Brand Haskell, is it time for him to go?

Once again the Brand has made the front pages for all the wrong reasons (Aussie Kiss!), is this guy more trouble than his worth?

I thought England looked better once Easter came on Saturday, OK I know Haskell was still on the pitch but we looked like we moved forward more with Easter carrying the ball.

So this begs the question once Haskell goes to Japan is his England career over? As it gives the England management a fantastic opportunity to oust him for the squad for good, and I for one would be glad to see the back of him.

On another subject why was Moody left on the sidelines so long once he had been patched up for his blood injury? could the England coaches see that we looked better without him on the pitch?

Its difficult to see how England improved when Easter came on, i'd say he made no more yardage than Haskell at no8 and is slower getting up to speed. Haskell may lack a top two inches, but i'd have him over the predictable Easter any day. MJ has a dilema because he's not supposed to be picking players who work overseas, having said that, Wilkinson is still there, so clearly there are exceptions to be made.

Moody couldn't get back on until a suitable break in play, i'm not sure why anyone would think otherwise.

But there was breaks in play for Moody to get back on hence why the camara was on him on the touch line.

and we did look more direct when Easter came on.

The off the field stuff is a nothing.

On the field , England need a proper 8. Im now in the " if only we had another captain" camp thinking he should switched for Moody. Im also inthe Hape for Tindall camp, and the Flood for Wilko camp.

Whos the Capatin, Thommo?


With regard to overseas players ... the new "rule" doesnt come into force till post WC when its almost certain JW will retire form internationals anyway. Theres also a huge differnece between being and France and vailable, and beingin Japan and not being available.
Unless Haskell cancels his contract and gets one in the Jeff he wont be playing in the 6 nations, that has no bearing on his selection for the rest of the wc though.

Hang on, weren't the majority of people on here praising Haskell for his recent performances saying that he deserved the starting 8 spot and was finally showing some good form in the team?

I think he's done very well recently and for too long now Easter has been underperforming

Brand Haskell, is it time for him to go?

In my opinion, yes - to the bench. Must make way for Easter. Easter, that pudgy, rolly-poly Number 8, who just always seems to make the right play. Easter, who always looks a bit out of shape and that he might have had a wee bit extra at his local last night. For all that, England just look steadier with Easter at the back of the scrum. And can win with him there.

rugbyfan wrote:Hang on, weren't the majority of people on here praising Haskell for his recent performances saying that he deserved the starting 8 spot and was finally showing some good form in the team?

I think he's done very well recently and for too long now Easter has been underperforming

Yes. Trouble is hes doen well ate evrything except for the specialist number 8 skills, which is why he should be playing flanker. England are also missing a forward who can rumble with the ball, get the defence onm the backfoot, and give the backs something to play from. Easter offers that, as unglamorous as he is...Waldrom too.

I think some of you are believing the Brands own hype.

True Easter is no Parisse but nor is Haskell, who has only looked good against Romania and Georgia and don't forget that easy try against Wales which Waldroms Granny could have scored.

I agree that his control at the base of the scrum has been les than impressive, but he still deserves a place in the team. Croft is a definate at 6, so 7 and 8 are between Moody, Wood, Haskell and Easter. For me, Easter has underperformed for too long and offers no running threat. So out of the other 3 only Haskell could play 8.

Easter offers more of a running threat in the tight from 8 than Haskell does.

Englands backrow as it is lacks some power. Its no shock that the Fat Controller was called into the squad, hes the one youre mising from your equation (but wont get in)

Easter probably wouldve started the Soctland game if he hadnt beebn coming bakc form injury, I suspect he will start against France.

Seabiscuit...

Moody doesnt offer much on the pitch, and is supposedly there for his leadership.

But i didnt witness anything good in his leadership on Saturday.

GeordieFalcon wrote:Seabiscuit...

Moody doesnt offer much on the pitch, and is supposedly there for his leadership.

But i didnt witness anything good in his leadership on Saturday.

He does seem to have gone down the martin corry route of bleeding by example

What would be wrong with a backrow of Croft,Wood and Haskell?

Certainly better than playing Moody who seems to have treatment for yet another injury every other minute and Easter who is simply too slow.

Haskell can be unceremoniously dumped once the world cup is over but till then he is unfortunately our best no 8.

I think i speak for all irish and welsh fans when i say

can you please fit the brand and easter into your team should you make the semi final

beshocked wrote:What would be wrong with a backrow of Croft,Wood and Haskell?

Certainly better than playing Moody who seems to have treatment for yet another injury every other minute and Easter who is simply too slow.

Haskell can be unceremoniously dumped once the world cup is over but till then he is unfortunately our best no 8.

I agree - it must only be the captaincy issue that's stopping this combination.

One of the problems England have had is control at the base of the scrum when the scrum is unsteady, this is where Haskall suffers and where Easter would be an advantage.

England need a captain and only Moody seems to offer that.

Croft is playing well at 6 so no need to change there.

Therefore Haskall’s position would be either Bench or No. 8, as our scrum has not always been that steady perhaps it’s time to put Haskall on the Bench.

Either that or MJ names a new captain & Haskall goes to 7

Do the positives of having Moody as captain outweigh the negatives of having him ahead of Wood in the team? In my opinion, no.

G2 - even if Moody was dropped I would still keep Haskell at 8 and bring Wood in - I just fail to see what Easter offers apart from controlling the ball at the back of a scrum! Surely you need more from your number 8!!??

rugbyfan wrote:Do the positives of having Moody as captain outweigh the negatives of having him ahead of Wood in the team? In my opinion, no.

G2 - even if Moody was dropped I would still keep Haskell at 8 and bring Wood in - I just fail to see what Easter offers apart from controlling the ball at the back of a scrum! Surely you need more from your number 8!!??

Rugbyfan, agreed thats why I said perhaps, a couple of times our scrum has gone belly up and we've lost control, something for MJ to ponder, I feel that against France Haskall will be fine at No. 8.

Wood now seems to be the forgotten man, I still want to see 6 - Croft, 7 - Wood & 8 - Haskall

Opinion is a funny thing, It takes a player xx good games for fans to like a player yet it takes 1 average game for fans to dislike!

I posted this on a similar thread the other day:

I've long backed Easter, I think he's always shown great vision and footballing ability. He hasn't been performing for more than a few games now though, and whilst he is good on the front foot he can disappear a bit when under pressure, plus he seems to be giving away more and more penalties these days (2 in 25mins today, 2 in the Argentina match and 3 in the Welsh warm up).

Haskell doesn't have some of the abilities of a classic 8, but he's been showing good workrate (leading tackler today, 11 in 60mins, Easter made 1 in his 25mins) and not giving away so many penalties (2 in his last 3 games, 3 in his last 6, compared to Easter's 7 in his last 3, 10 in his last 6), which given our problems at the breakdown and in discipline, I feel is more important at the moment.

good stats that man!

Haskell is nothing more than a gym monkey, plus his a complete tool and a very unlikeable chap.

This question of who will be captain always seems to appear doesn't it?

Quite depressing really. Just shows the lack of leadership England has.

In my opinion the way England played was clueless. No structure. No gameplan. It was ragged and a simple hope that one of our players would come up with some individual brilliance. There needs to be more unity and fluency in my opinion. Look at the way the Welsh and Irish have been playing.

I personally would pick Croft as captain. One of the only players in the team whose spot has been nailed down.

The likes of Moody,Tindall and Hartley can't nail their spot down and two of them have been involved in recent controversies.

It is a worrying precedent when you pick a player just to be captain, not because he is the best in that position.

Moody's numerous injuries hardly help either.

Who would be your England captain?

HERSH wrote:Haskell is nothing more than a gym monkey, plus his a complete tool and a very unlikeable chap.

Know him personally do you?

Beshocked - Haskell ...

Beshocked

Your right , with no stand out captaincy material...it needs to be someone who has their spot nailed down.

And that would mean one of:
Croft
Foden
Ashton
Cole
Tuilagi

Croft would be the obvious one out of those....

Yeah exactly the question I asked way back. 3 of the "capatins" dont justify their inclussion currently ( tindall, wilko and moody) the other tone ( Easter) cant get in the side and didnt exactly cover himslef in glory when he had a go.

Leaves you with umm Palmer? Thompson? Tuilagi?

Bitter Beer wrote:

HERSH wrote:Haskell is nothing more than a gym monkey, plus his a complete tool and a very unlikeable chap.

Know him personally do you?

Not personally but I know people who have had dealings with him in the past.

welcome to 606v2 by the way, but I suspect its not your first time here

Fine that's settled Croft will be captain. Peterseabiscuit wheeler will you pass on the message to Martin Johnson?

Also we would like Flood to start at fly half. A backrow of Croft,Wood and Haskell.

All in agreement?

Croft Easter Haskell

I htought Haskell was the new world class number 8? Well he was last week wasn't he?

GeordieFalcon wrote:Beshocked

Your right , with no stand out captaincy material...it needs to be someone who has their spot nailed down.

And that would mean one of:
Croft
Foden
Ashton
Cole
Tuilagi

Croft would be the obvious one out of those....

I'm not sure you could even consider Tuilagi, he's far too young and inexperienced.

No peterseabiscuit please don't pass that information of a backrow to MJ. He will probably agree with you!

Rubyguby what do you mean new? He has been a world class no 8 for some time.

Bitterbeer,

Croft is the only one of those even remotely worthy of Captaining England...

Tuilagi was a joke. Ill stick by my Easter as Haskell deserves to be in the side but not as an 8, he doesnt do the core skills of that position well enough.

Haskell was world class for 1 week, against a minnow team, can't remember who - Geordie is right -Croft is the only one worthy and he often gets criticised which i finedamazing. I think Wood has some merit and maybe you need another New Zealander or a Saffer like Fourie

Imagine Ashton as captain. He would be teaching all the players how to swallow dive properly and the correct method of throwing a dwarf.

Geordie falcon very true. Croft is the obvious choice.

PS its also quite bad....that we could only list 5 that we would consider nailed on players.....

Geordiefalcon is it not because we have such strength in depth that it's tough to pick between two players?

Waldrom's been called up, he's probably the best *English number 8.

Croft/Waldrom/Wood with Haskell on the bench to cover all 3.

Moody's been rubbish and Easters slower than cricket.

*well

I think we need to prevent a certain young English no 8 from playing for the dark side.... He hasn't played for them yet but we need him.

Absolutely correct beshocked!

Boooooo at you both!!! We've taught him how to plumb

beshocked wrote:Geordiefalcon is it not because we have such strength in depth that it's tough to pick between two players?

in some posiitions yes.

Id add Thomposn to the nailed on catagory, but Hartley was the golden boy not so long ago.
Cole too is pretty secure.

In the secodn row any combination of deacon, lawes and palmer is fine.

FH Flood is pressuring Wilko as much as wilko demanding to be dropped.

On the wings there was a big debate over Armitage vs Cuteo which is only settled by one being suspended, both have done well.

Tondalls place is under threat because Hape was excellent in his one start.

Peter seabiscuit wheeler you wouldn't call any of them world class though would you?

Most of the players are of similar level. None really stand out.

Tindall is mediocre.Hape is mediocre. Tuilagi is an excellent young prospect with huge potential but still young.

The two youngsters with real star quality left at home are Charlie Sharples and Owen Farrell in my opinion. Of course bias kicks in but their abilities to rack up points cannot be ignored for too long.

beshocked wrote:I think we need to prevent a certain young English no 8 from playing for the dark side.... He hasn't played for them yet but we need him.

If you're talking about Ben Morgan, we'd be much better off developing players of a similar age that have been through (& captained) England age grade teams, the very impressive Carl Fearns and U16, U18 & U20 6N granslam winning captain Alex Gray (golden boy being groomed as a future senior side captain if ever I saw one). It's a crying shame that injuries have prevented Guest & Crane from showing their worth whilst the England players are away, they'd be my preferred options over the next couple of years, particularly Guest.

A lot of praise was heaped on Morgan last season, but he hasn't really been tested. He barely featured in their HC campaign (just the Treviso games) and he's yet to face Heaslip, O'Brien or Leamy. Thomas most definitely got the better of him when Ospreys beat Scarlets 60-17 last season, and Scarlets are 2nd bottom of the PRO12 this season, only 1 point above the only team they've managed to beat so far, Aironi. They lost to Treviso at the weekend.

stlowe wrote:

beshocked wrote:I think we need to prevent a certain young English no 8 from playing for the dark side.... He hasn't played for them yet but we need him.

If you're talking about Ben Morgan, we'd be much better off developing players of a similar age that have been through (& captained) England age grade teams, the very impressive Carl Fearns and U16, U18 & U20 6N granslam winning captain Alex Gray (golden boy being groomed as a future senior side captain if ever I saw one). It's a crying shame that injuries have prevented Guest & Crane from showing their worth whilst the England players are away, they'd be my preferred options over the next couple of years, particularly Guest.

A lot of praise was heaped on Morgan last season, but he hasn't really been tested. He barely featured in their HC campaign (just the Treviso games) and he's yet to face Heaslip, O'Brien or Leamy. Thomas most definitely got the better of him when Ospreys beat Scarlets 60-17 last season, and Scarlets are 2nd bottom of the PRO12 this season, only 1 point above the only team they've managed to beat so far, Aironi. They lost to Treviso at the weekend.

the scarlets number 1 & 2 flyhalfs (the number 2 flyhalf starts at fullback usually), starting inside centre, starting outside centre, starting right wing and starting scrum half are away with the welsh squad. The scarlets biggest strength is their backlines potency. They were hit hard by the world-cup.

Although agree with the sentiment about Ben Morgan, but he improved every showing last season for me. He'll get more gametime there this season across all competitions, this will be the season to form a real opinion on what he could become will be.

stlowe Saracens have two of our own in the backrow - former England U20s Jackson Wray and former England U16 Will Fraser. Both have started the last two games for Sarries including of course the Leicester rout.

Of course we have Andy Saull too.

It helps these guys to have arguably England's best flanker ever as their mentor.

So Haskell had a few drinks made a few passing remarks to an hotel maid.

Who hasn't done a simlar thing on a friday/saturday night.

What does this have to do with his playing on the field? Nothing thats what.

A this moment in time at the rugby world cup Haskell is the second best no 8 we have, the first is Easter, after the Rugby World Cup Haskell is offf to Japan, the England will have a chance to look at others players in time for the next 6ns.


So for now leave Brand Haskell alone is what i say.