Mohammed Amir

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Mohammed Amir

Post by Guest on Thu 02 Feb 2012, 9:27 am

Mohammed Amir has been released after serving 3 of his 6 month prison sentence..

IMO the sentence wasnt long enough and now he has already been released, i find that a joke to be honest!

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Re: Mohammed Amir

Post by legendkillar on Thu 02 Feb 2012, 10:26 am

Well let's just see what he does from here.

I know when the accusations at the time were flying about that there was an element of sympathy with him from former players as Botham and Hussein. He was only 18 and if the stories are true that his family were threatened if he did not comply certainly adds to the sympathy he has.

Asif and Butt on the over hand were part of the set-up in a much larger scale.

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Re: Mohammed Amir

Post by Guest on Thu 02 Feb 2012, 10:39 am

legend, i know he was probably led astray by the older guys, and i said that originally...however he only got a 6-month sentence, which already IMO wasnt enough, but to only serve 3 is a joke!

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Re: Mohammed Amir

Post by legendkillar on Thu 02 Feb 2012, 10:51 am

In the grand scheme of things CF people would say people have done far worse and got away scot free. Like one Fred Goodwin. He didn't serve prison for mis-management of finance and the public trust.

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Re: Mohammed Amir

Post by Guest on Thu 02 Feb 2012, 10:53 am

i know they have however, this was a big deal, and these players should have been made an example of....i just cant get my head round the fact that he only had a short sentence and that he didnt even serve all of it...

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Re: Mohammed Amir

Post by dummy_half on Thu 02 Feb 2012, 10:54 am

CF
Sorry, but can you explain why a 6 month custodial sentence was not sufficient for what was really a fairly trivial crime (from the legal perspective, not the sporting one)?

Also, it is hardly a big surprise that he's only served half of the headline sentence - that's pretty much par for the course with UK prison sentences unless the prisoner's behaviour is such as to lead to it being extended.

Keeping people in prison is expensive, and it's not as though Amir presents a danger to society. In this case, I think the sporting sanctions imposed are much more significant than the legal ones.

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Re: Mohammed Amir

Post by legendkillar on Thu 02 Feb 2012, 10:55 am

CF for me he has served his punishment. A prison sentence and ban from cricket. What else do you want? Be-heading?

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Re: Mohammed Amir

Post by Fists of Fury on Thu 02 Feb 2012, 3:08 pm

I'm happy enough with the sentence that was passed.

As you may or may not know, those sentenced to less than four years jail are generally released after half of it upon license.

Amir did wrong (we are of course unsure of the truth in the threats to his family story), he was punished with a jail term along with a significant ban from the sport of cricket (his money making trade). As has been said, he is no threat to the public, and as such I don't see the issue with his release.

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Re: Mohammed Amir

Post by Guest on Thu 02 Feb 2012, 3:28 pm

hmmm well, everyone is certainly entitled to their opinon.

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Re: Mohammed Amir

Post by Fists of Fury on Thu 02 Feb 2012, 3:33 pm

Nobody said they weren't...just a few other opinions, that's all.

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Re: Mohammed Amir

Post by Guest on Thu 02 Feb 2012, 3:34 pm

i know mate i wasnt saying it in a huffy way, i was just saying it Smile

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Re: Mohammed Amir

Post by wadey101 on Thu 02 Feb 2012, 3:48 pm

CF, do you not fancy explaining why a 6 month custodial sentence was not sufficient for what was really a fairly trivial crime?

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Re: Mohammed Amir

Post by Guest on Thu 02 Feb 2012, 3:51 pm

i have said it so many times on the other spot-fixing threads!

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Re: Mohammed Amir

Post by Shelsey93 on Thu 02 Feb 2012, 5:50 pm

OK, he has served his prison sentence, but I hope that the rehabilitation and learning lessons process continues. He has quite a few years to go until he can play cricket again and needs to be doing something and the chances of finding work in cricket are remote at best.

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Re: Mohammed Amir

Post by Demon Racer on Thu 02 Feb 2012, 10:04 pm

With the correct help and support, I hope to see this kid play Test cricket again one day. He was led astray, by guys he looked up to, he was naive - but then again many teenagers are. He's done hiss time, he'll be 23 by the time his ban finishes, he could still play Test cricket for another 10-15 years and take 300-500 wickets. He was a once in a generation cricketer, I hope he can rekindle all we loved about him once upon a time.

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Re: Mohammed Amir

Post by Mike Selig on Thu 02 Feb 2012, 10:16 pm

I think 3 months is ample. In fact I think jail-time for such a crime excessive, but then I don't adhere to the Daily Mail religion of "prison works", so...

However I have to disagree with sentimentality which says he was young, led astray yada yada: he was 17 at the time and offered a vast amount of money in return to bowl some no-balls; he knew it was wrong, but did it anyway. No excuses for me.

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Re: Mohammed Amir

Post by Demon Racer on Thu 02 Feb 2012, 10:22 pm

Mike Selig wrote:I think 3 months is ample. In fact I think jail-time for such a crime excessive, but then I don't adhere to the Daily Mail religion of "prison works", so...

However I have to disagree with sentimentality which says he was young, led astray yada yada: he was 17 at the time and offered a vast amount of money in return to bowl some no-balls; he knew it was wrong, but did it anyway. No excuses for me.
Many of these sub continental players come from very poor backgrounds. Amir, once he become the new Pakistani superstar, was the mealcard for his entire family, inc cousins, uncles, plus any distant relations.

What he did was wrong, but he may have seen it as his only choice.

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Re: Mohammed Amir

Post by Mike Selig on Thu 02 Feb 2012, 10:43 pm

I'm not sure. Sometimes things are simpler than that, he had a choice: do the right thing or not.

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Re: Mohammed Amir

Post by Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler on Fri 03 Feb 2012, 8:48 am

Demon Racer wrote:
Mike Selig wrote:I think 3 months is ample. In fact I think jail-time for such a crime excessive, but then I don't adhere to the Daily Mail religion of "prison works", so...

However I have to disagree with sentimentality which says he was young, led astray yada yada: he was 17 at the time and offered a vast amount of money in return to bowl some no-balls; he knew it was wrong, but did it anyway. No excuses for me.
Many of these sub continental players come from very poor backgrounds. Amir, once he become the new Pakistani superstar, was the mealcard for his entire family, inc cousins, uncles, plus any distant relations.

What he did was wrong, but he may have seen it as his only choice.

Maybe we should just stop poor people form playing cricket then?

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Re: Mohammed Amir

Post by Guest on Fri 03 Feb 2012, 3:50 pm

i have no problem with amir playing cricket again, once he has served all his punishements, i have an issue however with him being released early.

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Re: Mohammed Amir

Post by Mike Selig on Fri 03 Feb 2012, 3:57 pm

cricketfan90 wrote:i have no problem with amir playing cricket again, once he has served all his punishements, i have an issue however with him being released early.

Why? What possible purpose would it serve to keep him in jail, other than cost us money and increase the likelihood of his re-offending (according to statistics)?

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Re: Mohammed Amir

Post by ShahenshahG on Fri 03 Feb 2012, 4:58 pm

I reckon ICC should hire bounty hunters everytime someones family is threatened. That way - Match Fixers get killed and everytime I buy a new house - I shall send a threat from a random name in pakistan and go on holiday for a month and then inform the ICC that the aforementioned person won't be threatening anyone again.

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Re: Mohammed Amir

Post by Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler on Fri 03 Feb 2012, 5:11 pm

Mike Selig wrote:
cricketfan90 wrote:i have no problem with amir playing cricket again, once he has served all his punishements, i have an issue however with him being released early.

Why? What possible purpose would it serve to keep him in jail, other than cost us money and increase the likelihood of his re-offending (according to statistics)?

Mike, you could say the same for letting him back in the Pakistan side.

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Re: Mohammed Amir

Post by gboycottnut on Sat 04 Feb 2012, 11:28 am

Mike Selig wrote:I think 3 months is ample. In fact I think jail-time for such a crime excessive, but then I don't adhere to the Daily Mail religion of "prison works", so...

However I have to disagree with sentimentality which says he was young, led astray yada yada: he was 17 at the time and offered a vast amount of money in return to bowl some no-balls; he knew it was wrong, but did it anyway. No excuses for me.

Agree there. The fact that he accepted this money in return for bowling these no-balls showed that he was fully aware of what he was doing, although he may not have know what the consequences would be if he was caught or found out. Anyway in my opinion he was old enough to know what he was doing from the outset.

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Re: Mohammed Amir

Post by Corporalhumblebucket on Sat 04 Feb 2012, 12:33 pm

I think 3 months in the jug is about right. The stigma of that plus the cricket ban is quite a big deal.

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Re: Mohammed Amir

Post by wadey101 on Sat 04 Feb 2012, 12:43 pm

CF, do you not realise that almost everyone that goes to prison only serve half of their sentence? Amir is not getting special treatment by being released after 3 months. It's not like he is going to cause any harm to anyone so what is the point in keeping him in prison for longer and costing us more money?

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Re: Mohammed Amir

Post by guildfordbat on Sat 04 Feb 2012, 1:19 pm

There seem various conflicting views on this one. Allow me to throw in a compromise solution.

I don't claim any great expertise but am a former student in Criminal Law which perhaps helps me to consider matters in a wider context and outside the (cricket) box.

I would have suggested that Amir should not have been sentenced to prison at all. Instead, and I realise this may sound a little drastic at first, I would have had one of his hands chopped off.

I would expect Mike, in particular, to welcome this as he has rightly warned of the disadvantages of imprisonment. Through following my suggestion, the State saves the considerable cost of imprisonment and Amir picks up no further bad habits there.

I would also expect CF to welcome my suggestion. By not sentencing Amir to imprisonment, there are no issues about when he should be released.

Amir should also appreciate his involvement with my suggestion. Not wishing to be unduly harsh, I would give Amir the choice of which hand to lose. I realise that will be seen as too soft an option by some but I did say at outset that this was all about compromise.

Some may also criticise my approach for sparing Amir the stigma of imprisonment which the Corporal recognises and appears to cruelly advocate.

The Pakistan Test team should also approve of this suggestion as there is no international ban involved. However, and even if I say so myself this is the beauty of my compromise solution, Pakistan and Amir would be disadvantaged by being one hand short, albeit the lesser one. All right thinking people would naturally take comfort from this as demonstration of the adage ''cheats never prosper''.

I really think I've cracked it ....

Excuse me, there's a knock at the door. It's our normally friendly moderator Fists. For some reason, he's returned early from his ski-ing holiday and doesn't look too approving .... Very Happy

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Re: Mohammed Amir

Post by ShahenshahG on Sat 04 Feb 2012, 1:24 pm

Bleeding heart guildford. One day you'll realise - spare the rod spoil the child (or remain unsatisfied - whichever is applicable)

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Re: Mohammed Amir

Post by Mike Selig on Sat 04 Feb 2012, 10:28 pm

Guilford, not wishing to argue the merits of a punitive justice system right now, but rest assured cutting off his right hand would severely hinder his bowling...

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Re: Mohammed Amir

Post by guildfordbat on Sat 04 Feb 2012, 11:14 pm

Mike, I thought that might attract your attention. Very Happy

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Re: Mohammed Amir

Post by rich1uk on Sun 05 Feb 2012, 12:34 am

cutting off one hand might give him a chance of batting in the top6 for england atm tho

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Re: Mohammed Amir

Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Fri 01 Jan 2016, 11:02 am

He's back in the Pakistan odi squad against New Zealand
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Re: Mohammed Amir

Post by LondonTiger on Fri 01 Jan 2016, 1:12 pm

Olly wrote:He's back in the Pakistan odi squad against New Zealand

I may be in the minority, but I am glad to see him back. I thought he was harshly dealt with by the authorities who chose to give near identical sentence to Salman Butt - who was the skipper, instigator and basicly bullied Amir into this. Seems to me people chose to ignore just how patriarchal Pakistan cricket was/is in their rush to condemn a naive young man.

People deserve a second chance.

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Re: Mohammed Amir

Post by Mad for Chelsea on Fri 01 Jan 2016, 1:50 pm

While I don't agree that he was harshly treated, equally I'm perfectly happy to see him back. As LT says, people deserve a second chance, in fact surely that is a large part of having a judiciary system in the first place? Amir has served his time, and from all accounts could only be considered rehabilitated, in that he understands that what he did was wrong, has taken responsibility and apologised for his actions. With that in mind, I have no problems with him playing for Pakistan again.

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Re: Mohammed Amir

Post by kingraf on Fri 01 Jan 2016, 3:39 pm

I'm not sure he should have gotten jail time for the offence but whatevs. As for the current situation. I've always been a fan of him making a come back (Asif as well for what it's worth) but looking at the current state of affairs I'm not sure if him coming back will be good for the team. You've already had the ODI captain and heir apoarent apparent to the Test gig tender his resignation over his selection whike while Hafeez, who would probably have been Pakistan's player of the year across all formats had they had such a thing, has already refised to play with him or even be in the same camp as him. They've both since recanted of course, but its almost certainly the kind of recall that can fracture a team*

*Unless he performs well and Pakistan are winning. Nothing can hide deep rooted problems like winning
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Re: Mohammed Amir

Post by GSC on Fri 01 Jan 2016, 3:54 pm

I don't think he should've played professionally again, but hes served his time. People have done worse in sports and been accepted by teammates if not loved, so get on with it.
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Re: Mohammed Amir

Post by Dolphin Ziggler on Fri 01 Jan 2016, 4:11 pm

Happy he's back. Hes still only 23 years old, yet I'd imagine hes now matured beyond his years.

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Re: Mohammed Amir

Post by Duty281 on Fri 01 Jan 2016, 4:31 pm

Should have been given a lifetime ban from the sport.

The only conceivable way to prevent this cancer, which so infests this once-noble game, is to terrify any potential spot-fixers.

A lifetime ban sends out a clear message - a message that such actions will not be tolerated. Otherwise you end up with weak-willed governance; the like which has rendered athletics to be in such an abominable state.

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Re: Mohammed Amir

Post by LondonTiger on Fri 01 Jan 2016, 5:39 pm

Salman Butt should have had a lifetime ban.

A 17 yo, from a culture where you do what you told, who then did what his skipper told him to, and was only offered money after the event - well if that is what you feel I guess then that is up to you. Needless to say I disagree 100% - but then not being perfect myself I am willing to forgive mistakes.


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Re: Mohammed Amir

Post by Good Golly I'm Olly on Fri 01 Jan 2016, 10:01 pm

Everyone should get a second chance if they've done their punishment

As for his cricket itself, I hope he's still good. Because I think people forget just how good this kid was!

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=P-8JR2qVWF8

I'll always remember the ball to Johnson in this match (about 6:10 into the link above) - just incredible that a 17 year old (17!!) Could do that
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Re: Mohammed Amir

Post by SimonofSurrey on Sat 02 Jan 2016, 12:44 pm

Great young talent but will everyone be happy he's back? I wouldn't bet on it.

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Re: Mohammed Amir

Post by alfie on Sat 02 Jan 2016, 2:16 pm

If they'd cut off his hand when guildford first suggested it we wouldn't have to discuss it now...

I think it is reasonable to give a man a second chance - after serving a fairly strong penance ! However I can also see why some former teammates aren't happy about his returning. Raf has a point about Pakistan being a pretty tight unit at present and the potential for this to disrupt things.
I'd probably have kept him waiting a bit longer.

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Re: Mohammed Amir

Post by Hammersmith harrier on Sat 02 Jan 2016, 2:19 pm

I don't believe in second chances to be honest when it comes to things like this; he, Butt and Asif should have received lifetime bans.

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