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The Valleys' Business Plan (continued)

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thebluesmancometh
LordDowlais
Shifty
Coleman
Stone Motif
Cardiff Dave
Irish Londoner
Kingshu
ScarletSpiderman
LeinsterFan4life
Luckless Pedestrian
Pete C (Kiwireddevil)
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The Valleys' Business Plan (continued) Empty The Valleys' Business Plan (continued)

Post by Pete C (Kiwireddevil) Thu May 23, 2013 1:54 pm

Carrying on from https://www.606v2.com/t26997p1000-the-valleys-business-plan#2072933:
Shifty wrote:http://www.valleysrugby.com/our-players-coaches

Our Region

The boundaries of the Valleys Rugby region will be decided by the fans and the clubs of the Valleys Rugby region.

Geography

Valleys Rugby’s primary objective will be to provide a home for those fans and clubs in Wales that consider themselves to be part of the Valleys community and who want to be part of a professional team for their region.

In order to capitalise on strong local support from fans and Rhondda Cynon Taf Local Authority, and predicated upon evidence of core established attendance figures, we have recommended that Sardis Road be the "home" of Valleys Rugby.

However, Valleys Rugby will also host up to 50% of its home matches at clubs throughout its region, in stadia capable of hosting professional Rugby fixtures - either now or in the future.

Clubs will be invited to affiliate to Valleys Rugby and to host home matches as per the Funding section.

North Wales

Valleys Rugby will also look to provide a resource for the development of the game in North and Mid Wales.

Valleys Rugby would work with the WRU to provide a sustainable development plan. Initially it is proposed that Valleys Rugby provides a 3 year commitment along the following basis:-

Base a permanent player academy in North Wales and a player academy in South Wales. The two academies would meet at a middle ground venue on a monthly basis;
Work closely with North and Mid Wales clubs to identify and develop talented players;
Play 2 Rabo Direct league fixtures in North Wales annually. For consistency purposes, Valleys Rugby would propose that the Edinburgh and Ulster games are played in North Wales annually;
Undertake preparation for the establishment of a similar Community owned business model for a professional franchise for North and Mid Wales.
The ultimate objective of Valleys Rugby would be to assist the WRU with the creation of a viable stand alone model for North and Mid Wales. The North and Mid Wales development would ultimately spin out and away from Valleys Rugby. The introduction of a 3 year timeframe in this proposal is intended to focus efforts on establishing this model within this timeframe.

Our Players & Coaches

Valleys Rugby proposes to operate with a low salary budget for playing staff. On the basis that the Region will carry a playing squad of 32 the total salary cap for this squad would be capped at £1,200,000.

The Region would rely on developing young players and so the above cap is based upon the squad have 12 of its players on salaries of c. £18,000 (£216,000) as young professionals.

The remainder of the playing budget (£984,000) would be available between the remaining 20 players to cover salary costs and incidental costs including national insurance.

The following key points would underpin this salary limit:-

All players to be Welsh qualified or qualifying;

Valleys Rugby players would be under contract with a “player release” available should the player aspire to join another Region. The player release would operate on the basis that Valleys Rugby would allow the release, provided the acquiring Region in return provides to Valleys Rugby an academy or younger professional deemed talented and unable to secure adequate development time at the acquiring Region. If a suitable player were not available from the acquiring Region, Valleys Rugby would look for a fixed level of financial contribution allowing further investment into the Valleys Rugby Community;

Valleys Rugby would operate with an “Area Quota” and so have a squad with at least 20% of its players being developed or from North Wales whilst within its time commitment to North Wales and a further 30% being developed or from the Valleys. See our outline regarding a commitment to North Wales elsewhere in the proposal;

Valleys Rugby would be keen to discuss and review “player policies” annually with the WRU and actively seek to engage the input of the WRU in placing younger or developing players with Valleys Rugby – as guided by the WRU on this important strategic issue;
Valleys Rugby would be keen to work with the Wales 7’s structure, to “home” international 7’s players and develop these within the 15 a side structure;

Valleys Rugby would look to develop a schools and young player academy with the WRU and actively seek to progress WRU policies of youth development within its region. To this end, Valleys rugby would be keen to adopt a “commitment to playing” development “stars” as identified by the WRU and with the other Regions if this became appropriate.
Valleys Rugby would not regard itself as a development region. However, it would absolutely embrace the concept of finding, developing and playing the rugby stars of the future.

The Academy

Valleys Rugby will be closely aligned with the playing academies of all existing Regions in any event and its business model is predicated on the ability to give young professional players game time and development time in the professional environment.

Valleys Rugby would propose to operate 2 playing academies, one based in South Wales and one in North Wales. The North Wales academy would ultimately spin-out into the full North Wales Region when this entity is established.

The 2 playing academies would meet at least monthly in a central geographic location to develop skills and coaching together.

Valleys Rugby would look to work closely with the WRU and allow the WRU to run the academy along the lines it thought most productive. Valleys Rugby would also seek to use the National Academy coaches and managers as often as possible.

Coaches

Valleys Rugby would conform to the coaching and support structure as laid out in the Regional Participation Agreement.

Valleys Rugby would appoint its coaches in conjunction with the WRU and in the interim will be assisted by Lynn Howells, currently the coach of the Romanian National team, formerly coach of Wales, Edinburgh in the Rabo Direct, Doncaster in the English Championship, Celtic Warriors and Pontypridd RFC operating in the role of interim Director of Rugby.

As Valleys Rugby develops, its coaching staff can be identified in more detail. Valleys Rugby would be very keen to work with the National Coaches, and provide these with the opportunity to work with and in the Region as often as desirable and agreed with the WRU.

Our Timescale

Valleys Rugby would look to compete in the 2013/4 season.

In the 2012/3 season, if financial backing is secured sufficiently, Valleys Rugby would stage some games to attract interest and demonstrate its operation to potential sponsors.

Competitons

Valleys Rugby would look to compete in the Rabo Direct league and in Europe.

In the first 3 years of its existence Valleys Rugby would agree to take on a role within the European Shield tournament rather than the Heineken Cup. This would allow each of the existing Regions to concentrate on the Heineken Cup for a period without having to worry about qualification.

Welsh Rugby would have a committed participant in the Shield tournament and so meet its obligations to this.

It is believed that Valleys Rugby and each of the existing Regions would benefit by this decision.

Name

Valleys Rugby has not proposed a name or nickname.

If a playing name were required then Valleys Rugby CBS would pick this using the majority vote of its members in due course.

Our Stadia

One major advantage of a new Region within Wales would simply be an increase in the number of derby games to the benefit of all of the Regions.

To develop this concept, and to engage in the entire Region, Valleys Rugby proposes hosting its Rabo Direct games in the most geographically advantageous area.

In order to capitalise on strong local support from fans and Rhondda Cynon Taf Local Authority, and predicated upon evidence of core established attendance figures, we have recommended that Sardis Road be the "home" of Valleys Rugby.

However, Valleys Rugby will also host up to 50% of its home matches at clubs throughout its region, in stadia capable of hosting professional Rugby fixtures - either now or in the future.

An illustrative schedule of fixtures to be undertaken by Valleys Rugby might look as follows:-

Fixture Venue
Valleys v. Blues Sardis Road (Pontypridd)
Valleys v. Ospreys Sardis Road (Pontypridd)
Valleys v. Dragons Eugene Cross Park (Ebbw Vale) / Pontypool Park (Pontypool)
Valleys v. Scarlets Virginia Park (Caerphilly) / Brewery Field (Bridgend)
Valleys v. Leinster Sardis Road (Pontypridd) / The Gnoll (Neath)
Valleys v. Edinburgh Parc Eirias (Colwyn Bay)
Valleys v. Ulster Parc Eirias (Colwyn Bay)
Valleys v. Munster Penydarren Park (Merthyr)
Valleys v. Treviso Sardis Road (Pontypridd)
Valleys v. Aironi Sardis Road (Pontypridd)
Valleys v. Connacht Sardis Road (Pontypridd)
Valleys v. Glasgow Sardis Road (Pontypridd)
European & LV Games Venues as appropriate
Valleys Rugby would hope to commit to a particular venue on a recurring basis (such as Eugene Cross Park for the Dragons) on the basis that this venue would generate home support for the Valleys and also generate a genuine derby atmosphere.

Fixing the fixture to a specific venue would add certainty to the “location” for supporters and hopefully avoid the crowd dilution effect suffered by Regions when moving to different venues previously.

Each of the grounds hosting Valleys Rugby would have to show adequate support from the ground owner and a commitment to ensure the playing surface and facilities are of adequate standard for Regional rugby.

Ultimately, the venues would be decided upon by the make-up of the affiliated clubs and their financial commitment to the Region.

Sardis Road Stadium

The initial principal stadium of Valleys Rugby would be Sardis Road. In this respect:-

RCT Local Authority has in principle agreed to spend £100,000 on the facility over a 3 year period, improving its drainage and playing surface;
RCT Local Authority has also indicated that it will be prepared to vest control of the asset of Sardis Road into the Community Benefit Society, provided it is satisfied with the "asset lock" provisions adopted by Valleys Rugby CBS.
A scheme for the redevelopment of Sardis Road has been investigated by award winning architects Austin-Smith Lord LLP and images of how a redevelopment could look can be seen here.

However, in its early stages, Valleys Rugby would spend predominantly on pitch improvement and general seating. Hospitality could be provided using marquee facilities and also by linking up with local hotels within the Region. Capital expenditure on hospitality would be required in the future but would not be targeted as an immediate priority.

Training Facilities

The training facilities of the University of Glamorgan would be utilised by Valleys Rugby. Valleys Rugby intends to develop close links with the University through player scholarships and similar schemes.

Travel Plan

Valleys Rugby recognises that an intelligent and well resourced travel plan will be required to maximise attendances at peripatetic Valleys Rugby home matches. Edwards Coaches has already indicated its support for Valleys Rugby and has undertaken to work with the new Region to develop and deliver a comprehensive and cost effective travel offering for Valleys Rugby supporters as part of our unique offering.

Pilot Business Plan

Despite the exceptional and welcome success of the Welsh national team, professional rugby in Wales is still subject to enormous challenges.

These challenges impact upon the financial well being of the game, its long term sustainability and its connection with the supporter base within Wales.

It is realistic to say that the existing Regional structure has had limited success to date and there continues to be a need to develop and improve the offering to rugby supporters throughout Wales, in order to further engage supporters of our national sport.

This document and its schedules provide a proposal for a new Region within the WRU structure.

The proposal is also intended to engage with the supporters of rugby in the Valleys who currently appear to be disenfranchised with the existing concept and also to reach out and attempt to assist the WRU with the development of professional rugby in North Wales.

This paper is presented as an outline document but should be considered as a proposal from which to launch a new Region that is both financially viable and closely aligned with, and owned by, its supporter base.

Valleys Rugby will be owned and controlled by the community it serves.

Valleys Rugby CBS will initially issue shares at £100 each. The shares will be “annual shares” and so need to be subscribed for once a year. Each shareholder, upon buying into Valleys Rugby, would be entitled to:-

Ability to vote and attend meetings of Valleys Rugby CBS;
Priority access to tickets and discounts on match tickets;
Ability to vote on the Board of Directors of Valleys Rugby and alter the executive structure of Valleys Rugby as required by its supporters;
Club magazine;
Discount in the club shop;
Ticket lottery;
Card and Share Certificate, certifying membership (which, if this is linked correctly with the regional businesses, could entitle an owner to discount in local shops in the community for example);
We will target a subscription by 10,000 fans at £100 per person – and using this model have an ability to raise £1,000,000 per annum from the owners of Valleys Rugby CBS.

It is important to note that anyone can subscribe for shares in Valleys Rugby CBS and support the establishment of a top-flight rugby team for the Valleys. Membership will be open to supporters from across Wales and the World.

This subscription and ownership will provide Valleys Rugby CBS with the equivalent of a rugby benefactor.

Fundraising - Clubs

As outlined in the Legal Structure section, Valleys Rugby CBS would own at least 60% of Valleys Rugby Limited.

The remaining balance would be owned by a combination of Affiliated Clubs, the WRU, Local Authorities and other interested parties.

A participation and subscription agreement will govern this ownership. The method and make-up of this element is subject to further investigation and discussion with the WRU and affiliated clubs.

It is envisaged that this element of ownership will also attract revenue into Valleys Rugby on an annual basis. However, if there is insufficient interest, the percentage of Valleys Rugby Limited owned by Valleys Rugby CBS would be increased and further shares made available to public ownership.

Early thoughts include a three tiered scale of club membership along the following lines:-

Junior Club Member - £500 pa;
Senior Club Member - £1,000 pa;
Senior Club Hosting Valleys Rugby Matches - £10,000 pa.
Commercial Sponsors

The commercial activities of Valleys Rugby Commercial Limited are also clearly key to the proposal as sponsorship, ticket sales, TV payments etc will make up the remainder of the balance sheet of Valleys Rugby.

Valleys Rugby will seek a minimum of £300,000 sponsorship per annum and believes the business community would be willing to support this as a venture.

Valleys Rugby at present cannot take full commitment from any sponsors as the concept has not been approved by the WRU. Until such approval takes place formal sponsorship and other commitments cannot be advanced.

However, in a show of support, Valleys Rugby has achieved an indication of sponsorship of £250,000 over a 3 year period from Heads of the Valleys Developments. Letters of support have been received from the following businesses:-

Heads of the Valleys Developments;
Acorn Recruitment;
Berry Smith LLP;
COS Group Limited;
Natural Power Wales;
Bluegg Creative;
HJBW Law;
SRB Legal;
Seer Green;
Nathan James Estate Agents;
Yolk Recruitment;
Skogstad UK;
Edwards Coaches.
The ability to progress this element in detail is difficult unless and until the WRU indicates that it would be willing to support Valleys Rugby being developed as a concept. If this backing can be indicated it is believed that significant sponsorship opportunities can be progressed.

WRU Support

Valleys Rugby would require the support of the WRU to develop its Region, infrastructure and players.

The level of support can be discussed and agreed and will vary depending upon which areas the WRU would want Valleys Rugby to focus and develop.

The current business proposal is predicated on annual “match funding” to be provided by the WRU which would require that the WRU provide funding to Valleys Rugby at a level broadly in line with the members funding provided to Valleys Rugby.

On this basis, Valleys Rugby would seek a minimum of £1,200,000 annual funding from the WRU (via television and other rights) but would not request more than £1,500,000 from the WRU in any year, unless specifically agreed otherwise in partnership with the WRU. Any additional funding agreed would relate to player development funding if required.

This match funding structure would provide a unique partnership between the WRU, the supporters of Valleys Rugby and the traditional rugby clubs affiliated with Valleys Rugby.

If the WRU were keen for Valleys Rugby to assist with the development of professional rugby in North Wales, then Valleys Rugby would also seek the assistance of the WRU in raising any sporting or other grants available to it for the development of rugby in North Wales.

Operating Profit & Loss

A draft operating Profit & Loss can be found within the Business Plan document. It is based on assumptions that are believed to be realistic and shows a break even figure after receipt of £1,000,000 per annum from supporter subscription and £700,000 from the Welsh Rugby Union as Valleys Rugby's share of TV rights, etc.

This loss is prior to any publicly raised funds, club funds or WRU funding. Therefore, the funding structure proposed will cover this shortfall and potentially provides an element of contingency funding.

Sponsorship

We would welcome the support of any persons, organisations or companies who wish to invest in a new community-led model for Welsh Rugby.

Valleys Rugby has already secured the support of twenty commercial sponsors including:

Heads of the Valleys Developments;
Acorn Recruitment;
Berry Smith LLP;
COS Group Limited;
Natural Power Wales;
Bluegg Creative;
HJBW Law;
SRB Legal;
Seer Green;
Nathan James Estate Agents;
Yolk Recruitment;
Skogstad UK;
Edwards Coaches.
For example, Heads of the Valleys Developments Ltd has already pledged a sum of £250,000.
Pete C (Kiwireddevil)
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Post by Luckless Pedestrian Thu May 23, 2013 2:01 pm

Thanks, Kiwi. Seeing as it was (apparently) the last thing we've heard from Valleys Rugby / Owen Smith on the matter, I thought I'd copy this over too. It's interesting to see how it differs from the original proposal / vision:


Owen Smith: Thoughts on the joint statement

10.9.2012


The statement released on Friday by the WRU and Valleys Rugby has been met with mixed emotions and differing interpretations. I understand the mixed emotions. I feel them too. We went into the meeting to ask for the WRU’s support to try and found a fan-owned, pro-club for the Valleys, and we came out without having yet achieved that objective.

However, that is not to say that we have achieved nothing, that we have not moved forward towards our goal, or certainly that we should now fold the campaign tent and give up. So, to all of the people who have either wished for or anticipated the failure of our campaign I want to state a few facts this afternoon.

And to those who seem ready to give up in the face of this first obstacle, I want to say ‘keep the faith’ – apathy and defeatism are our most powerful enemies.

The first thing we have achieved is to catalyse a debate about the on-going scandal that the Valleys are not properly represented by the current set-up of professional Welsh rugby. Yes, this debate has rumbled on for years, but it has emerged with renewed intensity in the last 12 months, compelling the rugby establishment to acknowledge and reflect on it, and Valleys Rugby has played a part in that process.

Secondly, we have galvanised people to take action. Individual Valleys clubs and representative bodies within the Union have been spurred to re-engage in dialogue with the WRU about the future of the game in the Valleys. And individual people have taken hope from, or been fired up to disagree with the debate we sought to re-ignite.

Most tellingly, as we revealed for the first time on Friday, 8,500 individuals have been moved to pledged on the Valleys Rugby website to pay £100 each to own a part of the new entity, raising, if we collected the money, £850,000 – just £150,000 shy of the £1 million we said we might raise. We want to thank all those 8,500 people for helping us demonstrate to the WRU and the wider world the passion for our national game that burns in the Valleys – and showing people they were wrong when they said it couldn’t be done.

Thirdly, turning to the outcome of Friday’s meeting, we have secured the engagement of the WRU in a process that we intend to be a pathway back to what the WRU call the ‘elite’ level of the game for Valleys Rugby. The key phrases in the statement we agreed with the WRU are these:

The core agreement is based on a pledge by Valleys Rugby to seek out funding streams from within the UK and Europe which could unlock development plans to improve or create new elite facilities for rugby in the region.

and

The WRU supported Valleys Rugby's aim of working towards improved facilities and possibly linking with an existing team to develop future competitive involvement within some level of the elite game.

What do they mean? Well, they mean that the WRU will work in partnership with Valleys Rugby and with other stakeholders such as Local Authorities, Pontypridd RFC, other sports clubs and local education providers to build a case to access funds – public or private, British or European – to capitalise on the great passion for Rugby and for sport in general that we have in the Valleys and to develop facilities that might reflect our great sporting past but more importantly, might spark sport-based economic and social regeneration for the future.

They also mean that the WRU recognises the great strength of our rugby communities in the Valleys and accepts the need to provide them with fresh support and impetus. Practically, this may imply, as has been the case in North Wales, the creation of a stadium for the Valleys capable of hosting elite rugby and other sports. Such a facility, however, would have to be rooted in the community, perhaps owned it in the manner already described by Valleys Rugby, and would certainly need to serve and not replace or overshadow existing clubs and facilities that deliver for our communities.

My vision is that we use sport – with rugby at its leading edge - as the vehicle to strengthen the health, wealth and wellbeing of our communities. We need now to build a new partnership and a pathway in the Valleys to shape that vision and, after Friday’s meeting, we can now do so in the knowledge that we will be doing so with the co-operation and support of the Welsh Rugby Union.

Though it would be nice to be able to be more definitive about where this pathway will lead us, it just isn’t possible at present, but in my opinion it is a significantly positive step for the Union to endorse our campaign to develop for the Valleys, in their words, future competitive involvement within some level of the elite game. The WRU are clear that they will not currently support the creation of a fifth region in the Valleys but Roger Lewis pointed in the meeting to the potential evolution of the European competitions and was clear that nothing "is linear or static in the development of Rugby."

At Valleys Rugby then, though we remain critical of Regional Rugby and will persist in calling for the WRU to review the system and its lack of focus on the Valleys heartlands of the game, we have always been clear that we need the Union’s support and goodwill if we are realistically to achieve anything. The Union have now held the door ajar and challenged us to work with them and other stakeholders to develop a vision and a pathway that will build on the strengths of Valleys Rugby – on great rugby and community institutions like Pontypridd RFC – and help create the facilities and finances that will enable engagement in a higher, 'elite' level of rugby. That’s a challenge I intend to grab with both hands. In his statement Roger Lewis says Valleys Rugby may make people watch this space. You’d better believe it Roger, eight and a half thousand people can’t be wrong!

Owen Smith MP

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Post by LeinsterFan4life Thu May 23, 2013 2:12 pm

So are the Valleys going to be in the Pro12 soon?

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Post by ScarletSpiderman Thu May 23, 2013 2:21 pm

thebluesmancometh wrote:Sardis was apparently looking really good with recorded 3k plus wasn't it?

SS Weren't Neath reapplying for the license? or at least in need of upgrades? Ponty and Sardis ensure they are way above what is needed for premiership rugby, the WRU wouldn't dare mix the pot again and stir the commando's up right now would they?

I thought the A-Licence was about being afiliated to a region too. That was the major issue Neath had, as their tiff with Cuddy/Ospreys caused a bit of a rift between them and the Ospreys. Also Neath were making all the same noise as Ponty, with regards being too big for the minnow league they were being left in. SO there are similarities between the two IMO.

LeinsterFan4life wrote:So are the Valleys going to be in the Pro12 soon?

Not likely, RGC1404 (North Wales) will be there before the Valleys. The WRU have shut down the Valleys talk time and time again, and IMO will not be willing to allow it to happen, as it would make them look even sillier in the whole closing the Warriors down debarcle.
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Post by Kingshu Thu May 23, 2013 2:25 pm

So did he win re-election and then release that??

To me it sounds like nothing was achieved.

"the engagement of the WRU in a process that we intend to be a pathway back to what the WRU call the ‘elite’ level of the game for Valleys Rugby"

That was always there work with the Blues, and it doesn't appear to have changed.


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Post by ScarletSpiderman Thu May 23, 2013 2:47 pm

To be honest guys nothing really new has happened with the Valleys attempt at regionalism, bar Ponty winning the Welsh Premiership by stuffing a Llanelli RFC side which had a handful of 'regional' players in it.
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Post by Irish Londoner Thu May 23, 2013 4:11 pm

I still think the best thing to do would be to start the whole process anyway, develop Sardis Road, call in the £850,000 they've been pledged plus the sponsors money and get on with it, they would certainly be capable of competing in the RFU Championship and an application for a Welsh side might be welcomed to inject some life into that.

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Post by Cardiff Dave Fri May 24, 2013 5:57 pm

Irish Londoner wrote:I still think the best thing to do would be to start the whole process anyway, develop Sardis Road, call in the £850,000 they've been pledged plus the sponsors money and get on with it, they would certainly be capable of competing in the RFU Championship and an application for a Welsh side might be welcomed to inject some life into that.

Good luck to them getting this so called £850,000.
In reality it was 8500 people who clicked on the following....
"Register your interest in becoming a shareholder of Valleys Rugby here: http://www.valleysrugby.com/user/register"
and IIRC, I was one of the 8500.

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Post by Stone Motif Fri May 24, 2013 6:07 pm

Cardiff Dave wrote:
Irish Londoner wrote:I still think the best thing to do would be to start the whole process anyway, develop Sardis Road, call in the £850,000 they've been pledged plus the sponsors money and get on with it, they would certainly be capable of competing in the RFU Championship and an application for a Welsh side might be welcomed to inject some life into that.

Good luck to them getting this so called £850,000.
In reality it was 8500 people who clicked on the following....
"Register your interest in becoming a shareholder of Valleys Rugby here: http://www.valleysrugby.com/user/register"
and IIRC, I was one of the 8500.
Well cough up then, you tight get
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Post by Cardiff Dave Fri May 24, 2013 6:24 pm

Stone Motif wrote:
Cardiff Dave wrote:
Irish Londoner wrote:I still think the best thing to do would be to start the whole process anyway, develop Sardis Road, call in the £850,000 they've been pledged plus the sponsors money and get on with it, they would certainly be capable of competing in the RFU Championship and an application for a Welsh side might be welcomed to inject some life into that.

Good luck to them getting this so called £850,000.
In reality it was 8500 people who clicked on the following....
"Register your interest in becoming a shareholder of Valleys Rugby here: http://www.valleysrugby.com/user/register"
and IIRC, I was one of the 8500.
Well cough up then, you tight get

I can't. I spent it.

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Post by Cardiff Dave Fri May 24, 2013 8:02 pm

Kingshu wrote:So did he win re-election and then release that??

To me it sounds like nothing was achieved.

"the engagement of the WRU in a process that we intend to be a pathway back to what the WRU call the ‘elite’ level of the game for Valleys Rugby"

That was always there work with the Blues, and it doesn't appear to have changed.


Doesn't look like it, however Richard Holland must have taken notes and again when Ponty refused the offer of LV games at Sardis. I'm hearing other stuff too and it's all paving the way forward IMHO.

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Post by Cardiff Dave Tue May 28, 2013 10:02 pm

As a reminder for the anti Cardiff people. Answers on a postcard to the Arms Park, Westgate Street, somewhere in Cardiff;

"Pontypridd RFC hit back at criticism of Cardiff Blues rejection.
The following statement is issued by Ponty Rugby Limited CEO Stephen Reardon regarding the decision to decline an invitation to stage Cardiff Blues fixtures at Sardis Road during the 2012/13 season."

http://www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/rugby/rugby-news/pontypridd-rfc-hit-back-criticism-2060576

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Post by Coleman Wed May 29, 2013 8:37 am

I've never read that article. I don't think that Ponty are asking a lot in wanting to use the training facilities and having them involved in H-Cup preparation seems to be a good idea. Maybe a game or two in Sardis this season? censored

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Post by Shifty Wed May 29, 2013 7:51 pm

I thought the idea was dead in the water. Basically Roger Lewis met with Owen Smith and the agreement was that when Owen Smith found a financial backer for Valleys rugby then they would discuss things further.

The WRU simply doesn't have the money for a 5th region. And even if they did it would be in Colwyn Bay not Pontypridd.
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Post by Cardiff Dave Wed May 29, 2013 9:26 pm

Shifty wrote:I thought the idea was dead in the water. Basically Roger Lewis met with Owen Smith and the agreement was that when Owen Smith found a financial backer for Valleys rugby then they would discuss things further.

The WRU simply doesn't have the money for a 5th region. And even if they did it would be in Colwyn Bay not Pontypridd.

I would wager that the Ponty faithful with their heads screwed on knew this from day one. Pontypridd are very good at being just Pontypridd and long may it continue.

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Post by LordDowlais Thu May 30, 2013 12:49 pm

Yes, I know that Cardiff Dave, but just for a small moment, just a little precipice in time, I imagined a fully pro regional side playing in Merthyr and it was shangri la. Oh well, I can always dream. Fingers Crossed


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Post by Cardiff Dave Fri May 31, 2013 11:02 pm

LordDowlais wrote:Yes, I know that Cardiff Dave, but just for a small moment, just a little precipice in time, I imagined a fully pro regional side playing in Merthyr and it was shangri la. Oh well, I can always dream. Fingers Crossed


You're mad obviously and you and your Cardiff supporting old man must have some interesting chats.

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Post by LordDowlais Sat Jun 01, 2013 8:56 am

Only of late Cardiff dave, now that there are good noises coming from the cap, he will have the man sausage of the walk again next season, unless, as I suspect, Phill Davies messes everything up, which I have absolutely no doubt he will.

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Post by Guest Sat Jun 01, 2013 9:52 am

LordDowlais wrote:Yes, I know that Cardiff Dave, but just for a small moment, just a little precipice in time, I imagined a fully pro regional side playing in Merthyr and it was shangri la. Oh well, I can always dream. Fingers Crossed


Why in Merthyr? What I mean is that this pro valleys regional team is the brain child of mainly Pontypridd fans. If the team was to be Merthyr based then the Ponty fans would again feel 'disenfranchised' and surely would not support that side either?!

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Post by thebluesmancometh Sat Jun 01, 2013 11:01 am

Griff wrote:
LordDowlais wrote:Yes, I know that Cardiff Dave, but just for a small moment, just a little precipice in time, I imagined a fully pro regional side playing in Merthyr and it was shangri la. Oh well, I can always dream. Fingers Crossed


Why in Merthyr? What I mean is that this pro valleys regional team is the brain child of mainly Pontypridd fans. If the team was to be Merthyr based then the Ponty fans would again feel 'disenfranchised' and surely would not support that side either?!

Don't open that can of worms Griff, they are doing their best to avoid that discussion Whistle

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Post by Seagultaf Sat Jun 01, 2013 3:56 pm

Forget romance, tradition and history, rugby is a professional game now.The existing 4 regions struggle to compete at both Rabo and European level on a salary cap of £3.5M. Valleys Rugby is intending to develop a competitive professional side on a salary cap of £1.2M!!!!!!!!!

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Post by Cardiff Dave Sun Jun 09, 2013 10:39 pm

Seagultaf wrote:Forget romance, tradition and history, rugby is a professional game now.The existing 4 regions struggle to compete at both Rabo and European level on a salary cap of £3.5M. Valleys Rugby is intending to develop a competitive professional side on a salary cap of £1.2M!!!!!!!!!

Not sure about that. Someone just chucked £500,000 down Cardiff way.

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Post by Brendan Mon Jun 10, 2013 5:19 pm

As i said before on an old debate about this they should tell Ponty its great idea but it will be just them. And from next season they will start the same process as they did with north wales and demote ponty

How did north wales do in div 2. What are your views on their progress. Also what kind of a budget would the top teams in the welsh prem be running on in comparsion to the 1.2m the want to spend

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Post by LordDowlais Tue Jun 11, 2013 12:51 pm

Griff wrote:
LordDowlais wrote:Yes, I know that Cardiff Dave, but just for a small moment, just a little precipice in time, I imagined a fully pro regional side playing in Merthyr and it was shangri la. Oh well, I can always dream. Fingers Crossed


Why in Merthyr? What I mean is that this pro valleys regional team is the brain child of mainly Pontypridd fans. If the team was to be Merthyr based then the Ponty fans would again feel 'disenfranchised' and surely would not support that side either?!

Becuase Merthyr has a bigger population than Ponty, has a bigger town than Ponty already has a decent ground to use which is better than Sardis, although I do like Sardis, and is only 15 mins away from Ponty, and most of all, I live in Merthyr. Yahoo

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Post by Pete C (Kiwireddevil) Tue Jun 11, 2013 1:18 pm

LordDowlais wrote:
Griff wrote:
LordDowlais wrote:Yes, I know that Cardiff Dave, but just for a small moment, just a little precipice in time, I imagined a fully pro regional side playing in Merthyr and it was shangri la. Oh well, I can always dream. Fingers Crossed


Why in Merthyr? What I mean is that this pro valleys regional team is the brain child of mainly Pontypridd fans. If the team was to be Merthyr based then the Ponty fans would again feel 'disenfranchised' and surely would not support that side either?!

Becuase Merthyr has a bigger population than Ponty, has a bigger town than Ponty already has a decent ground to use which is better than Sardis, although I do like Sardis, and is only 15 mins away from Ponty, and most of all, I live in Merthyr. Yahoo

I love your logic LD Smile

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Post by Cardiff Dave Thu Dec 19, 2013 4:14 pm

Valleys rugby has awoken from its slumber and is joining in the fun;

Owen Smith MP
19.12.2013
"However, the idea of Valleys Rugby was not created to be used as a pawn in a power battle between the Union and the regions. It was designed to highlight the injustice, the economic and rugby stupidity of disenfranchising parts of Wales which had been the backbone of our game for over a century."

http://www.valleysrugby.com/valleys-rugby-an-ambition-too-small?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=facebook

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Post by Casartelli Thu Dec 19, 2013 4:48 pm

Oh dear god.

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Post by Allty Fri Dec 20, 2013 3:57 pm

The sleeping Giant is waking beware Carpet Salesmen and Pie Eaters

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