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South Africa vs Argentina

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Post by Rugby Fan Sat 14 Aug 2021, 4:44 pm

It is 18-6 after 35 minutes.

It feels a bit like the earlier Bledisloe match. One Springbok try came from a loose Pumas attack, scopped up by Cobus Reinach. The Boks have made the most of their scoring chances, while Argentina have fallen at the last hurdle on theirs.

South Africa have made ten changes from the Lions Third Test, so this is a different proposition. The scrum does not look as formidable but that has not been much use to Argentina so far.

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Post by Old Man Sat 14 Aug 2021, 4:55 pm

Willemse looking out of his depth, unforced error deep in his 22 with a knock on, and conceded two penalties.

Better half then I expected by this new look Bok team. Although the defence isn’t as organised

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Post by Old Man Sat 14 Aug 2021, 4:55 pm

Dweba overthrowing the line out five meters out is a missed opportunity

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Post by Rugby Fan Sat 14 Aug 2021, 5:18 pm

24-12 after 50 minutes

Argentina have looked busy but not really putting the Boks under pressure. Meanwhile, any mistakes continue to look like opportunities for South Africa.

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Post by doctor_grey Sat 14 Aug 2021, 5:20 pm

First test for Los Pumas firsts this season against full sides?  Going back and forth between the SA commentary and the Argentine commentary.  Both teams very knowledgeable.


Last edited by doctor_grey on Sat 14 Aug 2021, 5:23 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Post by Old Man Sat 14 Aug 2021, 5:23 pm

I like Fassi, he is certainly one for the future.

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Post by doctor_grey Sat 14 Aug 2021, 5:28 pm

He had a pretty cool try off that kick. Really quick and good hands.

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Post by Old Man Sat 14 Aug 2021, 5:30 pm

Yep, very skillful player

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Post by Old Man Sat 14 Aug 2021, 5:36 pm

Willemse keeps messing up

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Post by Old Man Sat 14 Aug 2021, 5:45 pm

Love that kid Fassi, great hands, good feel for the game. A shame that try wasn’t allowed

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Post by Collapse2005 Sat 14 Aug 2021, 5:46 pm

Real stop start game, not the best rugby.

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Post by Old Man Sat 14 Aug 2021, 6:01 pm

Boks were good enough for the win, better than I expected, we do need to play more with ball in hand

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Post by mikey_dragon Sun 15 Aug 2021, 11:33 am

Boks were dominant all game and kept kicking for goal when they were well ahead. A a try bonus point gone missing I feel!

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Post by Old Man Sun 15 Aug 2021, 11:44 am

They did get a try bonus point, in the RC you get bonus point by scoring three tries more than your opponent

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Post by mikey_dragon Sun 15 Aug 2021, 11:46 am

Old Man wrote:They did get a try bonus point, in the RC you get bonus point by scoring three tries more than your opponent

Oh I see, so because Arg scored no tries the Boks get 5 points? Is it still 4 tries for a losing bonus point?

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Post by Old Man Sun 15 Aug 2021, 11:48 am

4 points for win
2 points for draw
1 point for scoring three tries more
1 point for within 7 points

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Post by doctor_grey Sun 15 Aug 2021, 12:41 pm

Old Man wrote:4 points for win
2 points for draw
1 point for scoring three tries more
1 point for within 7 points
Is that part of global trials or just something for the RC? I must have missed that one.

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Post by Old Man Sun 15 Aug 2021, 12:58 pm

doctor_grey wrote:
Old Man wrote:4 points for win
2 points for draw
1 point for scoring three tries more
1 point for within 7 points
Is that part of global trials or just something for the RC?  I must have missed that one.

No part of RC, also been in Super Rugby.

Been around a couple of years now

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Post by mikey_dragon Sun 15 Aug 2021, 4:41 pm

I missed it too, and I swear in the first bledisloe that the commentators were saying Aus need 4 tries to get the bonus point! I don’t think any of these teams bar Argentina will struggle to get three tries.

Is Cheika still part of the Puma’s coaching staff?

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Post by Rugby Fan Sun 15 Aug 2021, 4:47 pm

mikey_dragon wrote:I missed it too, and I swear in the first bledisloe that the commentators were saying Aus need 4 tries to get the bonus point! I don’t think any of these teams bar Argentina will struggle to get three tries.

The bonus point is for three tries more than the opposition, not a total of three tries.

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Post by Old Man Sun 15 Aug 2021, 4:47 pm

apparently Cheika was appointed the Lebanon head coaching position end of last year.

Yeah the try bonus point issue was even unclear to Nienaber and the SA presenters, they completely forgot how it worked.

In the post match presentation Joel Stransky even asked Wiese how they felt about missing the try bonus point

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Post by Rugby Fan Sun 15 Aug 2021, 4:51 pm

A few months ago, Michael Cheika was named Director of Rugby at Japanese Top League side Green Rockets, who are rumoured to want to sign Finn Russell.

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Post by doctor_grey Sun 15 Aug 2021, 8:07 pm

Old Man wrote:
doctor_grey wrote:
Old Man wrote:4 points for win
2 points for draw
1 point for scoring three tries more
1 point for within 7 points
Is that part of global trials or just something for the RC?  I must have missed that one.

No part of RC, also been in Super Rugby.

Been around a couple of years now
Completely missed that change. To be fair, last season I was just happy to see some Rugby on tv and didn't really pay attention to the standings (except that Gatland's Waikato were winless). This season Super Rugby Aotearoa didn't sign broadcast deals until late in their season (under legal threat) so never really watched.

What's the rationale for the change? So winning teams have more incentive to run up the score? Not sure I understand it. Are they playing these rules in the Currie Cup?

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Post by Old Man Sun 15 Aug 2021, 8:47 pm

No currie Cup is still under the old system.

I think the rationale behind the three tries more is to have defence play a role in the bonus point.

Super Rugby (much like currie cup is currently) just a try fest, matches regularly will have 11 tries or even more, this takes away from the quality of rugby as it inevitably is so focused on touch rugby like scenarios that games are unstructured and too open.

By having to win by three tries means you need to retain structure and therefor still focus on the important basic aspects of rugby.

The way I see it anyway

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Post by doctor_grey Sun 15 Aug 2021, 8:59 pm

Not sure I get how these new rules will prevent the try fest, touch Rugby aspect of the games. I guess I have to watch a few in a bit more detail to see how it effect the games.

Somehow teams up by 20 points late on going for one more try seems somehow against the basic ethic of the respect which is supposed to be part of our sport. Also going for it late on seems to me to be another opportunity to get a player injured. As I said, not sure I get the logic, but perhaps that's just me. Besides there aren't that many teams in the Premiership, Pro14, or Top 14 who can usually grind out 5 or 6 tries per game whilst holding the opposition to one or two.

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Post by Old Man Sun 15 Aug 2021, 9:11 pm

Well that’s the thing, more focused structured rugby means you take less risks, less 50/50 passes etc.

So you can win by three tries to nil, the riskier you play the more tries you have to score to counter errors.

Rewarding only the winning team with a try bonus point is seen as an added extra if you comprehensively beat a team by three tries or more.

In the past to win by a kick and your opponent scored the same number of tries doesn’t really award anyone as both get the bonus point.

You already earn a bonus point for getting within 7.

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Post by mikey_dragon Sun 15 Aug 2021, 10:40 pm

Rugby Fan wrote:
mikey_dragon wrote:I missed it too, and I swear in the first bledisloe that the commentators were saying Aus need 4 tries to get the bonus point! I don’t think any of these teams bar Argentina will struggle to get three tries.

The bonus point is for three tries more than the opposition, not a total of three tries.

I don’t think Aus got within 7 points, but I think they did score four tries. Did they get a bonus point for that, or is it scrapped? The Aus attack looks pretty good, but they could certainly benefit from being more conservative at times.

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Post by Old Man Sun 15 Aug 2021, 10:43 pm

They scored 3 tries, but even if they did score four the losing team does not get a try bonus point, they lost 57-22 so no losing bonus point either.

Also the match last weekend was Bledisloe, not part of the RC

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Post by mikey_dragon Sun 15 Aug 2021, 10:47 pm

I see, well that clears that up! I think I preferred the four try bonus point thing.

Thanks for also clearing that one up.

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Post by Old Man Sun 15 Aug 2021, 10:53 pm

No worries

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Post by Old Man Sun 15 Aug 2021, 11:02 pm

I found this on an old article in regards to the changed points system..

SANZAAR CEO, Andy Marinos stated, “SANZAAR EXCO reviewed the bonus point system implemented into Super Rugby this year and believed it had a significant impact in rewarding the more dominant teams, created a competition for the full 80 minutes and is providing a reward system that recognises both attack and defence.”

“Having witnessed some of the most exciting and complete 80-minute games in the history of the competition this season, spurred on by the introduction of the new bonus point system, we believe that across the SANZAAR tournaments, for the sake of the players, broadcasters and the fans, we should have consistency in terms of the tournament points system.”

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Post by Collapse2005 Sat 21 Aug 2021, 4:48 pm

Very one sided refereeing in the game

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