England vs Pakistan

First topic message reminder :

so guys, with a huge series coming up against pakistan, what do we think? In terms of the side, conditions, anything to do with this huge tour

IMO this should be the side

1.Strauss
2.Cook
3.Trott
4.KP
5.Bell
6.Prior
7.Bresnan
8.Swann
9.Broad
10.Anderson
11.Monty

however i think they will go with this side

1.Strauss
2.Cook
3.Trott
4.KP
5.Bell
6.Morgan
7.Prior
8.Bresnan
9.Swann
10.Broad
11.Anderson

The pitches that we have seen pak play sri lanka, on and previous tracks there, suggest the ball dosent spin much, and is just a batting paradie. Therefore do we really need 6 batsman plus prior, as prior is easily good enough to bat 6, and we have a strong line up all the way down. Jimmy at no 11 is no mug with the bat.

Gonna be strange to watch England in practically an empty stadium next week, without any atmosphere


Unless quite a few barmy army members are there

Gregers wrote:Monty giving me a great birthday present!

Happy birthday Gregers.

Skye, won't some 'local' Pakistanis be there like in the ODIs or is it really predicted to be empty? Those 2 venues (in Abu Dhabi and Dubai) look like top notch facilities - I remember them being packed out or about 3/4 full for some matches v Australia. There was a great atmosphere too with lots of noise. Hopefully some expat English fans will get out to the grounds. The recent 7s rugby was very well attended from reports.

Linebreaker wrote:Skye, won't some 'local' Pakistanis be there like in the ODIs or is it really predicted to be empty? Those 2 venues (in Abu Dhabi and Dubai) look like top notch facilities - I remember them being packed out or about 3/4 full for some matches v Australia. There was a great atmosphere too with lots of noise. Hopefully some expat English fans will get out to the grounds. The recent 7s rugby was very well attended from reports.

I hope so Lb, but from what I have read and heard they are not expecting very many supporters to attend, it will have nothing like the atmosphere you would feel if it were to be in Pakistan, a big shame.

I'm also hoping that some more Pak fans will attend - to try and support their players after all the scandals & shenanigans of the last few years. For the players; a chance to see them prove themselves... that sort of thing.

Gotta feeling that there will be more barmy army in attendance than so-called home fans just like Sydney last year.

Yeah, you guys are the best at coming out of the woodwork... no dispute there!

England fans have been there through thick and thin, line, you know that!

KP failed today, which I'm strangely quite pleased about. Often, if he has a good innings, he gets a little too lax and follows it up with a poor one. With his fabled work ethic, I expect he will work extra hard in the nets ahead of the first Test, and look to come out and make a real impression.

Pakistan XI 129/7 - England hunting the win after another good bowling performance.

Onions 2, Tremlett 2, Swann 1, Monty 1, KP 1.

Well bowled KP, and thats not just the hangover talking!

He should bowl more on helpful pitches.

Spoiler:

Pakistan vs England should be a good competitive series (even if I expect us to win fairly comfortably). Much better than India's shambolic performance down under

Onions takes another. 138/8.

Onions looks somewhat back to his best :yippee:

Well played England. Seems they had a good bat and then the bowlers shared the spoils. Tidy work.

Panesar bags the last two wickets to end up with 8 for the match, and England win as they bowl out the Pakistan XI for 150.

Summary of this warm-up?

Batting - runs for Cook, who looks in fine form. Trott finally got some runs after a few failures, with Strauss, Bell and KP all having one decent knock each. I guess Morgan could have done with more time in the middle, but not bad overall.

Bowling: Very impressive. The seamers have all taken wickets whilst being very economical, which is pleasing. Swann has looked ok and Monty has come in and done very well in this match, showing further strength in depth should a second spinner be needed.

Not perfect, but happy enough with where we are, and massively looking forward to the Tests now.

Id like to see Morgan bumped up the order when they take on the BJs, and Bopara given a chance. Maybe rest Cook and put Trott to open again.
Although theres a lot to said for just picking the first choice test team and treating it as a serious game.

Two games , two wins.

Would have been nice to get Morgan a hit in the second innings but England are sticking with the policy they had in Australia last year - play all matches to win and worry about practice later... worked quite well then so why not? Perhaps getting a winning habit is worth more than we used to think.

Anyway all the bowlers seem to be in decent form so roll on the Tests

very good effort from England to win the second warm-up, and a much more convincing performance than in the first game by all means. I like the "go out and try to win" attitude (not easy in three-day matches) as it creates the winning habit which is so important I believe. Slight disappointment was Morgan still not getting any runs, but I'm sure he'll come good in the tests. KP will be fine, don't worry, he got out when we were chasing quick runs this time, it happens.

All the bowlers are in form and picking up wickets, which can only be a good thing.

M for Chelsea. Hope you're right about Morgan but he seems the weak link in the side to me. Yes, his one-day stuff is excellent but I'm just not sure if he's ever going to be a Test player. Could be another Fairbrother.

It's a big series for Morgan this (actually more of a big couple of series). The subcontinental conditions should suit him as he's a fine player of spin, so he needs to repay the selector's faith in him. It's not that he's had a bad start to his career, his stats are pretty decent (average of 36, not too shabby - especially when you consider that he's thrown his wicket away a couple of times in search of quick runs), and he's certainly a much better fielder than Bopara, but he seems capable of much more.

I think the fact that the 'weak link' is Morgan shows just what a strong batting lineup England have. He hasn't done well of late, but make no bones about it he is a tremendously gifted player.

Mad for Chelsea wrote:It's a big series for Morgan this (actually more of a big couple of series). The subcontinental conditions should suit him as he's a fine player of spin, so he needs to repay the selector's faith in him. It's not that he's had a bad start to his career, his stats are pretty decent (average of 36, not too shabby - especially when you consider that he's thrown his wicket away a couple of times in search of quick runs), and he's certainly a much better fielder than Bopara, but he seems capable of much more.

It would look less shabby if he wasnt batting between Bell ( average 49 ) and Prior (avergae 45, and hes been asked to throw his wicket away on many occassions).
36 may be OK for the early 90's England or the West Indies middle order but he does stand out as the relative weak link in the current England side by some distance. More on performance so far than potential though, which is good. Its better to have an underperfoming cricker who you know can improve than one whos busting a gut to average 36, or in Boparas case all over the place to average 34.. The argument for Bopara though is that extra bowling option, if England wanted to go 2 seamers 2 spinners as they did in this warm up then theyd need him in. Theres little to suggest they are seriously considering this as an option though.

problem with Bopara is his average is somewhat artificially inflated by his three centuries against a rotten WI bowling attack (including one on a pitch which read 600/5 & 220/2 vs 750). Not convinced Bopara's bowling is good enough to be a third seamer at test level anyway. Better than Trott, sure, but not nearly as good as Collingwood IMO. Think it's far more likely England play three seamers and rely on KP for a few overs.

Mad for Chelsea wrote: Not convinced Bopara's bowling is good enough to be a third seamer at test level anyway. Better than Trott, sure, but not nearly as good as Collingwood IMO. Think it's far more likely England play three seamers and rely on KP for a few overs.

Quite. But Ive seen them do apparently crazier things and it come off all the same. Tim Bresnan as a test bowler? Who woulda thunk it.

Seems whoever England pick in tests recently its the right guy, even a county journeyman like Swann can be the king of spain.

good to see Trott's back in the runs :P

I know PSW: Bresnan who looks like your typical county trundler turning out to be a world-class test bowler has to be one of the most shocking things I can remember witnessing.

MfC
It's a common phenomenon amongst Yorkshire-born bowlers. Last one that looked genuinely Test class prior to debut was Goughie, but since then both Hoggard and Sidebottom have produced world class performances, so Bres is just following the tradition.

Even though they weren't the most difficult of games I'm glad we have come out with 2 wins, I remember many a time when we had disasters in warm up games and got hammered by a village 11. I love how professional the whole set up is right now.

good to see that we are professional and take all game seriously, just like we did in OZ

I've just heard that Panesar is in the 1st test against Pakistan,

Can anyone confirm if this is true or not?

According to our reliable source (CF) he is in the side. Good to see - he's worked very hard to get back into the reckoning.

For all his many virtues, CF has occasionally been known to let the relationship between facts and wishful thinking become a little closer than perhaps ought to be case.

Scyld Berry wrote this evening in the Telegraph:

"England are therefore going to adhere to three pace bowlers and Graeme Swann, even though Monty Panesar bowled very accurately — rather than incisively — to take eight wickets in the second of their practice games. “I’d go with two spinners in this part of the world,” Swann said on Saturday. “I love the tempo of the game with two spinners.” That is wistful thinking."

I'd be surprised if Panesar plays, and I would be even more surprised if a decision to play him had been taken this far in advance of the match...

Oh, I see Corporal. Thanks for that piece.

Linebreaker - just wanted to check - is CF as well as tigerrobins reporting that Panesar is in the side?

I've no idea, Corporal.

Maybe he got excited because of this last match when he bagged a few?

Linebreaker wrote:According to our reliable source (CF) he is in the side. Good to see - he's worked very hard to get back into the reckoning.

Linebreaker - crossed wires. I was just wondering on the origin of CF's views reported above? Whether they were on a particular thread....

Corporalhumblebucket wrote:

Linebreaker wrote:According to our reliable source (CF) he is in the side. Good to see - he's worked very hard to get back into the reckoning.

Linebreaker - crossed wires. I was just wondering on the origin of CF's views reported above? Whether they were on a particular thread....

I think it originated on here. I haven't seen it anywhere else... although I may be wrong.

Probably in the twelve if anything has been announced , or "leaked" ... would be unusual for England to name an eleven three days ahead.

I doubt they'll shift from 6/1/4 (including three seamers)

Corporalhumblebucket wrote:Linebreaker - just wanted to check - is CF as well as tigerrobins reporting that Panesar is in the side?

ive heard many reports about monty being selected for the 1st test


and gee thanks for that previous comment corporal.

Which comments CF - re mixing facts and wishful thinking?! If so, Tim Phillips locker comes to mind

England won't have picked the side until they've had a look at the wicket nearer the time. To suggest they have made their minds up either way a whole 3 days before the game is delusional. I've just spent a week-end with someone who knows Andy Flower very well indeed: he may well end up picking the 2 spinners, but he won't have decided yet.

Broad injured by an Anderson yorker in practice. Badly bruised foot apparently, although should be able to bowl today.

we are world no1, we must go into the game tomorrow, firing on all cylinders and take the game to pakistan!

Now Ian Bell has been hit in the nets, having an X-ray on his wrist now. Fingers crossed he's OK.

:O I hope he is ok, a key player in these conditions, you would think.

Seems like our bowlers are breathing fire, though

Fists of Fury wrote::O I hope he is ok, a key player in these conditions, you would think.

Seems like our bowlers are breathing fire, though batsmen cant cope with the pitches out here

latest news is that Bell and Broad are fit to play. After a scan, it seems Bell's wrist is fine, and Broad bowled in the training session today, so it seems he's been passed fit. Of more interest is the fact that neither Finn nor Onions took part in the training session, which suggests England will go with Tremlett in the test tommorow (or Panesar if it looks like being an absolute bunsen).

I find it strange that they didn't take part, what if someone pulls up injured during practice tomorrow morning?

Glad about Bell and Broad, they would have been big losses.

Bell and broad should be fine

im really looking forward to the game, and especially seeing what formula we go in with.

its gonna be a long hard tour, however we have bounced back before, and im sure we can do it again