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Whither Eddie Jones

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Post by Rugby Fan Wed 11 Oct 2023, 3:43 pm

Fox Sports reports that Eddie Jones is virtually a done deal as the next Japan coach, based on Japanese media reports.

https://www.foxsports.com.au/rugby/wallabies/fresh-twist-in-jones-bombshell-as-wallabies-coach-expected-to-find-new-job-after-world-cup-flop/news-story/936e8d2ee70cc1dbe04fcca8ee9a8ea9

However, that's not quite how it is being reported in Japan. The Japanese press is using the Sydney Morning Herald report about Jones interviewing with the JRFU to say that Jones is the top choice to take over from Jamie Joseph.

Now, it could certainly happen, as Japanese bigwigs had a good experience with Jones, and he has a name value with sponsors and the Japanese public. If Jones is going to jump, then he'll probably make a decision quickly. Still, no-one here has any inside line on Jones' intentions, so that Fox report looks like it's trying to get him to make up his mind.

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Post by Rugby Fan Fri 27 Oct 2023, 2:21 pm

Sydney Morning Herald says legal representatives for Jones have sent a letter to the ARU saying they are open to discussing terms of ending his contract.

It's not clear what status this has. It could be a way of saying "put up or shut up" to the ARU, to confirm he hasn't violated the terms of his contract, and let him carry on with the job in peace.  Alternatively, he might want to leave, and this a move to get the ARU to initiate action, so he can get a payout.
Eddie Jones and Rugby Australia have taken the first steps towards formally negotiating an exit for the embattled Wallabies coach after a disastrous Rugby World Cup campaign.

In a major development just nine months after he was appointed Wallabies coach on a five-year deal, Jones and his representatives this week advised Rugby Australia they were open to striking a deal for him to leave.

Movement on Jones’ future emerged as former Wallabies captain Michael Hooper prepared to fly to Wales on Sunday, where he is due to play under Jones in a Barbarians invitational side only days after the Wallabies coach told the Herald he’d left Hooper out of his World Cup squad because he wasn’t a good role model for the team.

Jones flew to London this week to help incoming All Blacks coach Scott Robertson coach the Barbarians against Wales in Cardiff on November 4.
Before his departure from Sydney, however, legal representatives of Jones sent a letter to RA expressing a willingness to discuss a mutual end to his time as Wallabies coach, according to multiple sources with knowledge of the situation who are unable to comment due to the confidential nature of the letter.
RA chairman Hamish McLennan and chief executive officer Phil Waugh received the letter, which was sent on Wednesday, and discussions with Jones about his future could begin as early as next week.

Waugh and Jones both declined to comment.

The Herald last month revealed Jones had participated in a Zoom interview for the Japan head coaching role just days before the Rugby World Cup began in France. Despite repeated denials, this masthead and other news outlets have reported that plans were underway for a second interview with the JRFU in November. Jones, who last week denied he was doing a second interview, told Herald columnist Peter FitzSimons in an interview published on Friday that he was due to be holidaying in Japan with his wife in November.

Jones oversaw the Wallabies’ worst World Cup campaign in history in France, where the men in gold failed to make it out of the pool stages.

A Wallabies source, speaking on the condition of anonymity because they were not authorised to speak publicly, said the working relationship between Jones and the RA leadership had grown increasingly strained and the prospect of the Wallabies coach carrying on business as usual in 2024 was unlikely.

In the interview with FitzSimons, Jones said his relationship with McLennan and Waugh was “good enough”. “But there’s two parts to being committed,” he continued. “There’s me being committed and there’s them being committed to make the changes. And I think they are, but Australia’s a difficult environment right now, how antiquated we are in our thinking and the way we do things, and we’re still so territorial.”

Rugby Australia now faces a decision about how it wants to progress with Jones, given a negotiated exit would almost certainly involve compensation as he is contracted through to 2027.

Sources with knowledge of Jones’s contract have told this masthead that if RA parted ways with the coach in the first quarter of next year, it would carry a smaller financial cost. There are exit clauses in Jones’s deal that pertain to RA’s pursuit of private equity and a centralised governance model, according to sources with direct knowledge of the contract, speaking anonymously due to the confidential nature of the contract.

Almost all the Wallabies staff who worked with Jones at the Rugby World Cup have not had their contracts renewed for next year. Most were on one-year deals.

Wallabies general manager Chris Webb has also departed after his four-year contract expired. Webb served in the role with Dave Rennie before re-uniting with Jones, who he’d worked with at the Wallabies in 2003. Waugh was keen to retain Webb but the experienced administrator elected to finish up.
Meanwhile, Jones and Hooper are set for an awkward reunion next week in Cardiff, when the pair will both be involved in a Barbarians game against Wales.
Hooper is one of several Australian players involved in the November 4 game, which is a testimonial for Wales veteran Alun Wyn-Jones. Taniela Tupou, Rob Leota, Angus Bell and Rob Valetini are also playing.

Hooper was controversially left out of the Wallabies’ World Cup squad by Jones, along with experienced stars Bernard Foley and Quade Cooper. It proved costly for the inexperienced Wallabies but Jones doubled down in the interview with FitzSimons.

“The situation reminded me of when Wayne Bennett let Wally Lewis go. No one could quite understand why, but Wally Lewis wasn’t a great role model for the rest of the team. And for those guys, I don’t think they were the right role models for the team going forward,” Jones said.

“Don’t get me wrong. They’re not bad guys. But you need guys – particularly when you’ve got a team like Australia has at the moment – you need guys who are obsessed with winning, obsessed with being good, and those three are past those stages.”

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Post by RDW Sat 28 Oct 2023, 10:04 am

As am honaray Wallabies fan I can say with certainty that Jones need to go.

What a sorry mess this whole saga has been. What must the players be thinking?

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Post by Rugby Fan Sat 28 Oct 2023, 12:17 pm

RDW wrote:As am honorary Wallabies fan I can say with certainty that Jones need to go.

I have a bit of sympathy for him on the direct charge. The Australian press started claiming Japanese media had reported Jones was confirmed for the Japan job. That was never true, as anyone with basic Japanese reading comprehension could have told them. One, gossipy, title had mentioned Jones, and only to say someone like him would be the JRFU's top choice.

There are other reasons to want him gone but the idea he was on the verge of abandoning Australia for Japan was never fully grounded. Mind you, I don't doubt he's maintained contact with the JRFU, and it is certainly possible he would turn up there if the ARU decides he has become too toxic. Going forward, the biggest issue for Jones is finding people who will work with him. There will always be new coaches who fancy an international stint on their CV. Whether he can get them to stay, is the problem.

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Post by doctor_grey Sat 28 Oct 2023, 5:47 pm

Rugby Fan wrote:
RDW wrote:As am honorary Wallabies fan I can say with certainty that Jones need to go.

I have a bit of sympathy for him on the direct charge. The Australian press started claiming Japanese media had reported Jones was confirmed for the Japan job. That was never true, as anyone with basic Japanese reading comprehension could have told them. One, gossipy, title had mentioned Jones, and only to say someone like him would be the JRFU's top choice.

There are other reasons to want him gone but the idea he was on the verge of abandoning Australia for Japan was never fully grounded. Mind you, I don't doubt he's maintained contact with the JRFU, and it is certainly possible he would turn up there if the ARU decides he has become too toxic. Going forward, the biggest issue for Jones is finding people who will work with him. There will always be new coaches who fancy an international stint on their CV. Whether he can get them to stay, is the problem.
In other words, would anyone hire him? Lots of baggage now. Literally may have talked himself out any future head coach positions.

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Post by Barney McGrew did it Sat 28 Oct 2023, 6:32 pm

He's obviously angling for the England gig - might be a thought
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Post by RDW Sun 29 Oct 2023, 9:21 am

Jones has resigned!

Whatever you think about the Wallabies issues, there's no doubt this has been an absolute shambles

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Post by mountain man Sun 29 Oct 2023, 9:25 am

Hmm wonder if he'll find himself in Japan as coach? Have to feel for Australia, they've been shafted.

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Post by Mcsweens Sun 29 Oct 2023, 9:38 am

God, imagine if the rumours are true that he had interviewed for the Japan job BEFORE taking Australia to the World Cup.

I don't think he would resign 9 months into a 5 year deal unless he had something else lined up


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Post by doctor_grey Sun 29 Oct 2023, 12:58 pm

Today's Telegraph:
Eddie Jones quits as Australia coach: 'You have to eat s--- for others to eat caviar'

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/rugby-union/2023/10/29/eddie-jones-quits-as-australia-coach/

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Post by westisbest Sun 29 Oct 2023, 4:18 pm

Wonder who will take over Australia.

Next 4 years will be big for them. Lions and then they host the World Cup. Hopefully they get someone in that turns then around.

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Post by Recwatcher16 Sun 29 Oct 2023, 4:38 pm

The next four years will be a critical time for Australian rugby. A Lions tour and RWC coming up and if Australia do poorly, the fans could well switch off in even greater numbers than are already happening with Super Rugby.
Best wishes to whichever coach takes that on, as it feels like further continued losses on the pitch will have damaging repercussions.

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Post by RDW Sun 29 Oct 2023, 8:26 pm

You hope for the sake of the Lions series that they turn things round quickly - a one sided Lions series where they romp to victory every game will be a big let down. They'll still sell the tickets though which is most important for the Lions...

I genuinely believe the Wallabies have the players to be a top 6 time - they've beaten most teams in the last few years, just not with any consistently - but really need to get their sh!t together quickly.

After the circus show that was Eddie's reign they surely need to get a much less controversial character and the players respect and want to play for. Who was that previous guy they had again...

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Post by doctor_grey Sun 29 Oct 2023, 9:33 pm

RDW wrote:You hope for the sake of the Lions series that they turn things round quickly - a one sided Lions series where they romp to victory every game will be a big let down. They'll still sell the tickets though which is most important for the Lions...

I genuinely believe the Wallabies have the players to be a top 6 time - they've beaten most teams in the last few years, just not with any consistently - but really need to get their sh!t together quickly.

After the circus show that was Eddie's reign they surely need to get a much less controversial character and the players respect and want to play for. Who was that previous guy they had again...
Great points. Right now, I think any of the Home Nations could go on tour to Oz and with a series. A Lions Tour is too much.

I think the question that is part of this is the overall state of Rugby Union in Australia. Commercially, performance, and so on. If that does not improve then where does Australia go from here?

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Post by RDW Mon 30 Oct 2023, 8:38 am

This is a good article

https://rugbynews.net.au/weve-hit-rock-bottom-where-to-from-here-for-australian-rugby/?fbclid=IwAR1Sb09DOcyRpS5H52La-HFMwt1T-G7_wCpdvKdDt0GqDyiofv3dwwiv6jg

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Post by Geordie Mon 30 Oct 2023, 10:20 am

Very good article.

There are some similarities with ourselves.


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Post by mikey_dragon Mon 30 Oct 2023, 10:28 am

RDW wrote:Jones has resigned!

Whatever you think about the Wallabies issues, there's no doubt this has been an absolute shambles

Yep and the fans aren't the least bit pleased with the ARU.

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Post by RDW Mon 30 Oct 2023, 10:34 am

mikey_dragon wrote:
RDW wrote:Jones has resigned!

Whatever you think about the Wallabies issues, there's no doubt this has been an absolute shambles

Yep and the fans aren't the least bit pleased with the ARU.

Understandable - those who saw fit to sack Rennie and then make things a whole lot worse have to shoulder responsibility here.

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Post by formerly known as Sam Mon 30 Oct 2023, 11:47 am

RDW wrote:
mikey_dragon wrote:
RDW wrote:Jones has resigned!

Whatever you think about the Wallabies issues, there's no doubt this has been an absolute shambles

Yep and the fans aren't the least bit pleased with the ARU.

Understandable - those who saw fit to sack Rennie and then make things a whole lot worse have to shoulder responsibility here.

Dan McKellar was asked after the Tigers game on Saturday (before Eddie resigned) about the state of Aussie Rugby and he said it pained him and said the treatment of Rennie was one of the reasons he took a job abroad.

I expect some of the ARU management are going to come under a lot of pressure as I doubt many coaches will have been watching the goings on and thinking "that's an environment I want to be in".

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Post by doctor_grey Mon 30 Oct 2023, 4:39 pm

formerly known as Sam wrote:
RDW wrote:
mikey_dragon wrote:
RDW wrote:Jones has resigned!

Whatever you think about the Wallabies issues, there's no doubt this has been an absolute shambles

Yep and the fans aren't the least bit pleased with the ARU.

Understandable - those who saw fit to sack Rennie and then make things a whole lot worse have to shoulder responsibility here.

Dan McKellar was asked after the Tigers game on Saturday (before Eddie resigned) about the state of Aussie Rugby and he said it pained him and said the treatment of Rennie was one of the reasons he took a job abroad.

I expect some of the ARU management are going to come under a lot of pressure as I doubt many coaches will have been watching the goings on and thinking "that's an environment I want to be in".
I guess this is the problem with a turnaround - how to attract good people to fix a problem if the problem is people?

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Post by formerly known as Sam Mon 30 Oct 2023, 8:06 pm

doctor_grey wrote:
formerly known as Sam wrote:
RDW wrote:
mikey_dragon wrote:
RDW wrote:Jones has resigned!

Whatever you think about the Wallabies issues, there's no doubt this has been an absolute shambles

Yep and the fans aren't the least bit pleased with the ARU.

Understandable - those who saw fit to sack Rennie and then make things a whole lot worse have to shoulder responsibility here.

Dan McKellar was asked after the Tigers game on Saturday (before Eddie resigned) about the state of Aussie Rugby and he said it pained him and said the treatment of Rennie was one of the reasons he took a job abroad.

I expect some of the ARU management are going to come under a lot of pressure as I doubt many coaches will have been watching the goings on and thinking "that's an environment I want to be in".
I guess this is the problem with a turnaround - how to attract good people to fix a problem if the problem is people?

This is it. You've got to show some serious intention to change things up. Any coach worth his salt will want to see some organisational changes, something that will change the culture and future trajectory of the sport in Australia. Who's want to go in there and be the next ARU attempt at a sticking plaster.

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Post by bsando Tue 31 Oct 2023, 5:57 am

RDW wrote:This is a good article

https://rugbynews.net.au/weve-hit-rock-bottom-where-to-from-here-for-australian-rugby/?fbclid=IwAR1Sb09DOcyRpS5H52La-HFMwt1T-G7_wCpdvKdDt0GqDyiofv3dwwiv6jg

As a Force fan I am fairly biased, but dropping them is not a good idea. I always felt the introduction of the Rebels was a poor move by RA. Melbourne is the home of AFL. Considering the Force have Andrew Forrest backing them (net worth $30bn+) I would argue that RA need to work with the Force to find a solution that ensures they remain a long term success story whilst contributing positively to the national setup. WA clubs need a pathway to super rugby and isolating them from the east of Australia isn’t the way to build a strong long term wallabies side. Not to mention, the Force nurtured Australia’s greatest rugby player of the 21st century in David Pocock, who is now an elected independent senator in the ACT.

Overall a good article into the dire situation RA have got themselves into.

Exposing players to international clubs is not a bad idea and to a certain extent is already happening, but RA need more control over these players development. Bringing their top overseas players back to Aus in the build up to big tournaments like the RWC should be a priority. Losing players like Mack Hansen to Ireland us not good enough. Here is another example of lost talent https://www.rugbypass.com/news/want-to-represent-ireland-why-former-force-star-left-aussie-rugby-behind/

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Post by RDW Tue 31 Oct 2023, 9:34 am

A good point on the Force Vs Rebels. Bigger potential to build a franchise that is the big attraction in Perth than Melbourne, although a smaller city. Nick White moving west is a huge coup which needs to be built on by the Force.

Melbourne is a hugely crowded sporting city and very few people actually give a crap about the rugby team. Tiny crowds and not good results on the pitch. Melbourne is utterly dominated by AFL and have one of the top NRL teams too. Super Rugby had a magic round in Melbourne last season and the crowds weren't good, but had terrible marketing and picked a big AFL weekend.

Realistically though I can't see them sacking off any of these clubs.

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Post by bsando Fri 03 Nov 2023, 12:58 pm

Yep it seems like a shambles to me. Until some good decision makers are running the show there is little that will change. There’s so much talent in Aus and it’s a joke they’re now close to a tier 2 ranking.

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Post by Rugby Fan Sun 19 Nov 2023, 2:56 pm

Hamish McLennan has just been sacked

https://www.afr.com/companies/sport/i-won-t-back-down-defiant-mclennan-goes-to-war-against-rugby-s-unions-20231119-p5el2d

Hamish McLennan is no longer the chairman of Rugby Australia after he was ousted in a late night board meeting and resigned as a director.

Rugby Australia’s board met four times over the weekend after some of the organisation’s most powerful stakeholders went public with their demand for Mr McLennan, who is also the chairman of REA Group, to resign.

Mr McLennan had earlier told The Australian Financial Review that he would not step down even as several states including Queensland prepared to call an extraordinary general meeting and have him dismissed over his direction and leadership of the game.

“As Tom Petty famously sung, I won’t back down,” Mr McLennan said on Sunday. “This is a classic case of the tail wagging the dog.”

On Sunday evening, Mr McLennan confirmed he has resigned from the board of directors after losing the chairmanship.

Former Wallaby Dan Herbert has been elected chairman.

In a statement, he said it had “never been more important for the Rugby Australia board, working with member unions, to come together and execute the reform we absolutely need”.

The stand-off over Mr McLennan’s position had escalated existing tensions between the state unions, sponsors, and executives, and threatened to further draw out an already long dispute over the future of the game.

The unions and Super Rugby clubs from Queensland, Tasmania, South Australia, the Northern Territory, Western Australia and the ACT wrote to Mr McLennan on Friday and had initially given him until Saturday afternoon to consider his position (it was later extended to Sunday).

Their letter, which has since been made public, said the move was to do with Mr McLennan’s cultural fit rather than Rugby Australia’s plans to create a united high-performance structure and take control of their commercial decisions.

“We no longer have any trust or faith in his leadership, or the direction in which he is taking rugby in Australia,” the letter reads. “His decisions and ‘captain’s picks’ have directly led to a historic failure at the men’s Rugby World Cup and a Wallabies international ranking at a historic low, with all the regrettable and public fallout that came with it.”

Rugby Australia is overseen by a board of directors, but is owned by state and territory rugby unions, the owners of the Super Rugby bodies and the Rugby Union Players’ Association.

The board of directors includes former rugby players Joe Roff and Daniel Herbert, Virgin Australia co-founder Brett Godfrey, Barrenjoey’s head of corporate finance, Matt Hanning, former Salesforce chief executive Pip Marlow and non-executive directors Dr Jane Wilson and Karen Penrose. Rugby Australia chief executive Phil Waugh also sits on the board.

Sources familiar with the position of the directors, who weren’t authorised to speak publicly, had said that there were divisions over whether to back Mr McLennan in light of the concerns of some shareholders.

Australian rugby descended into turmoil after the Wallabies failed to reach the knockout stage in the Rugby World Cup and coach Eddie Jones was reported to be flirting with a return to Japan. Jones has since resigned from his position – less than 10 months into a five-year contract.

Much of the fallout since has focused on the appointment of Mr Jones by the Rugby Australia board and Mr McLennan. It has also culminated in discussions about a new operating model, which would see high-performance coaches and training nationalised and Super Rugby clubs handing over their commercial functions to Rugby Australia.

While the clubs are supportive of a national high-performance division, there are disputes over the handling of money by Rugby Australia. At the same time, it has abandoned plans to inject $250 million in private equity in favour of a new $60 million loan. The loan has not yet been secured.

Mr McLennan had earlier urged ACT and Queensland rugby union members to call their own extraordinary general meetings and oust their own chairmen, on the grounds they had instigated a fight with him.

“They didn’t have the good grace to include NSW, Victoria and The [Western] Force in their secret discussions,” he said. “These are the same people who have told RA board members they have a coordinated campaign to discredit me if I don’t resign.”

On Saturday, Andrew and Nicola Forrest, who own the Western Force, and Melbourne Rebels chairman, Paul Docherty, came out supporting Mr McLennan. “We can’t land years of problems at the feet of one person. We are all custodians of the game for a short time, and our goal should be to come together, not to create more division,” Mr Docherty said.

The Forrests said Mr McLennan was steering rugby through a “difficult period”. “Now is not the time for more disruption in the sport, but a time for rugby to band together and back the proposed centralisation reforms,” they said in a joint statement on Saturday.

NSW Rugby, which was not consulted by other unions and last week agreed to hand over all corporate and performance functions to Rugby Australia, has yet to outline its position on Mr McLennan’s position.

This public fight could not come at a worse time for Rugby Australia which is in the middle of an independent review into what went wrong at the World Cup and has already made headlines for poor performance and the way it spends its money.

The review, led by former Wallaby Justin Harrison, is expected to assess everything from coaching and player performance to costs and corporate hospitality. Rugby sources previously told this masthead that Jones, at the very least, had blown his budget.

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Post by RDW Sun 19 Nov 2023, 7:43 pm

Well I thought he would cling on but he's finally gone. Means RA can properly rebuild from the ground up.

What a saga!

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