due to the finger injury : but all he ever did was let it be known that he wanted to keep and intended to keep working to earn that position. Have never heard him complain about being moved up and down the order so it seems to be no more than a convenient slur to be used by people who just don't like him.

Not defending that miss , by the way. He should have taken it ; and he's not had a great match. Will have thoughts of Foakes in the selectors minds (although at present he can't buy a run for Surrey) . But spare us the
football style character assassination , please...

[alfie]

Lyon chops on...The misery for the fielding team is over at last.

360 ? Good luck.

Just hope they make a serious attempt not another total collapse...

[Soul Requiem]

Your second point is garbage Alfie and you know it, HE DID throw a hissy fit when Foakes came into the side and he also threw one when he was criticised, it's in his nature.

[Duty281]

359 to get. I believe that would be the 10th highest chase in test history, were England successful.

About 76 overs left in the day. I think whatever wafer-thin chance England had this morning was extinguished by the Labuschagne/Pattinson partnership.

[alfie]

Your second point is garbage Alfie and you know it, HE DID throw a hissy fit when Foakes came into the side and he also threw one when he was criticised, it's in his nature.

Rubbish.  Find me a quote...you can't.  I recall very well he was first at the gate to congratulate Foakes on his debut innings.     You simply don't like the man ...

He did have a go back at Vaughan in the World Cup ! But frankly that was exactly what Vaughan deserved for his stirring...and it seemingly spurred both Jonny and the team to bounce back so I'd call that a Good Thing

[sirfredperry]

How many do we SERIOUSLY think England will get? I reckon they will be lucky to make 150.

My forecast. 132 all out.

[alfie]

Have to congratulate Labuschagne ...he saved Australia in the second innings at Lord's when he came in as substitute and dropped anchor ; and he has basically done a Smith in both innings here

He had more than his share of luck in this innings , true ... But one might argue he deserved some for his effort !

[No name Bertie]

Surely Jason Roy is going to last more than 20 balls this time around?

3rd test 1st innings: 15 balls for 9 runs.
2nd test 2nd innings: 13 balls for 2 runs.
2nd test 1st innings: 3 balls for 0 runs.
1st test 2nd innings: 58 balls for 28 runs.
1st test 1st innings: 22 balls for 10 runs.

[Duty281]

How many do we SERIOUSLY think England will get? I reckon they will be lucky to make 150.

My forecast. 132 all out.

208, all out this evening. Lyon with a five-for.

[alfie]

How many do we SERIOUSLY think England will get? I reckon they will be lucky to make 150.

My forecast. 132 all out.

Lord knows. If they get a decent start they might make Australia work...but given recent history another meltdown has to be on the cards.
They seem to rather lose interest these days once there is no serious chance of victory. The fear is that if two or three go down and the task looks hopeless the rest will simply go through the motions...

Not the best start with Burns copping a blow on the hand second ball !

[No name Bertie]

How many do we SERIOUSLY think England will get? I reckon they will be lucky to make 150.

My forecast. 132 all out.

208, all out this evening. Lyon with a five-for.

I am going for 264.  

They know they will win this test match if they don't get out - there is plenty of time to score the needed runs -  more than two and a half days left.  So they should be able to take their time and not get out too easily. However I don't think they will get the needed runs.

[Duty281]

Roy nearly getting out in the exact same fashion, with a loose drive well outside off. Burns playing and missing a few as well. Feels like just a matter of time.

[Duty281]

Ah, just a minute later. Burns perishes to the short ball. Could have left it. Should have left it.

[alfie]

Burns edges to slip...Warner can't miss this week - unlike Lord's.

First brick out of the wall...

[alfie]

Root still batting at three...

Two ducks in a row so he can't help but be anxious . Love to see a big hundred from him today .

Oh dear...Cummins cleans up poor Roy with a peach...

[Duty281]

That was a beauty of a ball. And when you have practically no defensive technique, you don't have much hope. Was that Roy's last test innings?

15/2.

[alfie]

Guess the order doesn't matter much if they are losing two in three balls... The two Joes together now.

Can England bat to tea ?

[alfie]

That was a beauty of a ball. And when you have practically no defensive technique, you don't have much hope. Was that Roy's last test innings?

15/2.

I think it has to be. He just doesn't look the part in this format. I suppose there will be fears that exposing a new player to a rampant Australian attack could risk wrecking their career at the start...but that is nonsense. If a player is good enough he will survive a tough introduction one way or another .

Sibley the logical pick...just hope the WC break hasn't spoiled his run of form.

What's the bet there will be calls for Chef to be implored to return flooding the Internet ?

[robbo277]

If the Ashes do go here then the calls for Cook will be silly. It's a risk free time to get someone else in.

Denly and Roy need to switch as a minimum. Or we need a new opener. Or a new 4. Or both.

There's some tough calls for the selectors and with the head coach going he might want to save his reputation rather than build for the future, but we need that look to the future. How are we going to look on the overseas tour and next summer? And can we get these guys in now?

Australia got out further than I'd have liked to 360 and 15-2 is a dreadful start. There's still runs in this pitch though, and a loss by 60 would be a hell of a lot different to a loss by 260, especially in the next selection meeting.

[alfie]

Burns is a bit of a concern too. He's done well , in the context of this series (openers on both sides struggling) but since the initial hundred he's been rather worked over by the short ball and it is something he will need to work on.
I like his attitude ; and really hope he can find a method to score consistently against this excellent attack. England really need one of these top three positions to be locked in - and not Root ! (Still want him back at four where he can be himself)

This is a big innings for Joe Denly.

[Duty281]

CricViz: Jason Roy's average as a Test opener is 8.85 runs per dismissal, only one player in the history of Test cricket to have opened as many times as Roy (7 times) has a lower average: New Zealand's Ken Rutherford who averaged 4.60 from ten innings as opener.

[Nathaniel Jacobs]

It’s funny to think just a few days ago plenty of the pundits declared Archer’s arrival, and subsequent absence of Smith, ‘changed the entire dynamic of the series’

In a certain aspect they where correct, Australia dropped a medium pacer and added a third fast bowler.

Funnier still their quickest bowler might not get a single match on the series.

[No name Bertie]

Surely Jason Roy is going to last more than 20 balls this time around?

3rd test 1st innings: 15 balls for 9 runs.
2nd test 2nd innings: 13 balls for 2 runs.
2nd test 1st innings: 3 balls for 0 runs.
...

3rd test 2nd innings: 18 balls for 8 runs.

So Jason Roy couldn't even last 20 balls. I should have put a bet on it. Burns was out on ball number 21 faced.

[No name Bertie]

The way England have batted their tail starts with their openers (or at least with Jason Roy, then Root ...).

[alfie]

It’s funny to think just a few days ago plenty of the pundits declared Archer’s arrival, and subsequent absence of Smith, ‘changed the entire dynamic of the series’

In a certain aspect they where correct, Australia dropped a medium pacer and added a third fast bowler.

Funnier still their quickest bowler might not get a single match on the series.

True. If Archer hitting Smith has ignited a "bouncer war" , then it has rebounded on England as the Aussie pace men have been more effective in the actual wicket taking , if not quite as fast. Their planned bowler rotation has worked like a charm...

[Nathaniel Jacobs]

It’s funny to think just a few days ago plenty of the pundits declared Archer’s arrival, and subsequent absence of Smith, ‘changed the entire dynamic of the series’

In a certain aspect they where correct, Australia dropped a medium pacer and added a third fast bowler.

Funnier still their quickest bowler might not get a single match on the series.

True.  If Archer hitting Smith has ignited a "bouncer war" , then it has rebounded on England as the Aussie pace men have been more effective in the actual wicket taking , if not quite as fast.  Their planned bowler rotation has worked like a charm...

Also with regards to Archer, he's been hindered by Woakes hardly bowling his 'fair share'. Heck poor old Stokes bowled 33 overs in his match considerably more than the actual third seamer

[Duty281]

Denly gets past 12. Should raise his bat.

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