Scotland vs France World Cup Warm Up Match - Toonie Strikes Back! Saturday 24th August

by bsando Tue 20 Aug 2019, 2:25 pm

First topic message reminder :

Toonie Strikes Back!

Following on from the disastrous "New Hope" instalment last weekend all we can hope for is a no nonsense first team showing with the soul intention of righting some wrongs. France have named their side and it is full strength! They are clearly looking to win well at Murrayfield and consolidate some positions having already named their 31 man squad. Only Finnsanity can save the day...

Venue: BT Murrayfield 1:10pm KO

Teams

Scotland

1. Gordon Reid (Ayrshire Bulls) – 35 caps
2. George Turner (Glasgow Warriors) – 6 caps
3. Willem Nel (Edinburgh) – 29 caps
4. Scott Cummings (Glasgow Warriors) – 1 cap
5. Sam Skinner (Exeter Chiefs) – 5 caps
6. Ryan Wilson VICE CAPTAIN (Glasgow Warriors) – 43 caps
7. Hamish Watson (Edinburgh) – 25 caps
8. Blade Thomson (Scarlets) – uncapped
9. Greig Laidlaw CAPTAIN (Clermont Auvergne) – 71 caps
10. Finn Russell (Racing 92) – 44 caps
11. Sean Maitland (Saracens) – 40 caps
12. Pete Horne (Glasgow Warriors) – 41 caps
13. Chris Harris (Gloucester) – 8 caps
14. Tommy Seymour (Glasgow Warriors) – 50 caps
15. Stuart Hogg VICE CAPTAIN (Exeter Chiefs) – 68 caps

Bench
16. Grant Stewart (Glasgow Warriors) – uncapped
17. Allan Dell (London Irish) – 22 caps
18. Simon Berghan (Edinburgh)– 20 caps
19. Grant Gilchrist (Edinburgh) – 34 caps
20. John Barclay (Edinburgh) – 72 caps
21. George Horne (Glasgow Warriors) – 5 caps
22. Rory Hutchinson (Northampton Saints) – 1 cap
23. Blair Kinghorn (Edinburgh) – 12 caps

France

1.Poirot
2.Guirado
3.Slimani
4.Lambey
5.Vahaamahina
6.Iturria
7.Ollivon
8.Alldritt
9.Dupont
10.Lopez
11.Raka
12.Fofana
13.Fickou
14.Penaud
15.Ramos

Bench: Chat, Baille, Setiano, Taofifenua, Camara, Serin, Ntamack, Médard

by **RDW** Sat 24 Aug 2019, 3:09 pm

Great to get the win. Much better performance than last week but still plenty to work on - which to be fair is a decent place to be halfway through the warm-ups.

2nd half was much better but should be acknowledged that France weren't great and didn't look massively interested.

Standout players for me were Watson, Wilson, Harris and Maitland and Russell really came into his game. Gilchrist made an important contribution off the bench and Kinghorn scrambled well.

by maestegmafia Sat 24 Aug 2019, 3:21 pm

Well done Scotland I read the text live feed on bbc sounds like a good game. Great to see an improved performance being reported by the pundits

by jimbopip Sat 24 Aug 2019, 3:27 pm

takethelongroad wrote:I hope you all saw the batman insignia on Ryan Wilson’s wrist sweatbands!

Well spotted Mr Road, it made I smile it did. Very Happy

Apart from that, I thought Batman had a very good game. The back row was much better than last week. Barclay was better than last week when he came on, which was a big bonus.

The scrum was much better. Both Skinner and Cummings did themselves no harm. Skinner looked in trouble when he came off, hopefully it's not as bad as it looks.

The French were using what I believe is called the umbrella defence and rushing up very quickly. It looks as if Toonie's instructions were to try to pass it around them if there was an extra man. For the intercept try Scotland have 3 on 2 and if the ball goes early it's an unopposed run in. In instances like that the 12 hasn't time to think; if he gets the call he passes the ball. The French player gambled and won. I thought both centres did very well defensively. Interestingly enough, Hutchie didn't make any more impact than Furra Linee when he came on.

So; we beat a Tier 1 side, we didn't concede 4 tries, no real stinking MFL type performances but no real standouts. Could have been worse.

by 123456789. Sat 24 Aug 2019, 3:30 pm

If Scotland are the new France and France are obviously still France then the obvious conclusion is that literally nothing can be derived from these two performances other than that Scotland are still unpredictable, still flaky and that Finn Russell is still brilliant.

by jimbopip Sat 24 Aug 2019, 3:51 pm

123456789. wrote:If Scotland are the new France and France are obviously still France then can we make any~~the~~ obvious conclusion is other than that literally nothing can be derived from these two performances other than that existentialism is alive and well On the morning the squad wakens up and decides to be brilliant they will be and on the morning they waken up in a Luvvie-ish mood we lose to Samoa, and Russia. Scotland are still unpredictable, still ~~flaky~~ too obviously watching too many Alain Delon movies and that Finn Russell is still brilliant but King Blarehorn is really working on his Monsieur Hulot impersonations.

by reallybored Sat 24 Aug 2019, 3:57 pm

Mixed performance; defence was better but still looked fragile, scrum was way better but lineout fell apart, looks like we've lost Skinner which is a real shame, scored a couple tries but didn't do much else.

Impressed with the front-five but Turner got a little loose. Watson and Wilson both made a huge difference, Blade went reasonably well for first 40.

Laidlaw was painfully slow, Russell had a mixed bag but didn't seem to have many options, centres were decent and back-three looked solid.

Fingers crossed on Skinner, he'd have been in my starting XV at 4.

by tigertattie Sat 24 Aug 2019, 4:48 pm

Meanwhile, down in Twickenham

by **NeilyBroon** Sat 24 Aug 2019, 5:22 pm

Very mixed performance. At least we ground out a result in the end. I don't think laidlaw was too bad today but Horne definitely upped the pace. Harris played well, certainly defensively, so fights another day. Hamish is essential, please stay fit! Patience and execution should be the focus of training, too many mistakes really. Luckily France were full of mistakes too.

We need to nip these issues in the bud in the next two games but I left murrayfield definitely happier than i was about last week!

by Tramptastic Sat 24 Aug 2019, 5:36 pm

When you consider that it wasn't our 1st choice hooker + Gray to return in the row that should sort out the line out. Turner has always been a bit shaky at lineout time and that was an unfamiliar 2nd row pairing for him too.

Should be more solid with McInally/Brown and Gray back

Laidlaw always matches the quality of ball he's given. If it's good ball he delivers good service, if its mince then we see Frodo the ponderous

by **RDW** Sat 24 Aug 2019, 5:55 pm

Tramptastic wrote:When you consider that it wasn't our 1st choice hooker + Gray to return in the row that should sort out the line out. Turner has always been a bit shaky at lineout time and that was an unfamiliar 2nd row pairing for him too.

Should be more solid with McInally/Brown and Gray back

Laidlaw always matches the quality of ball he's given. If it's good ball he delivers good service, if its mince then we see Frodo the ponderous

Gray jnr isn't a lineout leader - Toolis and Skinner are our best lineout locks. Gray snr would make a massive difference but we all know where he is!

by **NeilyBroon** Sat 24 Aug 2019, 5:58 pm

He could be called up if skinner is crocked, never know!

by funnyExiledScot Sat 24 Aug 2019, 6:52 pm

I was at the game so will need to watch it again to form a proper judgement, but a much improved defensive performance and a few players really showed up. Watson and Wilson were impressive on the flanks, andni must say that Harris put in a shift in defence and showed up well compared to Jones last week. Very mixed game from Russell, he kicked to much cross field and short stuff, but his pass for Maitland was nicely weighted.

I was properly depressed about last week. Today was better. Still much to work on.

by **RDW** Sat 24 Aug 2019, 7:14 pm

My player ratings:

1 Reid - 6
Solid in the scrum and put himself about. Squeeky bum time when he threw that pass though!

2 Turner - 5.5

Lineout throwing problems and tired quite early. Maybe took a knock?

3 Nel - 6.5

Dominant in the scrum - our number 1 number 3 there is no doubt.

4 Cummings - 6.5

He looks comfortable at Test level which is great - did his job without standing out too much.

5 Skinner - 6.5

Similar to Cummings he did his job and lineout was going well when he was running it. Injury didn't look good.

6 Wilson - 7.5

His best Scotland display for a while - carried hard and was involved in everything. Stupid penalties his major downfall. Probably confirmed on the plane now.

7 Watson - 8

He was everywhere and caused a lot of trouble on their rucks. Powerful carry helped set up the Harris try.

8 Thomson - 6
Was solid before he went off - shame we didn't see a full game out of him. Will he get another chance?

9 Laidlaw - 6

I feel a lot calmer when he's playing but he's also still slow. Made a few wrong decisions too, going to the wrong side or having to double back.

10 Russell - 6.5

Full house of a performance - pretty rubbish in the first half, much more controlled and accurate in the 2nd. Still streets ahead of Hastings at this level.

11 Maitland - 6.5

Another class display - a nailed on stater

12 Horne - 6

Solid enough but he'll be held responsible for the early interception. Didn't do much to show he should definitely travel bit we know Townsend bis a fan.

13 Harris - 7.5

Much maligned but I thought he put in a good display. Far more energetic than Jones last week and looked comfortable on the ball. Some nice offloads and a very well taken try. Has that performance edged him closer to the plane? Jones certainly needs to up his game!

14 Seymour N/A Kinghorn 6.5

Seymour went off too early to make an impression. Amazingly Kinghorn did his best work in defence! He was energetic in his kick chase with his efforts in the 2nd half leading to the key turnover. Made a mistake firing the ball at Hogg in attack but will be happy with his display.

Hogg - 7

Dangerous as always and was always a threat. Hopefully feels better for 80 minutes under his belt.

Subs

Dell, Stewart, Berghan, Hutchinson - 6. Did their jobs solidly enough.

Barclay - 6.5. Doesn't look fully fit yet but put a lot of work in off the bench.

Gilchrist - 6.5. Made some key physical contributions.

Horne jnr - not enough time to make an impression.

Overall - 6.5. Much improved from last week but defence, attack and lineout still plenty to work on.

by alive555 Sat 24 Aug 2019, 9:45 pm

Thompson looked great before going off. Lets hope the big fella is ok

by maestegmafia Sun 25 Aug 2019, 7:02 am

alive555 wrote:Thompson looked great before going off. Lets hope the big fella is ok

He’s been around for a while and pretty much continuously on the sick note list for games.

Has probably screwed less than ten matches for club or country in the last two years

by **RDW** Sun 25 Aug 2019, 10:09 am

Tell you what I bet Toonie is relieved he's got another game before picking his squad! I don't think many of the key questions have been answered so far, although Skinner's injury may simplify things in the pack.

If Skinner is ruled out (and it didn't look good) I suspect we'll go with the traditional 4 lock 6 BR split. Berghan at LH suggests we're going for 5 props which other teams seem to be doing. I suspect Strauss has blown his chance, but may get a reprieve if Bradbury and Thomson are struggling over the next few weeks.

So that means lock - Gray, Gilchrist, Toolis, Cummings

BR - Watson, Wilson, probably Barclay + 3 from everyone else! I'd take Ritchie, Bradbury and Thomson, assuming the last two are fit.

Backs are even less clear after the last 4 games, particular the centres. On the merry-go-round of form Harris' stock has risen and Horne's has gone down a little. Taylor and Jones need another run out to be able to tell, and I've liked what Hutchinson has brought off the bench recently but he hasn't had much of s chance to shine.

Back 3 wise Maitland and Hogg are certainties and we need to see what Seymour's head knock is like. Kinghorn has had plenty time to stake a claim the last 2 games and has done a lot of good but has also made mistakes. Graham and McGuigan need another run out to be able to tell their chances.

With that in mind I think the next game should be used to finalise the squad, then give more gametime to certain players. Assuming everyone is fit I'd go with

1 Bhatti
2 Brown
3 Fagerson
4 Gray
5 Toolis
6 Bradbury
7 Ritchie
8 Thomson (Strauss if not fit)

9 Price
10 Hastings
11 McGuigan
12 Taylor
13 Jones
14 Graham
15 Maitland

Subs - Berghan, Mcinally, Nel, Gilchrist, Wilson, Horne, Horne, Hutchinson

by funnyExiledScot Sun 25 Aug 2019, 10:25 am

Agree with most of that RDW, although I'd want to give Hutchinson a start in the next game, and I'd also be tempted to let George Horne start a game.

The key unknown for me is Bradbury. Is he fit and ready? We are short at number 8 and we need someone to put their hand in the air.

by jimbopip Sun 25 Aug 2019, 10:26 am

I know it's not often said on these threads but clap

a big thank you to England and Ireland.

England: Home-thrash Wales
Away-battered by Wales
Home -thrash Ireland

Ireland: rock up to Twickers and put in as abject a performance as I can remember from the men in green.

Seriously, if it had been a 6 Nations Ireland would never have been so woeful.

The only thing we can take from the warm up games is that the home teams tend to win. hopefully this will put our breast beating and sack-cloth and ashes of the past week into perspective.

There were a lot of positives to be taken from yesterday but here's one we haven't really discussed.

The French seemed pretty much set up to make the 10-13 channels very congested and prevent Scotland getting the ball wide. With Frodo at 9 they had that teeny weeny bit more time for their outside defenders to get on Harris' outside shoulder and bottle us up into the congested midfield. Now, in the past (or the present if Haircut had been 10) it would have just been a matter of time until we were trying to find the miracle ball and giving it away, or the forwards would be so desperate to generate quick ball that we would have conceded penalties and started falling behind on the scoreboard...leading to even more desperate "miracle balls".
Instead, despite the interception try, they stuck to the gameplan and gradually created time and space to play in. Dancer's variety of kicks meant they had to keep a sweeper and both centres were secure in what they were doing (interception aside).
RDW makes a good point that we feel calmer with Frodo at 9 but then so do the opposition. The knowledge that he won't snipe around the fringes allows them to push across and blitz the 10-12 channel (see the intercept try). I would have like to see Wee George on sooner, but that's the conundrum...in a tight game do you keep with steady, reliable, dependable heart of a warrior, Frodo or do you go all structured chaos?
I hope haircut spends a few hours this week watching Dancer's performance. he controlled everything and gave the French very little to feed off. Similarly, we all thought that Furra and Harris would be looking to outgun Hutch and Not A Pony in terms of line breaks and tries: instead they gave us a very controlled, solid performance (intercept blah blah).
Everyone knows the script for beating Scotland. France stuck to the script. Scotland won. Not a bad day at the office then.

Tigertattie...did your daughter enjoy her first match?

by **RDW** Sun 25 Aug 2019, 10:27 am

funnyExiledScot wrote:Agree with most of that RDW, although I'd want to give Hutchinson a start in the next game, and I'd also be tempted to let George Horne start a game.

The key unknown for me is Bradbury. Is he fit and ready? We are short at number 8 and we need someone to put their hand in the air.

I thought about Hutchinson starting but Taylor desperately needs more gametime and Jones needs another game to rise to Harris' challenge.

by **RDW** Sun 25 Aug 2019, 10:48 am

Oh I forgot about Johnson - if he's fit he'll definitely need a run out.

Major decisions to be made in the centres!

by TJ Sun 25 Aug 2019, 11:00 am

Berghan. Nel had them in trouble until he went off looking knackered. Berghan came on and we started going backwards. I think he is one who took a step backwards away from the plane. Shrek did well as well.

Our real issues is we seem to have some players where there really is no replacement available. Nel, Russel, Watson. anything happens to those 3 then we are in trouble

Frodo remains an issue. Yes he has weaknesses mainly in his lack of a sniping threat - but his passing is superb and he adds something intangible - we just do not look like a soft touch with him on the pitch

by **RDW** Sun 25 Aug 2019, 11:05 am

TJ wrote:Berghan. Nel had them in trouble until he went off looking knackered. Berghan came on and we started going backwards. I think he is one who took a step backwards away from the plane. Shrek did well as well.

Our real issues is we seem to have some players where there really is no replacement available. Nel, Russel, Watson. anything happens to those 3 then we are in trouble

Frodo remains an issue. Yes he has weaknesses mainly in his lack of a sniping threat - but his passing is superb and he adds something intangible - we just do not look like a soft touch with him on the pitch

Remember by that time TJ we had one lock, Barclay in the second row and two lightweight hookers in the pack. By contrast France had brought on some absolute monsters off the bench. We must have been losing a good 50-60kg compared to the French by that point. I actually thought we dealt with it really well - quick hooks, no messing about.

There is a vast drop off to our 4th choice tighthead too - Berghan will definitely travel.

by funnyExiledScot Sun 25 Aug 2019, 11:11 am

RDW wrote:Oh I forgot about Johnson - if he's fit he'll definitely need a run out.

Major decisions to be made in the centres!

Taylor and Hutchinson should start with Johnson on the bench. Perhaps switch at half time. McGuigan, Graham and Kinghorn and form a back three. Maitland can bench with Frodo, G Horne and Hastings to start.

by 123456789. Sun 25 Aug 2019, 12:28 pm

I'm not sure he learnt anything yesterday that he didn't know already. Nel, Barclay and Laidlaw had strong games which is good to see. Ritchie is a very good player but I'm not sure he's got quite the nous of Barclay and won't have the experience either (which obviously isn't his fault). If Skinner is out then that will be incredibly disappointing. In the increasingly bizarre world Richie Gray not being in the squad then I think our best combination in the boiler room is Skinner and Gray. Watson is different class, but then we already knew that. I think if this was a Lions year rather than a world cup won then I'd stick Faletau at blindside and Vunipola at 8 with Watson at 7, then sit back and watch the brutal contest between them and the Boks with an almighty grin. Turner showed himself to be a decent operator but still a solid third behind MacInally and Brown. Thomson displayed signs he could be the 8 we've been looking for. He's not likely to be the long term option at his age and with his injury record (I do fear that it is his injury that will prove longer lasting than Skinner's with his record). Going toward the Ireland game (there's no point trying to predict the side Toonie will pick to play in a warm up, perhaps it will be Blair and Townsend at 9 and 10 as almost everyone else has played now) and in an ideal world injury wise I'd like to see: Dell, MacInally, Nel, Skinner, Gray, Barclay, Watson, Thomson in the pack.

Laidlaw played very well I thought, cementing his status as Scotland's 'can't live with him, can't live without him' scrum-half. Likewise Russell showed why he is by far Scotland's best 10 of the last 20 years and perhaps even longer but he also showed moments of utter insanity. Horne, for me, showed why he is not the option at 12. He mouthed off in the papers about not being considered first choice despite playing all of the time. Perhaps it's because he keeps chucking the ball to the opposition. I actually thought he played pretty well, and I'd be surprised if he didn't travel. But when we play Ireland and when (I'm not countenancing losing to Japan, it's not good for my mental health) we play New Zealand/ South Africa we cannot afford one of his inexplicable missed tackles or his unnecessary interception passes. The margins in International rugby are so small, and the stakes so high that even if Horne is perfect for 79 minutes, there's a good chance that one minute will cost us. Harris actually played alright in the second half. Townsend obviously rates him so I think that 40 will be used as the pretext to take him along. I still think Jones' record in the biggest games should see him through He's won sixty percent of his Six Nations games. He's played seventeen games against the five nations and rugby championship team, scoring 9 tries. He's scored one in five against Italy/ Tier 2 countries. That could be seen as an attitude problem, but quite frankly if he gets us past Ireland and through an unimaginably difficult quarter-final he can pick and choose his Scotland appearances from then on as far as I'm concerned. Seymour still has the edge over Graham and Kinghorn just, Maitland is just an incredibly classy operator and would be the first name on the teamsheet for me. With a view to that Ireland game I'd have: Laidlaw, Russell, Seymour, Taylor, Jones, Maitland, Hogg.

With a view to next week, I think we'll see the Hastings-Russell axis again at one point either off the bench or to start. Jones needs another game and you have to think Hutchinson will get a start at some stage. If Johnson and Gray are fit I think they'll have to play too. Fagerson will surely be given a start also. So I think, if fit, we'll see Fagerson, Gray, Bradbury, Horne, Johnson, Hutchinson and Kinghorn start, with Hastings and Russell playing the last 20-30 together.

by **RDW** Sun 25 Aug 2019, 1:39 pm

Also completely forgot about Fagerson jnr! He'll probably start at 8 against Georgia.

by reallybored Sun 25 Aug 2019, 9:57 pm

Obviously Watson is nailed on and I think Wilson did enough to book his seat. If Skinner is out, I could see Townsend taking 6 back-row along with 4 locks. If Skinner makes the squad then it may be 5.

Thomson looked decent but 40 minutes then a HIA would feel like an amighty gamble at the expense of Bradbury or Fagerson who definitely have more game tape available.

For me Bradbury is the answer at 8 and deserves to have credit in the bank from the England game, if fit he has to start at 8 this week and get match sharpness for Ireland.

Fagerson Jnr finished the season like a house on fire and definitely deserves a chance to press his case ahead of Thomson.

This is the pecking order imo;

Wilson
Watson
Bradbury
Ritchie
Fagerson

Barclay
Thomson

by **NeilyBroon** Mon 26 Aug 2019, 7:55 am

Aye i think I'd rather see Thomson string some games together at Scarlets - i don't know if we can call up players to cover HIA, and i think it's important for him to have a run of fitness at a domestic level for himself as much as Scotland.

This match against Georgia has become significantly more important as the win against France is essentially just a sticking plaster, with the same problems with accuracy and a lack of game plan apparent. A lot of the time it's like watching the barbarians. We need more than just Finn playing heads up rugby, just throwing a pass for the sake of it doesn't help the cause, for instance if blair had just held that france player for another second THEN passed that was 90% certain to be a try. Peter Horne just throwing a pass in our half just 'because' then shipping a try in the first few minutes is another example. With Johnson as second playmaker this should improve but the players need to realise that just passing it more or always offloading doesn't win games. They have to recognise when it's not on and just be happy to take into contact for a few phases and not just depend on either Finn coming up with something when we don't progress after two phases or one random offload to come off, which seems to be Toonies gameplan.

If skinner is out, I'd like to see Toonie call up gray sr and give him a shot. We need lineout leadership badly as it's an area of weakness, and apart from skinner the others don't cut it. Will this happen? Doubtful but one can hope.

I think Hutch deserves a start, as does Horne Jr. Hastings needs a shot at redemption, France would have given him a good reality check. If Johnson is fit I'd put him on the bench and give him a run out, especially if we're under the kosch. Kinghorn can start at 15 and I'd have Finn on the bench with Price as support if all goes Pete Tong but let Hornestings play most of the game if it's going okay. Whatever happens we mustn't lose as psychologically that will really mess things up pre world cup, especially as arguably this will be a similar environment to the Japan game and we have a lot of young players who are still relatively green in important roles.

Finally, getting off to a good start is absolutely key, even more so away from home. Hopefully that'll be addressed in training this week.

by **RDW** Mon 26 Aug 2019, 9:08 am

We certainly can't go into the game lightly - this is a huge deal for Georgia and they're going to be firing into us. We're going to have a physical onslaught against us!

by tigertattie Mon 26 Aug 2019, 9:21 am

Right, had time to review the highlights and have a think about what is what!

Firstly, bye bye Pete Horne. He was giving it large in the media about how people say he is knickers but he’s always in the team so he must be good. He’s not! He is a professional rugby player and yet again he’s chucked the pass that wasn’t on. Pernaud took the interception brilliantly but he had a great big neon light flashing above his head saying “careful now” and Horne just launched the ball at him!

Ryan Wilson, he had a mixed bag but again he just isn’t an international class rugby player. He gave away too many stupid penalties and he was caught way out of position for the 2nd French try! Pete Horne was running back from somewhere, where from I do not know, but he wasn’t in the line building up to the try.

I thought Blairhorn did well. To me his pass that Hoggy couldn’t take wasn’t for Hoggy but for Horne, can’t really blame Blairhonrn for that one really!

Blade did well for 40 minutes. If he is passed fit, I’d have him starting again against Georgia to get him up to speed.

Finn Russell. What can you do with him? He’s just hot or not, even during games. His simple dropped ball led to the 2nd French try. Any other player doing that would have fans calling for blood, but because it’s Finn he’s allowed to get away with it as he is “mercurial”

Cummings did well. If Skinner is gubbed then Scott could be going to Japan. Still think we’re missing big Ritchie though!

Applause to Harris who seemed to have decent game all in all.

Watson. Boom. What a player.

For me, the most pleasing improvement was the defense. We nilled France in the 2nd half and if you take Pete Horne out the side we’d deffo have saved one try in the second half. If you take Watson out of the team though, we’re in doo doo!

by EWT Spoons Mon 26 Aug 2019, 9:28 am

This game was very confusing. Harris who has been much maligned seemed to have a pretty good game, and took his try well.

Russell who is largely deemed as our saviour had a real mixed game, with some good and some terrible moments. Hopefully it’s just rustiness and by the time the WC comes round he’ll have it out his system.

I was at the game so likely missed the good stuff, but I didn’t see Wilson do much of note, other then give away pens, but I was pretty high up in the stands, and was having an ongoing battle with the person in front of me, who seemed to take umbrage at me having knees or legs of any description.

Pretty certain that’s Laidlaw’s last game at BTM, he was very emotional during the anthems, and applauded the fans as he went off (which I don’t think I have seen him do before). I suspect he’ll be calling it a day after the WC and possibly know’s he’s not playing in the Georgia game back here.

On the injury front, I hope Skinner’s isn’t too bad, but I fear he’ll likely miss the WC. Thomson has no luck with head injuries in Edinburgh. I don’t know if Bradbury was always due to miss this game, but his “rib” injury might be more serious than hoped, and if it continues then possibly best he sits the WC out and gets his “rib” in a good place.

I don’t know if we learned much from the game though, other than we can beat teams at Murrayfield, but struggle away.

by Tramptastic Mon 26 Aug 2019, 9:36 am

I thought Russell had quite a good game, he seemed to know where the space was and put in the appropriate kicks/chips/grubbers to exploit it.

Im fairly sure a younger Russell wouldn't have bothered and would instead be flingin miracle passes all over the place but, definitely more noticeable in the 2nd half, he put boot to ball and just kept the french in their half. As fair as being game management goes I thought Russell led the charge rather than Laidlaw - probably a sign of some form of maturing playing in france

by Hazel Sapling Mon 26 Aug 2019, 9:46 am

It was a good game and it was a decent reaction, however it was a bit of a pyrrhic victory.

Potentially losing Skinner is a blow and Toolis/Thomson/Bradbury may be the beneficiaries. Skinner was likely the bench option going into the Ireland game with a chance of starting. The line-out was not going smoothly, however it appeared to be more the throwing was squint as opposed to the jumpers messing it up and Skinner can probably be absolved of that failure.

There are still too many brain farts. Wilson was slightly unlucky, Turner's was plain dirty and stupid. Hogg missed touch on one of his kicks. We allowed France to kick 10m on a restart and have a free jump for it without really challenging for the second week running. P Horne and Reid's long passes were poor. Was it P Horne or Harris who could have passed it off for the first try and we would not have had to go through phases to score further into the corner? These are the differences between comfortable wins and tight losses.

There are still questions to be answered in the centres. Harris played well and H Jones has to react. I think Harris is a good club player who can occasionally have a good international game, but H Jones can score tries from nowhere at international level and that is a serious skill. There is a reason Leicester were willing to throw serious cash at him.

The Georgia game will be fascinating if only to see how much stock beating the top Tier 2 nation holds. I don't think Georgia will get you on the plane, it can only get you booted off.

by **RDW** Mon 26 Aug 2019, 10:02 am

I'm certainly not a Wilson fan but he did play well, stupid penalty aside.

by Tramptastic Mon 26 Aug 2019, 10:06 am

I'd still argue the penalty was borderline, he was pinged for taking a man beyond the ruck/off the ball but Ramos had put his hands in to the ruck so Wilson was well within his rights to clear him

The only reason he was pinged was because Ramos disengaged at the last second, seeing Wilson charging in, removing himself from the ruck and thus being taken out off the ball/beyond the ruck. Unfortunate but if you want quick attacking ball in that situation you have to clear fast and aggressive. Wilson will have been coached to do that and I think he was unlucky

by **George Carlin** Mon 26 Aug 2019, 10:07 am

Good chat, everyone.

With Skinner out, it does potentially open the door for Fagerson as a bolter. Radio silence on Mr Snow (Bradbury) so I guess he's out of favour.

How fantastic to be able to say that we need to bring in Taylor, Johnson and Micro Horne in the next two games. Will enjoy watching these. Hope to hell we have no injuries.

I read that they are worried Conor Murray could be concussed. That's the damn thing about this world cup - you can lose crucial players instantly. I think that Wales are on a very thin edge with Anscombe now out.

by EWT Spoons Mon 26 Aug 2019, 10:10 am

George Carlin wrote:Good chat, everyone.

With Skinner out, it does potentially open the door for Fagerson as a bolter. Radio silence on Mr Snow (Bradbury) so I guess he's out of favour.

He's injured

by **RDW** Mon 26 Aug 2019, 10:11 am

Tramptastic wrote:I'd still argue the penalty was borderline, he was pinged for taking a man beyond the ruck/off the ball but Ramos had put his hands in to the ruck so Wilson was well within his rights to clear him

The only reason he was pinged was because Ramos disengaged at the last second, seeing Wilson charging in, removing himself from the ruck and thus being taken out off the ball/beyond the ruck. Unfortunate but if you want quick attacking ball in that situation you have to clear fast and aggressive. Wilson will have been coached to do that and I think he was unlucky

I think we debated it at the time but for me it was a clear pen - yes the Frenchie disengaged but Wilson then still followed through and cleared him out a good 2m past the ruck! That's an unforgivable penalty IMO - I get in the heat not the moment players will get carried away but they've got to know if they're in a ruck or not

by **George Carlin** Mon 26 Aug 2019, 10:20 am

EWT Spoons wrote:
George Carlin wrote:Good chat, everyone.

With Skinner out, it does potentially open the door for Fagerson as a bolter. Radio silence on Mr Snow (Bradbury) so I guess he's out of favour.

He's injured

Coke will do that to you. Allegedly.

by EWT Spoons Mon 26 Aug 2019, 10:31 am

George Carlin wrote:
EWT Spoons wrote:
George Carlin wrote:Good chat, everyone.

With Skinner out, it does potentially open the door for Fagerson as a bolter. Radio silence on Mr Snow (Bradbury) so I guess he's out of favour.

He's injured
Coke will do that to you. Allegedly.

Are you getting Hardie mixed up with Bradbury, or have you heard something?

Bradbury is out just now due to a rib injury picked up in training.

by Tramptastic Mon 26 Aug 2019, 10:35 am

RDW wrote:
Tramptastic wrote:I'd still argue the penalty was borderline, he was pinged for taking a man beyond the ruck/off the ball but Ramos had put his hands in to the ruck so Wilson was well within his rights to clear him

The only reason he was pinged was because Ramos disengaged at the last second, seeing Wilson charging in, removing himself from the ruck and thus being taken out off the ball/beyond the ruck. Unfortunate but if you want quick attacking ball in that situation you have to clear fast and aggressive. Wilson will have been coached to do that and I think he was unlucky

I think we debated it at the time but for me it was a clear pen - yes the Frenchie disengaged but Wilson then still followed through and cleared him out a good 2m past the ruck! That's an unforgivable penalty IMO - I get in the heat not the moment players will get carried away but they've got to know if they're in a ruck or not

This is where it gets quite subjective - a different wouldn't have given it. If it was the all blacks clearing out like that you can be sure they'd have gotten away with it (althought with Wayne Barnes he'd have probably still penalised the all blacks). I'd feel properly hard done by if i'd worked my @rse off to support my team mate, get to ruck, clear out the jackler and then get penalised for attempting to generate clean ball. Ramos was the single greatest threat in defense there, if he was given any more time to settle in the jackle position he could have slowed that ball right down. Wilson had one job to do and he did it 110% - unfortunately the ref saw it differently!

by **George Carlin** Mon 26 Aug 2019, 11:03 am

EWT Spoons wrote:
George Carlin wrote:
EWT Spoons wrote:
George Carlin wrote:Good chat, everyone.

With Skinner out, it does potentially open the door for Fagerson as a bolter. Radio silence on Mr Snow (Bradbury) so I guess he's out of favour.

He's injured
Coke will do that to you. Allegedly.

Are you getting Hardie mixed up with Bradbury, or have you heard something?

Bradbury is out just now due to a rib injury picked up in training.

I'm starting a rumour.

Like the one about Jim being able to use the quote function correctly every time now.

by tigertattie Mon 26 Aug 2019, 11:05 am

The issue with Wilson's penalty was that we went over the ball and then left his feet.

Simple rule. If you are off your feet, you are out of the game!

by TJ Mon 26 Aug 2019, 11:06 am

Wilson dived off his feet. If he had even attempted to stay on his feet and fallen 'cos the french guy pulled back then he would have been OK but you could clearly see him diving full length. YOu have to at least attempt to stay on your feet. The penalty was for going off his feet - you could hear the ref explain. It was not for clearing out beyond the ruck

Just over enthusiastic and the right decision

by EWT Spoons Mon 26 Aug 2019, 11:09 am

George Carlin wrote:
EWT Spoons wrote:
George Carlin wrote:
EWT Spoons wrote:
George Carlin wrote:Good chat, everyone.

With Skinner out, it does potentially open the door for Fagerson as a bolter. Radio silence on Mr Snow (Bradbury) so I guess he's out of favour.

He's injured
Coke will do that to you. Allegedly.

Are you getting Hardie mixed up with Bradbury, or have you heard something?

Bradbury is out just now due to a rib injury picked up in training.
I'm starting a rumour.

Like the one about Jim being able to use the quote function correctly every time now.

That's never going to catch on, it's just too unbelievable

by tigertattie Mon 26 Aug 2019, 11:30 am

[quoote="EWT Spoons"]

George Carlin wrote:
EWT Spoons wrote:
George Carlin wrote:
EWT Spoons wrote:
George Carlin wrote:Good chat, everyone.

With Skinner out, it does potentially open the door for Fagerson as a bolter. Radio silence on Mr Snow (Bradbury) so I guess he's out of favour.

He's injured
Coke will do that to you. Allegedly.

Are you getting Hardie mixed up with Bradbury, or have you heard something?

Bradbury is out just now due to a rib injury picked up in training.
I'm starting a rumour.

Like the one about Jim being able to use the quote function correctly every time now.

That's never going to catch on, it's just too unbelievable [/quote]

I dont see how folk can mess up using it!!!

by EWT Spoons Mon 26 Aug 2019, 11:33 am

Well played

by TJ Mon 26 Aug 2019, 11:37 am

You know - on reflection I am feeling a lot happier after that game. Not just because we won which was important but the way the scrum held up well and a few guys really stood up and said "pick me"

I want to see Graham get a start on the wing and Wee Horne a start at 9 with Russell in the next two games. I want to ssee both first and seconfd choice packs have a go at Gerogia pack and shove them around.

Then we are world beaters again!

by EWT Spoons Mon 26 Aug 2019, 11:40 am

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/49465609

The comments on this article are just different class. Folk clambering for Weir, despite him not really being good enough and not suited to Scotland's style. Someone having a pop at Fraser Brown and telling him to stop trying to be Finn Russell, I mean there is so much wrong with that it's just outstanding. Someone else adding an extra 8k extra seats to BTM.

I don't go on Facebook, but from what I hear, it seems like they are the same sort of bunch.

by TJ Mon 26 Aug 2019, 12:37 pm

Calling for Weir is not daft really - he was in fine form at the end of the season and Hastings looks to have lost it

by **George Carlin** Mon 26 Aug 2019, 12:39 pm

Love Tom English: "Nobody ever became rich by predicting Townsend's mindset, but..."

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