New Zealand v Wales, 18 June

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Post by George Carlin on Tue 14 Jun 2016, 3:16 pm

First topic message reminder :

New Zealand v Wales, 18 June - Page 2 All_bl10        New Zealand v Wales, 18 June - Page 2 Wales_10 
NEW ZEALAND v WALES
18 June 2016
19:35 NZST (UTC+12)
Westpac Stadium, Wellington

Live on [tbc]

Referee: Jaco Peyper (South Africa)
Touch judges: [tbc]
Television match official: [tbc]

A. Head to Head

31 Played 31
28 Won 3
0 Drawn 0
3 Lost 28
955 Points 328

B. Recent Form

11 June 2016 - Eden Park, Auckland: 39-21 to New Zealand

22 November 2014 - Millennium Stadium, Cardiff: 16 – 34 to New Zealand

24 November 2012 - Millennium Stadium, Cardiff: 10 – 33 to New Zealand

27 November 2010 - Millennium Stadium, Cardiff: 25 – 37 to New Zealand

26 June 2010 - Waikato Stadium, Hamilton: 29 – 10 to New Zealand

19 June 2010 - Carisbrook, Dunedin: 42 – 9 to New Zealand

7 November 2009 - Millennium Stadium, Cardiff: 12 – 19 to New Zealand

C. Teams

NEW ZEALAND 
New Zealand v Wales, 18 June - Page 2 Kiwi-b10
Israel Dagg; Ben Smith, Malakai Fekitoa, Ryan Crotty, Waisake Naholo; Aaron Cruden, Aaron Smith; Joe Moody, Dane Coles, Owen Franks, Brodie Retallick, Sam Whitelock, Jerome Kaino, Sam Cane, Kieran Read (capt).

Replacements: Nathan Harris; Wyatt Crockett, Charlie Faumuina, Patrick Tuipulotu, Ardie Savea, TJ Perenara, Beauden Barrett, Seta Tamanivalu.

WALES
New Zealand v Wales, 18 June - Page 2 Dragon10
Rhys Patchell, Liam Williams, Jonathan Davies, Jamie Roberts, Hallam Amos, Dan Biggar, Rhys Webb, Gethin Jenkins, Ken Owens, Samson Lee, Luke Charteris, Alun Wyn Jones, Ross Moriarty, Sam Warburton (capt), Taulupe Faletau.

Replacements: Scott Baldwin, Rob Evans, Tomas Francis, Bradley Davies, Ellis Jenkins, Gareth Davies, Rhys Priestland, Scott Williams.


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Post by eirebilly on Sat 18 Jun 2016, 9:13 am

Cant really see what happened to Cruden but it does not look good.
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Post by nathan on Sat 18 Jun 2016, 9:15 am

I wonder though I the all blacks have been straying offside a fair few times. I think all NH teams are too quick at rolling away, noticed on a fair amount of occasions SH players hanging around on the wrong side effecting supporting players getting there

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Post by Blueschief on Sat 18 Jun 2016, 9:15 am

Looked like he got rolled under Charteris in the ruck, hope it's not serious

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Post by eirebilly on Sat 18 Jun 2016, 9:18 am

They are certainly taking great care with him Bluechief, really hope he is ok.

Nathan, it what you expect from SH teams, especially if you have an SH ref. Wales need to wisen up to compete there.
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Post by Scottrf on Sat 18 Jun 2016, 9:23 am

Goal kicker like Biggar, keep the scoreboard ticking over. That kick from North was a waste too.

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Post by Pot Hale on Sat 18 Jun 2016, 9:26 am

Very good try by Wales on half time.
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Post by eirebilly on Sat 18 Jun 2016, 9:27 am

Great score on halftime for AWJ after a beautiful initial break from JD2. JD2 with a great last pass to AWJ to send him over in the corner. Biggar kicks the extras and its 10-10 at HT.
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Post by Blueschief on Sat 18 Jun 2016, 9:36 am

Like Patchells counter attacking so far, taking the ball to them. A back three of Williams, North and Patch at 15 would be good to have a look at in the autumn, 3 good attacking runners there.

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Post by eirebilly on Sat 18 Jun 2016, 9:50 am

Last week, CJ Stander deemed not in a position to contest the ball and red carded for reckless play.
This week an All Black deemed not in a position to contest the ball and penalised for reckless play.

Great consistency that.
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Post by Scottrf on Sat 18 Jun 2016, 9:52 am

Best 8 in the world cant catch eh.

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Post by Blueschief on Sat 18 Jun 2016, 9:53 am

Damn, non existent tackling. Good try tho

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Post by nathan on Sat 18 Jun 2016, 9:53 am

That should of been a yellow, the ref contradicted himself.

Not in a realistic position to get the ball but it was accidental.

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Post by brennomac on Sat 18 Jun 2016, 9:54 am

eirebilly wrote:Last week, CJ Stander deemed not in a position to contest the ball and red carded for reckless play.
This week an All Black deemed not in a position to contest the ball and penalised for reckless play.

Great consistency that.
+1 just because Williams didn't land on his head doesn't mean it wasn't a dangerous tackle in the air, Definite sinbin at minimum. Homer reffing from Peyper

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Post by eirebilly on Sat 18 Jun 2016, 9:54 am

What a try from the AB's.

They are electric when they get going.
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Post by Blueschief on Sat 18 Jun 2016, 9:55 am

I was expecting a yellow. Didn't think Williams would get up from that.

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Post by Scottrf on Sat 18 Jun 2016, 9:55 am

That's the kind of decision making you want from an SH...

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Post by TheMildlyFranticLlama on Sat 18 Jun 2016, 9:56 am

How important is that dropped ball from the Warburton break going to be in the context of this match! A real turning point by the looks of it

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Post by eirebilly on Sat 18 Jun 2016, 9:56 am

brennomac wrote:
eirebilly wrote:Last week, CJ Stander deemed not in a position to contest the ball and red carded for reckless play.
This week an All Black deemed not in a position to contest the ball and penalised for reckless play.

Great consistency that.
+1 just because Williams didn't  land on his head doesn't mean it wasn't a dangerous tackle in the air, Definite sinbin at minimum.  Homer reffing from Peyper

For the record, I believe both were genuine attempts to contest the ball but could be seen as reckless. Yellow cards at best for both but it simply cannot be a red card one week and only a penalty the next, the gulf in punishment is awful.

The AB's really going for it now.
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Post by TheMildlyFranticLlama on Sat 18 Jun 2016, 9:57 am

I take it back, definite turning point! Nice try that

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Post by Scottrf on Sat 18 Jun 2016, 9:57 am

What an impact from BB.

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Post by nathan on Sat 18 Jun 2016, 9:58 am

I think the difference is down to the outcome though

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Post by Blueschief on Sat 18 Jun 2016, 9:58 am

Ah here we go again.

Ah well, we did OK in the first half, that familiar sense of impending doom is creeping in.

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Post by nathan on Sat 18 Jun 2016, 9:59 am

Lots of errors creeping in now

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Post by offload on Sat 18 Jun 2016, 10:01 am

Been a very good test match so far but unless Wales dig deep now, this could become a rout.
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Post by Blueschief on Sat 18 Jun 2016, 10:02 am

Doing grubber kicks from your own 22 is not a good idea

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Post by Scottrf on Sat 18 Jun 2016, 10:03 am

Well, you can't say they don't take advantage when they are on top.

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Post by Guest on Sat 18 Jun 2016, 10:04 am

Deja vu. Pretty much as scripted now.

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Post by offload on Sat 18 Jun 2016, 10:04 am

So so easy. Poor from Webb there.
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Post by eirebilly on Sat 18 Jun 2016, 10:05 am

The AB's turning the screw now, this could get awful for Wales. For me the game hinged on 2 moments within minutes of eachother, firstly Faletau's drop and then the non card for reckless hit in the air. These gave the AB's the impetus and they are running away with this.
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Post by BamBam on Sat 18 Jun 2016, 10:07 am

eirebilly wrote:In the lead up to the try, Liam Williams made and absolute cracking try saving tackle on the big AB wing.

I always judge players against the best and right now in Falatau, Wales have probably the best 8 in world rugby.

Kieran Read is by far the best 8 in the world


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Post by brennomac on Sat 18 Jun 2016, 10:09 am

And Naholo who should have been binned for the tackle in the air blocks Wales player and it's just a peno!

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Post by Blueschief on Sat 18 Jun 2016, 10:10 am

Good try, shambolic line out and tackling there, meh!

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Post by offload on Sat 18 Jun 2016, 10:11 am

The lineout ahhhhhhh

Two terrible lineouts lead directly to two NZ tries.
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Post by monty junior on Sat 18 Jun 2016, 10:14 am

Amazing to watch, nobody like them.

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Post by Shifty on Sat 18 Jun 2016, 10:17 am

Wales getting routed now, no less than expected though.  We're an awful team. Hopefully we can keep it to under 50 points.


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Post by offload on Sat 18 Jun 2016, 10:18 am

As good as NZ have been Wales have offered nothing in the second half and the Welsh bench is a geer slower than the starters. Look dead on their feet again, virtually walking pace.
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Post by eirebilly on Sat 18 Jun 2016, 10:19 am

Excellent from Biggar and Williams for the Welsh try but my god, they have been blown away in the previous 15mins.
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Post by Guest on Sat 18 Jun 2016, 10:19 am

Wtf do they give the Welsh boys at half time? 4 pints of Guinness or something?!

I give up. I'm so fed up of watching Wales play. Remember when Adam Jones used to be subbed at half time as he was only good for 40 mins. Now it's the whole f***ing team.

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Post by Shifty on Sat 18 Jun 2016, 10:20 am

offload wrote:As good as NZ have been Wales have offered nothing in the second half and the Welsh bench is a geer slower than the starters.  Look dead on their feet again, virtually walking pace.

I know it's pathetic, Wales are clearly in serious decline and have been since the 6 Nations. We really need a serious clear out of coaches and players and start over again before the world cup. Things will only get worse from here.
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Post by offload on Sat 18 Jun 2016, 10:20 am

Patchell has done OK but In shifting Williams we lost what little back play momentum we had.
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Post by eirebilly on Sat 18 Jun 2016, 10:22 am

What a handoff from JD2 for his try clap
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Post by offload on Sat 18 Jun 2016, 10:24 am

Is Roberts the slowest centre in world rugby? Nice follow up though. Hansen will rip the AB's a new one for letting Wales score twice.
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Post by offload on Sat 18 Jun 2016, 10:27 am

Shifty wrote:
offload wrote:As good as NZ have been Wales have offered nothing in the second half and the Welsh bench is a geer slower than the starters.  Look dead on their feet again, virtually walking pace.

I know it's pathetic, Wales are clearly in serious decline and have been since the 6 Nations.  We really need a serious clear out of coaches and players and start over again before the world cup.  Things will only get worse from here.

Yep. Coaches are stale and can give nothing more to this team. I've said for two year Wales have gone backwards, but when ever you criticise Gatland most Welsh fans don't want to listen.
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Post by nathan on Sat 18 Jun 2016, 10:29 am

offload wrote:Is Roberts the slowest centre in world rugby?  Nice follow up though.  Hansen will rip the AB's a new one for letting Wales score twice.  
One team is at the end of long season where they play more games than the sh anyway, the other team are fresh at the beginning of the season. Pace and energy levels are always going to be better for the latter

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Post by eirebilly on Sat 18 Jun 2016, 10:29 am

When the AB's turn it on they look (and pretty much are) unbeatable. 20mins of pure rugby brilliance simply blew Wales away.

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Post by Guest on Sat 18 Jun 2016, 10:32 am

40 games unbeaten on home soil for NZ. Some record.

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Post by Shifty on Sat 18 Jun 2016, 10:34 am

offload wrote:
Shifty wrote:
offload wrote:As good as NZ have been Wales have offered nothing in the second half and the Welsh bench is a geer slower than the starters.  Look dead on their feet again, virtually walking pace.

I know it's pathetic, Wales are clearly in serious decline and have been since the 6 Nations.  We really need a serious clear out of coaches and players and start over again before the world cup.  Things will only get worse from here.

Yep. Coaches are stale and can give nothing more to this team.  I've said for two year Wales have gone backwards, but when ever you criticise Gatland most Welsh fans don't want to listen.

I don't think Gatland has become a poor coach, but clearly your correct things have gone "stale", even if we sack Edwards, McBryde, and Howley it would freshen things up in the camp. I do think certain players have been there too long and simply don't to perform to keep their Wales jerseys, and Gatland needs to have a look at younger players for a bit more energy and enthusiasm. Wales don't look hunry, they look slow, over coached, and Biggar, and Roberts is a totally uncreative partnership, while we have no pace or skill out wide. Wales look like they peaked a few years ago and now have no idea what to do next and are simply in decline.
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Post by Shifty on Sat 18 Jun 2016, 10:39 am

nathan wrote:
offload wrote:Is Roberts the slowest centre in world rugby?  Nice follow up though.  Hansen will rip the AB's a new one for letting Wales score twice.  
One team is at the end of long season where they play more games than the sh anyway, the other team are fresh at the beginning of the season. Pace and energy levels are always going to be better for the latter

That's a far too easy excuse to make, in reality most Wales internationals simply play for Wales and the Heinaken Cup games. Truth be told were a very poor team that bady needs a make over. At the very least Welsh rugby needs to have a serious look at things. Because were going backwards. The problems in the team are obvious, a stale coaching team, so sack Howley, Mcbryde and Edwards and freshed things up and give us new ideas. Clearly too many players are in the comfort zone and simply need to be fit to play. That needs to change, I'm actually in favour of doing what Steve Hansen did and clear out most of the squad and pick very young players and try and grow a squad for a few years time. It will have to happen because were declining down to Italy and Scotland's level quickly, were miles off England at the moment.
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Post by mikey_dragon on Sat 18 Jun 2016, 10:48 am

offload wrote:Is Roberts the slowest centre in world rugby?  Nice follow up though.  Hansen will rip the AB's a new one for letting Wales score twice.  

No. That was a sitter for your boy Priestland as well, trust him to balls it up.

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Post by kingjohn7 on Sat 18 Jun 2016, 10:49 am

Shifty I agree we are looking poor but how do you mean like Hansen did?

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