Newport Gwent Dragons v Edinburgh - Build-up, teams, banter & live match day thread

[George Carlin]

At the Parade of the Dave, 7pm.
Referee: John Lacey (IRFU, 23rd competition game)
Assistant Referees: James Jones, Simon Rees (both WRU)
Citing Commissioner: Gwyn Bowden (WRU)

Teams:

Dragons:

Dan Evans
Adam Hughes
Pat Leach
Andy Tuilagi
Tom Prydie
Steffan Jones
Jonathan Evans

Toby Faletau
Lewis Evans (c)
Dan Lydiate
Adam Jones
Ian Nimmo
Dan Way
Steve Jones
Phil Price.

Substitutes:
Sam Parry
Aaron Coundley
Nathan Buck
Jevon Groves
Tom Brown
Liam Davies (Bedwas)
Ashley Smith
Will Harries

Players not selected through injury:
Joe Bedford (Shoulder)
Tonderai Chavhanga (Knee)
Jamie Smith (Ankle)
Dan Watchurst (Leg break)
Darren Waters (Knee)
Rob Sidoli (Calf)
Andrew Coombes (Knee)
Mike Poole (Knee)
Wayne Evans (Back).

Edinburgh

15 Greig Tonks

14 Tom Brown
13 Nick De Luca
12 Ben Atiga
11 Tim Visser

10 Harry Leonard
9 Richie Rees

1 Allan Jacobsen
2 Andy Titterrell
3 Geoff Cross
4 Robert McAlpine
5 Sean Cox CAPTAIN
6 Stuart McInally
7 Ross Rennie
8 Netani Talei

Substitutes
16 Alun Walker
17 John Yapp
18 Lewis Niven
19 Dimitri Basilaia
20 Roddy Grant
21 Chris Leck
22 John Houston
23 Dougie Fife

Unavailable though injury:
Ben Cairns (knee)
David Denton (thigh)
Gregor Hunter (pectoral strain)
Steven Lawrie (knee)
Perry Parker (ankle)
Steven Turnbull (knee)

Form:

Dragons have won just one of their last eight matches in the RaboDirect PRO12 (37-6 at home to new franchise Zebre on 31 August) but are unbeaten in their last three games against Scottish opponents.

Edinburgh made a bit of an @rse of it at Leinster on Saturday evening to end a two game winning run. Edinburgh's single away victory in the competition since last November was 21-19 at Cardiff Blues on 7 September.

The Dragons achieved the double over Edinburgh last season, whilst Edinburgh's only victory over them since May 2009 came in April 2011.
Edinburgh's most recent victory at Rodney Parade was way back in May 2006.

Last Five Meetings:

23/03/2012 Edinburgh Rugby 15 29 Newport Gwent Dragons
18/02/2012 Newport Gwent Dragons 21 10 Edinburgh Rugby
22/04/2011 Edinburgh Rugby 27 15 Newport Gwent Dragons
12/02/2011 Newport Gwent Dragons 30 22 Edinburgh Rugby
18/04/2010 Newport Gwent Dragons 49 28 Edinburgh Rugby

[bedfordwelsh]

We really need to win this game, showed promise in first two games but have been poor in last two.

A home win is a must.

[RDW]

We really need to win this game
A home win is a must.

Should be a cracker then because Edinburgh will be seeing this as a must win too if they are to fullfil their ambitions of having a decent Rabbo season this year after all the investment.

Have to say I am never overly confident against the Dragons - they really are our bogey team and there's been some fairly horrendous games between the two teams over the years!

Heart says Edinburgh but head says Dragons to win.

Lets see what the teams are though - there's a few Edinburgh players due a rest and it will be interesting to see when he decides to do so.

[Impossible Standards]

I actually think edinburgh have a good chance of turning us over this season. RP is not the 'fortress' it was. If you turn up with the right attitude you stand a good chance. I guess we need to see the teams first to get a better idea.

[bedfordwelsh]

I am still (like many) cant understand why Edwards left Toby and Lewis on the bench all last weekend against Munster.

I know we haven't got a huge squad and we have to give lads a chance but unfortunately if we need to get anywhere we need our best players playing especially away in Ireland.

Hopefully normal service will be resumed of Firday and both will be back in starting line up

[AsLongAsBut100ofUs]

Potential banana skin for Edinburgh if they rotate too many players and weaken the team too much - think this will be a real test of the 'new' depth available at Embra. Could see Dragons eking out a narrow win

[RDW]

Wonder when Mr Atiga is going to be making an appearance again?

By the look of things on Twitter they are really working hard on his fitness. Plenty pictures and banter to do with him being passed out on the floor after a beasting!

Suspect Matt Scott is going to have to hold the fort with Houston in reserve up until after the first HK games then Atiga can come on once he's got up to speed with his match fitness.

Of course now that I said that he'll probably be starting on Friday now!

[Guest]

Faletau injured himself in the warm up, last weekend.

I will offer an early prediction of Embra by 5 and I don't like backing against Dragons at home. I'm still very scarred by that Cardiff Snooze game.

[Guest]

Few links Here and here

I would just allow Lewis Robling and Steff to take the kicks this week. Robling seemingly did better than Prydie, so really he should be the kicker

Dragons squad: D Evans, T Prydie, W Harries, A Hughes, A Tuilagi, P Leach, A Smith, L Robling, Steffan Jones, J Evans, L Davies, P Price, A Coundley, Steve Jones, S Parry, D Way, N Buck, I Nimmo, A Jones, H Stoddart, L Evans, T Faletau, T Brown, D Lydiate, J Groves

[youngguns6]

DE must put out his best avalible 15 and we must win. Loose this and the season is all but over. Is L Evans is struggling with his calf problem then don't play him. We can't afford to pick players who aren't 100%

Not sure what's happening with Prydie's kicking. He looked like he would never miss but is in a bit of a bad patch atm.

I'd bring Steffan back at 10. Start Hughes and leach/tui in the centre.

[RDW]

It would be great if we could see Denton and Talei V Lydiate and Faletau.

Denton has been out injured for a few weeks now so hopefully he'll be back soon.

[funnyExiledScot]

Hopefully we won't go down the same road as Glasgow with crazy rotations. Now is the time to build partnerships and get the 1st XV fully firing on all cylinders.

These are the games we need to win to make the play-offs.

[RDW]

Looks like Gilchrist won't be getting his rest afterall with Turnbull and PJP ruled out for 6-8 weeks.

http://www.edinburghrugby.org/news/edinburgh-news/4439-squad-update

Having had a few options we're now starting to look a bit light in the 2nd row with McAlpine the only other option!

I think Van Der Vesthausen comes in mid-late October which is still quite far away.

Worrying that we're going into the first round of HK fixtures with only 3 fit locks.

[TJ1]

Its the sort of match Edinburgh need to win if they are going to mount any sort of challenge in the league. Should be able to do so as well

[Luckless Pedestrian]

My first thought is that Edinburgh are going to win: they mullered the Blues' scrum while we didn't get much change out of them and they play a lovely offloading game that could cause us all sorts of problems if we defend like we did against Munster; but on the other hand, we played some good rugby ourselves against Zebre and Leinster (albeit in defeat at the RDS) and I'm told by a Munster supporter that we could have had two or three tries against them, plus we were held up against Munster and against the Blues, so it's not as though we're not creating chances.

It could actually be a good, open game of rugby. But I still have a feeling Edinburgh will come out on top - depending on the side they select.

[RDW]

Edinburgh's scrum has been particularly pleasing this year. I don't think our top level scrum is nowsignificantly better this year, it's more the fact that we now have 2 top class front rows whereas last year we had 1 top class front row and 1 afwul front row. It also means we can sub Geoff Cross off on 60 minutes and have a similarly good scrummager come on to close the game out, instead of get pumped in the scrums at the end of the game.

Think we've had 3 pushover/penalty tries this year (granted the other team had a man in the bin) and Yapp, Nel, Chunk and Cross have all contributed to at least one of them.

[EST]

Edinburgh team has been announced:

15 Greig Tonks

14 Tom Brown
13 Nick De Luca
12 Ben Atiga
11 Tim Visser

10 Harry Leonard
9 Richie Rees

1 Allan Jacobsen
2 Andy Titterrell
3 Geoff Cross
4 Robert McAlpine
5 Sean Cox CAPTAIN
6 Stuart McInally
7 Ross Rennie
8 Netani Talei

Substitutes
16 Alun Walker
17 John Yapp
18 Lewis Niven
19 Dimitri Basilaia
20 Roddy Grant
21 Chris Leck
22 John Houston
23 Dougie Fife

Surprised that Matt Scott has been rested/rotated, he has only played twice since coming back from his extended pre-season. Looking forward to seeing Leonard at 10 and McAlpine at lock, with no cover on the bench for either position they will get good game time.

[Luckless Pedestrian]

Dragons Team for Edinburgh;
Dan Evans, Adam Hughes, Pat Leach, Andy Tuilagi, Tom Prydie, Steffan Jones, Jonathan Evans, Toby Faletau, Lewis Evans (c), Dan Lydiate, Adam Jones, Ian Nimmo, Dan Way, Steve Jones, Phil Price.

Replacements;
Sam Parry, Aaron Coundley, Nathan Buck, Jevon Groves, Tom Brown, Liam Davies (Bedwas), Ashley Smith, Will Harries.

[Captain_Sensible]

I see Lee Jones has been dropped which, given his form, is no bad thing. I'd still have liked to have seen Farndale in their somewhere.

Who will cover flyhalf - Tonks?

[George Carlin]

OP duly amended to reflect the teams.

[GLove39]

Gutted the game isn't on TV

[EST]

I see Lee Jones has been dropped which, given his form, is no bad thing. I'd still have liked to have seen Farndale in their somewhere.

Who will cover flyhalf - Tonks?

I imagine Tonks will fill in if needed with Brown then going to FB. I think its a fairly decent team, like the look of Rees and Leonard together. What will be interesting is the front row replacements of Yapp, Niven and Walker; two of the three are third choice so will be good to know if they can hold their own.

[RDW]

Aye Tonks will cover 10. Big decision to rest Scotland Captain Ford at the same time as Edinburgh Captain Laidlaw, but there's still plenty experience in there. Slightly concerned about a fairly lightweight 2nd row pairing but the Dragons pack isn't massive either.

Strong front row, back row and, assuming Atiga is fit, a decent backline.

Wonder who will fill in 2nd row is one of them gets injured?

Not too bad a thing to rest Scott - he's had 2 weeks in a row back, then will no doubt be brought back in next week to get him up to speed for the two HK games the weeks after that.

Suspect De Luca will be rested next week.

[RDW]

Also good to see he's stuck to his guns and rested Gilchrist - he's played every game so far and is still pretty young so needs looked after. Particularly considering he's going to be playing a lot of rugby over the coming months with Turnbull and PJP injured!

[RuggerRadge2611]

Glad to see Laidlaw get a rest too. He's been playing a lot of Rugby as has Fordy.

I agree with the comments above, this game will be a belter since both camps will be seeing it as a "must win".

[George Carlin]

I think that the issue of when to rest players is once on which we will have no meaningful visibility. The coaches will speak to the medical staff, the performance analysts and the players and see whose body is crying out for a break the most. We'll never know whether it's a sensible call or not (or whether your name is Gregor Towsend and you pick your team from a Scrabble tiles bag).

I agree that Laidlaw, Ford and Gilchrist need to be out of the firing line for a while.

By the same token, it's a sign of respect for the Dragons that Visser and Rennie are back after a fortnight off.

[George Carlin]

As a footnote, I note that Bradley was also smart enough to recognise that Visser, Tonks and Brown is his best back 3 at the moment.

[funnyExiledScot]

It's a pretty lightweight second row there, and with Titterall at hooker the front five must be fairly high on the list of all time light front fives. Cross is hardly a monster either.

Suspect the Dragons will shove that pack all over the park, and whilst the back row is pretty strong, the Dragons back row is a more powerful unit as well.

I suspect the Edinburgh half backs will have to play well with scrappy ball, and query how well Leonard will cope in that respect, given he hasn't had much rugby this season.

Strongest back three available on the other hand, and Atiga and NDL are defensively strong.

I think the Dragons will win this. Don't think Edinburgh have the necessary firepower to win away from home in that side.

It's a shame there isn't a mechanism for Nick Campbell to be loaned to Edinburgh. He isn't getting a shot under Toonie, and he's exactly what Edinburgh need right now.

[youngguns6]

"Suspect the Dragons will shove that pack all over the park"

Have you seen us play? Our scrum is the worst in the league.

Happy with the Dragons team, probably the best we could put out.
I'm a massive Steffan Jones fan n it's great he's starting but I don't understand why Roblin isn't on the bench? He can cover 12 like smith anyway.

[funnyExiledScot]

"Suspect the Dragons will shove that pack all over the park"

Have you seen us play? Our scrum is the worst in the league.

Yes, but Titterall is a dwarf, and MacAlpine can't stand up in a stiff breeze. Our enforcer, Sean Cox, sits somewhere between a lock and flanker in terms of stature, and we've had fatter and slower centres playing for Scotland than Geoff Cross (Brendan Laney and Alan Bulloch, you know who you are).

Seriously, if the Dragons can't smash that Edinburgh front 5, you're playing the wrong game.

[Luckless Pedestrian]

That baffles me too, Youngguns. If your outside half's having a shocker, wouldn't you want to have another genuine ten on the bench, seeing as it's such a pivotal role?

Also, I wouldn't say our scrum's the worst in the league. I wouldn't say whose is, but I don't think ours is as bad as all that.

[funnyExiledScot]

Perhaps the coaches got together before selection and both agreed not to include any proper fly half cover on the bench!

If Leonard gets injured the Edinburgh side will look pretty odd.

[RDW]

From what I've seen so far, the Blue's starting scrum is poor, and their back up is apocalyptically poor!

[EST]

I dunno fEs, from what I have seen I think Edinburgh have much more steel this year. Chunk and Cross are both international props and Titterrell has played well this season. I hear what you are saying about McAlpine, this would have been the perfect game PJP; but he has had a full pre season to bulk up and Cox looks like he has added some beef this year.

[RDW]

Titerall is a midget (he claims to be 5ft 10 though) but the man is an absolute unit. What he lacks in height he very much makes up for in work rate and explosive power.

I've been really impressed with him when he's come on for Ford - he adds a lot of work rate and enthusiasm to lift the team.

His lineout throwing isn't great, but has got a lot better.

[Captain_Sensible]

One of the best things about this season for Edinburgh is that Ford's throwing has been absolutely superb. If only he can bring that into Scottish colours.

[RDW]

I don't think there's ever been much wrong with his throwing skill, it's his concentration and mentality that sometimes goes to pot I think (see the end of the most recent 6 nations!).

I agree though - we've only lost one or two lineouts all season so far with him throwing. Credit to Gilchrist and Cox too of course.

His throwing has been the reason why other nations have said he won't be a top class hooker, but it is a lot better than people make out.

[Captain_Sensible]

Ford blows hot and cold with ball in hand too, again, mostly with Scotland. He's an utter beast in the loose when he puts his mind to it.

[reallybored]

Pleased that players are being systematically rested but once again it seems odd as we're playing Treviso at home next week.

Why not play full strength teams away against Leinster and Dragons, while rotating the squad at home against the Italian teams?

Ford is looking class this season.

[George Carlin]

Titterrell's official weight (on ESPN) is 207lbs. If that's true, then he's about three and a half stones lighter than Willem Nel, for example. And almost five stones lighter than Mike Cusack. So touche, FES.

Am also a little worried about the tight five but hopefully the Dragons will want to throw it around a bit, which is where we will hopefully have parity.

Obviously, having two thirds of the Welsh back row playing is asbestos underpants time, but that's what Talei and Rennie are there for.

[cp10]

Pleased that players are being systematically rested but once again it seems odd as we're playing Treviso at home next week.

Why not play full strength teams away against Leinster and Dragons, while rotating the squad at home against the Italian teams?

Your best team should be used for home games. As a Season Ticket Holder that's what I pay to see. I don't pay for the 2nd/3rd string team - like the one we saw last year.

[Guest]

I really don't see Darren Edwards' logic in picking Smith for the bench over Robling, especially when we have centre cover on the wing in Adam Hughes. Guy is a first class whopper (Edwards).

I like our team. It's very harsh on Tom Brown (the real one, not their imitation ) and I always worry about our front row, but it is probably the strongest one I would like to see out at the minute (probably Coombsy or Sid instead of Madam, but that's it).

[reallybored]

cp10, I appreciate you want to see the best Edinburgh players but wouldn't four wins be better than 2?

The squad is a lot stronger than last year and by only resting a couple players at once, the spine of the team doesn't change drastically.

[justified sinner]

fES think you're being a tad pessimistic about that pack. Chunk is a better scrummager than Yapp and imo better in the loose too. Agreed Titterell is small for a hooker, Cross is fine. In the 2nd row Cox is a constant, McAlpine is the same height and 2 kg lighter than Gilchrist so not a lot of physical differences, I'm expecting him to really come through this year. That backrow is the equal or better than Dragons. In summary not overly weakened, I see us winning the battle up front.

Backs look decent. Weak bench though.

I fancy Embra by 7 no TBP unless Visser has one of those days.

[Morgannwg]

Hoping for another 49-28 victory (like the one over...1/2 years ago?), but I doubt that'll happen.

* Just seen it was in 2010, by reading the post. Odds look stacked in our favour. Both teams look pretty good.But only Edinburgh have the capabilities to make a significant impact on Europe, but can they show it in the league. ...

[justified sinner]

Morgan just hope you get to see a good game. Sadly I won't as no tele for this one. Updates appreciated.

JS

[Morgannwg]

I'll have no TV either. Stream appreciated.

[justified sinner]

Not on tv at all afaik

[munkian]

Have Embra really not gotten a win at the Dave since 2005 ? Bet they do tonight just cos I'm going....

[RDW]

As I said minkian - the Dragons are our bogey team!

Still got memories of a November night at Murrayfield, snow and -3 degrees, with 1500 people in the crowd and the Dragons ended up winning. Not good memories!

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