6N 2016: Ireland v Wales, 7 February

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IRELAND v WALES
7 February 2016
KO: 15:00 GMT
Aviva Stadium, Dublin

Live on RTE, ITV, FR2, DMAX, BBC(H)

Referee: Jérôme Garcès (France)
Touch judges: [tbc]
Television match official: [tbc]

A. Head to Head

123 Played 123
52 Won 67
4 Drawn 4
67 Lost 52
1,365 Points 1,461

B. Recent Form

29 August 2015
Aviva Stadium, Dublin
10 – 16 to Wales

8 August 2015
Millennium Stadium, Cardiff
21 – 35 to Ireland

14 March 2015
Millennium Stadium, Cardiff
23 – 16 to Wales

8 February 2014
Aviva Stadium, Dublin
26 – 3 to Ireland

2 February 2013
Millennium Stadium, Cardiff
22 – 30 to Ireland

C. Teams

IRELAND

S Zebo; A Trimble, J Payne, R Henshaw, K Earls; J Sexton, C Murray; J McGrath, R Best (capt), N White; D Toner, M McCarthy; CJ Stander, T O’Donnell, J Heaslip.

Replacements: S Cronin, J Cronin, T Furlong, D Ryan, R Ruddock, K Marmion, I Madigan, D Kearney.

WALES

G Anscombe; G North, J Davies, J Roberts, T James; D Biggar, G Davies; R Evans, S Baldwin, S Lee, L Charteris, A-W Jones, S Warburton (capt), J Tipuric, T Faletau.

Replacements: K Owens, G Jenkins, T Francis, B Davies, D Lydiate, L Williams, R Priestland, A Cuthbert

mikey_dragon wrote:

RiscaGame wrote:

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:I'd have Amos on the bench over Cuthbert, given that Amos can cover fullback.

Yep. Cuthbert is a waste of a sub

Or Liam Williams. Total waste of a sub and that could come back to haunt us. I also expect Tom James to show us why he's been out of the international arena all this time.

Tom James has matured a great deal during his sabbatical from Wales. I really don't see him as anywhere near as big a risk as you allude to. He is scoring tries, has good defense and a good left boot kicking game now.

Ireland are going to kick. Having a starting fullback who plays most of his rugby at outside half is risky, but then having an out-and-out winger as your back-three cover is even more risky / stupid, especially when Hallam Amos seems like the natural choice for that.

An eye for the next world cup perhaps? Start of a new WC cycle, get some players (like Evans) in with a 4 year development window (god, I sound like I've swallowed a management manual!)??? One at a time is better than a load of new faces.

RiscaGame wrote:

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:I'd have Amos on the bench over Cuthbert, given that Amos can cover fullback.

Yep. Cuthbert is a waste of a sub

Yeah that is a bit mental. I probably would have started Lydiate and Owens too.

Griff wrote:An eye for the next world cup perhaps?  Start of a new WC cycle, get some players (like Evans) in with a 4 year development window (god, I sound like I've swallowed a management manual!)???  One at a time is better than a load of new faces.

I'm happy about that. I've said for a while that we should be using the full four years to build for the World Cup.

Griff wrote:An eye for the next world cup perhaps?  Start of a new WC cycle, get some players (like Evans) in with a 4 year development window (god, I sound like I've swallowed a management manual!)???  One at a time is better than a load of new faces.

There is a pretty strong backbone of experience there...!

Roberts and Davies, Warburton and Faletau, Jones and Charteris...! Correct me if I am wrong but all these guys were involved in our RWC squad and training sessions. I dont think the same can be said for so many of the squads of the opposition teams?

maestegmafia wrote:

Griff wrote:An eye for the next world cup perhaps?  Start of a new WC cycle, get some players (like Evans) in with a 4 year development window (god, I sound like I've swallowed a management manual!)???  One at a time is better than a load of new faces.

There is a pretty strong backbone of experience there...!

Roberts and Davies, Warburton and Faletau, Jones and Charteris...! Correct me if I am wrong but all these guys were involved in our RWC squad and training sessions. I dont think the same can be said for so many of the squads of the opposition teams?

I was only commenting really on players like Rob Evans. The bulk of the team is the same. As I wrote, one at a time (i.e. this approach) is much better than a whole raft of new faces. Maybe for the next game we'll see someone else too.

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:

Griff wrote:An eye for the next world cup perhaps?  Start of a new WC cycle, get some players (like Evans) in with a 4 year development window (god, I sound like I've swallowed a management manual!)???  One at a time is better than a load of new faces.

I'm happy about that. I've said for a while that we should be using the full four years to build for the World Cup.

I agree. I've not got a problem with doing it. Gethin will be gone (perhaps?) by the next WC so we need to find a successor. The only way, or best way, is by trying players out more regularly at international level, but at the same time not doing so in a completely second string team like we do with the AI fixture against a second tier team, as that does no one any favours IMO.

Griff wrote:

maestegmafia wrote:

Griff wrote:An eye for the next world cup perhaps?  Start of a new WC cycle, get some players (like Evans) in with a 4 year development window (god, I sound like I've swallowed a management manual!)???  One at a time is better than a load of new faces.

There is a pretty strong backbone of experience there...!

Roberts and Davies, Warburton and Faletau, Jones and Charteris...! Correct me if I am wrong but all these guys were involved in our RWC squad and training sessions. I dont think the same can be said for so many of the squads of the opposition teams?

I was only commenting really on players like Rob Evans.  The bulk of the team is the same.  As I wrote, one at a time (i.e. this approach) is much better than a whole raft of new faces.  Maybe for the next game we'll see someone else too.

Yes I agree... There is a decent balance in that respect. I agree with a few other lads that I would have preferred Amos to Cuthbert on the bench and Ideally all fit and well I would like to see Owen Williams instead of Priestland on the bench too...

Strong team!

From an Irish perspective, I don't like to see Tipuric in the team. Too fast and too good!

Wales by 20

munkian wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:

munkian wrote:Si ref is Garces - so Ireland need to be careful at slowing things down at the breakdown

Also, that means Gethin Jenkins might as well not bother, he pings him off the park at the scrum every time I have seen him ref us.

QUICK ! SOMEONE DO AN ARTICLE WITH PICTURES AND ARROWS FOR THE LOVE OF GOD !!!

Oh well then, it looks as though Gatland was thinking along the same lines as me, interesting why he has dropped Gethin due to who the ref is :-

http://www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/rugby/rugby-news/warren-gatland-admits-jerome-garces-10831359

Not a bad selection at all. I'm happy that Lydiate/Williams, as the two most recent returnees, aren't being thrown straight in. Anscombe has shown some positive signs at FB, particularly his kick and chase. Rob Evans' intro is an indication of Gatland trying to rebuild the scrum from the retreating unit it was in October. Tipuric and Warbs together in the back row could be an Irish nightmare.

Would have started Amos over James personally. The latter forfeited any right to represent Wales when he walked out of camp six years ago. I impatiently count the days until the amateur is safely axed again.

If James is playing well then fair enough - I'd certainly of had Amos on the bench though.

munkian wrote:If James is playing well then fair enough - I'd certainly of had Amos on the bench though.

It's good that players like Amos, Williams and Lydiate are not being rushed back but the bench is the one area that worries me. Priestland nor Cuthbert are in good enough form to come on and change the game if it needs it, which as you mentioned I would have risked either Amos or Williams on the bench.

I feel strangely deflated looking ahead to this game. Maybe I just think that our tight five isn't good enough- it certainly isn't any better than any of our direct rivals. We've not just lost O'Connell, but Healy is off form and unfit, Ross likewise and our brightest young talent Iain Henderson is out for the tournament. Even the likely successor to Ross, Moore, is out. Inexperienced tight heads and no compelling choice at lock to partner Toner means this could be a long tournament up front.

6-15 think we look really good.

Notch,

We are not exactly ripping up any trees with our front row or we weren't in the world cup anyway.

bedfordwelsh wrote:Notch,

We are not exactly ripping up any trees with our front row or we weren't in the world cup anyway.

You're right beds, these lads in the front row have a lot to prove. Great to see Evans get an opportunity but Wales have a very inexperienced front row similar to Ireland.

Notch wrote:I feel strangely deflated looking ahead to this game. Maybe I just think that our tight five isn't good enough- it certainly isn't any better than any of our direct rivals. We've not just lost O'Connell, but Healy is off form and unfit, Ross likewise and our brightest young talent Iain Henderson is out for the tournament. Even the likely successor to Ross, Moore, is out. Inexperienced tight heads and no compelling choice at lock to partner Toner means this could be a long tournament up front.

6-15 think we look really good.

I know what you mean Notch, I keep having nightmares of Welsh people beaming as they leave the Aviva Wouldn't begrudge them at all, but would prefer out 6N to not be over before it began. Mightn't be the worst thing in the world to lose the first one and then start the rebuilding process in earnest with some bold decisions ( for me around Jackson, Dillane, McCloskey and Payne).

In terms of the front five, I think McGrath is in very good form coming into this and White didn't let himself down when coming on for Ross in the World Cup at All. I also think there is good quality on the bench in Cronin and Furlong (although less assured by Sean Cronin's lineout work if he is on bench as expected). Between Lee/Francis and Evans I think they can be got at

The second row is an awful concern though. I'd be worried Ryan or McCarthy are not up to the pace of international rugby either through injury or inconsistent form anyway, but against Jones and Charteris it could be a long afternoon. Toner is great for his line-out and maul work, but he hit's rucks at the speed of the glacier as well and against a backrow with two of the best opensides in the world that will be very worrying in trying to secure ball or even get the ball out it (even worse if SOB is out as well). I know he has not much experience, but getting Dillane in on the bench could offer some momentum that the either Ryan or McCarthy would struggle to.

Also hope don't kick the leather off it. Can't look past Wales for this one.

Marshes wrote:

Notch wrote:I feel strangely deflated looking ahead to this game. Maybe I just think that our tight five isn't good enough- it certainly isn't any better than any of our direct rivals. We've not just lost O'Connell, but Healy is off form and unfit, Ross likewise and our brightest young talent Iain Henderson is out for the tournament. Even the likely successor to Ross, Moore, is out. Inexperienced tight heads and no compelling choice at lock to partner Toner means this could be a long tournament up front.

6-15 think we look really good.

I know what you mean Notch, I keep having nightmares of Welsh people beaming as they leave the Aviva Wouldn't begrudge them at all, but would prefer out 6N to not be over before it began. Mightn't be the worst thing in the world to lose the first one and then start the rebuilding process in earnest with some bold decisions ( for me around Jackson, Dillane, McCloskey and Payne).

In terms of the front five, I think McGrath is in very good form coming into this and White didn't let himself down when coming on for Ross in the World Cup at All. I also think there is good quality on the bench in Cronin and Furlong (although less assured by Sean Cronin's lineout work if he is on bench as expected). Between Lee/Francis and Evans I think they can be got at

The second row is an awful concern though. I'd be worried Ryan or McCarthy are not up to the pace of international rugby either through injury or inconsistent form anyway, but against Jones and Charteris it could be a long afternoon. Toner is great for his line-out and maul work, but he hit's rucks at the speed of the glacier as well and against a backrow with two of the best opensides in the world that will be very worrying in trying to secure ball or even get the ball out it (even worse if SOB is out as well). I know he has not much experience, but getting Dillane in on the bench could offer some momentum that the either Ryan or McCarthy would struggle to.

Also hope don't kick the leather off it. Can't look past Wales for this one.

Will have to see ahout the result. I don't think there's as much in it as you allude.. You're right our front row could be targeted. Jerome Garces is a stickler on the scrum.

I am surprised at the lack of young talent being offerered a chance considering the opportunity to do so....! I think I mentioned a bunch of them in a thread the other day. Dooley, Moloney, Ringrose, Dillane all look good.

Marshes wrote:but would prefer out 6N to not be over before it began

As much as I am doubtful of a Wales win on Sunday, if Wales did win, it does not mean your 6N is over. You do not always have to win a grand slam to have a good 6N. When Wales last won it, after losing to Ireland in the first match, I thought we had a great 6N.

Just for you Lord Dowlais! Gatland sees Amos as a 15 and Amos prefers to play 15 too:

"I know Hallam can cover on the wing and does play there but we do see his long-term position as full-back and us exploiting and working on that left foot of his," said the New Zealander.

"He is quick but he wouldn't be international wing quick so that opportunity to play more at full-back is the plan for him."

http://www.southwalesargus.co.uk/sport/14252994.Wales_boss_Warren_Gatland__I_want_Dragons_speedster_Hallam_Amos_to_force_his_way_in_at_15/

I guess that's why Cuthebert is on the bench as wing cover, with Preistland able to cover 10 and 15.

Griff wrote:Just for you Lord Dowlais! Gatland sees Amos as a 15 and Amos prefers to play 15 too:

I would be more comfy with Amos to cover fullback than Preistland, I would also be happier to see Amos on the bench over Cuthbert. Amos is a winger though, not a fullback, so why does Gatland insist on changing his position ?

And WTF does this mean ?

"He is quick but he wouldn't be international wing quick so that opportunity to play more at full-back is the plan for him."

Does he think about the same thing when he puts Liam Williams on the wing to allow Halfpenny to play at FB ?

Sometimes Gatland baffles me. But he has won enough 6N's to lead me to think he knows what he is on about.

The Bench should have both Amos and Williams on it, Preistland should be nowhere near the starting team, he is not even playing well for Bath.

Whats the official international wing speed then ?

I wouldn't consider Amos slower than Cuthbert or North ?

munkian wrote:Whats the official international wing speed then ?

I wouldn't consider Amos slower than Cuthbert or North ?

Neither would I, Amos is a winger, not a fullback.

LordDowlais wrote:

munkian wrote:Whats the official international wing speed then ?

I wouldn't consider Amos slower than Cuthbert or North ?

Neither would I, Amos is a winger, not a fullback.

Ah, this again.

munkian wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:

munkian wrote:Whats the official international wing speed then ?

I wouldn't consider Amos slower than Cuthbert or North ?

Neither would I, Amos is a winger, not a fullback.

Ah, this again.

I am agreeing with you, you are right, Amos is not slower than Cuthbert or North, also he is a winger, so he should be on the bench as wing cover, instead of Cuthbert.

Because utility players dont exist - right ?

Loving the look of the Welsh backrow. It's also nice to see a Welsh backline with a bit more guile and flair as opposed to steam roller type players.

Not entirly convinced about your front row though. AWJ and Chateris should be very strong in the lineout.

LordDowlais wrote:Amos is a winger, not a fullback.

If the player sees himself as a fullback, his national coach sees him as a fullback and his regional coach saw him initially as a fullback, isn't there the tiniest possibility that he's a fullback?

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:Amos is a winger, not a fullback.

If the player sees himself as a fullback, his national coach sees him as a fullback and his regional coach saw him initially as a fullback, isn't there the tiniest possibility that he's a fullback?

Only if you're going to be all *literal* about it.

RuggerRadge2611 wrote:Loving the look of the Welsh backrow. It's also nice to see a Welsh backline with a bit more guile and flair as opposed to steam roller type players.

Not entirly convinced about your front row though. AWJ and Chateris should be very strong in the lineout.

Front row should be tidy, especially against 2nd/3rd choice 'Irish' props.

Anyway, looks like Ireland are worried:-

http://www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/rugby/rugby-news/ireland-call-gaelic-football-experts-10834796

They've called in the experts to stop Dan Biggar.

Oh, and for those of you who do not like to click on links:-

Ireland call in Gaelic Football experts to combat Dan Biggar and Wales' aerial brilliance.

The contest to rule the skies has become an increasingly pivotal part of the game, so Ireland have turned to some outside help.

Ireland have turned to Gaelic Football for inspiration as they look to win the all-important aerial battle with Wales in Sunday’s Six Nations opener at the Aviva Stadium.
The contest to rule the skies has become an increasingly pivotal part of the game in recent years with teams looking to utilise a kicking strategy to put pressure on opposition defences.
Wales, in particular, have implemented a successful kick-to-compete policy to gain valuable territory, with fly-half Dan Biggar a master exponent of the art, chasing his own up-and-unders and leaping high to win back possession.
Well aware of this threat, the Irish have been picking the brains of some of the leading coaches from Gaelic Football, a sport in which jumping for the ball in the air is such a key element.
Former Mayo manager James Horan and Meath boss Mick O’Dowd were both spectators at Ireland’s training session at Carton House, in County Kildare, yesterday.
Horan, who guided Mayo to four consecutive Connacht titles and took them to two All-Ireland finals, met with Joe Schmidt’s management team over lunch to compare notes on the two sports.
And Irish assistant coach Simon Easterby confirms there are aspects of Gaelic Football which the Six Nations champions can learn from, acknowledging they came second best to Wales in the aerial battle in Cardiff last March.
“We spoke about a lot of things,” said the former Scarlets boss.
“He was interested in a lot of what we were doing in terms of the flow of the session and how that worked. We talked about the high ball stuff. There were lots of conversations we had with him that could relate to rugby as well as Gaelic.
“I think over the last couple of years, that high ball work has intensified.
“The game has changed slightly, there’s more competition for the ball in the air. Naturally we have to be able to compete and win our own ball, or try and retrieve some ball that we’re kicking.
“Work on the air is something that’s continuous. We have come second best to Wales, certainly in Cardiff in the last Six Nations.
“The Gaelic element to it is something that we can learn from, and something that players in Ireland have the natural feel for. That shows in lot of the good work that players do, and have done for a number of years.”
Former flanker Easterby knows the Welsh team well from his time as player and coach with the Scarlets and has a fair idea of what the approach will be from Warren Gatland’s men.
“It’s an experienced team and more often than not with that Welsh team they do things very well and they go about their business,” he said.
“In some ways when you know what’s been selected you know how they’re going to play the game, but it’s one thing knowing that and one thing stopping it.
“That’s something that they’ve always prided themselves on, ‘this is what we are and you’ve got to stop us doing what we do’.
“They’re well coached, they know what they’re good at and when they come together they can slot back into it pretty quickly.
“I know they had a couple of injuries at the World Cup, but on the whole their selection has been pretty consistent for a few years and that allows them to come into camp and hit the ground running.
“They’ve picked a fairly consistent team from the World Cup. They can change a few things, but personnel-wise it’s fairly consistent so they’re not going to be able to change too much in a short space of time.
“None of us have had any games since the World Cup so we’re limited in our preparation for the first game in the Six Nations.”
It was former Ireland boss Gatland who handed the 65-cap Easterby his international debut back in 2000 and he has a lot of respect for the Kiwi coach.
“He has been successful and he has won things not just with Wales, but with Wasps,” he said.
“He has done well throughout his career. He is pretty loyal to those guys around him in selection to a point and then also he has had a pretty consistent coaching staff for a number of years.
“He has got a good group around him and that allows him to go out and select a team and build a team that can do a certain thing. It doesn’t take a rocket scientist to know how that works.
“It has bene pretty effective for him over the number he has worked with Shaun Edwards both in Wasps and in Wales and he brought in other coaches to assist that and assist their system. As they say, if it’s not broke don’t fix it. It’s pretty effective as have we been in the last couple of years as well.”

WHAT?!!!!!!

Rugby team uses experts in their field to try and improve their skills?!

They must be ABSOLUTELY shi*ting themselves at the thought of facing the mighty Dan Biggar!!!!!!!!

I'd say if Dan Biggar wasn't starting we'd just have prepared for the game by binging on frosty chocolate milkshakes and a few box sets. But since Biggar is in, we decided we better actually do some training.

N.B. It's a Wales Online story.

Lord Clickbait...

Walesonline does have about as much journolistic integrity as the national enquirer and daily sport...

Notch wrote:I'd say if Dan Biggar wasn't starting we'd just have prepared for the game by binging on frosty chocolate milkshakes and a few box sets. But since Biggar is in, we decided we better actually do some training.

Well, Dan Will do that to you.

Can't wait to get to Dublin for this, it's going to be a monumental battle, and tbh aside from Wales having 2 poachers, and Irelands packs carrying ability I don't think theres anything between either side.

Best 10's in NH, the best 2 12's in NH, best 8's in NH, and IMO the top consistenly strongest teams in the NH going head to head, both with something to prove.

mikey_dragon wrote:Lord Clickbait...

Anything better to do on here rather than insult, wum or troll me mikey ?

It will not be long before you need to change your username again.

You could ignore him mind Dowlais. Then if he is wumming you, it doesn't achieve its objective.

Also, you aren't meant to accuse people of being returning posters (not username changes as you suggest). People have been told of that when doing the Ghost icon. Why not use the correct channels and alert a moderator, if you're that concerned?

RiscaGame wrote:You could ignore him mind Dowlais. Then if he is wumming you, it doesn't achieve its objective.

Also, you aren't meant to accuse people of being returning posters (not username changes as you suggest). People have been told of that when doing the Ghost icon. Why not use the correct channels and alert a moderator, if you're that concerned?

Fair enough Risca, point taken.

Guy constantly posts clickbait, and gets insulted when referred to as clickbait? Something odd here.

Fanster wrote:Can't wait to get to Dublin for this, it's going to be a monumental battle, and tbh aside from Wales having 2 poachers, and Irelands packs carrying ability I don't think theres anything between either side.

Best 10's in NH, the best 2 12's in NH, best 8's in NH, and IMO the top consistenly strongest teams in the NH going head to head, both with something to prove.

You're off to Dublin? I'm a little envious. I think I'm going to look into going back to Paris next season, it's been too long since I went to an international away game.

We'll just leave it at the two best teams in the NH, in spite of how much that fact winds up the others .

mikey_dragon wrote:

Fanster wrote:Can't wait to get to Dublin for this, it's going to be a monumental battle, and tbh aside from Wales having 2 poachers, and Irelands packs carrying ability I don't think theres anything between either side.

Best 10's in NH, the best 2 12's in NH, best 8's in NH, and IMO the top consistenly strongest teams in the NH going head to head, both with something to prove.

You're off to Dublin? I'm a little envious. I think I'm going to look into going back to Paris next season, it's been too long since I went to an international away game.

We'll just leave it at the two best teams in the NH, in spite of how much that fact winds up the others .

Sadly I have to travel to Edinburgh for work, so am flying out from there, I say sadly it was very cheap so it's worked out well.

I don't think thats a term that would wind many up, Scotland Italy and France have all been struggling, and yes I get England have finished 2nd like 4 times, but in reality Wales and Ireland have shared the title twice each in 4 years, and are both in with a shot on final weekend every year. When I look at the squads, in terms of quality, consistency, and potential I think it's fair to say these 2 teams are probably favourites, with England a very close 3rd, followed by others.

Fanster wrote:

Best 10's in NH, the best 2 12's in NH, best 8's in NH, and IMO the top consistenly strongest teams in the NH going head to head, both with something to prove.

I think you're on the wrong thread .

rodders wrote:

Fanster wrote:

Best 10's in NH, the best 2 12's in NH, best 8's in NH, and IMO the top consistenly strongest teams in the NH going head to head, both with something to prove.

I think you're on the wrong thread   .

hahaha really? Sexton, Biggar, Henshaw, Roberts, Falatau, Heaslip, whos better up here?

Fanster wrote:

mikey_dragon wrote:

Fanster wrote:Can't wait to get to Dublin for this, it's going to be a monumental battle, and tbh aside from Wales having 2 poachers, and Irelands packs carrying ability I don't think theres anything between either side.

Best 10's in NH, the best 2 12's in NH, best 8's in NH, and IMO the top consistenly strongest teams in the NH going head to head, both with something to prove.

You're off to Dublin? I'm a little envious. I think I'm going to look into going back to Paris next season, it's been too long since I went to an international away game.

We'll just leave it at the two best teams in the NH, in spite of how much that fact winds up the others .

Sadly I have to travel to Edinburgh for work, so am flying out from there, I say sadly it was very cheap so it's worked out well.

I don't think thats a term that would wind many up, Scotland Italy and France have all been struggling, and yes I get England have finished 2nd like 4 times, but in reality Wales and Ireland have shared the title twice each in 4 years, and are both in with a shot on final weekend every year. When I look at the squads, in terms of quality, consistency, and potential I think it's fair to say these 2 teams are probably favourites, with England a very close 3rd, followed by others.

Well I wouldn't complain about spending time in such glamorous cities, with that said I must go back to Edinburgh soon.

Oh trust me on here it does, you simply have to mention how you're a Wales fan and happen to rate your players to get some English and Scottish frothing at the mouth. I'd say England are up there players wise, as a lot of them are on good form. France for me are a bit of an unknown, new coach and some new faces.

mikey_dragon wrote:

Fanster wrote:

mikey_dragon wrote:

Fanster wrote:Can't wait to get to Dublin for this, it's going to be a monumental battle, and tbh aside from Wales having 2 poachers, and Irelands packs carrying ability I don't think theres anything between either side.

Best 10's in NH, the best 2 12's in NH, best 8's in NH, and IMO the top consistenly strongest teams in the NH going head to head, both with something to prove.

You're off to Dublin? I'm a little envious. I think I'm going to look into going back to Paris next season, it's been too long since I went to an international away game.

We'll just leave it at the two best teams in the NH, in spite of how much that fact winds up the others .

Sadly I have to travel to Edinburgh for work, so am flying out from there, I say sadly it was very cheap so it's worked out well.

I don't think thats a term that would wind many up, Scotland Italy and France have all been struggling, and yes I get England have finished 2nd like 4 times, but in reality Wales and Ireland have shared the title twice each in 4 years, and are both in with a shot on final weekend every year. When I look at the squads, in terms of quality, consistency, and potential I think it's fair to say these 2 teams are probably favourites, with England a very close 3rd, followed by others.

Well I wouldn't complain about spending time in such glamorous cities, with that said I must go back to Edinburgh soon.

Oh trust me on here it does, you simply have to mention how you're a Wales fan and happen to rate your players to get some English and Scottish frothing at the mouth. I'd say England are up there players wise, as a lot of them are on good form. France for me are a bit of an unknown, new coach and some new faces.

Thats the thing about rating individual players though, a lot of them when tested against international metal come up short, Ireland and Wales squads are so settled the players who aren't world class function better, whereas the English players who arent quite there get found out a little easier, because the squad is generally in transition. A settled England 23 is a worrying prospect, but with so much competition for places players are in and out too regularly IMO, take Farell and Ford, now Farrell is shoe horned in at 12 because a decision can't be made solidly about 10. I don't think it's a great situation

Fanster wrote:

rodders wrote:

Fanster wrote:

Best 10's in NH, the best 2 12's in NH, best 8's in NH, and IMO the top consistenly strongest teams in the NH going head to head, both with something to prove.

I think you're on the wrong thread   .

hahaha really? Sexton, Biggar, Henshaw, Roberts, Falatau, Heaslip, whos better up here?

I'll give you Biggar.
As to the 3 Irishmen there are many Ireland who do not think they are the best in their respective positions let alone the best in Europe - you could argue Jackson, McCloskey, Stander
Falatau ahead of Vunipola, Parisse, Picamoles - really?
Roberts ahead of Fofana, Danty (you wait till you see him play) - very questionable.

The players are good but your claim is a bit of a stretch to say the least