Rugby World Cup - other team/games and general chat

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I couldn't see a topic to discuss general WC stuff and non home nations games.......

Now we do...

king_carlos wrote:NZ are swamping Dupont around the fringes. It's largely kept him quiet but leaves gaps elsewhere as it requires committing numbers near the ruck on every phase.

Yeah NZ have done a great job of pressuring Dupont

Collapse2005 wrote:Terrible decision to go for goal, what are France at???

Would have made it a six point game. Would have put pressure on the ABs to gamble and look for a try.

formerly known as Sam wrote:

Collapse2005 wrote:Terrible decision to go for goal, what are France at???

Would have made it a six point game. Would have put pressure on the ABs to gamble and look for a try.

NZ are down a player and France are making ground every time at maul time. Real lack of ambition from France.

Gingers are on for NZ....could cost them

Collapse2005 wrote:

formerly known as Sam wrote:

Collapse2005 wrote:Terrible decision to go for goal, what are France at???

Would have made it a six point game. Would have put pressure on the ABs to gamble and look for a try.

NZ are down a player and France are making ground every time at maul time. Real lack of ambition from France.

Wasn't the kick immediately before the yellow?

The one he's just landed, yeah I'd have considered putting that one into the corner and ramping up the pressure. Having had my captain complain about the number of penalties NZ have conceded at the same time.

Are forward passes legal now?

No it was after the yellow. Odd tactics from France. Weird game.

Collapse2005 wrote:No it was after the yellow. Odd tactics from France. Weird game.

It's not been a great spectacle has it, I blame Peyper.

Mauvaka has had a brilliant game here. Coming on after 12 minutes in a game this fast paced and for a side that's just lost a player of Marchand's quality. He's be very good at set-piece and consistently smashing runners in defence. Such a physical player to have as your second choice hooker.

Ah as I say that he makes his first error fumbling a not sympathetic pass!   Comes back for the advantage.

Haha it was Will Jordan again

Think Italy will fancy their chances against the ABs, maybe France too.

He was pushed over into that wasn't he and collected a boot in the face for his trouble - not sure even a pen?

France now doing France things.

Penaud is unreal....what a player

I don’t think Penaud actually touched it looking at that replay

Morgan75 wrote:I don’t think Penaud actually touched it looking at that replay

There was no complaint from him, I thought Peyper had blown early until I saw the Penaud reaction.

What a bounce!

Oof, that's a pretty scoreboard now for France.

NZ's first ever loss in the pool stage and it's quite a big'un.

NZ falling apart....Great to see.

Sgt_Pooly wrote:NZ falling apart....Great to see.

Why?

One flag up, one down.

Good thing it wasn't a game-deciding decision!

Without Ntamack they have to run their kicking game far more off Dupont. He has hasn't been as prominent in attack as he can be but he's controlled a tense game very well. I'm not sure I've ever seen a rugby player who's as prominent for their team as often. Truly incredible.

Jalibert may not take on the same tactical kicking load as Ntamack but his attacking play has been excellent when there's been half a chance.

Considering the players they are missing this has been very impressive from France.

I wouldn't be surprised if the final is a repeat of this opener. I have a feeling that the carnage of group B might tell physically come the QFs for whichever two teams from that group qualify. Then these two should have no problem dismissing whoever crawls to a semi from the make a wish foundation side of the draw.

Just 1 point for the conversion then ...

king_carlos wrote:Without Ntamack they have to run their kicking game far more off Dupont. He has hasn't been as prominent in attack as he can be but he's controlled a tense game very well. I'm not sure I've ever seen a rugby player who's as prominent for their team as often. Truly incredible.

Jalibert may not take on the same tactical kicking load as Ntamack but his attacking play has been excellent when there's been half a chance.

Considering the players they are missing this has been very impressive from France.

I wouldn't be surprised if the final is a repeat of this opener. I have a feeling that the carnage of group B might tell physically come the QFs for whichever two teams from that group qualify. Then these two should have no problem dismissing whoever crawls to a semi from the make a wish foundation side of the draw.

Id be surprised if NZ make it to the final, they arent great.

I think the Boks broke NZ.

Getting beat by the best team in the world isn't tournament ending.

Very well done to France, a deserved win and no repeat of 2007. They dominated the second half, had supremacy at the scrum and maul, and conceded (I think) just four penalties, about three times fewer than NZ, an incredible statistic.

Don't think either team was at their best. NZ shouldn't be too concerned, they should have more than enough to beat Italy, but it does set them on course for a potentially monstrous QF v South Africa. This loss may actually be a good thing for the rest of the tournament for NZ - and while France remain my favourites for the tournament, it'll be interesting to see if they get struck by the All Blacks curse.

Was interesting to see both sides repeatedly try adventurous chips over the opponent's line. That was normally only done under penalty advantage. Less good to see a number of players throwing themselves to the floor at the slightest contact.

Got a good weekend of rugby set to continue, but I worry that other weeks during the group phase will be sparse and dull the tournament's momentum. But this was a good start.

Morgan75 wrote:What a bounce!

I just had a flashback of an old coach screaming "don't let it bounce in the 22".

Very sweaty conditions and not a hugely important result but did anyone else think the ABs were dreadful?

I might be getting carried away but I think even Italy have a chance against that level of performance

Did NZ kick the ball more than England in their last few games?

Very tense game, with neither side looking great. Plenty of time for the ABs to grow into the competition. Looked like they had the upper hand in the scrum when all the replacements came on. I wouldn't have given Alldritt the Player of the Match, the replacement hooker was more deserving for me.

The ref wasn't great but to blame him for the lack of overall spectacle in this case seems harsh.

NZ still look immensely dangerous for brief periods but the game got away from them and they never looked like taking it back.

Was a strange game but a good start and just a million miles from what we have seen recently from England.

theslosty wrote:Very sweaty conditions and not a hugely important result but did anyone else think the ABs were dreadful?

I might be getting carried away but I think even Italy have a chance against that level of performance

Yep, quite poor. Thought France made hard work of putting them away.

Italy wont win but they will be looking forward to the match with a lot less fear than usual.

Unclear wrote:Very tense game, with neither side looking great.  Plenty of time for the ABs to grow into the competition.  Looked like they had the upper hand in the scrum when all the replacements came on.  I wouldn't have given Alldritt the Player of the Match, the replacement hooker was more deserving for me.

The ref wasn't great but to blame him for the lack of overall spectacle in this case seems harsh.

Yeah thought he was fine, he wanted it to flow, made some errors perhaps favouring NZ slightly but honest effort from him.

Penaud was so good. Really went up through the gears in that 2nd half. Funny how nobody complains about him running sideways

Yoda wrote:Did NZ kick the ball more than England in their last few games?

France kick the ball the most in international rugby. It's by a notable degree as well. They're just very very good at it.

Collapse2005 wrote:

king_carlos wrote:Without Ntamack they have to run their kicking game far more off Dupont. He has hasn't been as prominent in attack as he can be but he's controlled a tense game very well. I'm not sure I've ever seen a rugby player who's as prominent for their team as often. Truly incredible.

Jalibert may not take on the same tactical kicking load as Ntamack but his attacking play has been excellent when there's been half a chance.

Considering the players they are missing this has been very impressive from France.

I wouldn't be surprised if the final is a repeat of this opener. I have a feeling that the carnage of group B might tell physically come the QFs for whichever two teams from that group qualify. Then these two should have no problem dismissing whoever crawls to a semi from the make a wish foundation side of the draw.

Id be surprised if NZ make it to the final, they arent great.

They aren't great but are very good still. The RC showed that. Jordie, Cane, Frizell and Lomax will be important returnees. Vitally, their group means they shouldn't be that beaten up reaching the QF though. Between now and the 14/15th October they've got Namibia, Italy and Uruguay.

Whereas their opponents will have been through the toughest group by a distance.

Calling a ABs vs Boks or ABs vs Ireland QF I'd probably be about 50/50. Three sides performing at a very high level indeed. In a tight game such as that having a brutal pool with the wear and tear that will involve could be telling.

I'm not saying it's nailed on that France and the ABs will be the two sides to go through to semis from that side of the draw. As said in my post, it wouldn't surprise me at all though. Once in the semis they should definitely take care whoever progresses from the other side of the draw.

king_carlos wrote:

Yoda wrote:Did NZ kick the ball more than England in their last few games?

France kick the ball the most in international rugby. It's by a notable degree as well. They're just very very good at it.

First half they weren't so good but then then they went for it and found they could crank up the gears. NZ just kicked more and more yet looked quite good when they put it through the hands. France were braver so got the reward.

Yoda wrote:

king_carlos wrote:

Yoda wrote:Did NZ kick the ball more than England in their last few games?

France kick the ball the most in international rugby. It's by a notable degree as well. They're just very very good at it.

First half they weren't so good but then then they went for it and found they could crank up the gears. NZ just kicked more and more yet looked quite good when they put it through the hands. France were braver so got the reward.

They kept kicking in the second half too. Just found the line when they got in the right areas.

I think NZs bench had noticeably less impact, which is indicative of how good Frances depth is considering the injuries. Their tight five subs gave no let up even though they're missing Baille and Willemse whilst Marchand went off. Whereas NZ missed potentially Papali, Laulala and ALB on the bench had the likes of Cane, Frizell, Lomax and Jordie been available. The French depth is insane. That told and gaps appeared which they take advantage of ruthlessly.

France
44 kicks
106 passes
99 runs
127 tackles

New Zealand
39 kicks
154 passes
110 runs
107 tackles

France were slightly down on possession but significantly up on territory stats as well. Which tends to indicate a side that kicked lots and well.

As said, France kick an absolute ton. They just do it accurately and with purpose. Then when the kicking precision has carefully engineered opportunities that axis of Dupont, Jalibert and Ramos combined with an incredibly skilled team are spellbinding.

Winning the kicking battle is even more impressive considering that the injury to Ntamack has caused a late and fundamental change to how they kick with far more of it coming from Dupont. They're a very impressive team tactically.

The territory battle was won 56-44 by NZ in the first half. But the second half France won it decisively by a margin of 78-22.

Like Carlos said, they kicked lots, kicked well and won the game because of it. 1780 metres kicked by France to 1312 by NZ.

The stat that i thought was decisive was the penalty count. When it popped up on screen towards the end of the game, New Zealand had given away 11 and France only 4. From memory, I think France have had a similarly low count in a lot of their recent games. That kind of discipline is a huge advantage in any game.

Those Ardie Savea are a thing of beauty.

These national anthems are ridiculous, please World Rugby, get rid of them stupid choir versions and go back to the proper versions.

Italians showing English levels of ball handling at the moment

There was some talk of Italy toppling NZ, but I think this ends any of those thoughts.

Looked like that ball went backwards - another one in a long list of Joy Neville errors maybe?

It was a good effort from Namibia in the first half, but they tired very quickly in the oppressive heat after that, losing the second half 35-0.

I do like Paolo Odogwu as a player. Low centre of gravity, wide, muscular and quick. Bit of X Factor about him. Whilst he may not be top, top drawer, he's exciting and slightly unpredictable.

Another in the long list of potential England players we missed seeing in white.

Congratulations also to Dino Lamb. A Harlequins stalwart (and former England U20 player) who, like Odogwu, looks like a shrewd choice for the Azurri.

France did it again. Looking unspectacular, accumulating the points, and having an ability to throw bodies all over the pitch and suffocate the opposition. They look extremely well conditioned.

Have to admire Ireland for keeping going after full time for the last try - but would have looked daft if someone had picked up an injury at that point ...