The Incontinentia Nine Chins Woods Depreciation Thread.

[super_realist]

As stated above.

Events at The Masters seem to have changed a few minds on the great man.

Share your views with the class.

[Bob_the_Job]

Setting aside the "should he/shouldn't he have been DQ'd" debate....

A solid if uninspiring performance from him - scored pretty well without ever seeming to catch fire. It was like he'd could no longer find the overdrive button like he used to.

[pedro]

A mediocre Woods almost winning. Scary.

[incontinentia]

1/???

May I say how delighted I am to see the bald, 9-chinned one crash and burn at the Masters. Quite fitting, after Woods took a massive steaming dump on the rule book over the weekend. He also gave a golden shower to golfers and fans all over the globe.

[Gareth_NI]

Disliked him before the Masters, little has changed since. Putter didn't seem to be quite as hot as his earlier wins this season.

FWIW he was well within his right to complete the final two rounds, don't think any other competitor would have DQ'd themselves after the powers that be bottled it and deemed it appropriate to simply dock him 2 shots.

[super_realist]

1/???

May I say how delighted I am to see the bald, 9-chinned one crash and burn at the Masters. Quite fitting, after Woods took a massive steaming dump on the rule book over the weekend. He also gave a golden shower to golfers and fans all over the globe.

I think you've caught Superitis.

[mystiroakey]

I love it-- INCONT and SUPER have switched minds


But in this case great post Incont

[Skydriver]

A mediocre Woods almost winning. Scary.

Agreed - seeing as you could take the view he was extremely unlucky to lose effectively 4 shots for the Watergate incident on Friday.

But hey - I'm not sure what the heck to think, as it now looks like we're in some kind of parallel universe on this board...

[pedro]

A mediocre Woods almost winning. Scary.

Agreed - seeing as you could take the view he was extremely unlucky to lose effectively 4 shots for the Watergate incident on Friday.

But hey - I'm not sure what the heck to think, as it now looks like we're in some kind of parallel universe on this board...

I know, just trying to provide some balance.

[NedB-H]

A mediocre Woods almost winning. Scary.

Agreed - seeing as you could take the view he was extremely unlucky to lose effectively 4 shots for the Watergate incident on Friday.

But hey - I'm not sure what the heck to think, as it now looks like we're in some kind of parallel universe on this board...

I don't agree. I didn't see a huge amount of his play, on account of liking the guy about as much as super, but what I did see was someone playing pretty well, with the odd wild shot. Certainly wouldn't describe it as "mediocre", except if you're comparing to the 2005-era Woods. Forget the two-shot penalty, cos you don't know how he'd have played if he'd been closer to the lead at the weekend, and anyway plenty of people have won golf tournaments after taking penalty shots. He had a pretty good week, played fairly well, and was a few bad swings and a couple of dubious putts away from being one of the genuine Sunday leaders. Fairly unremarkable.

Also don't see why anyone would have changed their opinion of him based on the penalty shots incident. I don't think anyone seriously thinks the original infringement was intentional. And it's not like he'd have been disqualifying himself by calling an infringement that hadn't been spotted, like plenty of people have done before now. He was unsure of the situation, left it to the officials, and they decided he'd incurred a two shot penalty. You can moan about their decision, but people seem to have wanted Woods to say "no, you might be the rulemakers but I think you're wrong and I should be disqualifed" - find me a golfer in the world who would do that, after the decision had been confirmed.

[mystiroakey]

NedBH i for one think a lot less of him.

Not for being a cheat.

Not neccesarily for playing on.

But for not knowing this rule, or just simply not caring enough to think,and having a cady that doesnt know ,care,be to scared or disinterested to tell him..

I also think a lot less of the masters commitee- for lets be honest here not applying rules correctly.. The more important issue is why did they do this?

[NedB-H]

He's not the first to not know a rule he should though mysti, and as someone said it probably messed with his head a bit more that he'd gone in the drink off a shot that looked perfect. Bit different to just shanking it straight into the lake.

Don't think I could think any less of the Masters committee than I already do!

[gaelgowfer]

Am I the only person who thinks Tiger Woods missed an opportunity to demonstrate that he is a changed man?

Given the fiasco that followed, surely he must have at least have considered a win would forever be tainted. Therefore, given he is only interested in wins, why play on? In withdrawing from the tournament, he could've given a nice speech about protecting the integrity of the game and gone home armed with a few 'respect' plaudits in his back pocket.

He didn't and now I'm thinking, same old Tiger.

[super_realist]

You should have withdrawn from the Masters competition

[barragan]

[Diggers]

Am I the only person who thinks Tiger Woods missed an opportunity to demonstrate that he is a changed man?

Given the fiasco that followed, surely he must have at least have considered a win would forever be tainted. Therefore, given he is only interested in wins, why play on? In withdrawing from the tournament, he could've given a nice speech about protecting the integrity of the game and gone home armed with a few 'respect' plaudits in his back pocket.

He didn't and now I'm thinking, same old Tiger.

I dont see why he needs to blur the lines between sport and his personal life Gael. Golf is his profession, as far as I know his integrity on the golf course has never been in question before in relation to the rules. On that basis he has no need to show he is a changed man.
He made some personal mistakes and he has moved on.....thats it, we shouldnt be naymopre interested in his personal life than the next golfer.

[incontinentia]

Tiger allowed spectators to move a huge boulder away from his ball in competion before, there's no way any honourable golfer would allow such a thing to happen. Woods isnt a cheater but he has no respect for the spirit of the game imo

[monty junior]

Diggers ,you must know that nobody judging him has never made any mistakes in their personal lives. I frankly couldn't care less, he's a great golfer, that's what i watch him for.

[Skydriver]

In contrast (to this and perhaps incidents such as Monty's infamous "Jakartagate"), there's a passage in Darren Clarke's autobiography about his approach on one occasion some years ago.

The situation was that he had ended up in the cabbage with no shot, when thunderstorms caused a halt to play. Strangely, when he returned to the ball the next day, it was magically now on a perfect lie - Clarke suspected that some fans of his had perhaps moved it to "help" him out, misguided though this may have been. Tour officials were asked about the situation, and confirmed there was no problem - play as it lies, Mr Clarke. Darren proceeded to chip out sideways. Was awarded European Tour shot of the month, although this would have looked very odd out of context.

[McLaren]

"Woods isnt a cheater but he has no respect for the spirit of the game imo"

Strange you should say that, I am not sure the current set of rules have much respect for the spirit of the game.

[gaelgowfer]

Am I the only person who thinks Tiger Woods missed an opportunity to demonstrate that he is a changed man?

Given the fiasco that followed, surely he must have at least have considered a win would forever be tainted. Therefore, given he is only interested in wins, why play on? In withdrawing from the tournament, he could've given a nice speech about protecting the integrity of the game and gone home armed with a few 'respect' plaudits in his back pocket.

He didn't and now I'm thinking, same old Tiger.

I dont see why he needs to blur the lines between sport and his personal life Gael. Golf is his profession, as far as I know his integrity on the golf course has never been in question before in relation to the rules. On that basis he has no need to show he is a changed man.
He made some personal mistakes and he has moved on.....thats it, we shouldnt be naymopre interested in his personal life than the next golfer.

It never fails to amaze me how the male mind consistently manages to compartmentalize human behaviour.

[mystiroakey]

Gael.

My GF shocks me - She knows all the sports stars that I do. however she knows who there children are and the crazy nameds they have, Who they married last year. What they ate yesterday for breakfast.

I only truely care and know about the sport they play.

Women are crazy- How could you lot understand..

[barragan]

[Plunky]

You didn't know that Jason Day has a son called Dash ?!

[Diggers]

Am I the only person who thinks Tiger Woods missed an opportunity to demonstrate that he is a changed man?

Given the fiasco that followed, surely he must have at least have considered a win would forever be tainted. Therefore, given he is only interested in wins, why play on? In withdrawing from the tournament, he could've given a nice speech about protecting the integrity of the game and gone home armed with a few 'respect' plaudits in his back pocket.

He didn't and now I'm thinking, same old Tiger.

I dont see why he needs to blur the lines between sport and his personal life Gael. Golf is his profession, as far as I know his integrity on the golf course has never been in question before in relation to the rules. On that basis he has no need to show he is a changed man.
He made some personal mistakes and he has moved on.....thats it, we shouldnt be naymopre interested in his personal life than the next golfer.

It never fails to amaze me how the male mind consistently manages to compartmentalize human behaviour.

It's called logic.

[Tiler76]

Am I the only person who thinks Tiger Woods missed an opportunity to demonstrate that he is a changed man?

No, you're not. I'm not sure it would have demonstrated he is a "changed man", and Woods' harshest critics would still find a reason a criticise, probably letting down the sponsors, committee, etc, but I do feel he missed an opportunity to take the moral high ground for a change.

General consensus seems to be that he should have been disqualified by the letter of the law as it stands today, whether that law needs changing is a separate issue for the future. Tiger knows he signed for an incorrect score, and that penalty would normally be DQ. So whilst the committee gave him an easy out with their decision, and I don't necessarily think he should have withdrawn, it was definitely a missed opportunity for some positive press for a change, IMO.

[MontysMerkin]

Having been told it was a 2 shot pen and not a DQ why the heck would he withdraw? Be like saying Oh I'm not going to play any more, let someone else have a chance of winning for a change... (as in just as ridiculous)

[pedro]

Just want to add that yes, golf is his work, but 90% of his income comes from ads, sponsorships, PR etc. How he acts as a person has a great influence on these 90%. So a clever business move might have been to WD?

[mystiroakey]

Pedro

I agree with that sentiment and faldos original point that he should WD to boost his public image!

[gaelgowfer]

Am I the only person who thinks Tiger Woods missed an opportunity to demonstrate that he is a changed man?

No, you're not. I'm not sure it would have demonstrated he is a "changed man", and Woods' harshest critics would still find a reason a criticise, probably letting down the sponsors, committee, etc, but I do feel he missed an opportunity to take the moral high ground for a change.

General consensus seems to be that he should have been disqualified by the letter of the law as it stands today, whether that law needs changing is a separate issue for the future. Tiger knows he signed for an incorrect score, and that penalty would normally be DQ. So whilst the committee gave him an easy out with their decision, and I don't necessarily think he should have withdrawn, it was definitely a missed opportunity for some positive press for a change, IMO.

Yes, I think I was aiming a bit too high with "changed man" but you got the drift of where I was coming from on this.

[ScottieD18]

Here's an interesting question?

If the Master's Committee had spoken to Tiger before he signed his card (and before any Press), how honest would Tiger have been? (same question for any professional golfer). I think it depends on how the question was phrased. Here are two options:

Option 1
"Tiger, someone queried where your drop at 15. We checked the TV pictures and think you dropped between 3 and 6 feet behind the divot from the last shot. Given the rule states you must drop as near as possible we decided you dropped close enough and there was no advantage gained therefore no penaly. Tiger, anything to add?

Option 2
"Tiger, we are investigating your drop at 15. Can you talk us through the process from hitting the first ball in the water until hitting your second shot?"

I may be a bit synical, but I would expect many if not most professional golfers, including Tiger, not to admit to deliberately dropping the ball 2m behind the first shot if asked the first question. I would also expect many smarter professional golfers to figure out the mistake in time if asked the second question. No one would have suspected.

A few changes are needed:

1 - If a player is investigated during his round, the Committee must discuss the incident with the player before he signs his card.

2 - The new rule must be made clearer. The sections shown on TV give the Committee far too much latitude.

PS: I used to be a huge Faldo fan in the 80's and 90's but I'd lost respect for the guy since his attempt at being the Ryder Cup Captain, but he's went back up my esteem as he was the only guy in the Press / TV to state what most were thinking. Well done Faldo.

I hope you don't loose your job over thiis stance.

[gaelgowfer]

Am I the only person who thinks Tiger Woods missed an opportunity to demonstrate that he is a changed man?

Given the fiasco that followed, surely he must have at least have considered a win would forever be tainted. Therefore, given he is only interested in wins, why play on? In withdrawing from the tournament, he could've given a nice speech about protecting the integrity of the game and gone home armed with a few 'respect' plaudits in his back pocket.

He didn't and now I'm thinking, same old Tiger.

I dont see why he needs to blur the lines between sport and his personal life Gael. Golf is his profession, as far as I know his integrity on the golf course has never been in question before in relation to the rules. On that basis he has no need to show he is a changed man.
He made some personal mistakes and he has moved on.....thats it, we shouldnt be naymopre interested in his personal life than the next golfer.

It never fails to amaze me how the male mind consistently manages to compartmentalize human behaviour.

It's called logic.

... rather more an inability to think outside the box and I don't mean the TV!

[pedro]

Well, if TV can be used for viewers to call in, it certaintly disfavours Tiger since they show every move he makes. For instance, we didn't see any of Kuchar on Sunday, yet he ended up T8. How "fair" is that then?

[Diggers]

Am I the only person who thinks Tiger Woods missed an opportunity to demonstrate that he is a changed man?

Given the fiasco that followed, surely he must have at least have considered a win would forever be tainted. Therefore, given he is only interested in wins, why play on? In withdrawing from the tournament, he could've given a nice speech about protecting the integrity of the game and gone home armed with a few 'respect' plaudits in his back pocket.

He didn't and now I'm thinking, same old Tiger.

I dont see why he needs to blur the lines between sport and his personal life Gael. Golf is his profession, as far as I know his integrity on the golf course has never been in question before in relation to the rules. On that basis he has no need to show he is a changed man.
He made some personal mistakes and he has moved on.....thats it, we shouldnt be naymopre interested in his personal life than the next golfer.

It never fails to amaze me how the male mind consistently manages to compartmentalize human behaviour.

It's called logic.

... rather more an inability to think outside the box and I don't mean the TV!

You are applying rules in life to Woods you would never dream of applying to the normal person. If you worked in an office would what happened in your private life influence decisions you made there, of course not. And you would be mortified if you believed people thought that should be the case.
Whether you like it or not what happened in Woods private life was exactly that...his private life. He doesnt have to justify his rehabilitation to you or to anyone by taking a decision within his working life that he doesnt believe is the right one.

[Tiler76]

I don't think this is necessarily about his private life. He is often criticised in his "workplace", demeanour on the course, interaction with fans and media, club-throwing, spitting, etc.

I think this was a missed opportunity to redress the balance slightly, that's all. I don't think Tiger gives a stuff what any of us think, which is of course his right.....

[Diggers]

He may well get criticisms for those things but as I said at the start his integrity in regard to the rules of the game, which is after all what this whole scenario pertains to, as far as I know has always been exemplary.
So there was no previous wrong to right basically. Which is Im sure exactly how he saw it.

[Tiler76]

Whether his integrity was or wasn't in question before, it is now, because of this incident. And that isn't all of Tiger's making - the Masters committee have made a compelte nonesense of this. It's probably just simple ignorance of the rules on his part (not an excuse under the laws of the game), and maybe stupidity for not getting a ruling before taking the drop. He had an opportunity to remove any doubt, that's all I'm suggesting.

There presumably wasn't any doubt about Brian Davis' integrity prior to calling the penalty on himself at the Heritage, but his reputation IS enhanced by his handling of that incident.

[Diggers]

As Ive said on other threads Woods took his punishment just like Davis did. Davis didnt take any extra punishment for what he did, that is what you are suggesting Woods should do. He was given a 2 shot penalty, he accepted it and thats it really. Its not like Woods has been denying what he did.

[Tiler76]

I'm not suggesting he should have withdrawn, I merely responded to Gael's point that there was a missed opportunity here. It sums up how I feel about the incident.

I'm not at all surprised by Tiger's decisions, nor do I necessarily disagree with them, but he COULD have decided to WD, and possibly gained a great deal of credit for doing so.

The Masters Committee effectively let him off the hook (IMO) with their decision, and as soon as they made this decision, he was absolutely 100% within his rights to carry on.

Still can't believe he didn't know the rules though.....

[incontinentia]

Davis called the penalty on himself, Woods should have called the DQ penalty on himself but didn't because he doesnt care about honour or integrity

[MontysMerkin]

Davis called the penalty on himself, Woods should have called the DQ penalty on himself but didn't because he doesnt care about honour or integrity

meh...

[incontinentia]

meh yourself, you know i'm right

[gaelgowfer]

He may well get criticisms for those things but as I said at the start his integrity in regard to the rules of the game, which is after all what this whole scenario pertains to, as far as I know has always been exemplary.
So there was no previous wrong to right basically. Which is Im sure exactly how he saw it.

Well, I guess you and Tiger have something in common ... neither of you can think outside the box for he definitely missed an opportunity. For the reasons I have already stated, it would have cost him nothing but the value gained from such a gesture would have gone some way to repairing his tarnished image.

[Diggers]

Gael, Im perfectly capable of thinking outside the box, I can see what you are arguing...I just think you happen to be wrong. But then again I think the two shot penalty was perfectly acceptable and Im sure you don't agree with that either.

[incontinentia]

2/???

nine chins befouls the noble sport of golf. He voids his rheum through the green, and foots his clubs as one would a mongrel cur. it would benefit the game if he descended to the lowest possible world ranking...

... oh who am i kidding? i can't stay mad at tiger. all is forgiven

[super_realist]

He may well get criticisms for those things but as I said at the start his integrity in regard to the rules of the game, which is after all what this whole scenario pertains to, as far as I know has always been exemplary.
So there was no previous wrong to right basically. Which is Im sure exactly how he saw it.

Well, I guess you and Tiger have something in common ... neither of you can think outside the box for he definitely missed an opportunity. For the reasons I have already stated, it would have cost him nothing but the value gained from such a gesture would have gone some way to repairing his tarnished image.

I think it's a bit naive to think that Nine Chins really cares about what the public think about him or his reputation or repairing a tarnished image.
If you get a yellow card, but you think it should have been a red you don't walk off. You play by the officials decision.

[MontysMerkin]

He may well get criticisms for those things but as I said at the start his integrity in regard to the rules of the game, which is after all what this whole scenario pertains to, as far as I know has always been exemplary.
So there was no previous wrong to right basically. Which is Im sure exactly how he saw it.

Well, I guess you and Tiger have something in common ... neither of you can think outside the box for he definitely missed an opportunity. For the reasons I have already stated, it would have cost him nothing but the value gained from such a gesture would have gone some way to repairing his tarnished image.

I think it's a bit naive to think that Nine Chins really cares about what the public think about him or his reputation or repairing a tarnished image.
If you get a yellow card, but you think it should have been a red you don't walk off. You play by the officials decision.

Exactly. He doesn't give a stuff what anyone thinks and why should he, it's his job. His sponsors would probably go ape as well if he just walked off in arguably the most important tournament (as far as they are concerned).

[gaelgowfer]

Gael, Im perfectly capable of thinking outside the box, I can see what you are arguing...I just think you happen to be wrong. But then again I think the two shot penalty was perfectly acceptable and Im sure you don't agree with that either.

I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree on this. Regarding the penalty though, of one thing I am certain; it wasn't only the Augusta ctte who pi$$ed on the rules that day.

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