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Premiership Round Number 16 (I think)

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formerly known as Sam
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Post by doctor_grey Fri 27 Jan 2023, 8:23 pm

First topic message reminder :

OK, so I can't count too high, round 15,16, 20; it's all the same.....

Jeez, Sale are sullying Bath, 22-3 with 35 minutes gone. Almost seems like Bath doesn't want to be there.....



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Post by Heaf Sun 29 Jan 2023, 3:30 pm

Now a daft pen from Crevy at the ruck when not under any danger ...

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Post by Heaf Sun 29 Jan 2023, 3:32 pm

Now Coleman is broken again Rolling Eyes

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Post by Cumbrian Sun 29 Jan 2023, 3:34 pm

Not sure what Ugo is wittering on about, Lewies launched a shoulder into Cunningham-South's neck/head, it isn't really a debate for me...
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Post by Heaf Sun 29 Jan 2023, 3:35 pm

Heaf wrote:Unfortunately yes - inevitable for Irish to start well then give away a stupid card ...

Having said that forgot to say - similar one the other end that wasn't looked at ...

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Post by Heaf Sun 29 Jan 2023, 3:36 pm

Cumbrian wrote:Not sure what Ugo is wittering on about, Lewies launched a shoulder into Cunningham-South's neck/head, it isn't really a debate for me...

Ugo talking drivel for a change Erm

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Post by Cumbrian Sun 29 Jan 2023, 3:37 pm

Lovely play from Quins.
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Post by Heaf Sun 29 Jan 2023, 3:38 pm

Everyone getting their money's worth so far

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Post by Heaf Sun 29 Jan 2023, 3:44 pm

Slight argument for a pen try there - or at least a yellow for dragging player into touch 1m from line ...

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Post by Heaf Sun 29 Jan 2023, 3:49 pm

WGC going off not going to help the scrum problems

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Post by Heaf Sun 29 Jan 2023, 3:53 pm

Need to score now after so many missed from here so far

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Post by Heaf Sun 29 Jan 2023, 3:54 pm

That'll do ... nice finish

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Post by Cumbrian Sun 29 Jan 2023, 3:55 pm

That is some finish from Dykes.
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Post by formerly known as Sam Sun 29 Jan 2023, 3:57 pm

No 7&1/2 wrote:
formerly known as Sam wrote:
No 7&1/2 wrote:Reminds me of Clark.

No. Not in the slightest.

Clark took Hawkins elbow to a point where he knew he had leverage to do damage. Heard Hawkins cry out and then yanked the arm further to ensure he broke it. It's was GBH and that low life scum should have gone to jail instead of a stupidly lenient ban.

Weise a) never takes Waller's leg anywhere close to the point where he can do that level of damage and b) let's go when Waller yells at him suggesting that it's more of a heat of the moment desperation to complete the tackle rather than malicious intent. As I said it he wanted to do damage he just had to roll and take the weight through the side of Waller's knee, would have ended his season Weise notably doesn't.

If Weise gets a citing and Ramm doesn't the message to take away from this is that you either need to kick off or go down injured to ensure investigation. Potter playing on with a bloody nose and not going down meant Ramm got away with yellow. Had he gone down holding his face then Ramm doesn't play past 10 mins. Waller doesn't kick off and drop the old forearm into Weise then this is just another rugby playing incident like Potter in Hutchinson or Moon on Watson. All in the same game all bits of foul play but the last two aren't discussed at all because nobody kicked off or rolled around.

Does for me.

I'm sure you'd make that case to Hawkins who had a couple of operations and months out before playing again. He was never able to get all the mobility back in his elbow. Waller didn't even receive treatment on the field and played on without issue but yeah very similar.

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Post by formerly known as Sam Sun 29 Jan 2023, 3:59 pm

Blimey, tuned in to the Quins Vs Irish game late and that seems to be an error. Hopefully the second half continues in the same manner.

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Post by No 7&1/2 Sun 29 Jan 2023, 4:00 pm

formerly known as Sam wrote:
No 7&1/2 wrote:
formerly known as Sam wrote:
No 7&1/2 wrote:Reminds me of Clark.

No. Not in the slightest.

Clark took Hawkins elbow to a point where he knew he had leverage to do damage. Heard Hawkins cry out and then yanked the arm further to ensure he broke it. It's was GBH and that low life scum should have gone to jail instead of a stupidly lenient ban.

Weise a) never takes Waller's leg anywhere close to the point where he can do that level of damage and b) let's go when Waller yells at him suggesting that it's more of a heat of the moment desperation to complete the tackle rather than malicious intent. As I said it he wanted to do damage he just had to roll and take the weight through the side of Waller's knee, would have ended his season Weise notably doesn't.

If Weise gets a citing and Ramm doesn't the message to take away from this is that you either need to kick off or go down injured to ensure investigation. Potter playing on with a bloody nose and not going down meant Ramm got away with yellow. Had he gone down holding his face then Ramm doesn't play past 10 mins. Waller doesn't kick off and drop the old forearm into Weise then this is just another rugby playing incident like Potter in Hutchinson or Moon on Watson. All in the same game all bits of foul play but the last two aren't discussed at all because nobody kicked off or rolled around.

Does for me.

I'm sure you'd make that case to Hawkins who had a couple of operations and months out before playing again. He was never able to get all the mobility back in his elbow. Waller didn't even receive treatment on the field and played on without issue but yeah very similar.

Yeah I'd make that case. Merely point out that outcomes of things like that are not always the same.

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Post by Heaf Sun 29 Jan 2023, 4:22 pm

Don't know what the TMO was looking at there but what they showed on the replay was never a pen ...

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Post by Heaf Sun 29 Jan 2023, 4:24 pm

How ironic is that - nick two of their line-outs and then gift them a try off ours ...

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Post by Heaf Sun 29 Jan 2023, 4:34 pm

Should have kicked from that break

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Post by Heaf Sun 29 Jan 2023, 4:34 pm

Pen wrong way though as hands on the floor

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Post by Heaf Sun 29 Jan 2023, 4:36 pm

And a try ... hmmmm

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Post by No 7&1/2 Sun 29 Jan 2023, 4:40 pm

Swings and roundabouts heaf. You weren't complaining for your first try where Creevy leaves and rejoins the driving maul. Sometimes things are missed.

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Post by Heaf Sun 29 Jan 2023, 4:41 pm

Must have missed that Wink

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Post by Heaf Sun 29 Jan 2023, 4:42 pm

Need to score now to stop Quins momentum

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Post by Heaf Sun 29 Jan 2023, 4:43 pm

Ahh pass needed to be better

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Post by Heaf Sun 29 Jan 2023, 4:44 pm

FFS - again

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Post by Heaf Sun 29 Jan 2023, 4:44 pm

Have to score now with 2 men up

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Post by No 7&1/2 Sun 29 Jan 2023, 4:45 pm

I know Marler is up there with the best looseheads around but don't understand why Harlequins aren't rotating him with Baxter a bit more.

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Post by Heaf Sun 29 Jan 2023, 4:47 pm

That scrum needed resetting

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Post by Heaf Sun 29 Jan 2023, 4:47 pm

That should do it - finally!

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Post by Sgt_Pooly Sun 29 Jan 2023, 4:48 pm

So Arundell does have a weakness....can't pass off his left! Like me!

On Weise....he's one of the dirtiest players in the game currently (most of others are SA) but I didn't see much in that tbh.

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Post by Heaf Sun 29 Jan 2023, 4:51 pm

Looks like we're ignoring forward passes now ...

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Post by Heaf Sun 29 Jan 2023, 4:55 pm

Another overthrown line out ruins a scoring opportunity and almost leads to a try for Quins - catch & drive from there surely?

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Post by formerly known as Sam Sun 29 Jan 2023, 5:00 pm

Sgt_Pooly wrote:So Arundell does have a weakness....can't pass off his left! Like me!

On Weise....he's one of the dirtiest players in the game currently (most of others are SA) but I didn't see much in that tbh.

So dirty he's not had a card (of any colour) or citing since December 2021.

The Arundell passes aren't great but Cinti needs to hold a bit more depth and make the pass easier for both of them.

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Post by Heaf Sun 29 Jan 2023, 5:09 pm

Cinti further away than he needed to be and Arundell a bit rusty still ... but I'll take that overall. Good to see Dykes do well on his debut. Maybe losing OHC won't be so bad after all.

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Post by formerly known as Sam Sun 29 Jan 2023, 6:08 pm

Heaf wrote:Cinti further away than he needed to be and Arundell a bit rusty still ... but I'll take that overall.  Good to see Dykes do well on his debut.  Maybe losing OHC won't be so bad after all.

The lad certainly knows his way to the try line doesn't he. The LI back three production line in full flow. I wasn't expecting Rory Jennings to turn into a hard running, offloading inside centre either.

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Post by Heaf Sun 29 Jan 2023, 6:25 pm

Yes starting to see some nice development in the squad overall. Pearson also continues to shine.

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Post by doctor_grey Sun 29 Jan 2023, 7:45 pm

formerly known as Sam wrote:
Sgt_Pooly wrote:So Arundell does have a weakness....can't pass off his left! Like me!

On Weise....he's one of the dirtiest players in the game currently (most of others are SA) but I didn't see much in that tbh.

So dirty he's not had a card (of any colour) or citing since December 2021.

The Arundell passes aren't great but Cinti needs to hold a bit more depth and make the pass easier for both of them.
Don't really know whether Weise is a dirty player or not.  He does have a rep and they can take a long time to change.  

Pinning someone in a ruck like that is extremely dangerous.  If the person being held tries to turn and get out he/she could torque and do real damage to ankle, achilles tendon, knee, or even a hammy.  It's more dangerous if someone enters the ruck and causes the person being held to fall or just lose balance (Weise couldn't see because he was more or less face down on the ground).  The fact that no one seemed to be injured in this case doesn't change anything.  Most people who take head knocks don't have concussion or concussion symptoms...

Calum Clark is a perfect example of what can happen if coaches and/or team management don't arrest this kind of behaviour early enough.  He received a lot of support after it was clear he had a problem, but that was far too late.

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Post by formerly known as Sam Sun 29 Jan 2023, 9:24 pm

doctor_grey wrote:
formerly known as Sam wrote:
Sgt_Pooly wrote:So Arundell does have a weakness....can't pass off his left! Like me!

On Weise....he's one of the dirtiest players in the game currently (most of others are SA) but I didn't see much in that tbh.

So dirty he's not had a card (of any colour) or citing since December 2021.

The Arundell passes aren't great but Cinti needs to hold a bit more depth and make the pass easier for both of them.
Don't really know whether Weise is a dirty player or not.  He does have a rep and they can take a long time to change.  

Pinning someone in a ruck like that is extremely dangerous.  If the person being held tries to turn and get out he/she could torque and do real damage to ankle, achilles tendon, knee, or even a hammy.  It's more dangerous if someone enters the ruck and causes the person being held to fall or just lose balance (Weise couldn't see because he was more or less face down on the ground).  The fact that no one seemed to be injured in this case doesn't change anything.  Most people who take head knocks don't have concussion or concussion symptoms...

Calum Clark is a perfect example of what can happen if coaches and/or team management don't arrest this kind of behaviour early enough.  He received a lot of support after it was clear he had a problem, but that was far too late.

I seem to remember Cockers opinion about late tackles that directly lead to inadvertent concussion should be treated harshly being poo pooed at the time. This feels similar. Lots of things could have happened but they didn't.

Speaking from experience, when your knee gets hyperextended to a degree where you're in bother you know about it at the time. In my case it felt that if burnt the inside of the knee and by some miracle my cruciate ligaments were pulled and not torn. Not being able to walk comfortably for two or three weeks and then longer for running.

I would understand the RFU/PRL publicly reminding Weise that he has a duty of care. I would also point out he and club have invested plenty of time in changing his tackle and ruck technique to point he's not had a card or citing since December 2021.

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Post by Sgt_Pooly Mon 30 Jan 2023, 4:27 am

formerly known as Sam wrote:
Sgt_Pooly wrote:So Arundell does have a weakness....can't pass off his left! Like me!

On Weise....he's one of the dirtiest players in the game currently (most of others are SA) but I didn't see much in that tbh.

So dirty he's not had a card (of any colour) or citing since December 2021.

The Arundell passes aren't great but Cinti needs to hold a bit more depth and make the pass easier for both of them.

Good for him....he's still a sneaky, cheap shot merchant though. As the Doc says...sometimes a reputation sticks despite going though a clean patch. I'd have him in a similar bracket to Clarke tbh, a nasty human being.

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Post by formerly known as Sam Mon 30 Jan 2023, 9:44 am

Sgt_Pooly wrote:
formerly known as Sam wrote:
Sgt_Pooly wrote:So Arundell does have a weakness....can't pass off his left! Like me!

On Weise....he's one of the dirtiest players in the game currently (most of others are SA) but I didn't see much in that tbh.

So dirty he's not had a card (of any colour) or citing since December 2021.

The Arundell passes aren't great but Cinti needs to hold a bit more depth and make the pass easier for both of them.

Good for him....he's still a sneaky, cheap shot merchant though. As the Doc says...sometimes a reputation sticks despite going though a clean patch. I'd have him in a similar bracket to Clarke tbh, a nasty human being.

laughing you're still sore that Welsh got cleared out whilst in at the side and ended up with an injured shoulder.

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