Hibbard Best in Europe?

by RuggerRadge2611 Thu 17 Jan 2013, 10:48 am

Another piece of BBC hyperbole. Although they are quoting the Osprey's coach. Although I am concerned at what they put in the water down in Swansea to draw such a crazy comment.

I would say he isn't even the best hooker in Wales let alone in Europe...

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/rugby-union/21047775

Wales hooker Richard Hibbard has been dubbed the "best hooker in Europe" and tipped to make the British and Irish Lions tour to Australia.

Ospreys coach Jonathan Humphreys insisted Hibbard more than matches any hooker in the rest of the Six Nations.

"I think he is the best hooker in Europe," said Humphreys, a former Wales hooker himself who won 35 caps.

Hibbard hopes to be fit for Wales' Six Nations opener against Ireland on 2 February despite a shoulder injury.

Asked if he would pick Hibbard, who has been selected alongside Scarlets hookers Matthew Rees and Ken Owens in Wales' 35-man Six Nations squad, on the Lions tour, Humphreys said: "If it was up to me to pick it - yes."

As a former Cardiff hooker and ex-Wales captain, Humphreys is well placed to make his judgment of 29-year-old Hibbard.

He has been impressed by Hibbard's commitment to the Ospreys' cause in recent weeks despite carrying a shoulder problem he originally picked up winning his 19th Wales cap against Samoa last November.

"You have got to bear in mind he came back in less than half the time [the medical staff] said.

"We have people out for 10 weeks and he came back in three."

It was only 12 months ago that Scott Johnson, the then Ospreys director rugby, questioned Hibbard's fitness after he was left out of Wales' squad for the 2012 Six Nations.

But Hibbard has come a long way since then and made Wales' three-Test summer tour of Australia in 2012.

"I'm biased but I spend my life looking at opposition, looking at other hookers' strength and weaknesses," said Humphreys.

"The kid is 112kg, phenomenally aggressive, outstanding at set piece. What more do you want? The kid can change games. He is very important to us [the Ospreys]."

Hibbard played in the 15-15 Heineken Cup draw with Leicester Tigers on Saturday before coming off 21 minutes from time with the shoulder problem.

"I thought he was phenomenal on the weekend," added Humphreys.

"Here is a kid who has got a bad shoulder. We had to manage it all week and the first couple of minutes in the game he is smashing into people.

"He's a loyal kid. He wants to play. He wants to do his best.

"With one shoulder he was phenomenal on the weekend and I hope he starts for Wales."

by BlueNote Thu 17 Jan 2013, 10:51 am

I don't think it's crazy. He is the best hooker in Wales at the moment. Whether he's the best hooker in Europe I'm not so sure, but he is a candidate.

by Cyril Thu 17 Jan 2013, 10:53 am

Thing is, this is what coaches do. Humphreys probably doesn't believe it himself but is trying to give the lad some confidence.

Given how he was treated by the Welsh management and fellow players after losing to Aus in the summer he probably needs a bit of a boost.

“I knew the management were angry with me, none of them spoke to me – and neither did a few of the players after the game."

http://www.therugbypaper.co.uk/featured-post/3000/ospreys-hooker-richard-hibbard-hurt-by-fingers-of-blame-but-points-to-future/

He's a fair way down in terms of being the best hooker in Europe, but he's decent. I very much doubt he'll make the Lions squad though.

by thebluesmancometh Thu 17 Jan 2013, 10:54 am

Who would you pick for Lions Hook cyril?

It wouldn't be Best, Ford, Hibbard?

by BlueNote Thu 17 Jan 2013, 10:56 am

"I very much doubt he'll make the Lions squad though.."

If he stays fit and keeps his form for a good part of the 6 Nations, I disagree.

by TJ1 Thu 17 Jan 2013, 11:06 am

He looked pretty impressive to me -

by RubyGuby Thu 17 Jan 2013, 11:15 am

He's a very good hooker but I'd have him on about the same level as Englands new boy Youngs. Both great in the loose, strong and powerful runners. Both a bit suspect with their throwing in. Anyone listening to Jonathan Humphreys players' apprasals is bananas. If he had said that Hibbard's one of the best in europe then fair enough, no embarassment, this sort of rubbish just motivates your opponents and sets your own team up for a fall. Typical naive welsh management speak yet again. furious

by Cyril Thu 17 Jan 2013, 11:26 am

thebluesmancometh wrote:Who would you pick for Lions Hook cyril?

It wouldn't be Best, Ford, Hibbard?

It would definitely be Best, probably Ford and one of Hartley/Youngs. Not Hibbard at this stage. He's in the next group that may get a look in with loss of form/injuries.

by TJ1 Thu 17 Jan 2013, 11:42 am

Ford will have to have a good 6N to be considered. Last year a certainty, this year lost his way badly.

best in europe? Schalk Brits and Dimitri Szarzewski admittedly neither is eligible for the lions

by UlstermaninGlasgow Thu 17 Jan 2013, 11:44 am

Rory Best is the standout at the minute, with the group of Ford, Hartley, Youngs, Hibbard and Strauss behind him. Hibbard has impressed as has Youngs while Ford is going backwards at a rate of knots... Probably won't be starting for Scotland in the 6N too...

by BlueNote Thu 17 Jan 2013, 11:46 am

I think Ulsterman is spot on there. Although I am not a great fan of Hartley.

by Triangulation Thu 17 Jan 2013, 11:57 am

This is typical Welsh one eyed hyperbole. They're all the best in the world sometimes even when they lose.

And why the hell does Humphreys keep referring to Hibbard as "kid". Read the comments! It's "kid" this and "kid" that.

Hibbard is no the best in europe and he's 29 years old FFS.

The welsh and reality have never been the best of friends when it comes to evaluating their own.

by RubyGuby Thu 17 Jan 2013, 12:00 pm

Triangulation, most welsh fans would not have this view, you should not attach, "the welsh and reality" to the thread, that's wrong and serves no purpose other than to devalue your comments. My post above will be indicative of 99% of welsh fans thumbsup

by Triangulation Thu 17 Jan 2013, 12:15 pm

RubyGuby wrote:Triangulation, most welsh fans would not have this view, you should not attach, "the welsh and reality" to the thread, that's wrong and serves no purpose other than to devalue your comments. My post above will be indicative of 99% of welsh fans

Sorry. I apologise for gross generalisation and for overreacting.

It just nearly killed me as i choked on my cornflakes this morning.

by Standulstermen Thu 17 Jan 2013, 12:26 pm

Coach in talking up his own player shock! It's like Humphreys thinks this praise might have a positive effect on his game! How very dare he!

by RubyGuby Thu 17 Jan 2013, 1:00 pm

Triangulation wrote:
RubyGuby wrote:Triangulation, most welsh fans would not have this view, you should not attach, "the welsh and reality" to the thread, that's wrong and serves no purpose other than to devalue your comments. My post above will be indicative of 99% of welsh fans

Sorry. I apologise for gross generalisation and for overreacting.

It just nearly killed me as i choked on my cornflakes this morning.

This sort of boxxcks from Humphreys does no one any favours - it angers me as it just illustrates the naiveity behind a lot of welsh management by x players. A seasoned and mature coach would have said something on the lines of, "he's up there with some of the best in europe on his day" - That then gives the player an opportunity to improve on his performance etc. In all honesty, Hibbard will be embarassed by the comments as he knows he has so much to prove as he has yet to be Wales's number 1 hooker never mind the best in fecking europe furious

by bedfordwelsh Thu 17 Jan 2013, 1:08 pm

Despite me never having been convinced in the past, hes certainly best in Wales on current form though I still think Rees has lot to offer

by funnyExiledScot Thu 17 Jan 2013, 1:08 pm

I'd be looking to Best, Hartley and Youngs for the moment as my Lions trio.

Ford is way off his game, I haven't seen Rees in ages and whilst I am a fan of Hibbard, I think he needs to play well to topple the three I list above.

Don't have an issue with coaches talking up their own players. It's when Guscott starts talking players up that they have to worry!

by Triangulation Thu 17 Jan 2013, 1:09 pm

Standulstermen wrote:Coach in talking up his own player shock! It's like Humphreys thinks this praise might have a positive effect on his game! How very dare he!

Is that what he was doing is it Standulstermen?

It read more like he was pushing him forwards for Wales and Lions selection.

Frankly if Hibbard needed his tyres to be pumped up in this fashione in order to up his game then that would be a little odd for a 29 year old "kid" would it not?

No Stand, i think you're wrong.

I think RubyGuby is right.

by Luckless Pedestrian Thu 17 Jan 2013, 1:33 pm

I just wish he'd have a haircut.

by Cyril Thu 17 Jan 2013, 1:36 pm

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:I just wish he'd have a haircut.

So you can stick it on your hair shirt?

by Luckless Pedestrian Thu 17 Jan 2013, 1:38 pm

Now there's an idea!

by munkian Thu 17 Jan 2013, 1:44 pm

Player's coach says hes the best in his position shocker Erm

by RuggerRadge2611 Thu 17 Jan 2013, 1:50 pm

munkian wrote:Player's coach says hes the best in his position shocker

I beleive PDV said the same thing about Smit in the RWC and I'm sure smit quipped "Yeah and my Mrs thinks I'm the most handsome man in the world too".

by funnyExiledScot Thu 17 Jan 2013, 1:52 pm

Not sure even Mrs Hibbard would say that about him though....

by munkian Thu 17 Jan 2013, 1:53 pm

Did he gouge her too ?

by funnyExiledScot Thu 17 Jan 2013, 1:54 pm

Harsh!

by munkian Thu 17 Jan 2013, 2:08 pm

funnyExiledScot wrote:Harsh!

To be fair, it was a 50/50 call for a South African International player...

by RuggerRadge2611 Thu 17 Jan 2013, 2:31 pm

Heard he was going to be part of a major advertising campaign for Apple.

They have pioneered a brand new mp3 player called the iGouge apprently.

by Morgannwg Thu 17 Jan 2013, 2:33 pm

Not the best in europe, but probably the best in Wales, Scotland and England right now. Jealousy is a terrible, terrible thing.

thumbsup

by RuggerRadge2611 Thu 17 Jan 2013, 2:39 pm

Best, Youngs, Heartly, Rees and when he has his act together Ford I would say are all better players.

Ford's recent poor showings have opened the door for the Dynamic and young (by hooker standards) MacArthur in the Scotland camp.

Anyone who has seen anything of Glasgow this season will know that their set pieces are rock solid, a lot of that is to do with MacArthur's accurate darts in the line and strength in the scrum.

I'm not trying to say Hibbard is a bad player, that would be unfair. However I do think in Europe there are much better players, Szarzewski, Best and Heartly all spring to mind.

I still think Matt Rees offers a lot more too.

by Morgannwg Thu 17 Jan 2013, 2:46 pm

He's the best in Wales on form. He is better than all the Scottish hookers on form. Youngs is good, but I don't think he is better yet. I would need to see him become an England regular first. Hartley didn't feature in the autumn and since returning for Northampton has looked to have gone backwards. He has also got himself banned and is behind Youngs in my view. Therefore Hibbs is the best of what England, Wales and Scotland have to offer and a Lions squad member. Please cut out the bitter jealousy.

by RuggerRadge2611 Thu 17 Jan 2013, 2:59 pm

Morgannwg wrote:He's the best in Wales on form. He is better than all the Scottish hookers on form. Youngs is good, but I don't think he is better yet. I would need to see him become an England regular first. Hartley didn't feature in the autumn and since returning for Northampton has looked to have gone backwards. He has also got himself banned and is behind Youngs in my view. Therefore Hibbs is the best of what England, Wales and Scotland have to offer and a Lions squad member. Please cut out the bitter jealousy.

Not only are you not using any facts or examples to state why you think he is better you also feel more comfortable claiming I am bitter and jealous.... Headscratch

Away from personal insults and fabricated statements I would like to know why you think he is so high in not only the Wales pecking order but also why you think he'll displace far better and far more experienced hookers for the Lions?

Sure enough the acid test will be the 6N and there is a lot of competitive rugby to be played between now and then. I'm not saying he doesn't deserve plaudits, he is playing well but I think chill pills are in order. Wales Line out and Scrum was destroyed in the Autumn series, the lineout barely worked (save for that wonderful 14 man maul against NZ) and the scrum was crushed every time. So please enlighten me as to why he is so highly thought of.

by munkian Thu 17 Jan 2013, 2:59 pm

Hartley is a penalty giving bully and no where near the best in Europe

by Effervescing Elephant Thu 17 Jan 2013, 3:21 pm

I'm fairly sure Hartley isn't a referee.

by RubyGuby Thu 17 Jan 2013, 3:27 pm

I don't think Hartley is as sure as you EE thumbsup

by RuggerRadge2611 Thu 17 Jan 2013, 3:28 pm

I personally think Szarzewski or Best are the best hookers in Europe.

by Luckless Pedestrian Thu 17 Jan 2013, 3:30 pm

I think Ken Owens could yet force his way into the Lions mix.

by RuggerRadge2611 Thu 17 Jan 2013, 3:35 pm

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:I think Ken Owens could yet force his way into the Lions mix.

+1

by BlueNote Thu 17 Jan 2013, 3:51 pm

Hibbard won the head-to-head with Owens in the autumn (contrary to what I expected). Hibbard is a player who had great promise in the past, but let himself down with his fitness and his technical skills (I'm thinking lineout in particular, also he was too prone to technical offences at the breakdown). He seems to have got on top of those, which makes him pretty formidable.

It's not the same as Best, who has been at least at that level more consistently over a long period (when not injured). But I think he's being underestimated by some, maybe not surprisingly given his past.

by Morgannwg Thu 17 Jan 2013, 3:52 pm

RuggerRadge2611 wrote:
Morgannwg wrote:He's the best in Wales on form. He is better than all the Scottish hookers on form. Youngs is good, but I don't think he is better yet. I would need to see him become an England regular first. Hartley didn't feature in the autumn and since returning for Northampton has looked to have gone backwards. He has also got himself banned and is behind Youngs in my view. Therefore Hibbs is the best of what England, Wales and Scotland have to offer and a Lions squad member. Please cut out the bitter jealousy.

Not only are you not using any facts or examples to state why you think he is better you also feel more comfortable claiming I am bitter and jealous....

Away from personal insults and fabricated statements I would like to know why you think he is so high in not only the Wales pecking order but also why you think he'll displace far better and far more experienced hookers for the Lions?

Sure enough the acid test will be the 6N and there is a lot of competitive rugby to be played between now and then. I'm not saying he doesn't deserve plaudits, he is playing well but I think chill pills are in order. Wales Line out and Scrum was destroyed in the Autumn series, the lineout barely worked (save for that wonderful 14 man maul against NZ) and the scrum was crushed every time. So please enlighten me as to why he is so highly thought of.

Well what facts have you produced? Obviously jealous to be posting such a bitter article. Get over it ffs.

Secondly, you're wrong about the scrum and lineout being destroyed. Claims such as "the scrum was crushed every time" is a load of unsubstantiated bolox. Plus, Hibbard barely played. He was wrongfully overlooked as a starter for the first test, and got injured in the opening quarter of the second test. So yeah, these mystery lineouts and scrums that were destroyed at every single lineout and scrum were all Hibbards fault....

by munkian Thu 17 Jan 2013, 3:59 pm

Least we didnt have to face the mighty Tongan scrum...

by Scrumpy Thu 17 Jan 2013, 4:05 pm

I'd still put Best above him, but sometimes a player develops at a different rate, there is nothing to say Hibbard couldn't go on and be the best and most consistent hooker in Europe for a few years to come, but as always injuries and form will always play a part.

by RuggerRadge2611 Thu 17 Jan 2013, 4:07 pm

munkian wrote:Least we didnt have to face the mighty Tongan scrum...

Yep... you faced the mighty Samoan Scrum and what a bang up job you did too. When I last checked Scotland's Scrum did pretty well against South Africa and New Zealand.

It's a shame that we can't have a good discussion about this without you guys resorting to posts like that and the post previous to it.

I'm stating my opinion... nothing more. It is my opinion that Ken Owens and Matt Rees are better players than Hibbard, it's ok for me to disagree with you and it's ok for you to disagree with me. What bothers me is the childish level you guys have dragged this down to.

Ok I concede Morgannwg, after checking it up Hibbard didn't play as big a part in the Autumn as I thought, he seemingly made a brief cameo against Samoa and retired. However in the times I have seen Hibbard play (with the exception of last weekend) I have felt that the other hookers in Wales have more to offer. I can't say it any plainer.

by munkian Thu 17 Jan 2013, 4:09 pm

He's played very well for the Ospreys this season Radge, especially against Leinster.

And can't really judge our scrum on the Autumn tests with the amount of forwards we were missing.

by Morgannwg Thu 17 Jan 2013, 4:12 pm

Well yeah Samoa have improved in every aspect, in particular the scrum. And it's no surprise, look at the players they have. Oh so Scotland eradicated SA and NZ off the park then? I guess that's the issue of the Lions captian and Lions XV solved.

And, I was basing what I said on playing form, domestic league and european cup. Out of the Lions qualified hookers in Wales, England and Scotland I think Hibbard is the best. I'm looking forward to seeing him play in the 6 Nations but I also have a feeling his dodgy shoulder will get worse midway through the tournament and require surgery.

by RuggerRadge2611 Thu 17 Jan 2013, 4:16 pm

Morgannwg wrote:Well yeah Samoa have improved in every aspect, in particular the scrum. And it's no surprise, look at the players they have. Oh so Scotland eradicated SA and NZ off the park then? I guess that's the issue of the Lions captian and Lions XV solved.

And, I was basing what I said on playing form, domestic league and european cup. Out of the Lions qualified hookers in Wales, England and Scotland I think Hibbard is the best. I'm looking forward to seeing him play in the 6 Nations but I also have a feeling his dodgy shoulder will get worse midway through the tournament and require surgery.

Under those condtitions you still think him a Lions candidate? picard

Also I didn't say anything like the Scottish Scrum eradicated NZ or SA. Again a bizzare fabrication.

In truth (although off topic) I think Scotland will produce only a handful of Lions players, however I think some of them will be likely starters. Gray and Hines being 2 of them, Visser another, Brown and Beattie being the others.

by Cyril Thu 17 Jan 2013, 4:18 pm

Morgannwg wrote:And, I was basing what I said on playing form, domestic league and european cup. Out of the Lions qualified hookers in Wales, England and Scotland I think Hibbard is the best.

Well, there's the rub. It's just opinion. There's no need to get so aggressive if other posters don't agree with you.

by munkian Thu 17 Jan 2013, 4:20 pm

Has Gray done anything of note since crossing the border though ?

Hes always been hyped but has he produced anything ?

by RuggerRadge2611 Thu 17 Jan 2013, 4:20 pm

munkian wrote:Has Gray done anything of note since crossing the border though ?

Hes always been hyped but has he produced anything ?

Sale have been dire but he was Excellent in the Autumn for Scotland.

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