Dan Parks by John Beattie

I don't agree but its a good piece.

Robinson also has a interview in the guardian which sheds some light and shows how poor Robinson behaviour is.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/2012/feb/08/scotland-dan-parks-six-nations

That is absolutely disgraceful behaviour from Robinson then

"So Dan, you're thinking of retiring - well I've no imagination when it comes to selection, so would you mind sticking around for a couple of games?"

"Sure, Andy, no problem"

....................

"Actually, Dan can I have a wee word? I've changed my mind, but thanks for coming"

TJ

What dont you agree about it?......... that he never won MOM performancesin the past, he never won matches for us in the past?, or / and are you saying that it was Parks fault that we lost on the weekend?...... AR has been forced into this as much by the Scottish public outcry as by Parks very average performance

There is nothing in that Guardian article to suggest that AR disagreed that Parks has not been a good servant (and won a multitude of MOM performances in the past)

DP has his limitations yes, but he has given 100% always and hence with all his limitations that has won MOM awards over the years speaks volumes about the man, which is more than I can say for many a fellow players around him over the years.

I can say he was a good footballer playing in some very limited Scottish sides over the last 6-7 years

Some posters on here have very short or even worse very selective memories, some of the comments have quite shameful not in the abusive tone but in the selective way they have singled him out

Finally the conduct of the man has been exemplary......... and alot of people on here have been less than..

Leaves a bad taste in your mouth

Like I said on another thread, the scrumhalf took a step before he passed to Parks, the blame is also his, as top scrumhalves should not be stepping to make a pass that deep into your own 22.

flyhalffactory wrote:TJ

What dont you agree about it?......... that he never won MOM performancesin the past, he never won matches for us in the past?, or / and are you saying that it was Parks fault that we lost on the weekend?...... AR has been forced into this as much by the Scottish public outcry as by Parks very average performance

There is nothing in that Guardian article to suggest that AR disagreed that Parks has not been a good servant (and won a multitude of MOM performances in the past)

DP has his limitations yes, but he has given 100% always and hence with all his limitations that has won MOM awards over the years speaks volumes about the man, which is more than I can say for many a fellow players around him over the years.

I can say he was a good footballer playing in some very limited Scottish sides over the last 6-7 years

Some posters on here have very short or even worse very selective memories, some of the comments have quite shameful not in the abusive tone but in the selective way they have singled him out

Finally the conduct of the man has been exemplary......... and alot of people on here have been less than..

Leaves a bad taste in your mouth

Seriously, fhf? Do you honestly think Robinson would be swayed by public outcry in chatrooms and forums and the like? The medjia(!) weren't even that voracious, I thought?

flyhalffactory wrote:TJ

What dont you agree about it?......... that he never won MOM performancesin the past, he never won matches for us in the past?, or / and are you saying that it was Parks fault that we lost on the weekend?...... AR has been forced into this as much by the Scottish public outcry as by Parks very average performance

There is nothing in that Guardian article to suggest that AR disagreed that Parks has not been a good servant (and won a multitude of MOM performances in the past)

DP has his limitations yes, but he has given 100% always and hence with all his limitations that has won MOM awards over the years speaks volumes about the man, which is more than I can say for many a fellow players around him over the years.

I can say he was a good footballer playing in some very limited Scottish sides over the last 6-7 years

Some posters on here have very short or even worse very selective memories, some of the comments have quite shameful not in the abusive tone but in the selective way they have singled him out

Finally the conduct of the man has been exemplary......... and alot of people on here have been less than..

Leaves a bad taste in your mouth

Agree with all except the highlighted part. Really leaves a bad taste in my mouth all of this!

Parks has single handedly won us some very good matches before there's no doubt and I don't think everyone is directing their frustration at him as some posters insinuate.

He was at fault for the try on Saturday even if the ball should have been cleared 1 or 2 phases beforehand. He kicked the ball end of. When I played FB at school level, I was always taught to kick high when inside your own 22 to nulify any chance of a charge down. This is basic stuff and he has the experience to know that you get next to no time at all to clear.

However, the blame lies squarely at Robinson's door for not realising we have at least three FH's better than Parks and this is a fact most, if not all, posters here realise too.

And for idiot's like Beattie Snr (and he is a class 1 numpty for saying this in public) to state that Scottish fans didn't like Parks due to his accent - well, he's gone way down in my estimation for that. Same goes with Matt Williams - nobody liked him because he was crap as head coach, not because he was Australian.

Anyway, Parks has gone, time to move on. Starting with Sunday.

I really hope Laidlaw GIRFU the Welsh and gives us some much craved success.

biltongbek wrote:Like I said on another thread, the scrumhalf took a step before he passed to Parks, the blame is also his, as top scrumhalves should not be stepping to make a pass that deep into your own 22.

Mate
There are fellow posters who would watch that a 1000 times and still see that it was singlehandedly DPs fault........... its in their nature

the post by aslongas is what I mean by Robinsons disgraceful behavour.

Like it or not Parks was responsible for alot that went wrong with the game. Not his fault he was selected of course but he is unable to release the backs outside of him and is very easy to dfened against.

Flyhalffactory - I really don't know how you can defend him he is an honest player and tried his best but once again showed his limitations and his brittle psyche.

flyhalffactory wrote:

biltongbek wrote:Like I said on another thread, the scrumhalf took a step before he passed to Parks, the blame is also his, as top scrumhalves should not be stepping to make a pass that deep into your own 22.

Mate
There are fellow posters who would watch that a 1000 times and still see that it was singlehandedly DPs fault........... its in their nature

Yeah we have a saying in Afrikaans " as jy n' stok soek om n' hond mee te slaan sal jy hom kry."

It basically means. " if you are looking for a reason to hang someone, and you look hard enough, you will eventually find it."

Just a little reminder of a november day in the autumn of 2010 at Murrayfield.

Scotland 21 - South Africa 17.

Dan Parks 6 penalties, 1 dropgoal.

South Africa 1 try, 4 penalties.

Wonder how many remember that day?

TJ

Not defending ............never have defended him
His limitations didnt knock the ball on, lose the ball in the contact area, a poor front 5 display as you might wish to see, an O/C who didnt make one serious threat with five attempts with ball in hand and space

We lost the game simply....... because
*we lost the ball in contact many many times,
*we got turned over on numerous occasions,
*we knocked the ball on so many times it was untrue,
*the front 5 didnt perform,
*we mis-passed the ball from midfield,
*we butchered three passes particularly the 3 on 1 with only the FB to beat
* our 9 was his usually two-step slowness
* our 10 had a mare

NOTE:........... I havent mentioned any players ,,,,,,,,,,, because of NONE of them singlehanded LOST the game for us

Brittle psyche !!...... are you mad?, just look back (past games) at some of his kicks that was req's to get over to win us the game or pull us back in, he might play with a frown on his face but that doesnt mean he hasn't an inner strength

I always wanted Dan to retire last season , and I wanted my men to start last week and I am disappointed that Cussie is starting this week, but I can see where AR was coming from last week........... we had newish combos all through the backs............. FB rorry just back from long injury, Jones brand new, and a newish midfield pairing, so to play Greig from the start might have been too much a risk

biltongbek wrote:

flyhalffactory wrote:

biltongbek wrote:Like I said on another thread, the scrumhalf took a step before he passed to Parks, the blame is also his, as top scrumhalves should not be stepping to make a pass that deep into your own 22.

Mate
There are fellow posters who would watch that a 1000 times and still see that it was singlehandedly DPs fault........... its in their nature

Yeah we have a saying in Afrikaans " as jy n' stok soek om n' hond mee te slaan sal jy hom kry."

It basically means. " if you are looking for a reason to hang someone, and you look hard enough, you will eventually find it."

Yes we have a saying down in down in the 'burgh
"Say it often enough and it will become FACT"

biltongbek wrote:Just a little reminder of a november day in the autumn of 2010 at Murrayfield.

Scotland 21 - South Africa 17.

Dan Parks 6 penalties, 1 dropgoal.

South Africa 1 try, 4 penalties.

Wonder how many remember that day?

biltong, beware selective statistics, my friend, or else I'll have to go trawling for myriad others that would prove the reverse! No question that wasn't a good day, much like the game against Australia the previous autumn. Sadly they are too infrequent

AsLongAsBut100ofUs wrote:

biltongbek wrote:Just a little reminder of a november day in the autumn of 2010 at Murrayfield.

Scotland 21 - South Africa 17.

Dan Parks 6 penalties, 1 dropgoal.

South Africa 1 try, 4 penalties.

Wonder how many remember that day?

biltong, beware selective statistics, my friend, or else I'll have to go trawling for myriad others that would prove the reverse! No question that wasn't a good day, much like the game against Australia the previous autumn. Sadly they are too infrequent

The only point I am trying to make my friend, is that Dan Parks in his 60 odd test career was as important to the teams cause as anyone else. The fact that his career has come to an end the way it did is sad. He was perhaps never the best flyhalf in world rugby and perhaps in the last few years not the best in Scotland, but he served his country proud and deseerved a more respectable end to his career.

flyhalffactory wrote:TJ

Not defending ............never have defended him
His limitations didnt knock the ball on, lose the ball in the contact area, a poor front 5 display as you might wish to see, an O/C who didnt make one serious threat with five attempts with ball in hand and space

We lost the game simply....... because
*we lost the ball in contact many many times,
*we got turned over on numerous occasions,
*we knocked the ball on so many times it was untrue, (isn't this the same point as your first two? The official match stats actually show that both teams turned the ball over 16 times - of these, at least 6 were from wayward DP kicks)
*the front 5 didnt perform, (not great in the scrum, but dominant in the lineout, and mostly carried well, the two props aside)
*we mis-passed the ball from midfield, (or rather we hardly passed the ball at all! S Lamont: 0 kicks/1 pass/14 runs)
*we butchered three passes particularly the 3 on 1 with only the FB to beat
* our 9 was his usually two-step slowness
* our 10 had a mare

NOTE:........... I havent mentioned any players ,,,,,,,,,,, because of NONE of them singlehanded LOST the game for us

Brittle psyche !!...... are you mad?, just look back (past games) at some of his kicks that was req's to get over to win us the game or pull us back in, he might play with a frown on his face but that doesnt mean he hasn't an inner strength

I always wanted Dan to retire last season , and I wanted my men to start last week and I am disappointed that Cussie is starting this week, but I can see where AR was coming from last week........... we had newish combos all through the backs............. FB rorry just back from long injury, Jones brand new, and a newish midfield pairing, so to play Greig from the start might have been too much a risk

Comments in green above

biltongbek wrote:

AsLongAsBut100ofUs wrote:

biltongbek wrote:Just a little reminder of a november day in the autumn of 2010 at Murrayfield.

Scotland 21 - South Africa 17.

Dan Parks 6 penalties, 1 dropgoal.

South Africa 1 try, 4 penalties.

Wonder how many remember that day?

biltong, beware selective statistics, my friend, or else I'll have to go trawling for myriad others that would prove the reverse! No question that wasn't a good day, much like the game against Australia the previous autumn. Sadly they are too infrequent

The only point I am trying to make my friend, is that Dan Parks in his 60 odd test career was as important to the teams cause as anyone else. The fact that his career has come to an end the way it did is sad. He was perhaps never the best flyhalf in world rugby and perhaps in the last few years not the best in Scotland, but he served his country proud and deserved a more respectable end to his career.

biltong, as a 10, arguably he was always going to be one of the most important players in the team, couldn't agree more. And certainly not his fault that he was the best of a less than stellar bunch, nor his fault that he was selected sometimes when he shouldn't have been, but let's not try to disguise his limitations cos of some collective guilt feeling over the manner of his international retirement?

AsLongAsBut100ofUs wrote:

biltongbek wrote:

AsLongAsBut100ofUs wrote:

biltongbek wrote:Just a little reminder of a november day in the autumn of 2010 at Murrayfield.

Scotland 21 - South Africa 17.

Dan Parks 6 penalties, 1 dropgoal.

South Africa 1 try, 4 penalties.

Wonder how many remember that day?

biltong, beware selective statistics, my friend, or else I'll have to go trawling for myriad others that would prove the reverse! No question that wasn't a good day, much like the game against Australia the previous autumn. Sadly they are too infrequent

The only point I am trying to make my friend, is that Dan Parks in his 60 odd test career was as important to the teams cause as anyone else. The fact that his career has come to an end the way it did is sad. He was perhaps never the best flyhalf in world rugby and perhaps in the last few years not the best in Scotland, but he served his country proud and deserved a more respectable end to his career.

biltong, as a 10, arguably he was always going to be one of the most important players in the team, couldn't agree more. And certainly not his fault that he was the best of a less than stellar bunch, nor his fault that he was selected sometimes when he shouldn't have been, but let's not try to disguise his limitations cos of some collective guilt feeling over the manner of his international retirement?

I am a neutral mate, no guilt this side. I just read a lot of comments over the past week of which some were very one eyed and unfair to the man. It is really all about respect, isn't it.

biltongbek wrote:I am a neutral mate, no guilt this side. I just read a lot of comments over the past week of which some were very one eyed and unfair to the man. It is really all about respect, isn't it.

You'll always get some fairly wild comments about players, i think that's just the nature of professional sport? It is about respect, but as I've said elsewhere, it is ok to separate respect for DP the man and DP the player - again, that's life as a professional sportsman/performer/etc.

Well, as a neutral, I guess this is where I will step away and leave it for the Scottish fans to continue.

AsLongAsBut100ofUs wrote:

biltongbek wrote:I am a neutral mate, no guilt this side. I just read a lot of comments over the past week of which some were very one eyed and unfair to the man. It is really all about respect, isn't it.

You'll always get some fairly wild comments about players, i think that's just the nature of professional sport? It is about respect, but as I've said elsewhere, it is ok to separate respect for DP the man and DP the player - again, that's life as a professional sportsman/performer/etc.

AsLongAs

I would say a trawl thro the stats would be revealing indeed............ and I can bet you a penny to a pound that he had more good games than bad. To state that you are "seperating the respect" is by nature insinuating that you dont agree that he was a good player even tho the match facts over the yrs e.g. 6Ns 2010 3 MOMs out of 4 games, that means not just best Scot but best player on the park, and many MOMs for Glasgow along the way.

Your opinion (its a forum site after all) is valid, but I cannae see how anybody who has watched Scottish rugby during his tenure can state (for all his limitations) that he wasnt a good or even our best player and then watch his MOMs over the years.

flyhalffactory wrote:AsLongAs

I would say a trawl thro the stats would be revealing indeed............ and I can bet you a penny to a pound that he had more good games than bad. To state that you are "seperating the respect" is by nature insinuating that you dont agree that he was a good player even tho the match facts over the yrs e.g. 6Ns 2010 3 MOMs out of 4 games, that means not just best Scot but best player on the park, and many MOMs for Glasgow along the way.

Your opinion (its a forum site after all) is valid, but I cannae see how anybody who has watched Scottish rugby during his tenure can state (for all his limitations) that he wasnt a good or even our best player and then watch his MOMs over the years.

fhf, you're right, i don't think he was a good player. No denying that he had some very good games, but they were few and far between to my recollection. As a player, he had a particular strength, and several weaknesses - but we've been thru all of that. He played many good games for Glasgow as well, and as you say, won 3 out 4 MOTMs in the 2010 6Ns (note sure that I would have given all 3, but then again that's just my view). Of those 4 games, we lost to Wales, lost to Italy, drew with England and salvaged avoiding the wooden spoon with a narrow win over Ireland (and what a match that was).

The Wales match was possibly DP's best:

Wales vs Scotland
24 Kicks from hand 33
199 Passes 100
139 Runs 73
536 Metres run with ball 384

His territorial game was to the fore, but again the stats point to his limitations as a player - we kicked more, passed less, ran less, and secured less yardage (and I am not ignoring the fact that we finished with 13 men on the park). DP personally had K/P/R stats of 19/18/2.

The less said about the Italy and England games the better. Against Ireland, DP also won man of the match, but on the day, watching live in CP, the heroes for Scotland were our backrow. You may not agree, which is fine.

DP was also awarded Scotland's Player of the Tournament award at the RWC 2007, something which I could never understand.

Overall, in my opinion, he had more poor games than he did good ones - it's that simple.

AsLongAs

Respect for you brother....... you provide a sound argument, and altho he wasnt that expansive player with a great defence, those loses you declared was more to do with our limitations outside of the flyhalf channel than because of it.

I'll say it again our current forwards have scored 4 tries in 100s of combined caps, and NDL 1 try in 30 matches, Laidlaw and Jones have 4 games now with 0 tries (early days but hey ho)

You could have put Dan (Carter) in our team over the last 6 seasons and he would have looked cr@p

Anyway lets draw a line in the sand here............ and cry freedom on the weekend

Lets hope for a good game............... we are travelling down tomorrow evening COME ON SCOTLAND

Yesterday I posted that I thought DP was perhaps ill advised to retire after one match of the 6Ns and that seeing the tournament through, even if not selected might have been better.

After reading the comments by Robinson I withdraw that opinion completely. I'm sure DP is an honourable man and what he did must have taken some courage. Robinson on the other hand..........

The sooner Scoltland find a new coach the better.

Looking forward to welcoming fans to Cardiff this weekend.

Robinson is well within his rights to drop Parks, he is the coach. He asked Parks to come back for two games; he played poorly against England and so he was dropped. Parks ten decided to leave the squad earlier; this isn't Robinson's fault, had he not retired we would have wanted him out the 22 there was no point in him stating so he retired!

Robinson made a major misjudgement n asking parks to come back then to publicly humilate him? - that piece from robinson is awful

I wonder theres a lot of guilt on these threads about the treatment of Parks, from fans media and now management.

If it was reported that he was on his way back to Glasgow, would Glasgow and Scottish fans be happy?

Kingshu wrote:If it was reported that he was on his way back to Glasgow, would Glasgow and Scottish fans be happy?

NOOOOOO!!!

Honestly, it's not that he's a bad player, but rather that he would force Glasgow to play in a certain way, as well as stand in the way of the development of Messrs Weir and Jackson.

I'm far happier him doing those things in Cardiff!

And soon Connacht if the rumours are true?

I don't see the problem. Surely it's worth having Parks as a back up 10 to bring on if you need to tighten up the game? He'd need some confidence back first but a good tactical kicker is a useful tool if it becomes clear and open running game isn't going to work in a given match

ChequeredJersey wrote:I don't see the problem. Surely it's worth having Parks as a back up 10 to bring on if you need to tighten up the game? He'd need some confidence back first but a good tactical kicker is a useful tool if it becomes clear and open running game isn't going to work in a given match

Weir does all of that and more, CJ

And Nick Evans is our kicker and playmaker but sometimes he gets injured

ChequeredJersey wrote:And Nick Evans is our kicker and playmaker but sometimes he gets injured

Ah, right, I see what you're getting at. We're not there yet, but we've quite a promising group of pivots developing in Laidlaw, Jackson, Weir, Leonard, etc. - hopefully will be plenty of decent cover in years to come in the event of injury