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His Majesty's Premiership Rugby, Round 11

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WELL-PAST-IT
formerly known as Sam
Recwatcher16
lostinwales
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Post by doctor_grey Thu 04 Jan 2024, 7:08 pm

Here we are and 2024 is still in nappies and Rugby is starting to implode.  They (and we know who 'they' are) will either right the ship or run it into the rocks with the RPA.  So, almost as expected, Rugby in England is half-screwed.  Again.

At least we can pass the last few days of the first week of the year comforted with the knowledge that Northampton Saints are top of the table.  Praise Bacchus for that.  

Friday Jan 5, 2024
2:45pm EST Salford City Stadium, Sale-Bristol, 7:45pm in His Majesty's Lush and Blessed Islands
2:45pm EST Kingston Park, Newcastle-Harlequins, 7:45pm in His Majesty's Lush and Blessed Islands

Sat Jan 6, 2024
10:00am EST Sandy Park, Exeter Chiefs-Northampton Saints, 3:00pm in His Majesty's SAINTLY and Blessed Islands
10:05am EST Mattioli Woods Welford Road Stadium, Leicester-Saracens, 3:05pm in His Majesty's Lush and Blessed Islands

Sun Jan 7, 2024
10:00am EST Recreation Ground, Bath-Gloucester, 3:00pm in His Majesty's Lush and Blessed Islands


Last edited by doctor_grey on Fri 05 Jan 2024, 2:20 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Post by Poorfour Fri 05 Jan 2024, 8:33 am

Best guess would be an alternating pattern of home and away wins across the weekend. Saints could be the best chance of an upset
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Post by lostinwales Fri 05 Jan 2024, 11:44 am

Doc I can't help but notice that your ESTimates are 7 hours out.

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Post by doctor_grey Fri 05 Jan 2024, 2:04 pm

lostinwales wrote:Doc I can't help but notice that your ESTimates are 7 hours out.
Mate, they are right on time (for me here in New Jersey)

Copied from a web site without really noticing.

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Post by doctor_grey Fri 05 Jan 2024, 2:24 pm

EXETER CHIEFS vs NORTHAMPTON SAINTS
Gallagher Premiership, Round 11
Saturday 6 January, 2023
Sandy Park, Kick-off: 3pm

15 George Furbank (c)
14 Ollie Sleightholme
13 Burger Odendaal
12 Rory Hutchinson
11 Tom Litchfield
10 Fin Smith
9 Callum Braley

1 Tarek Haffar (watch out for this lad, real high ceiling, methinks)
2 Sam Matavesi
3 Trevor Davison
4 Alex Moon
5 Chunya Munga
6 Alex Coles
7 Angus Scott-Young
8 Sam Graham

Replacements:
16 Curtis Langdon
17 Emmanuel Iyogun
18 Elliot Millar Mills
19 Temo Mayanavanua
20 Tom Pearson
21 Alex Mitchell
22 Fraser Dingwall
23 Tommy Freeman

Not available for selection:
Juarno Augustus, George Hendy, Paul Hill, Tom James (suspended), Lewis Ludlam, James Ramm, Tom Seabrook and Alex Waller.

EXETER TEAM TO FACE SAINTS:
15 Tommy Wyatt, 14 Immanuel Feyi-Waboso, 13 Henry Slade, 12 Joe Hawkins, 11 Ben Hammersley, 10 Harvey Skinner, 9 Stu Townsend; 1 Nika Abuladze, 2 Jack Yeandle, 3 Josh Iosefa-Scott, 4 Lewis Pearson, 5 Dafydd Jenkins (c), 6 Ethan Roots, 7 Jacques Vermeulen, 8 Greg Fisilau.
Replacements: 16 Max Norey, 17 Alec Hepburn, 18 Ehren Painter, 19 Rusi Tuima, 20 Ross Vintcent, 21 Tom Cairns, 22 Ollie Devoto, 23 Zack Wimbush.

Referee: Anthony Woodthorpe
Assistant referees: George Selwood and Neil Chivers
No. 4: Paul Dix
TMO: David Rose

Not close to Saints best side, but all part of the rotation and load management.  The Saints bench is very strong.

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Post by Recwatcher16 Fri 05 Jan 2024, 2:30 pm

Big game this weekend and Gloucester have a pretty strong 23 on paper, but something is not working for them results wise and hopefully continues in that vein this weekend...

Bath Rugby: 1 Beno Obano, 2 Tom Dunn, 3 Will Stuart, 4 Elliott Stooke, 5 Charlie Ewels, 6 GJ van Velze, 7 Miles Reid, 8 Jaco Coetzee, 9 Ben Spencer ©, 10 Finn Russell, 11 Will Muir (50), 12 Cameron Redpath, 13 Ollie Lawrence, 14 Joe Cokanasiga, 15 Tom de Glanville

Replacements: 16 Niall Annett, 17 Thomas du Toit, 18 Archie Griffin, 19 Quinn Roux, 20 Alfie Barbeary, 21 Tom Carr-Smith, 22 Sam Harris, 23 Sam Underhill

Noticeable the two young halfbacks getting a turn off the bench for this big home game and Underhill also back after a few weeks break. Bayliss and Hill are still to return from injury, although the former gets a run out with one of the junior sides this weekend and the latter to return in March. They need to, as Reid has played a lot of minutes since the start of the season.
Oh, Gloucester Rugby

15. Santi Carreras 14. Jonny May 13. Chris Harris 12. Seb Atkinson 11. Ollie Thorley 10. Adam Hastings 9. Caolan Englefield 1. Mayco Vivas 2. George McGuigan 3. Fraser Blamain 4. Freddie Clarke 5. Matias Alemanno 6. Ruan Ackermann 7. Lewis Ludlow (C) 8. Zach Mercer

Replacements 16. Seb Blake 17. Jamal Ford-Robsinon 18. Kirill Gotovtsev 19. Cam Jordan 20. Jack Clement 21. Stephen Varney 22. Max Llewellyn 23. Louis Rees-Zammit



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Post by formerly known as Sam Fri 05 Jan 2024, 2:58 pm

STARTING XV
15 Freddie Steward [79]
14 Harry Simmons [36]
13 Dan Kelly [70]
12 Solomone Kata [9]
11 Mike Brown [18]
10 Handré Pollard [22]
9 Tom Whiteley [19]
1 James Cronin [24]
2 Julián Montoya (c) [49] *
3 Joe Heyes [134]
4 George Martin [71]
5 Ollie Chessum [50]
6 Matt Rogerson [12]
7 Tommy Reffell [107]
8 Jasper Wiese [68]

REPLACEMENTS
16 Finn Theobold-Thomas [4]
17 Francois van Wyk [43]
18 Will Hurd [35]
19 Harry Wells [187]
20 Kyle Hatherell [10]
21 Olly Cracknell [31]
22 Ben Youngs [308]
23 Jamie Shillcock [15]

Saracens Men team to play Leicester Tigers:

1 Sam Crean
2 Kapeli Pifeleti
3 Christian Judge
4 Maro Itoje
5 Hugh Tizard
6 Theo McFarland
7 Juan Martin Gonzalez
8 Ben Earl
9 Gareth Simpson
10 Owen Farrell (c)
11 Lucio Cinti
12 Nick Tompkins
13 Elliot Daly
14 Rotimi Segun
15 Tom Parton

Replacements:

16 Theo Dan
17 Logovi’i Mulipola
18 Ollie Hoskins
19 Nick Isiekwe
20 Andy Christie
21 Ivan van Zyl
22 Manu Vunipola
23 Alex Lewington

Not much let up in the injuries for Tigers though Ben Youngs is fit enough for the bench. The ban for Vunipola means Sarries are very short at LH though Dan Cole's unavailability probably saves them somewhat.

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Post by WELL-PAST-IT Fri 05 Jan 2024, 3:22 pm

Saints have rung the changes this time, with at least 5 of the bench being normal starters. Not a lover of Braley or Hutchinson at 12. Good to see Lawes getting a rest though.
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Post by doctor_grey Fri 05 Jan 2024, 5:39 pm

WELL-PAST-IT wrote:Saints have rung the changes this time, with at least 5 of the bench being normal starters. Not a lover of Braley or Hutchinson at 12. Good to see Lawes getting a rest though.
I think this is driven by load management and the need to spread the work and get game time to the broader squad.  If Saints are reasonably close at the 55-60 minute mark, with that bench they could easily take it.

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Post by doctor_grey Fri 05 Jan 2024, 8:18 pm

Foolish yellow by Radwan.  Falcons don't need to be a man down.  But a needless no-arms tackle will get a yellow most of the time.  The fact the Quins 9 was a real bloody mess afterwards didn't help Radwan either.

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Post by Poorfour Fri 05 Jan 2024, 8:20 pm

Sale looking well off the pace so far.

I'm impressed with what Pat Lam has managed to do with Gabs Ibitoye. At Quins we saw him as an outrageous physical talent who was a superb finisher but didn't work hard enough on his defence and all-round skills. Bristol have really unlocked his potential and he's improved his work rate, positioning and kicking significantly.
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Post by doctor_grey Fri 05 Jan 2024, 8:27 pm

And Quins just scored as a result of the Radwan yellow.....

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Post by doctor_grey Fri 05 Jan 2024, 8:57 pm

Quins just scored again off a lineout. Just switched to watch Sale-Bristol.

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Post by Poorfour Fri 05 Jan 2024, 9:49 pm

Very satisfying evening for Quins fans. 5 points for us, 0 for Sale, 4 for Bristol (with good efforts by former Quins). Tightens up the table a fair bit, apart from Falcons.
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Post by No 7&1/2 Sat 06 Jan 2024, 3:09 pm

Bit of pressure and Furbank reverts a little to type.

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Post by No 7&1/2 Sat 06 Jan 2024, 3:15 pm

Lovely finish by Feyi-Waboso. A bit abysmal by Odendaal though.

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Post by No 7&1/2 Sat 06 Jan 2024, 3:18 pm

Great pressure on Sleightholme from him too for the charge down.

2 (or 3) errors in their 22 from Northampton and 2 tries from them.

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Post by No 7&1/2 Sat 06 Jan 2024, 3:25 pm

Massively 1 sided this. Northampton haven't kept hold of it for more than 2 phases! Can't imagine it's long before they have to do something with the bench. Bonus point after 24 mins. More point than minutes gone.

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Post by No 7&1/2 Sat 06 Jan 2024, 3:30 pm

Finally a bit of pressure. 4 or 5 pens on the bounce.must be risking a yellow

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Post by No 7&1/2 Sat 06 Jan 2024, 3:33 pm

Finally.

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Post by No 7&1/2 Sat 06 Jan 2024, 3:36 pm

2 on the bounce. What the game needed.

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Post by No 7&1/2 Sat 06 Jan 2024, 3:49 pm

Flicking onto the Leicester game after the crowd were very optimistically claiming a try from a non grounded knock on Healy calls for Farrell to kick it directly into touch and end the half from a drop out....

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Post by formerly known as Sam Sat 06 Jan 2024, 4:02 pm

No 7&1/2 wrote:Flicking onto the Leicester game after the crowd were very optimistically claiming a try from a non grounded knock on Healy calls for Farrell to kick it directly into touch and end the half from a drop out....

Onfield decision was try, ball is clearly over the line and you can't see half of it. Try should have stood as there's no clear evidence to overturn the decision. TMO has been MIA so far and Pearce uncharacteristically poor. Cinti took out Steward in the air early on resulting in Steward landing on his head and needing treatment, Pearce refused to review and TMO was silent. Pearce also missed a knock on 2m in front of him and then gave a knock on at the next ruck against the other side when the tackler got up and knocked the ball out the 9s hands. Pretty shocking to be honest, TMO could have certainly helped and so could have looking at the big screens at either end of the ground.

Sarries have looked good off first phase and kick passed wide at every opportunity. Tigers have showed more attacking intent than prior weeks but haven't been clinical enough.

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Post by No 7&1/2 Sat 06 Jan 2024, 4:09 pm

formerly known as Sam wrote:
No 7&1/2 wrote:Flicking onto the Leicester game after the crowd were very optimistically claiming a try from a non grounded knock on Healy calls for Farrell to kick it directly into touch and end the half from a drop out....

Onfield decision was try, ball is clearly over the line and you can't see half of it. Try should have stood as there's no clear evidence to overturn the decision. TMO has been MIA so far and Pearce uncharacteristically poor. Cinti took out Steward in the air early on resulting in Steward landing on his head and needing treatment, Pearce refused to review and TMO was silent. Pearce also missed a knock on 2m in front of him and then gave a knock on at the next ruck against the other side when the tackler got up and knocked the ball out the 9s hands. Pretty shocking to be honest, TMO could have certainly helped and so could have looking at the big screens at either end of the ground.

Sarries have looked good off first phase and kick passed wide at every opportunity. Tigers have showed more attacking intent than prior weeks but haven't been clinical enough.

It's clearly held up on the replay to be fair.

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Post by No 7&1/2 Sat 06 Jan 2024, 4:25 pm

Great comeback from Northampton.

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Post by No 7&1/2 Sat 06 Jan 2024, 4:37 pm

Properly good game this.

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Post by No 7&1/2 Sat 06 Jan 2024, 4:43 pm

Brilliant offloading by Exeter. Fisilaus looked slightly forward like.

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Post by No 7&1/2 Sat 06 Jan 2024, 4:47 pm

Exeter lucky there. Late by skinner with no arms and could be playing with 14 and against a pen in the corner.

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Post by No 7&1/2 Sat 06 Jan 2024, 4:49 pm

Last minute 5 metre lineout. What a game.

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Post by No 7&1/2 Sat 06 Jan 2024, 4:50 pm

And a try. Brilliant to and fro game.

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Post by Cumbrian Sat 06 Jan 2024, 4:52 pm

What a game down at Sandy Park.  Exeter haven't lost there in an ice age.  What is the GOT quote?  "Give me 15 good men an I'll impregnate..."

Loved watching it as a neutral.
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Post by WELL-PAST-IT Sat 06 Jan 2024, 4:55 pm

Saints are not a side to support if you have a dicky ticker
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Post by WELL-PAST-IT Sat 06 Jan 2024, 4:56 pm

Definitely a side to watch if you are a neutral, always exciting.
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Post by Heaf Sat 06 Jan 2024, 6:09 pm

Would have been better if they hadn't scored that last try though as I had Chiefs by 1 on Superbru, having supposedly learned my lesson for picking Tigers to beat them at home previously ....

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Post by doctor_grey Sat 06 Jan 2024, 7:57 pm

WTF was that?  Started to remind me of Harlequins run to the Premiership title a few years ago.

Sleightholme was so much better than merely scoring a Hat Trick on three medium to long range tries.

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Post by doctor_grey Sat 06 Jan 2024, 8:02 pm

WELL-PAST-IT wrote:Saints are not a side to support if you have a dicky ticker
Agree. Stay away if one is prone to coronary difficulties, aneurysm, or stroke.

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Post by No 7&1/2 Sun 07 Jan 2024, 3:04 pm

This new re discovered stand still deep under the opposition half on kicks is annoying. Hope the refs remember eventually that those players all need to be retreating not merely stood still to be legal from any 5 m run.

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Post by No 7&1/2 Sun 07 Jan 2024, 3:17 pm

Monye now quoting the same thing saying they're allowed to stand still. Not sure that's correct is it?


It's not correct. The player needs to immediately retreat. Fair few mistakes kn laws from the tnt commentary teams this week. 2 yesterday from Healey too.

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Post by No 7&1/2 Sun 07 Jan 2024, 3:32 pm

Lovely by de Glanville and Muir.

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Post by Heaf Sun 07 Jan 2024, 3:41 pm

This TMO seems keen to intervene on Bath's behalf but not so much when things in Glaws favour are missed ...

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Post by Heaf Sun 07 Jan 2024, 3:42 pm

No 7&1/2 wrote:Monye now quoting the same thing saying they're allowed to stand still. Not sure that's correct is it?


It's not correct. The player needs to immediately retreat. Fair few mistakes kn laws from the tnt commentary teams this week. 2 yesterday from Healey too.

I thought they only had to retreat outside the 10m?

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Post by No 7&1/2 Sun 07 Jan 2024, 3:44 pm

If you're ahead of the kicker you have to immediately retreat else its a pen. Anyone standing still is offside.

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Post by No 7&1/2 Sun 07 Jan 2024, 3:44 pm

Think it's 10 4 c.

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Post by Heaf Sun 07 Jan 2024, 3:47 pm

Was in front of a team-mate who kicked the ball and fails to retire immediately behind an onside team-mate or an imaginary line across the field 10 metres on that player’s side from where the ball is caught or lands, even if it hits a goal post or crossbar first. If this involves more than one player, then the player closest to where the ball lands or is caught is the one penalised. This is known as the 10-metre law and still applies if the ball touches or is played by an opponent but not when the kick is charged down.

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Post by No 7&1/2 Sun 07 Jan 2024, 3:51 pm

Heaf wrote:Was in front of a team-mate who kicked the ball and fails to retire immediately behind an onside team-mate or an imaginary line across the field 10 metres on that player’s side from where the ball is caught or lands, even if it hits a goal post or crossbar first. If this involves more than one player, then the player closest to where the ball lands or is caught is the one penalised. This is known as the 10-metre law and still applies if the ball touches or is played by an opponent but not when the kick is charged down.

And non of them are running back when it's kicked merely stood. So just enforce the law and start pinging them.

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Post by Heaf Sun 07 Jan 2024, 3:56 pm

But if they are already 10m away they don't have to - I realise that requires a level of judging where the ball is likely to land or be caught before it's actually happened and the law does need changing.

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Post by No 7&1/2 Sun 07 Jan 2024, 3:58 pm

Heaf wrote:But if they are already 10m away they don't have to - I realise that requires a level of judging where the ball is likely to land or be caught before it's actually happened and the law does need changing.

They have to be running back towards their own try line until it's caught or landed. Without that they're not immediately retreating. The law could be clearer granted but its there to be enforced now.

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Post by No 7&1/2 Sun 07 Jan 2024, 4:00 pm

Lol. Monye being diplomatic to the question of whether Muir should be in the endmgland conversation. Nicely side stepped when the answer is of course not.

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Post by No 7&1/2 Sun 07 Jan 2024, 4:10 pm

Why has the ref given a try if he didn't see it grounded? If he did we didn't see anything there to overturn the try.

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Post by No 7&1/2 Sun 07 Jan 2024, 4:14 pm

Bath seem to be on top but Russell is having an iffy game.

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