6N 2017: Wales v Ireland, 10 March

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WALES v IRELAND
10 March 2017
KO: 20:05 GMT
Principality Stadium, Cardiff

Live on [ITV, RTE, SC4, FR2, DMAX / BBC (H)]

Referee: Wayne Barnes (England)
Touch judges: [tbc]
TMO: [tbc]

A. Head to Head

124 Played 124
50 Won 67
7 Drawn 7
67 Lost 50
1,477 Points 1,381

B. Recent Form

7 February 2016
Aviva Stadium, Dublin
16 – 16 draw

29 August 2015
Aviva Stadium, Dublin
10 – 16 to Wales

8 August 2015
Millennium Stadium, Cardiff
21 – 35 to Ireland

14 March 2015
Millennium Stadium, Cardiff
23 – 16 to Wales

8 February 2014
Aviva Stadium, Dublin
26 – 3 to Ireland

2 February 2013
Millennium Stadium, Cardiff
22 – 30 to Ireland

5 February 2012
Aviva Stadium, Dublin
21 – 23 to Wales

8 October 2011
Regional Stadium, Wellington, New Zealand
22 – 10 to Wales

C. Teams

WALES 


Halfpenny; North, J Davies, S Williams, L Williams, Biggar, Webb, Evans, Owens, Francis, Ball, A Jones, Warburton, Tipuric, Moriarty.

Replacements: Roberts for S Williams (67), S Davies for Biggar (80), G Davies for Webb (67), Smith for Evans (67), Baldwin for Owens (72), Lee for Francis (70), Charteris for Ball (63), Faletau for Moriarty (67).

IRELAND


Kearney; Earls, Ringrose, Henshaw, Zebo; Sexton, Murray; McGrath, Best, Furlong, D Ryan, Toner, Stander, O'Brien, Heaslip.

Replacements: Bowe for Kearney (70), Jackson for Sexton (19), Marmion for Murray (46), C Healy for McGrath (59), Scannell for Best (80), J Ryan for Furlong (80), Henderson for Toner (63), O'Mahony for Stander (63).

munkian wrote:

SecretFly wrote:

marty2086 wrote:

munkian wrote:He even apologised to Best for not being able to award the try for an Irish infringement.

Why should a referee have to apologise for doing his job ? It was ridiculous.

The Irish media need a long hard look at themselves.

*Edit*

Sexwee knew what he was doing, no attempt what so ever to roll away, yellow card every time.

How can you roll away when the tackled player lies on top of you?

You can't.  But you have to shake, rattle and roll, and hold your hands out, and wiggle your toes, and stick out your tongue to make sure the ref believes that 'you are trying'.  He knows you can't but the rule book says you gotta look like an eejit and 'try'.

Not wrapping yourself around the ball carrier and rolling with him will work too.

Yeah, that never happens in a game where one side is attacking and one is defending. You never see the lads catching, wrapping, falling and rolling together. Quite distasteful from Ireland to play the game of rugby in front of Wayne. Thanks for pointing that bit out.

captain carrantuohil wrote:I wish we could just forget about Barnes - he wasn't the reason we lost, we were. So Barnes is a schoolmasterly type who enjoys the authority he wields. Big deal.

Of course he was the reason we lost. Joe made some bad calls but Barnes shouldn't be allowed off the hook. The level of corruption now in international rugby is outrageous.

He harshly awarded Sexton a yellow but ignored a similar infringement by Wales after Standers break. We conceded 10 points whilst Sexton was off the field.

He also ignored a clear yellow for a high tackle on Jackson, despite the new directives about head high challenges.

Most other refs would have awarded Bests try given he was going to score despite Henshaw's intervention.

That is a 17 point swing which is impressive even by Barnes standard.

Internet supervision is lax at the special school.

rodders wrote:
Most other refs would have awarded Bests try given he was going to score despite Henshaw's intervention.

Strange how he gave a penalty against Henshaw illegally coming into the maul but the TWO Welsh players on the side weren't an offence?

Scottrf wrote:Internet supervision is lax at the special school.

Well hopefully they don't catch you then

marty2086 wrote:

SecretFly wrote:

captain carrantuohil wrote: I wish we could just forget about Barnes - he wasn't the reason we lost, we were. So Barnes is a schoolmasterly type who enjoys the authority he wields. Big deal.

We wasted all our opportunities, it's that simple. Henshaw had no business anywhere near that bloody maul; the try was going to be scored without his intervention and it was the correct decision to penalise him, unfortunately. As I say, Jonny was unlucky to go off, but that's the way it goes. We weren't good enough and I expect a serious reaction in Dublin on Saturday. I'm sure the players won't be making excuses; they'll be looking to make England suffer a backlash and quite right, too.

To be fair, we were good enough but not great that's the frustrating bit. Despite being capable of so much more we could have should have got more from the game but ultimately poor execution cost us

We melted Marty. We melted mentally, which is a cardinal sin at this level. And I'm sure, despite all his failings on tactics and personal, Joe Schmidt has that rule first on his lips - even under the most pressured conditions don't melt under the strain - keep it together, go through the processes. That team did melt and it caught all of them in the combined panic. At times (and Munkian is right here) it was terrible to look at as balls were slipped quickly from one player to another and they didn't have a clue what to do with it. It was rushed, it was panicked, it had no structure of confidence. That period, think it was middle of the second half, was the period that lost us the game. The minds fried and all tactics went out the window.

rodders wrote:

captain carrantuohil wrote:I wish we could just forget about Barnes - he wasn't the reason we lost, we were. So Barnes is a schoolmasterly type who enjoys the authority he wields. Big deal.

Of course he was the reason we lost. Joe made some bad calls but Barnes shouldn't be allowed off the hook. The level of corruption now in international rugby is outrageous.

He harshly awarded Sexton a yellow but ignored a similar infringement by Wales after Standers break. We conceded 10 points whilst Sexton was off the field.

He also ignored a clear yellow for a high tackle on Jackson, despite the new directives about head high challenges.

Most other refs would have awarded Bests try given he was going to score despite Henshaw's intervention.

That is a 17 point swing which is impressive even by Barnes standard.  

Are you like, taking the pistachio ? This is absolute gold

Do you mean when Jackson slipped head first into Biggar who tried to wrap his arms around him ?

Are you suggesting every penalty Ireland were awarded was fair too ?

I'll agree about Sexton being unlucky, but would add that in that area of the field, even being unable to get out of the way is going to produce a card from most refs. I know the break you mean by Stander, but couldn't see the same (however accidental) denial of a clear scoring opportunity in its immediate aftermath. Would have to look again.

As for the Henshaw thing, most refs know the laws and if they had allowed the impending try after Henshaw's balls-up, they'd have been wrong. Simple as that. Madness, it was, white-line fever, and if you want to blame any single thing for our loss, blame that, which cost us seven points, the lead and all the momentum.

munkian wrote:Are you like, taking the pistachio ? This is absolute gold

Do you mean when Jackson slipped head first into Biggar who tried to wrap his arms around him ?

I think Rodders is taking the pee but Marty actually believes it

Scottrf wrote:

munkian wrote:Are you like, taking the pistachio ? This is absolute gold

Do you mean when Jackson slipped head first into Biggar who tried to wrap his arms around him ?

I think Rodders is taking the pee but Marty actually believes it

So there weren't two Welsh players coming in at the side of the maul slowing it down which according to Barnes himself cost Ireland a try?

marty2086 wrote:

rodders wrote:
Most other refs would have awarded Bests try given he was going to score despite Henshaw's intervention.

Strange how he gave a penalty against Henshaw illegally coming into the maul but the TWO Welsh players on the side weren't an offence?

Come on not even Barnes is going to penalise Ireland for a Welsh player joining a maul

marty2086 wrote:

Scottrf wrote:

munkian wrote:Are you like, taking the pistachio ? This is absolute gold

Do you mean when Jackson slipped head first into Biggar who tried to wrap his arms around him ?

I think Rodders is taking the pee but Marty actually believes it

So there weren't two Welsh players coming in at the side of the maul slowing it down which according to Barnes himself cost Ireland a try?

It's a game of rugby, there are numerous offenses at every area of play. The ref judges the most relevant. I haven't rewatched how each player entered the maul.

Blaming the referee for this defeat is wide of the mark and completely classless.

Gooseberry wrote:

marty2086 wrote:

rodders wrote:
Most other refs would have awarded Bests try given he was going to score despite Henshaw's intervention.

Strange how he gave a penalty against Henshaw illegally coming into the maul but the TWO Welsh players on the side weren't an offence?

Come on not even Barnes is going to penalise Ireland for a Welsh player joining a maul

Hes making Keet Wood seem rational

Actually, in Keith's defense he was pretty good in the post match red button analysis on the BBC.

Called it a yellow at the time and agreed afterwards too.

Scottrf wrote:

marty2086 wrote:

Scottrf wrote:

munkian wrote:Are you like, taking the pistachio ? This is absolute gold

Do you mean when Jackson slipped head first into Biggar who tried to wrap his arms around him ?

I think Rodders is taking the pee but Marty actually believes it

So there weren't two Welsh players coming in at the side of the maul slowing it down which according to Barnes himself cost Ireland a try?

It's a game of rugby, there are numerous offenses at every area of play. The ref judges the most relevant. I haven't rewatched how each player entered the maul.

Blaming the referee for this defeat is wide of the mark and completely classless.

Reading isn't your forte I take it? Where have I blamed the ref? Criticism of decisions doesn't mean blame

If you read up you'll see Ive put the blame at the players feet and their inability to execute, that however doesn't mean Barnes was right

The try was correctly disallowed, again because of poor execution from Henshaw. It was however a penalty to Ireland for the illegal entry by the Welsh players who slowed down the advancing maul.

The Sexton card was wrong and was indicative of Barnes overall performance, the Welsh early on played him like a fiddle. They were constantly being tackled the crawling to gain extra yards, they were constantly being told to stop holding players in the ruck and this was essentially was what Davies did. He rolled on top because its how Barnes refs games, after the England Italy game I talked about blurring lines and creating a picture, it's because of the likes of Barnes that this is the case. He plays a guessing game when making decisions, I described it to someone on Friday as a monkey in his head tossing a coin. He thinks he sees something and goes by that but all too often he is wrong

Apologies, Rodders blames him, all the stupid seems to amalgamate into one poster.

There weren't Welsh players joining from the side though.

No 7&1/2 wrote:There weren't Welsh players joining from the side though.

Try watching it again, Charteris and Francis were hanging on the side. Charteris actually tried to bring the maul down but that was after Henshaw came in

marty2086 wrote:
The Sexton card was wrong and was indicative of Barnes overall performance, the Welsh early on played him like a fiddle. They were constantly being tackled the crawling to gain extra yards, they were constantly being told to stop holding players in the ruck and this was essentially was what Davies did. He rolled on top because its how Barnes refs games, after the England Italy game I talked about blurring lines and creating a picture, it's because of the likes of Barnes that this is the case. He plays a guessing game when making decisions, I described it to someone on Friday as a monkey in his head tossing a coin. He thinks he sees something and goes by that but all too often he is wrong

At least we always know which side youre going to land on, I do think being tossed by a monkey might calm you down a bit though.

Gooseberry wrote:I do think being tossed off by a monkey might calm you down a bit though.

Gooseberry wrote:

marty2086 wrote:
The Sexton card was wrong and was indicative of Barnes overall performance, the Welsh early on played him like a fiddle. They were constantly being tackled the crawling to gain extra yards, they were constantly being told to stop holding players in the ruck and this was essentially was what Davies did. He rolled on top because its how Barnes refs games, after the England Italy game I talked about blurring lines and creating a picture, it's because of the likes of Barnes that this is the case. He plays a guessing game when making decisions, I described it to someone on Friday as a monkey in his head tossing a coin. He thinks he sees something and goes by that but all too often he is wrong

At least we always know which side youre going to land on, I do think being tossed by a monkey might calm you down a bit though.

I have been critical of Barnes no matter who he refs, I have said numerous times over the years on here its a lottery with him.

Irelands problem is they don't play refs, other teams do and Wales did, NZ do, England do, the Wallabies do

Really enjoyed this match. Wales were awesome, Tipuric surprised me a bit and was my man of the match. It was nice to see AWJ have a big game as I would like to see him captain the Lions.

At one point in the 1st quarter some of the hits were seismic and the commitment from both sides incredibly admirable. A lot of Ireland fans are all doom and gloom about this result but it doesn't hurt as much when you see how much effort and commitment the players are putting in.

Two away losses will sting but they were both against good sides in games that we put ourselves in a position to win in the closing stages. With a bit of luck the Ireland team will take stock, improve and move on.

One of the great enigmas in world rugby is why Wales always struggle against Australia but seem to relish playing teams like Ireland.

Yes there were players at the side marty but no one joined from the side. Bar The obvious one.

No 7&1/2 wrote:Yes there were players at the side marty but no one joined from the side. Bar The obvious one.

I didn't say they joined from the side, I said they were on the side, its still a penalty so you're being pedantic about something that wasn't said

Being on the side of a maul isn't a penalty. Perhaps you shouldn't be criticising referees...

Scottrf wrote:Being on the side of a maul isn't a penalty. Perhaps you shouldn't be criticising referees...

He should probably go back to the crayons.

munkian wrote:

Scottrf wrote:Being on the side of a maul isn't a penalty. Perhaps you shouldn't be criticising referees...

He should probably go back to the crayons.

Well aren't you a pair of fools

It's called offside geniuses

Got a video?

Sorry marty but you said there were 2 Welsh players coming in at the side and I assumed yu meant joining from the side. As above being at the side as you have now acknowledged they didn't join isn't a penalty.

No I said they were on the side of the maul, you have to come through the middle of the maul. They came round the side, that's a penalty offence

They didn't change their bind so no they're fine to be there.

No 7&1/2 wrote:They didn't change their bind so no they're fine to be there.

Can you please stop cluttering up this crybaby daisy chain with facts please ?

Well done wales. Quite simply the better team

carpet baboon wrote:Well done wales. Quite simply the better team

Was a fantastic game, best of the tournament - good luck against England

munkian wrote:

carpet baboon wrote:Well done wales. Quite simply the better team

Was a fantastic game, best of the tournament - good luck against England

Cheers munk. Give the French a spanking too

carpet baboon wrote:

munkian wrote:

carpet baboon wrote:Well done wales. Quite simply the better team

Was a fantastic game, best of the tournament - good luck against England

Cheers munk. Give the French a spanking too

Mais oui !

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:

Gooseberry wrote:I do think being tossed off by a monkey might calm you down a bit though.

Works for me!

munkian wrote:

carpet baboon wrote:Well done wales. Quite simply the better team

Was a fantastic game, best of the tournament - good luck against England

I've seen a few people say this. I thought Wales v England was the better Test match, even though we lost.

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:

munkian wrote:

carpet baboon wrote:Well done wales. Quite simply the better team

Was a fantastic game, best of the tournament - good luck against England

I've seen a few people say this. I thought Wales v England was the better Test match, even though we lost.

I'd blocked that one out

Both very intense though.

Maybe it was because Wales v England was played in the afternoon without the roof, but it felt like a throwback to me. A full on, thunderous Test match. It was a belter, I thought.

To say Wayne Barnes favoured Wales is just sour grapes. With a penalty count of 10 against Wales and only 4 against Ireland you would say differently. Check this link, anybody looking at this can make their own mind up, I thought Barnes had a very good game on Friday, got the crucial calls right, although the high tackle for Biggar was a mistake.

http://www.espn.co.uk/rugby/matchstats?gameId=290911&league=180659

LordDowlais wrote:To say Wayne Barnes favoured Wales is just sour grapes. With a penalty count of 10 against Wales and only 4 against Ireland you would say differently. Check this link, anybody looking at this can make their own mind up, I thought Barnes had a very good game on Friday, got the crucial calls right, although the high tackle for Biggar was a mistake.

http://www.espn.co.uk/rugby/matchstats?gameId=290911&league=180659

Looked like Paddy fell or ducked into the tackle to me ?

munkian wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:To say Wayne Barnes favoured Wales is just sour grapes. With a penalty count of 10 against Wales and only 4 against Ireland you would say differently. Check this link, anybody looking at this can make their own mind up, I thought Barnes had a very good game on Friday, got the crucial calls right, although the high tackle for Biggar was a mistake.

http://www.espn.co.uk/rugby/matchstats?gameId=290911&league=180659

Looked like Paddy fell or ducked into the tackle to me ?

Yes you could see the bemusement in Biggars face, he was already committed to the tackle, and his hands/arms were around his own stomach area and the player fell towards him. I cannot remember without watching it again, but I also do not think he made contact either.

P.S, this world rugby ranking malarkey has made the French game all the more juicier.

As a neutral I thought it was a very good game that could easily have gone either way, and that the final score did not represent the balance of the match.

No problems with the Sexton yellow - thought he was conscious of how he made the tackle and didn't even make the pretence of an effort to roll away. Quite a cynical play, given the position and the likelihood of Wales scoring off quick recycled ball.

However, the game hinged on a few things:
1 - Henshaw joining the maul in front of Best. Correctly penalised, as he took out the Welsh defenders. Had he joined behind or alongside Best, the try would have likely been scored anyway, so a 'shoot yourself in the foot' moment.

2 - Biggar's clearance kick from deep in goal, touched by an Irish forward and the partial charge down just evaded Earls, who only needed to catch the ball and fall forward for the try.

3 - Compare with Faletau charge down and Roberts getting the unopposed run in.

Yes, Wales were probably the better side overall, but Ireland didn't have much luck, which could have been enough to tilt the result the other way

munkian wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:To say Wayne Barnes favoured Wales is just sour grapes. With a penalty count of 10 against Wales and only 4 against Ireland you would say differently. Check this link, anybody looking at this can make their own mind up, I thought Barnes had a very good game on Friday, got the crucial calls right, although the high tackle for Biggar was a mistake.

http://www.espn.co.uk/rugby/matchstats?gameId=290911&league=180659

Looked like Paddy fell or ducked into the tackle to me ?

Jesus, he's lucky Wayne didn't spot that. We might have had a red to go with the yellow.

dummy_half wrote:Yes, Wales were probably the better side overall, but Ireland didn't have much luck, which could have been enough to tilt the result the other way

Ireland could still be playing until today, and they would not have scored a try through the backs, i thought Wales had their number.

LordDowlais wrote:

dummy_half wrote:Yes, Wales were probably the better side overall, but Ireland didn't have much luck, which could have been enough to tilt the result the other way

Ireland could still be playing until today, and they would not have scored a try through the backs, i thought Wales had their number.

Good one Lord.

Funny how the Welsh are being more honest about Ireland's efforts than some Irish. It's us that need this level of honesty if we're going to goad the coaching outfit to change perceptions and drag Joe Schmidt back to being the kind of coach he was at Leinster. Don't anyone give me the crap that it can't be played at International and that you have to keep the blasted ball 'safe' to play International. Horseschidt

LordDowlais wrote:To say Wayne Barnes favoured Wales is just sour grapes. With a penalty count of 10 against Wales and only 4 against Ireland you would say differently. Check this link, anybody looking at this can make their own mind up, I thought Barnes had a very good game on Friday, got the crucial calls right, although the high tackle for Biggar was a mistake.

http://www.espn.co.uk/rugby/matchstats?gameId=290911&league=180659

Its bad governance that the same referee is given every Wales v Ireland fixture for the last 10 years or so. That in itself is quite dodgy. There are 8 potential referees that could get this fixture and yet every year Barnes gets the gig. That should never happen in my opinion.

GunsGermsV2 wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:To say Wayne Barnes favoured Wales is just sour grapes. With a penalty count of 10 against Wales and only 4 against Ireland you would say differently. Check this link, anybody looking at this can make their own mind up, I thought Barnes had a very good game on Friday, got the crucial calls right, although the high tackle for Biggar was a mistake.

http://www.espn.co.uk/rugby/matchstats?gameId=290911&league=180659

Its bad governance that the same referee is given every Wales v Ireland fixture for the last 10 years or so. That in itself is quite dodgy. There are 8 potential referees that could get this fixture and yet every year Barnes gets the gig. That should never happen in my opinion.

Call it payback for all the homer refs we get in the Pro12

GunsGermsV2 wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:To say Wayne Barnes favoured Wales is just sour grapes. With a penalty count of 10 against Wales and only 4 against Ireland you would say differently. Check this link, anybody looking at this can make their own mind up, I thought Barnes had a very good game on Friday, got the crucial calls right, although the high tackle for Biggar was a mistake.

http://www.espn.co.uk/rugby/matchstats?gameId=290911&league=180659

Its bad governance that the same referee is given every Wales v Ireland fixture for the last 10 years or so. That in itself is quite dodgy. There are 8 potential referees that could get this fixture and yet every year Barnes gets the gig. That should never happen in my opinion.

No it shouldn't, that is a very fair comment, and I did not realise that Wayne Barnes reffed so many of these fixtures. But in saying that, Wayne Barnes was not the difference on Friday night. Sexton aside, who was a class act, and looked like he was going to war with Wales, the backs were poor. So poor in fact that they did not once pose a threat to the Welsh line. It was that reason and the fact that your lineouts were misfiring under the stewardship of Rory Best again why you lost. Losing your own throw on the oppositions 5mtr line is criminal.