Haskell puts the boot into team mates

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Interesting post-match press conference today:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/rugby_union/14965366.stm

A career in PR surely beckons for James Haskell.

Some of Big Jim's carefully worded, non-inflammatory words as follows:

"People have got to start pointing some fingers and saying 'This is not acceptable'.

"Johnno is not happy, the coaches are not happy - the players need to look at themselves and realise they are not working as hard as they should be.

"People should be excited about this team, excited about our performances, but we are letting ourselves down. We are stuck in a bit of a mire.

"Look at the good sides - they have that control. Whatever happens, you feel they are going to win. With England at the moment it is, 'This could go either way'.

"We are not in control and there is uncertainty which makes everyone go: 'Christ what's going on?'."

"You can't even begin to play your game if every time you do something there's a penalty.

"You are just on the back foot, tackling, get up, penalty. It is like banging your head against the wall. That is not acceptable with the players and talent we have got."

As a neutral, this is just plain weird.

England may not have put 40 points on each opponent, but they've won each match to date and currently top the group on points difference, having already beaten the highest ranking seed in their group.

What in the name of Oprah does he think the squad has to gain by squirting vitriol in public?

Why show a lack of unity in a squad? Surely it cannot be gamesmanship.

I'm no expert on the English squad management so I'd be grateful for some of the regulars' best guesses at what the smeg is going on.

but he's right?

SafeAsMilk wrote:Irish fans getting carried away again after one decent win. Mind you when aren't they getting over-excited?

Thats two decent wins thank you and yes I'm excited about the Russia and Italy games and the prospect of a QF. Sorry if that bothers you.

What has any of this to do with the OP?

Will the English players force their coaches' hand?

Stay on topic, this is about England not Ireland

I dont think anyone disagrees with what he's saying but I'm unconvinced that he should be the one shooting his mouth off about it - it is potentially divisive in many respects.. IMO this is the Captains role and the coaches. He's not even a regular in the first XV

I don't think he's shooting his mouth off. It will definitely have been given the green light before being put up on the RFU website.

These things need to be said and to be honest I believe it a lot more from Haskell then from the captain reading off a script ala Borthwick.

He also doesnt say " they" but "we", its not just " my teammates are making me look bad" but " I and everyone else need to do better".

Hardly shooting his mouth off, and yes this "outburst" will have been controlled by England PR team.

can't stand haskell, even looking at him erks me, but in this instance he is right!

Some of the criticism within the English camp may be realistic - and you'd have to single out Hartley for that.

But you'd have to point out that the players' management of the ref was poor. Even if he was bi-polar in his interpretation of the law.

Kaplan with the whistle and Walsh holding the touch flag was always going to be challenging to the English professionals.

Don't most teams have rules about what get's said by whom in public?? If MJ gave them a rollocking after their performance I'm sure he would agree who speaks to the media about it.

SafeAsMilk wrote:Irish fans getting carried away again after one decent win. Mind you when aren't they getting over-excited?

Hhahaha. How many times have I heard that. Point out examples then!! Its killing you milky boy. Killing you.

Boyne wrote:

SafeAsMilk wrote:Irish fans getting carried away again after one decent win. Mind you when aren't they getting over-excited?

Hhahaha. How many times have I heard that. Point out examples then!! Its killing you milky boy. Killing you.

Boyne hits nail on head - nice one

Can we stop the Irish diversions please?

Portnoy wrote:Can we stop the Irish diversions please?

I agree. Too much discussion about the residue.

Safeasmilk, I detect a wee bit of smirkyness from the Celtic cousins?

Must admit, never experienced that before.....................ever.

Portnoy wrote:What has any of this to do with the OP?

Absolutely nothing Portnoy, but I don't dislike where the thread has gone necessarily.

My question really wasn't whether Haskell has a point (clearly, he has) but whether an on-the-record public interview in which he seems to be blaming individuals within his own squad specifically was the correct forum to voice it.

Haskell the Brand - what a total bell end !

George Carlin wrote:

Portnoy wrote:What has any of this to do with the OP?

Absolutely nothing Portnoy, but I don't dislike where the thread has gone necessarily.

My question really wasn't whether Haskell has a point (clearly, he has) but whether an on-the-record public interview in which he seems to be blaming individuals within his own squad specifically was the correct forum to voice it.

I think that's what a lot of us are trying to say on here - I think this "open" strategy will backfire, not in the next game against the minnows but when it comes to the pressure games when mistakes will be made as inevitably they are by all teams; the reaction you want from your team mates when this happens is support and dont worry about it, lets crack on and nail this side - The last thing you want is criticism - Its basic psychology and very poor and naive from Haskell IMO.

RubyGuby wrote:

George Carlin wrote:

Portnoy wrote:What has any of this to do with the OP?

Absolutely nothing Portnoy, but I don't dislike where the thread has gone necessarily.

My question really wasn't whether Haskell has a point (clearly, he has) but whether an on-the-record public interview in which he seems to be blaming individuals within his own squad specifically was the correct forum to voice it.

I think that's what a lot of us are trying to say on here - I think this "open" strategy will backfire, not in the next game against the minnows but when it comes to the pressure games when mistakes will be made as inevitably they are by all teams; the reaction you want from your team mates when this happens is support and dont worry about it, lets crack on and nail this side - The last thing you want is criticism - Its basic psychology and very poor and naive from Haskell IMO.

What you have completly ignore dis that :

Its plain to everyone lready what the problems with England are. Its hardly going to be news to the other teams. Nor is there anything in any of the interviews to suggest that the England camp is divided or squabbling, quite the opposite. That they get an opportunity to air their views shows a mature and close team that has moved on form the early days when players were afraid to play and to speak out , a mistake Johnson admits he made and has rectified.

He did this with the backing of the team management, it was Johnson who called the meeting and made them air their problems

He isnt the only one who has spoken to the pree about it, again with the backing of the England management

He didnt blame anyone specific in the interview, and used the word "we" , which would include him. Its the headline writers who made up that he had "blasted" his teammates. What actually ahppened was that in their team meeting they had an open honest frank discussion about mistakes that were made and what each of them had to do to get better.

Its pretty clear the naive ones here are the people incapable of reading beyond a shock headline.

Your missing the point as usual biscuit - For the last time, no one is suggesting that what he said was anything other than the truth; its pretty obvious to all and sundry that England are struggling in many facets of their play and Jonno has stated this publicly. What we are trying to say is that this public display of the obvious by Haskell is inappropriate in the eyes of some. If you are fine with it and see it as some kind of American type catharsis where we all bare our souls so we can move on in harmony then thats fine, that's your view and opinion. Some of us see it as being potentially divisive.

RubyGuby wrote:Your missing the point as usual biscuit - For the last time, no one is suggesting that what he said was anything other than the truth; its pretty obvious to all and sundry that England are struggling in many facets of their play and Jonno has stated this publicly. What we are trying to say is that this public display of the obvious by Haskell is inappropriate in the eyes of some. If you are fine with it and see it as some kind of American type catharsis where we all bare our souls so we can move on in harmony then thats fine, that's your view and opinion. Some of us see it as being potentially divisive.

Are you Steve Borthwick in disguise? The approach of lying and telling eveyone its all great and happy is low rent psychology that doesnt work.

Its not "by Haskell" either, the point you are still ignoring. He hasnt done this as an individual despite what the headline tries to make out. Its been done by the team, and with the backing of the management (both the meeting and the statements to teh press). Its not divisive at all.

And as you point out it is obvious to everyone so what s the probelm in talking in public about it? Its already public knowledge. Yes they coudl just put up the bariers and just spout the boring old non statements to the press, but all that happens then is they dont have any talking points so start looking ofr them in bars or making things up. The press got their story, no one was hurt, the fans feel like England are doing something about their play and taking steps to improve.
Im struggling to see who you think this has divided? Compared to the way Ashton handled things by refussing to let his players have a say in the way their team played untill they forced him its a breath of fresh air.


Its really not the big deal that some people are making out, and far from reason to call him a bell end as someone did above.

Or in teh words of Steve Thompson:

"We've got to be brutally honest. That's what this group of players is all about. Honesty is the best policy - stab you in the belly rather than in the back," said Thompson. "Some reviews are nice and easy, some are harder and some are a bit more brutal. The harder meetings are just because we've got such high standards and we've got to get up to the standards again.

"We've been together a long time and the last thing you want is for things to get comfortable. Sometimes everyone needs to give each other a little boot up the backside and that's what's happening. It's like a relationship - sometimes you get a little bit stale, don't you? Sometimes you've got to have a little bit of an argument and have the old make-up afterwards!

"Today there was a great buzz in training. Everyone wants to get better. For me, it's great to be part of. It's the team and the buzz that we know England is all about."

Good to hear this.

Pete I couldn't have said it better.

Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler wrote:

RubyGuby wrote:Your missing the point as usual biscuit - For the last time, no one is suggesting that what he said was anything other than the truth; its pretty obvious to all and sundry that England are struggling in many facets of their play and Jonno has stated this publicly. What we are trying to say is that this public display of the obvious by Haskell is inappropriate in the eyes of some. If you are fine with it and see it as some kind of American type catharsis where we all bare our souls so we can move on in harmony then thats fine, that's your view and opinion. Some of us see it as being potentially divisive.

Are you Steve Borthwick in disguise? The approach of lying and telling eveyone its all great and happy is low rent psychology that doesnt work.

Its not "by Haskell" either, the point you are still ignoring. He hasnt done this as an individual despite what the headline tries to make out. Its been done by the team, and with the backing of the management (both the meeting and the statements to teh press). Its not divisive at all.

And as you point out it is obvious to everyone so what s the probelm in talking in public about it? Its already public knowledge. Yes they coudl just put up the bariers and just spout the boring old non statements to the press, but all that happens then is they dont have any talking points so start looking ofr them in bars or making things up. The press got their story, no one was hurt, the fans feel like England are doing something about their play and taking steps to improve.
Im struggling to see who you think this has divided? Compared to the way Ashton handled things by refussing to let his players have a say in the way their team played untill they forced him its a breath of fresh air.


Its really not the big deal that some people are making out, and far from reason to call him a bell end as someone did above.

Fair comments Peter, but it's not trite to suggest that one man's mature 'clearing the air' tough-love-in is another man's lack of team discipline, professionalism and PR problem. And with such a long gap between the action, it was always going to be something for a bored press to write about.

6 of one and pick em whether this amount of coverage was intentional or unintentional.

given the language was positive (not the badly reported headlines and selective quoting) then England fans should see this as clearing-the-air and intentional.

See the French Coach on how to do the opposite