Mayweather vs Ortiz in September 17th

First topic message reminder :

Thank god for a proper welterweight fight.

None of this Pacquiao vs Norris outta Corrie nonsense.

http://boxrec.com/list_bouts.php?human_id=352&cat=boxer

Thoughts?

Gassed after 6 rounds?

azania wrote:

Lumbering_Jack wrote:

azania wrote:

Lumbering_Jack wrote:

azania wrote:

Lumbering_Jack wrote:

azania wrote:

Lumbering_Jack wrote:Azania,

I guess we look for different things in fighters. I admire fighters who are tough enough to dig deep when they need to, Ortiz has demonstrated that he sometimes have it in him and quits.

Being a boxer does not make you brave, they are trained professionals in a controlled environment.

I admore fighters who come thru a gut check win or lose. I also admire fighters who know when their time's up and doesn't want to risk further injuries to themselves. When you are dehydrated the risks are huge.

Maybe if they were on the end of a brutal beating, not because it was getting a bit hard.

The man had nothing left to give. He was knackered.

So was Amir Khan in the last few rounds, he found a way to hang in their in and win.

Obviously he had something left. The Berto fight was much harder for Ortiz in terms of punches thrown and landed. The extra weight helped him in that it increased his stamina.

Ortiz has plently left, he had shown no real signs of gassing.... He lost his bottle and mugged off paying fans.

You're just guessing now. You believe he chose to protect his looks but ignore when he also said he was gassed.

I have formed an opinion based on what I have seen. I dont buy all this he was spent rubbish as he had shown no signs of gassing earier on. Fighters pride is important.

The Mighty Atom wrote:Gassed after 6 rounds?

I'm surprised he made it into the ring to fight. After 2 rounds he was blowing. His whole camp was bad. He had a torrid time making weight and in all honesty he shouldn't have been in the ring to fight in the first place. There is an argument for docking his pay for that reason only.

azania wrote:

The Mighty Atom wrote:Gassed after 6 rounds?

I'm surprised he made it into the ring to fight. After 2 rounds he was blowing. His whole camp was bad. He had a torrid time making weight and in all honesty he shouldn't have been in the ring to fight in the first place. There is an argument for docking his pay for that reason only.

Quitting has no place in boxing.

At least Audley was pulled out by the ref, Ortiz shamefully left the ring to protect his looks....

I really dont know how you can defend him.

Lumbering_Jack wrote:

azania wrote:

The Mighty Atom wrote:Gassed after 6 rounds?

I'm surprised he made it into the ring to fight. After 2 rounds he was blowing. His whole camp was bad. He had a torrid time making weight and in all honesty he shouldn't have been in the ring to fight in the first place. There is an argument for docking his pay for that reason only.

Quitting has no place in boxing.

At least Audley was pulled out by the ref, Ortiz shamefully left the ring to protect his looks....

I really dont know how you can defend him.

You're being far to harsh on the guy. He was young and inexperienced and some say weight drained. He redeemed himself against Berto. He never had the heart to go on but has learned from it and got up from being down and won since.

licence_007 wrote:

KO-KING wrote:

The Mighty Atom wrote:Ahhhh that makes sense, your original post seemed to suggest the opposite mate

'Similar talent but Khan heart<<<<Ortiz's heart' 1st post that i compared the two

Yeah you have the symbol the wrong way. Khan's heart >>> Ortiz's heart, is what you were looking for.

You're right, normally i dont make mistakes like this which make me look like an idiot

Lumbering_Jack wrote:

azania wrote:

The Mighty Atom wrote:Gassed after 6 rounds?

I'm surprised he made it into the ring to fight. After 2 rounds he was blowing. His whole camp was bad. He had a torrid time making weight and in all honesty he shouldn't have been in the ring to fight in the first place. There is an argument for docking his pay for that reason only.

Quitting has no place in boxing.

At least Audley was pulled out by the ref, Ortiz shamefully left the ring to protect his looks....
I really dont know how you can defend him.

If you say so. Pretty pointless debating with someone who point blank refuses to see the whole picture. If you take what he said into the correct context and you still disagree then fine. But by simply banging on anout a quote taken completely out of context lends me to question your ability to understand the nature of debate. Or would o uprefer point scoring?

The bottom line is, he gassed and stopped fighting. He came back and is now a world champion. Common sense states that he took the right decision. I doubt very much if he cares what your opinion of him is. I doubt very much is he cares what the opinions of sadists and people who have little to zero understanding what weight cutting is and how weight loss affects boxers.

Clueless, hopeless, worthless.

azania wrote:

Lumbering_Jack wrote:

azania wrote:

The Mighty Atom wrote:Gassed after 6 rounds?

I'm surprised he made it into the ring to fight. After 2 rounds he was blowing. His whole camp was bad. He had a torrid time making weight and in all honesty he shouldn't have been in the ring to fight in the first place. There is an argument for docking his pay for that reason only.

Quitting has no place in boxing.

At least Audley was pulled out by the ref, Ortiz shamefully left the ring to protect his looks....
I really dont know how you can defend him.

If you say so. Pretty pointless debating with someone who point blank refuses to see the whole picture. If you take what he said into the correct context and you still disagree then fine. But by simply banging on anout a quote taken completely out of context lends me to question your ability to understand the nature of debate. Or would o uprefer point scoring?

The bottom line is, he gassed and stopped fighting. He came back and is now a world champion. Common sense states that he took the right decision. I doubt very much if he cares what your opinion of him is. I doubt very much is he cares what the opinions of sadists and people who have little to zero understanding what weight cutting is and how weight loss affects boxers.

Clueless, hopeless, worthless.

He quit like a dog, you need to get over it. He showed no signs of gassing and openly said he quit to protect his looks. That is what happened, the "whole picture" if you like. He was not weight drained, he was winning the fight and had dropped Maidana twice.

He has been very fortunate to get a title shot, more to do with the fact GB promote him. Most fighters would not get that opportunity and would put in a damn side more effort than Ortiz did that night, many would probably swap their own mother to be in the position Ortiz was after 6 rounds.

Joe Calzaghe said that after 6 rounds he had nothing left vs Eubank... he still found a way to get himself through. Great mentality and fighters pride got him through that night, something Ortiz was found lacking on that night.

The fact his is now potentially a FMJ opponent is a disgrace.

I think some are being very harsh on Ortiz, yes he bottled it against Maidana but I believe he has since redeemed himself.

He can't forever be looked down upon for one moment of weakness and Duran seems to for the majority forgiven and he wasn't even involved in a brawl in the 2nd Leonard fight?!?

I think people found guilty of taking enhancers should be more frowned upon but this seems merely overlooked by many.

Bob Arum publicly confirmed at the moment no Top Rank boxer will fight a Golden Boy boxer so that puts end to Floyd fighting Manny (I know Floyd not strictly with GBP but he always uses them), he's already beaten Mosley to please some fans so the next viable opponent is Ortiz because he's beaten the unbeaten Berto and now holds a proper world title whilst the other 2 titilists are not worth fighting.

Additionally, Clottey doesn't deserve to get another large payday and their two styles would make one boring fight and Cotto and Williams have moved up.

I would have been happy for any top WW's fighting Berto so I'd be happy for the top guys top fight Ortiz.

Ideally as the Manny vs Floyd fight will never happen i'd like to see Mayweather step again and fight Martinez at 154ibs.

berto is a far better fighter than maidana - ortiz is a very good opponent, and someone who i dont see any welter beating other than the top 2.

ortiz is a big, fast, hard punching live opponent for anyone. if floyd takes this on, he's blown mannys opponent choices out of the water again.

oscar had already been beaten up at light middle by floyd.
hatton lost his unbeaten record against floyd
marquez was humiliated by floyd
mosley was humiliated by floyd

and manny takes them on after, after dodging marquez until roach saw he couldnt fight at welter.

~Ho~Ho, boxrec says Mr. Moneybags is fighting Victor Ortiz September 17 after Ortiz pounded out Mr. Moneybags' stablemate, the well padded Mr. Berto.

Guess that is the taxman's deadline. Sweet that Mr. Oscar lined up another Golden Boy fighter for him, but where he shows up is anybody's guess as prison bars are calling.

In another Golden Boy alert, Montreal boxing commission mulls whether or not to give Mr. Hopkins special drug tests after his one off out of character performance last outing.

Ho~Ho, what goes around comes around, eh?

Perfessor Albertus Lion V wrote:~Ho~Ho, boxrec says Mr. Moneybags is fighting Victor Ortiz September 17 after Ortiz pounded out Mr. Moneybags' stablemate, the well padded Mr. Berto.

Guess that is the taxman's deadline. Sweet that Mr. Oscar lined up another Golden Boy fighter for him, but where he shows up is anybody's guess as prison bars are calling.

In another Golden Boy alert, Montreal boxing commission mulls whether or not to give Mr. Hopkins special drug tests after his one off out of character performance last outing.

Ho~Ho, what goes around comes around, eh?

Do you know something about the Floyd trial no one else does because as far as I was aware he hasn't even been tried yet. Innocent until proven guilty?

You are going to look even more ridiculous than usual if Bhop does indeed take those tests and passes them.

Ortiz's manager has said the fight rumour with Floyd is false.

I must admit I thought Ortiz would at least have an 'easy' fight straight after winning his first title.

You would have had to be a massive optimist or blind Floyd fan to believe this anyway.

prettyboykev wrote:
Do you know something about the Floyd trial no one else does because as far as I was aware he hasn't even been tried yet. Innocent until proven guilty?

You are going to look even more ridiculous than usual if Bhop does indeed take those tests and passes them.

~ My dearest, most anyone following the news knows more than you, so it's no big deal at all to know that Mr. Moneybags has publicly pulled out of many high profile fights in the past and has a rap sheet to make Mike Tyson jealous with more than a half dozen recent charges queued for a shiny new page.

A fight with him ain't never on until he steps into the ring, clearly.

Anyone can pass an Olympic drug test. Marion Jones and the rest did so easily hundreds of times as just about everyone but you already knows.

I don't know if you should blame your parents or your schooling for your lack of attention to current events you have a desperate need to rattle on about.

Or just blame Mr. Moneybags, now that's the ticket!

Perfessor Albertus Lion V wrote:

prettyboykev wrote:
Do you know something about the Floyd trial no one else does because as far as I was aware he hasn't even been tried yet. Innocent until proven guilty?

You are going to look even more ridiculous than usual if Bhop does indeed take those tests and passes them.

~ My dearest, most anyone following the news knows more than you, so it's no big deal at all to know that Mr. Moneybags has publicly pulled out of many high profile fights in the past and has a rap sheet to make Mike Tyson jealous with more than a half dozen recent charges queued for a shiny new page.

A fight with him ain't never on until he steps into the ring, clearly.

Anyone can pass an Olympic drug test. Marion Jones and the rest did so easily hundreds of times as just about everyone but you already knows.

I don't know if you should blame your parents or your schooling for your lack of attention to current events you have a desperate need to rattle on about.

Or just blame Mr. Moneybags, now that's the ticket!

Actually I'm quite an intelligent guy who doesn't feel the need to talk like a moron in order to make a point.

You brought the testing up by suggesting Bhop would fail the tests I just pointed out if he didn't you would look even more ridiculous.

You said Floyd would be behind bars soon. I asked if you know something we don't because he isn't being tried for past misdmeanors he's already paid his debt to society for them. He is being tried for his current alleged misdemeanors and the main rule of law is innocent until proven guilty. Maybe it was your schooling or the fact your parents might be cousins that stops you from understanding that.

prettyboykev wrote:
Actually I'm quite an intelligent guy who doesn't feel the need to talk like a moron in order to make a point.

You brought the testing up by suggesting Bhop would fail the tests I just pointed out if he didn't you would look even more ridiculous.

You said Floyd would be behind bars soon. I asked if you know something we don't because he isn't being tried for past misdmeanors he's already paid his debt to society for them. He is being tried for his current alleged misdemeanors and the main rule of law is innocent until proven guilty. Maybe it was your schooling or the fact your parents might be cousins that stops you from understanding that.

~ My dearest little smarty pants, I merely relayed breaking news that the Montreal Commission is mulling over whether to issue special drug tests Mr. Hopkins. It was YOU who introduced the specter of passing and failing.

Mr. Moneybags is already certifiably GUILTY many times over of criminal charges prior to his current charges. I am not a juror, thus I have no such restrictions as thinking that this serial misogynist is innocent of his criminality.

Yessir, no doubt you are the most intelligent being in your sandbox with your action hero dolls doing battle~Ho~Ho!

Not a bad fight. Ortiz is made for Mayweather however.

A conversation about a Floyd Mayweather fight and predictably half the comments are about Pacquiao. The same old arguments churned out again and again. Pacquiao has defeated more world class opponents than anyone else in the p4p top 20, the only fighter who comes close to number of world champs beaten is Mayweather. Pacquiao is derrided for fighting an aged Mosely, which is exactly what Mayweather did. Every fighter receives criticism, but Pacquiao also deserves some credit. Pacquiao is pretty much regarded as the p4p 1, perhaps no 2 - thats quite a high standard.

But, anyway back to the subject at hand. If the fight happens and its along way of yet, I'd quite fancy Ortiz. Mayweather is 34 now and has only fought twice since 2007, time takes its toll. Plus, with the out of ring distractions its very difficult to maintain focus. Ortiz is young, strong - could be a real handful. The Berto fight was a very talented performance and he's improving all the time.

I don't have a problem with fighters quitting, if he feels thats the best way of preserving his health then good idea. Preferable, to him becoming punch drunk and losing all is marbles. Anyway, Ortiz didn't quit against Berto and showed some guts in taking the fight.

Your point is Chris?

Perfessor Albertus Lion V wrote:

prettyboykev wrote:
Actually I'm quite an intelligent guy who doesn't feel the need to talk like a moron in order to make a point.

You brought the testing up by suggesting Bhop would fail the tests I just pointed out if he didn't you would look even more ridiculous.

You said Floyd would be behind bars soon. I asked if you know something we don't because he isn't being tried for past misdmeanors he's already paid his debt to society for them. He is being tried for his current alleged misdemeanors and the main rule of law is innocent until proven guilty. Maybe it was your schooling or the fact your parents might be cousins that stops you from understanding that.

~ My dearest little smarty pants, I merely relayed breaking news that the Montreal Commission is mulling over whether to issue special drug tests Mr. Hopkins. It was YOU who introduced the specter of passing and failing.

Mr. Moneybags is already certifiably GUILTY many times over of criminal charges prior to his current charges. I am not a juror, thus I have no such restrictions as thinking that this serial misogynist is innocent of his criminality.

Yessir, no doubt you are the most intelligent being in your sandbox with your action hero dolls doing battle~Ho~Ho!

Once again more mindless drivel.

You suggested Hopkins would fail the test I just pointed out that you would look rather considerably more stupid than you regularly do if he did indeed take these test and pass them.

I'm never questioned Floyds guilt for previous offences, I stated he been convicted and paid his debt to society. You stated as a fact that Floyd would not be able to fight Victor Ortiz in September because he would be in prison. This led me to the conclusion that you either have some information on the cases against him or you're just spouting your usual drivel in this uniquely queer manner of yours.

I will leave the childish jokes to you I'm to much of a smart ass for that sort of stuff. Next time you need to be educated on anything just PM me so I don't embarass you on the threads anymore.