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Spain booted out of RWC 2023

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LordDowlais
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Post by Hazel Sapling Thu Apr 28, 2022 2:48 pm

https://www.rugbypass.com/news/props-forged-passport-sees-spain-kicked-out-of-the-2023-world-cup/

Apparently a South African prop had a forged passport and came on as a replacement in two games. Romania take the place of Spain.

Not sure if this is an April Fools....

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Post by No 7&1/2 Thu Apr 28, 2022 2:51 pm

I want to bring up 1999 then and the rightful award of a Grand Slam please!

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Post by The Oracle Thu Apr 28, 2022 4:00 pm

No 7&1/2 wrote:I want to bring up 1999 then and the rightful award of a Grand Slam please!

Laugh

Spain booted out of RWC 2023 6c920f10
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Post by GeordieFalcon Thu Apr 28, 2022 4:25 pm

Apparently one of the games was against Netherlands and they shouldnt have even needed to play him...

Just let them go to the World Cup for gods sake.

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Post by LordDowlais Thu Apr 28, 2022 4:30 pm

Wasn't there another dodgy refereeing game to qualify for the previous WC involving Spain ?


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Post by The Oracle Thu Apr 28, 2022 4:44 pm

Ban the player, not the team. Unless of course it was the Spain union themselves who forged the passport? In which case they should be thrown out and legal action brought against the people doing the forging!
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Post by Lowlandbrit Thu Apr 28, 2022 5:20 pm

The Oracle wrote:Ban the player, not the team. Unless of course it was the Spain union themselves who forged the passport?
Part of their punishment is that they have to pay a suspended fine they got last cycle for... playing an ineligible player (which cost them a place then too).

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Post by No 7&1/2 Fri Apr 29, 2022 8:41 am

The Oracle wrote:Ban the player, not the team. Unless of course it was the Spain union themselves who forged the passport? In which case they should be thrown out and legal action brought against the people doing the forging!

I say it tongue in cheek (slightly) but clearly anyone playing someone who isn't eligible has got an advantage even if it's the player who has been misleading. I heard a similar case, though not exact around Saracens and their cheating the salary cap being unfair on the Saracens fans but for me you've got to think of the other fans, teams etc too. Why is it fair on them that they've had to play a team who broke the rules? I personally want to see teams punished for this, like Spain here, like Sale, which heart them in a sporting term and not just financially. Look back to West Ham cheating in the prem years ago picking players they shouldn't have been able to play. Financial slap on the wrist, Shef U relegated instead and it leads to them playing in the semi final of europe and Shef U playing bloody Boro!

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Post by GeordieFalcon Fri Apr 29, 2022 8:52 am

Looking in to it more...as much as i hate to see all the genuine honest Spanish players (and Coaches) missing out...apparently Spain were banned from the last world cup due to fielding an ineligible player...and there is also history with Romania, Belgium etc etc also doing so.

Seems the World Rugby needs to be getting hold of these Euro Nations and making the rules very clear.

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Post by geoff999rugby Fri Apr 29, 2022 12:15 pm

At least Jodi Murphy will remain IQ for the rest of his career Spain booted out of RWC 2023 1f600

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Post by profitius Fri Apr 29, 2022 1:49 pm

A complete shambles. All the hard work and celebrations down the drain.
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Post by formerly known as Sam Wed May 04, 2022 8:19 am

No sympathy, after the last balls up you'd have thought all of the officials within the Spain set up would have wanted to see player paperwork confirming eligibility. If I was a Spanish player I'd have been going round the changing room making sure everyone had brought their paperwork in.

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Post by The Oracle Mon May 30, 2022 10:13 pm

Things getting very interesting on this case now. Spain citing Ireland, Scotland and NZ as examples of eligibility inconsistencies. Seems part of the Spain player’s ban revolves around how long he has ‘felt’ Spanish (!), with only 2 years of ‘feeling’ that Spain was his home and not the full 3 years needed. Odd. Apparently Bundi Aki, James Lowe and Pierre Schoeman all said similar things but have obviously been allowed to represent their adopted nations.

Shouldn’t distract from the main offence here though for me - I.e. tampering with a passport. That’s just plain fraud!
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Post by No 7&1/2 Tue May 31, 2022 8:23 am

Sounds like whichever official has got involved there hasn't been briefed on how important language can be. I don't think how a person feels comes into it at all does it?

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Post by GeordieFalcon Tue May 31, 2022 9:42 am

Haven't they also cited Wales 1999 WC squad also that had 2 ineligible players playing in all 4 games yet only got a £10k fine.

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Post by No 7&1/2 Tue May 31, 2022 9:59 am

GeordieFalcon wrote:Haven't they also cited Wales 1999 WC squad also that had 2 ineligible players playing in all 4 games yet only got a £10k fine.

That was over a few years and they really weren't properly punished. Wembley damn it, it was a grand slam!

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Post by The Oracle Wed Jun 01, 2022 8:28 am

GeordieFalcon wrote:Haven't they also cited Wales 1999 WC squad also that had 2 ineligible players playing in all 4 games yet only got a £10k fine.

Perhaps because Wales were found guilty and fined £10k, so they’ve already been reprimanded Headscratch

The point Spain are making is that World Rugby (or whoever it is who are ruling on this) are using an interview with the player where he said he considered Spain his home only 2 years ago as part of the reason that he is ineligible, yet they refused to act on similar interviews with the above players. So inconsistency. Bizarre turn of events, but there you go!
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Post by GeordieFalcon Wed Jun 01, 2022 9:08 am

The Oracle wrote:
GeordieFalcon wrote:Haven't they also cited Wales 1999 WC squad also that had 2 ineligible players playing in all 4 games yet only got a £10k fine.

Perhaps because Wales were found guilty and fined £10k, so they’ve already been reprimanded Headscratch

The point Spain are making is that World Rugby (or whoever it is who are ruling on this) are using an interview with the player where he said he considered Spain his home only 2 years ago as part of the reason that he is ineligible, yet they refused to act on similar interviews with the above players. So inconsistency. Bizarre turn of events, but there you go!

is that sufficient punishment for knowingly breaking the rules?? I dont think so.

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Post by The Oracle Wed Jun 01, 2022 12:59 pm

GeordieFalcon wrote:
The Oracle wrote:
GeordieFalcon wrote:Haven't they also cited Wales 1999 WC squad also that had 2 ineligible players playing in all 4 games yet only got a £10k fine.

Perhaps because Wales were found guilty and fined £10k, so they’ve already been reprimanded Headscratch

The point Spain are making is that World Rugby (or whoever it is who are ruling on this) are using an interview with the player where he said he considered Spain his home only 2 years ago as part of the reason that he is ineligible, yet they refused to act on similar interviews with the above players. So inconsistency. Bizarre turn of events, but there you go!

is that sufficient punishment for knowingly breaking the rules?? I dont think so.

Fair enough. But they’ve (Wales) been found guilty and punished, that’s the point. You can talk about the penalty and whether it was severe enough or whether you agree with it of. Of course you can. But Spain are arguing that they are being punished when those other 3 have not. I don’t agree with Spain’s approach here. Tampering with a passport is pretty low and it seems they’re now trying to wriggle out of the ban by using other things as precedents. But for me it doesn’t excuse the passport tampering, which is the main offence here.
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Post by No 7&1/2 Mon Jun 27, 2022 1:49 pm

No surprise that the appeal wasn't successful (BBC):

'Spain's appeal against their disqualification from the 2023 Rugby World Cup has been dismissed.

They clinched a World Cup spot for the first time in 24 years in March, but were later stripped of their place after World Rugby deemed they used an ineligible player - Gavin van den Berg - during qualification.

It is the second successive World Cup at which Spain have lost their place, both times for the same offence.

They will be replaced by Romania.

"The Independent Appeal Committee reviewed the original decision of the Independent Judicial Committee based on the evidence that was before it," World Rugby said

"Having considered detailed submissions from the Spanish Union and World Rugby, the Independent Appeal Committee dismissed the appeal."

Spain were given a £25,000 fine and will also have to pay a £50,000 suspended fine from a previous eligibility breach made in qualifying for the 2019 World Cup.

With Romania taking Spain's place in Pool B, Portugal can now secure their place through a final qualification tournament in November.

The World Cup takes place in France from 8 September-28 October 2023.'

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Post by GeordieFalcon Mon Jun 27, 2022 2:40 pm

Well the Spanish only have themselves to Blame. They need to sort out their administration so it doesnt happen again. Did they really need to play him...?

Anyway, Romania will benefit.

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